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#22
posted to rec.boats
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Consumer Reports Annual Reliability Survey
On 10/26/2017 4:32 PM, John H wrote:
On Thu, 26 Oct 2017 16:12:37 -0400, wrote: On Thu, 26 Oct 2017 14:17:46 -0400, John H wrote: On Thu, 26 Oct 2017 14:07:10 -0400, wrote: On Thu, 26 Oct 2017 11:57:10 -0400, John H wrote: Here are the '10 Least Reliable Cars' from the latest CR reliability survey. The least of the least is at the bottom. Chevrolet Camaro Mercedes-Benz GLC Jaguar F-Pace GMC Acadia Fiat 500 Ford Focus Ford Fiesta Volvo XC90 Cadillac Escalade Tesla Model X All of these got 'one out of five' in the predicted reliability rating, based on the results of the owner surveys. Maybe folks are a bit more honest than we might think when it comes to rating their own cars. I wonder if some of this is just that a guy who paid $70-100k for a Cadillac or a Jag is a little less tolerant of a little misalignment of the door or a squeak behind the dash than a guy with a $20k Versa Could well be. But if there are more misalignments or squeaks in the Cadillac or Jag then the various Lexus' then the ratings are doing their job. The CR survey covers about 25 different 'topics' in the auto section, like sound system, navigation, engine electronics, brakes, transmission, etc. Once a topic is identified, further questions are asked if the topic was a problem area. I wouldn't think may folks would whine about their transmission if their problem was a squeak in the dash. The principle is still there tho. If I have a new Lincoln that is shifting a little rough, I am complaining. If it is a Yugo, I might just believe that is how they work. I do agree Lexus (a premium Toyota) is a well built car but it was the Japs who taught Detroit about quality. In the 70s and 80s we were talking about how well Hondas were built and the UAW was still making jokes about leaving coke bottles in the door. The only one that surprised me was the Benz. I wonder where the GLC they tested was made? Finland? Those may be left over commies from the Trebant factory ;-) The thing for you and Luddite to do is never look at Consumer Reports. I can't remember the last time I read Consumer Reports. Do they still publish a paper version? Once in a while I see something on the Internet but it wants you to subscribe to view the entire report. |
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#23
posted to rec.boats
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Consumer Reports Annual Reliability Survey
On 10/26/17 6:13 PM, Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 10/26/2017 4:14 PM, wrote: On Thu, 26 Oct 2017 14:20:37 -0400, "Mr. Luddite" wrote: On 10/26/2017 2:12 PM, Keyser Soze wrote: On 10/26/17 2:07 PM, wrote: On Thu, 26 Oct 2017 11:57:10 -0400, John H wrote: Here are the '10 Least Reliable Cars' from the latest CR reliability survey. The least of the least is at the bottom. Chevrolet Camaro Mercedes-Benz GLC Jaguar F-Pace GMC Acadia Fiat 500 Ford Focus Ford Fiesta Volvo XC90 Cadillac Escalade Tesla Model X All of these got 'one out of five' in the predicted reliability rating, based on the results of the owner surveys. Maybe folks are a bit more honest than we might think when it comes to rating their own cars. I wonder if some of this is just that a guy who paid $70-100k for a Cadillac or a Jag is a little less tolerant of a little misalignment of the door or a squeak behind the dash than a guy with a $20k Versa Why should the buyer of a new inexpensive car be tolerant of a poorly assembled vehicle? Surprised the list of the least reliable cars doesn't include Jeep vehicles. Me too. Based on what I've read the current crop of Jeeps have a terrible reputation for reliability problems and being outdated in design in general.Â* My daughter can't wait until her lease is up on a Jeep Liberty she has.Â* I've driven it. It's terrible. Transmission shudders at slow speeds but she was told it's "normal".Â* My brother also bought a Jeep Compass a couple of months ago, replacing a 12 year old, rotted out Dodge Ram pickup. His shutters also at slow speeds, so perhaps it *is* normal.Â* He's already shopping for a replacement for it Not much of a sampling but consistent with many of the on-line reviews. I had problems with my 72 AMC Jeep too but I beat the **** out of it. Followup:Â*Â* I received a call from my daughter an hour ago asking if I could give her a ride to her car dealership.Â* She had dropped her Jeep off for an inspection sticker this morning.Â* She also had a couple of lights out ... parking light and a running light and they all have to work to pass inspection. She didn't hear from the dealership all day and finally called them to see if it was ready.Â*Â* She was transferred to the service manager who told her, "There's a problem.Â* The problem with the lights is not the bulbs or LEDs.Â* There's a problem in the wiring of the vehicle and we haven't been able to trace it so far."Â*Â* So, they gave her a loaner .. a new Dodge Charger. About two months ago her Jeep suddenly started by itself in her driveway at about 1 am.Â* The lights turned on and the horn started beeping.Â* My son-in-law heard it, went out and somehow shut it off.Â* Probably related to the wiring problem. Wow! Seriously. Sheesh. |
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#24
posted to rec.boats
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Consumer Reports Annual Reliability Survey
On 10/26/2017 6:15 PM, Keyser Soze wrote:
On 10/26/17 6:13 PM, Mr. Luddite wrote: On 10/26/2017 4:14 PM, wrote: On Thu, 26 Oct 2017 14:20:37 -0400, "Mr. Luddite" wrote: On 10/26/2017 2:12 PM, Keyser Soze wrote: On 10/26/17 2:07 PM, wrote: On Thu, 26 Oct 2017 11:57:10 -0400, John H wrote: Here are the '10 Least Reliable Cars' from the latest CR reliability survey. The least of the least is at the bottom. Chevrolet Camaro Mercedes-Benz GLC Jaguar F-Pace GMC Acadia Fiat 500 Ford Focus Ford Fiesta Volvo XC90 Cadillac Escalade Tesla Model X All of these got 'one out of five' in the predicted reliability rating, based on the results of the owner surveys. Maybe folks are a bit more honest than we might think when it comes to rating their own cars. I wonder if some of this is just that a guy who paid $70-100k for a Cadillac or a Jag is a little less tolerant of a little misalignment of the door or a squeak behind the dash than a guy with a $20k Versa Why should the buyer of a new inexpensive car be tolerant of a poorly assembled vehicle? Surprised the list of the least reliable cars doesn't include Jeep vehicles. Me too. Based on what I've read the current crop of Jeeps have a terrible reputation for reliability problems and being outdated in design in general.Â* My daughter can't wait until her lease is up on a Jeep Liberty she has.Â* I've driven it. It's terrible. Transmission shudders at slow speeds but she was told it's "normal".Â* My brother also bought a Jeep Compass a couple of months ago, replacing a 12 year old, rotted out Dodge Ram pickup. His shutters also at slow speeds, so perhaps it *is* normal.Â* He's already shopping for a replacement for it Not much of a sampling but consistent with many of the on-line reviews. I had problems with my 72 AMC Jeep too but I beat the **** out of it. Followup:Â*Â* I received a call from my daughter an hour ago asking if I could give her a ride to her car dealership.Â* She had dropped her Jeep off for an inspection sticker this morning.Â* She also had a couple of lights out ... parking light and a running light and they all have to work to pass inspection. She didn't hear from the dealership all day and finally called them to see if it was ready.Â*Â* She was transferred to the service manager who told her, "There's a problem.Â* The problem with the lights is not the bulbs or LEDs.Â* There's a problem in the wiring of the vehicle and we haven't been able to trace it so far."Â*Â* So, they gave her a loaner .. a new Dodge Charger. About two months ago her Jeep suddenly started by itself in her driveway at about 1 am.Â* The lights turned on and the horn started beeping.Â* My son-in-law heard it, went out and somehow shut it off. Probably related to the wiring problem. Wow! Seriously. Sheesh. Hey, it's a Fiat. |
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#25
posted to rec.boats
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Consumer Reports Annual Reliability Survey
On Thu, 26 Oct 2017 18:34:16 -0400, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote: On 10/26/2017 6:15 PM, Keyser Soze wrote: On 10/26/17 6:13 PM, Mr. Luddite wrote: On 10/26/2017 4:14 PM, wrote: On Thu, 26 Oct 2017 14:20:37 -0400, "Mr. Luddite" wrote: On 10/26/2017 2:12 PM, Keyser Soze wrote: On 10/26/17 2:07 PM, wrote: On Thu, 26 Oct 2017 11:57:10 -0400, John H wrote: Here are the '10 Least Reliable Cars' from the latest CR reliability survey. The least of the least is at the bottom. Chevrolet Camaro Mercedes-Benz GLC Jaguar F-Pace GMC Acadia Fiat 500 Ford Focus Ford Fiesta Volvo XC90 Cadillac Escalade Tesla Model X All of these got 'one out of five' in the predicted reliability rating, based on the results of the owner surveys. Maybe folks are a bit more honest than we might think when it comes to rating their own cars. I wonder if some of this is just that a guy who paid $70-100k for a Cadillac or a Jag is a little less tolerant of a little misalignment of the door or a squeak behind the dash than a guy with a $20k Versa Why should the buyer of a new inexpensive car be tolerant of a poorly assembled vehicle? Surprised the list of the least reliable cars doesn't include Jeep vehicles. Me too. Based on what I've read the current crop of Jeeps have a terrible reputation for reliability problems and being outdated in design in general.* My daughter can't wait until her lease is up on a Jeep Liberty she has.* I've driven it. It's terrible. Transmission shudders at slow speeds but she was told it's "normal".* My brother also bought a Jeep Compass a couple of months ago, replacing a 12 year old, rotted out Dodge Ram pickup. His shutters also at slow speeds, so perhaps it *is* normal.* He's already shopping for a replacement for it Not much of a sampling but consistent with many of the on-line reviews. I had problems with my 72 AMC Jeep too but I beat the **** out of it. Followup:** I received a call from my daughter an hour ago asking if I could give her a ride to her car dealership.* She had dropped her Jeep off for an inspection sticker this morning.* She also had a couple of lights out ... parking light and a running light and they all have to work to pass inspection. She didn't hear from the dealership all day and finally called them to see if it was ready.** She was transferred to the service manager who told her, "There's a problem.* The problem with the lights is not the bulbs or LEDs.* There's a problem in the wiring of the vehicle and we haven't been able to trace it so far."** So, they gave her a loaner .. a new Dodge Charger. About two months ago her Jeep suddenly started by itself in her driveway at about 1 am.* The lights turned on and the horn started beeping.* My son-in-law heard it, went out and somehow shut it off. Probably related to the wiring problem. Wow! Seriously. Sheesh. Hey, it's a Fiat. === Fix It Again Tony |
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#26
posted to rec.boats
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Consumer Reports Annual Reliability Survey
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#27
posted to rec.boats
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Consumer Reports Annual Reliability Survey
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#28
posted to rec.boats
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Consumer Reports Annual Reliability Survey
wrote:
On Thu, 26 Oct 2017 14:17:46 -0400, John H wrote: On Thu, 26 Oct 2017 14:07:10 -0400, wrote: On Thu, 26 Oct 2017 11:57:10 -0400, John H wrote: Here are the '10 Least Reliable Cars' from the latest CR reliability survey. The least of the least is at the bottom. Chevrolet Camaro Mercedes-Benz GLC Jaguar F-Pace GMC Acadia Fiat 500 Ford Focus Ford Fiesta Volvo XC90 Cadillac Escalade Tesla Model X All of these got 'one out of five' in the predicted reliability rating, based on the results of the owner surveys. Maybe folks are a bit more honest than we might think when it comes to rating their own cars. I wonder if some of this is just that a guy who paid $70-100k for a Cadillac or a Jag is a little less tolerant of a little misalignment of the door or a squeak behind the dash than a guy with a $20k Versa Could well be. But if there are more misalignments or squeaks in the Cadillac or Jag then the various Lexus' then the ratings are doing their job. The CR survey covers about 25 different 'topics' in the auto section, like sound system, navigation, engine electronics, brakes, transmission, etc. Once a topic is identified, further questions are asked if the topic was a problem area. I wouldn't think may folks would whine about their transmission if their problem was a squeak in the dash. The principle is still there tho. If I have a new Lincoln that is shifting a little rough, I am complaining. If it is a Yugo, I might just believe that is how they work. I do agree Lexus (a premium Toyota) is a well built car but it was the Japs who taught Detroit about quality. In the 70s and 80s we were talking about how well Hondas were built and the UAW was still making jokes about leaving coke bottles in the door. The only one that surprised me was the Benz. I wonder where the GLC they tested was made? Finland? Those may be left over commies from the Trebant factory ;-) They are assembled in Alabama with German engines and transmission among other parts. |
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#29
posted to rec.boats
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Consumer Reports Annual Reliability Survey
Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 10/26/2017 4:14 PM, wrote: On Thu, 26 Oct 2017 14:20:37 -0400, "Mr. Luddite" wrote: On 10/26/2017 2:12 PM, Keyser Soze wrote: On 10/26/17 2:07 PM, wrote: On Thu, 26 Oct 2017 11:57:10 -0400, John H wrote: Here are the '10 Least Reliable Cars' from the latest CR reliability survey. The least of the least is at the bottom. Chevrolet Camaro Mercedes-Benz GLC Jaguar F-Pace GMC Acadia Fiat 500 Ford Focus Ford Fiesta Volvo XC90 Cadillac Escalade Tesla Model X All of these got 'one out of five' in the predicted reliability rating, based on the results of the owner surveys. Maybe folks are a bit more honest than we might think when it comes to rating their own cars. I wonder if some of this is just that a guy who paid $70-100k for a Cadillac or a Jag is a little less tolerant of a little misalignment of the door or a squeak behind the dash than a guy with a $20k Versa Why should the buyer of a new inexpensive car be tolerant of a poorly assembled vehicle? Surprised the list of the least reliable cars doesn't include Jeep vehicles. Me too. Based on what I've read the current crop of Jeeps have a terrible reputation for reliability problems and being outdated in design in general. My daughter can't wait until her lease is up on a Jeep Liberty she has. I've driven it. It's terrible. Transmission shudders at slow speeds but she was told it's "normal". My brother also bought a Jeep Compass a couple of months ago, replacing a 12 year old, rotted out Dodge Ram pickup. His shutters also at slow speeds, so perhaps it *is* normal. He's already shopping for a replacement for it Not much of a sampling but consistent with many of the on-line reviews. I had problems with my 72 AMC Jeep too but I beat the **** out of it. Followup: I received a call from my daughter an hour ago asking if I could give her a ride to her car dealership. She had dropped her Jeep off for an inspection sticker this morning. She also had a couple of lights out ... parking light and a running light and they all have to work to pass inspection. She didn't hear from the dealership all day and finally called them to see if it was ready. She was transferred to the service manager who told her, "There's a problem. The problem with the lights is not the bulbs or LEDs. There's a problem in the wiring of the vehicle and we haven't been able to trace it so far." So, they gave her a loaner .. a new Dodge Charger. About two months ago her Jeep suddenly started by itself in her driveway at about 1 am. The lights turned on and the horn started beeping. My son-in-law heard it, went out and somehow shut it off. Probably related to the wiring problem. Tell her to drive that Charger like she stole it! |
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#30
posted to rec.boats
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Consumer Reports Annual Reliability Survey
On Thu, 26 Oct 2017 19:12:44 -0400, Wayne.B
wrote: On Thu, 26 Oct 2017 16:54:14 -0400, wrote: The reality is that for most people "quality" is really pretty far down on the list of what they look into when buying a car. They look at price, styling, performance, maybe gas mileage and the doodads available. Then there is the culture. Ford people buy Fords, Toyota people buy Toyotas etc. === I'm not sure I agree with that, maybe true for people who lease or trade cars a lot. My preference is to buy a high quality car, maintain it well, and drive it until it is ready to drop - typically 15 years or so. Why? I'd rather spend my money on boats and boating. You are not the usual car buyer. The churn used to be 2 years, now I think it is up around 5 or 6 but still not 15 OTOH my Ford truck is 17 years old and the Honda is 20. I will probably think they are ready to drop long after you would have let them go ;-) I tell everyone, do not buy a car from me. |
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