"Harry Krause" wrote in message
...
Ahh, but if you were capable of thinking abstractly, you would realize
that Wal-Mart in many ways *is* dictating your preferences.


I have no Wal*Mart preference but I will shop there when it is convenient.
I just resent some individual with their own axe to grind trying to tell me
where to shop. If I want to shop discount store I tend to shop at the
closest at the time.

Let the marketplace decide (Economics 101?).

Tex

On 27 Nov 2003 21:55:06 -0800, (Just In Time)
wrote:

Say NO NO NO to Wal-Mart!!!


I've pretty much stopped buying from wally-world. I think everybody
should stop and examine what these mega chains do to the economy.
This is all about buying quality-challenged stuff dirt cheap and the
net result is settling for less that"better," sending most of you hard
earned cash overseas, and putting a lot of the smaller service
oriented Ma&Pa's out of business.

When you can't find a chandlery or tackle shop, you'll see what I
mean. Try asking your local wally-world trained barcode scanner
associate where and how to use 5200 or what type of rig to use for
yellow-fin. You'll glimpse a snapshot of the future.

We, as Americans, can really do better for ourselves.

Gene Kearns wrote:

On 27 Nov 2003 21:55:06 -0800, (Just In Time)
wrote:

Say NO NO NO to Wal-Mart!!!


I've pretty much stopped buying from wally-world. I think everybody
should stop and examine what these mega chains do to the economy.
This is all about buying quality-challenged stuff dirt cheap and the
net result is settling for less that"better," sending most of you hard
earned cash overseas, and putting a lot of the smaller service
oriented Ma&Pa's out of business.

When you can't find a chandlery or tackle shop, you'll see what I
mean. Try asking your local wally-world trained barcode scanner
associate where and how to use 5200 or what type of rig to use for
yellow-fin. You'll glimpse a snapshot of the future.

We, as Americans, can really do better for ourselves.


Think about the well-trained and motivated Wal-Mart clerks who work
behind the pharmacy counter. Now that is scary. Not the pharmacist...the
worker bee crew. No training, bad pay, no benefits.

Wal-Mart actually advises its workers who are excluded from its crummy
health care plan to apply for public assistance.

Yep. We're subsidizing Wal-Mart and its profiteering.

Wal-Mart is the true reflection of the Conservative Vision of
Corporation Uber Alles.





--
Email sent to is never read.

Gene,
Exactly right. We complain about our corporation's short term obsession
but if we, as consumers , only look at the price, we'll put ourselves out of
business as a nation of independent business people. Maybe it's an
atmosphere of greed rather than solidarity.
Paul

"Gene Kearns" wrote in message
...
On 27 Nov 2003 21:55:06 -0800, (Just In Time)
wrote:

Say NO NO NO to Wal-Mart!!!


I've pretty much stopped buying from wally-world. I think everybody
should stop and examine what these mega chains do to the economy.
This is all about buying quality-challenged stuff dirt cheap and the
net result is settling for less that"better," sending most of you hard
earned cash overseas, and putting a lot of the smaller service
oriented Ma&Pa's out of business.

When you can't find a chandlery or tackle shop, you'll see what I
mean. Try asking your local wally-world trained barcode scanner
associate where and how to use 5200 or what type of rig to use for
yellow-fin. You'll glimpse a snapshot of the future.

We, as Americans, can really do better for ourselves.

Tex Houston wrote:
"Harry Krause" wrote in message
...
Ahh, but if you were capable of thinking abstractly, you would realize
that Wal-Mart in many ways *is* dictating your preferences.


I have no Wal*Mart preference but I will shop there when it is convenient.
I just resent some individual with their own axe to grind trying to tell me
where to shop. If I want to shop discount store I tend to shop at the
closest at the time.

Let the marketplace decide (Economics 101?).

Tex



As I stated previously, you don't seem capable of thinking abstractly.
Wal-Mart is deciding where you will shop. Think it through. Think of all
the stores that close because of Wal-Mart. Think of all the American
workers out of a decent job because of Wal-Mart. Think of the varieties
of selection diminished because of Wal-Mart.

Got it?

--
Email sent to is never read.

"Harry Krause" wrote in message
...
As I stated previously, you don't seem capable of thinking abstractly.
Wal-Mart is deciding where you will shop. Think it through. Think of all
the stores that close because of Wal-Mart. Think of all the American
workers out of a decent job because of Wal-Mart. Think of the varieties
of selection diminished because of Wal-Mart.

Got it?

If a store was not competive in price, service, etc allowing a Wal*Mart to
achive a market share starting with one unit, was that store serving our
interest in the first place? If Wal*Mart leaves an opening for a competitor
due to 'not minding the store' (pun intended) a competitor will indeed
appear. You've singled out one store but the model appears in all
marketplaces. How much variety is there in an average mall?

I live in an area of about 500,000 people and still tend to buy downtown
where the stores are individual setups but why would I condemn a chain
because they saw a need and fulfilled it. Sam Walton must have satisfied a
need for someone. My first experience with them was not a good one as the
store was quite small, crowded with merchandise and not all that clean.
That store is no longer open. We did not have a store here at the time and
I wondered...is this what all the talk is about?

Tex

"Harry Krause" wrote in message
...
As I stated previously, you don't seem capable of thinking abstractly.
Wal-Mart is deciding where you will shop. Think it through. Think of all
the stores that close because of Wal-Mart. Think of all the American
workers out of a decent job because of Wal-Mart. Think of the varieties
of selection diminished because of Wal-Mart.

Actually I have access to a wider variety of merchandise
today than I could ever possibly need. Wal-Mart sells
discount goods and this only makes up a small portion
of the overall consumer market. I go there when they
have something that I need. That only happens a few
times a year.

"Harry Krause" wrote in message
...
Tex Houston wrote:
"Harry Krause" wrote in message
...
Ahh, but if you were capable of thinking abstractly, you would realize
that Wal-Mart in many ways *is* dictating your preferences.


I have no Wal*Mart preference but I will shop there when it is
convenient.
I just resent some individual with their own axe to grind trying to tell
me
where to shop. If I want to shop discount store I tend to shop at the
closest at the time.

Let the marketplace decide (Economics 101?).

Tex



As I stated previously, you don't seem capable of thinking abstractly.
Wal-Mart is deciding where you will shop. Think it through. Think of all
the stores that close because of Wal-Mart. Think of all the American
workers out of a decent job because of Wal-Mart. Think of the varieties
of selection diminished because of Wal-Mart.

Got it?


Nope and you don't either. Within 5 miles of my home are at least 20
clothing stores, 5 drug stores, 9 Ace and Tru-Value Hardware stores, 3
nurseries, 7 grocery stores, 4 book sellers, 3 shoe stores, 2 mega toy
stores, 2 super-mega electronics stores, countless gas stations, sundry
independent retailers and two Super Wal-Marts.

I have lived in 6 large and small towns in the last 15 years. In each case
when Wal-Mart/Sam's Club, Costco, Home Depot or Lowe's came to town all the
small INEFFICIENT retails sang songs of woe. In every case, those retailers
who studies their markets and offered selection and service survived and
prospered. Those who had been lazy and grossly overcharging their customers
promptly went out of business; deservedly so.

Tell me again how Wal-Mart has diminished my shopping choices.

--
Dave Thompson

On Fri, 28 Nov 2003, Dave Thompson wrote:
In each case
when Wal-Mart/Sam's Club, Costco, Home Depot or Lowe's came to town all the
small INEFFICIENT retails sang songs of woe. In every case, those retailers
who studies their markets and offered selection and service survived and
prospered. Those who had been lazy and grossly overcharging their customers
promptly went out of business; deservedly so.

Well said.

What also isn't mentioned is that those small inefficient retailers which
gouge their customers often pay their employees LESS than Wal*Mart. Most
pay minimum wage and expect their employees to put in unpaid overtime.
When a Wal*Mart begins construction the first thing the employees at the
dinky little stores do is fill out job applications at Wal*Mart.

A Wal*Mart is opening locally next year. I can predict which local
retailers will die and which ones will survive. None of the doomed ones
will be missed.

In the case of one particular business, I will cheer when it closes its
doors. The owner offended me to the point that I will drive 30+ miles to
get to (what is now) the nearest Wal*Mart rather than buy from there, even
if the cost of the gas is more than the price savings. Needless to say,
that individual is one of the head cheerleaders of the anti-Wal*Mart
group (which just lost their final appeal).

As for the ones that will survive... They're the ones which, when I ask
about something they don't carry, say "We can order that for you, and if
you're in a hurry I can have it fedex'ed here tommorrow." They're the
ones who want to sell me the products that I want to buy (as opposed to
the products they want to sell).

-- Mark --

http://staff.washington.edu/mrc
Science does not emerge from voting, party politics, or public debate.
Si vis pacem, para bellum.

In article ,
"Tex Houston" wrote:

"Harry Krause" wrote in message
...
Ahh, but if you were capable of thinking abstractly, you would realize
that Wal-Mart in many ways *is* dictating your preferences.


I have no Wal*Mart preference but I will shop there when it is convenient.
I just resent some individual with their own axe to grind trying to tell me
where to shop. If I want to shop discount store I tend to shop at the
closest at the time.

Let the marketplace decide (Economics 101?).

Tex



Except in this case, it isn't the marketplace deciding. Wal-mart forces
manufacturers to meet their specs. "We will *ONLY* carry laundry soap
packaged in 410 gram plastic buckets shipped as pallets 4 layers high,
and we will only pay $X.YY per unit for it - No, we don't care that your
cardboard box packaging at 413 grams per unit is more cost-effective or
environmentally freindly. No, we don't care that the customer WANTS the
413 gram box, and that you can give it to us for a third of the cost of
the 410 gram tub. Either do it our way, or we go to your competition,
the XYZ soap company, and shut you out of the market completely."

Wal-mart forces customers to shop only there through the fact that by
sheer size (ignore the pressure they apply to manufacturers that I
mentioned above for the moment) they can and do run any other
competition in a town out, leaving no option.

Wal-mart pays their employees next to nothing, and, simply fires all
employees and shuts the store down at the first hint of union activity
that could force them into paying a competitive wage in a store. Despite
the fact that I hate unions with a passion, this is *WRONG*. The pay
that a Wal-mart employee takes home isn't sufficient for them to shop
anyplace BUT Wal-mart, and there have been rumors (you decide yourself
about the fallacy or reality - to *ME* they're rumors. To someone else,
they may be "This happened to me") of Wal-mart employees being seen in
other stores one day coming in to work the next day to find they've been
given their walking papers. Never, of course, for any reason related to
being in the other store, but hey, who on this planet doesn't have
*SOMETHING* that can be used against them to legitimize their firing?

Tex, it isn't that Wal-mart is "bad" in and of itself. I'll argue
against anyone who claims it is. It's the fact that Wal-Mart is, much
like Microsoft, forcing consumers to give up choice through pressure
that can only be applied by someone with a monopoly or near-monopoly
position in the market. "I used to buy my tuna in 10 ounce cans, but all
you've got on the shelf are 8 ounce cans at half again the price. When
are you going to get the regular cans back in? We're not. Buy what we
sell, or suffer with nothing." The worst part is, in MANY MANY MANY
places, that's exactly what the customer *MUST* do: Wal-mart has driven
all competition out of town, and the only place to shop is there. Which
is exactly what their operating goal is: Shut down anything that looks
like competition, either indirectly, through their massive size and
attendant ability to almost literally give merchandise away until
there's noplace left in town for customers to turn to (the "company
store in a company town" concept) or they outright buy up and shut down
any competition that doesn't fold from the first method.

Wal-mart as a concept is great. Wal-mart as a reality is the death-knell
for a town's economy. Don't take my word for it - look around and see
how many towns that have had a Wal-mart move in are losing their other
retailers in numbers that are hard to believe.

No, Tex, it isn't about letting the marketplace decide. It's about
keeping the marketplace from being decided for you by the corporate
power that is Wal-mart.

--
Don Bruder - --- Preferred Email - SpamAssassinated.
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