That's a losing point, Boobie. If you fitted out a J30 for cruising the way most real
cruisers fit out, you'd have a rather slow boat. Actually it would be almost impossible,
since the J30 only holds 30 gallons of water and less fuel.

You can claim that a lightly loaded boat would be faster, and that's true. However, its
not the way most people cruise, unless they're just marina hopping for a few days.




"Bobsprit" wrote in message
...
Bob I believe you stated they would be equal in displacement in regards to
race crew weight vs cruise weight.
I think Ole Thom corrected you about that assumption.

Nope. Not at all. People carry a lot or a little when they cruise. Doug is
doing little more than guessing at what cruising gear and supplies might
weight.
My ONLY point was that the J30 or Express 30 are still "performance" boats
compared to cruisers like the Nordic, even when loaded down for a cruise.

RB

That's a losing point, Boobie. If you fitted out a J30 for cruising the way
most real
cruisers fit out, you'd have a rather slow boat. Actually it would be almost
impossible,
since the J30 only holds 30 gallons of water and less fue

You guys crack me up! "Real cruisers?" Bwahahahaha! I have friends who just
grab a few things and dissapear on their boats for weeks, but I guess they're
not REAL cruisers.
Since adding water tankage to a J30 would cost upwards of 2-300 bucks, I guess
you can't cruise them!
As for fuel....J30's don't do a lot of motoring. Come to think of it, niether
does my C&C.

Dopes!

RB

No, they're not. I've gone cruising in lightweight racing dinghies and daysailors - that
isn't real "cruising." Taking a J30 to Block Island isn't the same as heading DownEast
for the season.

You can add the tankage to a J30 if you want, but who would be so stupid? You'd just end
up with a boat that's slower than a proper cruiser, but not as strong! Here's a J35 that
tried to cruise Maine:
http://www.cliffisland.com/boat.html

Bottom line is, anything's possible. I know people have cruised J30 all over. But for
some reason, you don't see too many of the where most cruisers go. And usually, they're
young guys have the cheapest vacation possible.




"Bobsprit" wrote in message
...
That's a losing point, Boobie. If you fitted out a J30 for cruising the way
most real
cruisers fit out, you'd have a rather slow boat. Actually it would be almost
impossible,
since the J30 only holds 30 gallons of water and less fue

You guys crack me up! "Real cruisers?" Bwahahahaha! I have friends who just
grab a few things and dissapear on their boats for weeks, but I guess they're
not REAL cruisers.
Since adding water tankage to a J30 would cost upwards of 2-300 bucks, I guess
you can't cruise them!
As for fuel....J30's don't do a lot of motoring. Come to think of it, niether
does my C&C.

Dopes!

RB

No, they're not. I've gone cruising in lightweight racing dinghies and
daysailors - that
isn't real "cruising." Taking a J30 to Block Island isn't the same as heading
DownEast
for the season

Cruising to Block Island or to Florida...both cruising. We were talking about a
WEEK long trip, Jeff.
As much as you try to change the debate, you can't.
My point stands.

RB

Jeff is right, you're wrong! Look at the picture at the link.
A proper cruising boat would not have lost its keel like
that cheap piece of crap. The GPR was so thin it actually
split like an egg shell. Racing boats don't make good cruising
boats. Lord, but you're stupid lately. Stop smoking dope,
will ya?

S.Simon


"Bobsprit" wrote in message ...
No, they're not. I've gone cruising in lightweight racing dinghies and
daysailors - that
isn't real "cruising." Taking a J30 to Block Island isn't the same as heading
DownEast
for the season

Cruising to Block Island or to Florida...both cruising. We were talking about a
WEEK long trip, Jeff.
As much as you try to change the debate, you can't.
My point stands.

RB

The problem is that I think of a 1 week cruise as a shakedown for 3 week cruise later in
the Summer. For you, a one week cruise is a life's ambition! With the exception of food
and clothing, my boats is usually outfitted for an extended cruise.



"Bobsprit" wrote in message
...
No, they're not. I've gone cruising in lightweight racing dinghies and
daysailors - that
isn't real "cruising." Taking a J30 to Block Island isn't the same as heading
DownEast
for the season

Cruising to Block Island or to Florida...both cruising. We were talking about a
WEEK long trip, Jeff.
As much as you try to change the debate, you can't.
My point stands.

RB

Racing boats don't make good cruising
boats. Lord, but you're stupid lately. Stop smoking dope,

A J30 is a racing boat? Are you sure?

RB

The problem is that I think

Yes, Jeff.

RB

Bob,

I know what you are saying and yes it can be true but probably not. When
you say a week you are getting into the time period where cruising
people take their "Do Dads" with them. When they do this the R/C suffers
badly in performance. This is to be expected and is accepted. It is
still a fast cruiser but its' performance does drop off badly, where a
true cruiser doesn't lose that much and it does start to be a toss up of
which boat is going to have the better over-all performance. Granted the
"Crab Cruncher" didn't have that much to lose to start with

Boat designers have spent forever trying to find the right compromise
and will be for ever looking. That's sailing. There is untold
personalities to be satisfied. As soon a one is satisfied the desire
will change.

For sure You and I aren't going to come up with the answer but one thing
is sure a J30 loaded for cruising isn't going to match a Nordic. A
stripped out Nordic, sure a hell, isn't going to out-perform a J30 in
racing trim. Even Bob Perry says about the same thing, and he probably
comes the closest with his fast cruiser concept.

You can use it as a troll but the discussion is a old as the first "Rag
Sailer" that hollowed out the first Keel.

And; "I'll Drink to That!"

Ole Thom

"Thom Stewart" wrote in message ...

Boat designers have spent forever trying to find the right compromise
and will be for ever looking. That's sailing. There is untold
personalities to be satisfied. As soon a one is satisfied the desire
will change.


Wrong! The looking stopped when the first production Coronado 27
was commissioned. It's the perfect cruising sailboat!

S.Simon - sails only the very best