JAXAshby wrote:
That's not true on the SF bay. Tugs with barges have stand on.



they do on LIS as well.

Says who?

You fictionalizing again Doodles?

Jonathan Ganz wrote:
That's not true on the SF bay. Tugs with barges have stand on.


I would want to read the nav regs for SF bay before I agreed fully with
that.
I believe the bay has a number of "traffic separation schemes" which
fall under SF traffic and thus "shall not impede" becomes important.
However, this is not a clear "stand-on" condition although many treat it
as such and justifiably so.

otn

On Mon, 16 Aug 2004 03:38:10 GMT, something compelled otnmbrd
, to say:



Jonathan Ganz wrote:
That's not true on the SF bay. Tugs with barges have stand on.


I would want to read the nav regs for SF bay before I agreed fully with
that.
I believe the bay has a number of "traffic separation schemes" which
fall under SF traffic and thus "shall not impede" becomes important.
However, this is not a clear "stand-on" condition although many treat it
as such and justifiably so.


F=MA. It's all you really need to know.

The tow has no special status unless it declares itself a RAM (Restricted
Ability to Maneuver) and displays the appropraite lights in addition to the
tow
lights..


tugs with tow on LIS display the correct running lights at night. There are
enough CG boats around to ensure that.

gonefishiing wrote:

what would you have done differently?

Hailed them on the radio to reduce/remove doubt regarding their intentions?


--
Wally
www.artbywally.com
www.wally.myby.co.uk

gf, that is a crock of squat.

a.) no barge coming out from under the Throgs Neck is heading *east* at least
until it nears City Island a couple miles to the northeast, and

b.) there is no ships traffic on western LIS except for
veeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeery occasionally, and

c.) commercial traffic on that part of the Sound is limited to about 7 knots.

*if* you missed seeing an approaching barge you were asleep for quite some
time.

don't give up your day job. fiction writing is not likely to make you any
money for the foreable future.

From: "gonefishiing"
Date: 8/15/2004 4:39 PM Eastern Daylight Time
Message-id:

out for a late night sail last week, which i do a lot of.
western edge of long island sound, ny
on a port tack heading southwest towards the throgs neck bridge.
slack tide.
particulary dark night.
full main and jib set
15 knots wind

keeping a vigilant eye out for ships, i spot a black form against the lights
of the city in front of me and realize it is a tug and barge and i also
realize (in the absence of visible nav lights) his small profile means he is
headed right at me and steaming.

i decide to tack the boat around 180 degrees and give him some
room........assuming (correctly) his course has 2 possiblities--he is going
to continue eastbound in the sound or he is going to turn north towards
eastchester bay to anchor his barge (partial mistake no.1?). he turns
northeast towards the barge anchorage, paralleling my course and i am east
of him and the barge anchorage- out of his way.

towards the east i spot another ship (freighter) steaming westbound for the
gate. he is north of the lane that most of the commerical ships take for the
bridge. and a quick visual calculation tells me i can cross his bow without
problem and also because he needs to turn behind my stern to set his course
for the bridge (and soon!) (partial mistake no.2?)

they are both aware that i am here-- million candle power lights
illuminating sails had a way of doing that. (my light)

1: the freighter, westbound, is not turning although i have crossed his
bow--only slightly and he'll end up passing beyond me, far too close and
moving fast.
2: the tug/barge decides to steer a circle around the barge anchorage and
end up eastbound again --off my port beam and close enough that i can see
the pilot. he has slowed down significantly at this point as i am now
between both vessels. (on a starboard tack)

3: they both passed "safely" at my stern, to the south of me the freigher
first, the tug next.

this was really too close for comfort, and i had my hands full sailing.
not to negate my responsiblity, i think constrained by draft here is a
relative term, if it even applies. they each had a mile of room to the south
(behind me) to manuveur and cannot understand why they would choose to
approach so closely, as my actions were clear, my course was appropriate and
consistent and meant to give each a wide berth

and for whatever it may be worth, i think everyone took the correct actions
i believe i was the stand on vessel
the freighter was 2nd in pecking order
the tug/barge gave way

what would you have done differently?

gf.

Its pretty clear the jax has never sailed in these waters ...
"JAXAshby" wrote in message
...
gf, that is a crock of squat.

a.) no barge coming out from under the Throgs Neck is heading *east* at least
until it nears City Island a couple miles to the northeast, and


The Throgs Neck Bridge is almost exactly North/South, and the channel is almost
exactly East/West. The tow may have begun to turn North, but is essentially
heading East as it passes under the bridge. And regardless of the exact
heading, vessels in the area would be described as "eastbound" or "westbound."


b.) there is no ships traffic on western LIS except for
veeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeery occasionally, and

I've been through there a half dozen times in the last few years and have
encountered traffic each time. I was at King's Point last weekend and saw
commercial traffic go by.



c.) commercial traffic on that part of the Sound is limited to about 7 knots.

*if* you missed seeing an approaching barge you were asleep for quite some
time.

Unless, of course, it was hidden by Throgs Neck.

Of course, at 7 knots a mile goes by in less than 9 minutes.


don't give up your day job. fiction writing is not likely to make you any
money for the foreable future.

Hey jaxie, are you still claiming you sail nearby? Very doubtful, jaxie.



From: "gonefishiing"
Date: 8/15/2004 4:39 PM Eastern Daylight Time
Message-id:

out for a late night sail last week, which i do a lot of.
western edge of long island sound, ny
on a port tack heading southwest towards the throgs neck bridge.
slack tide.
particulary dark night.
full main and jib set
15 knots wind

keeping a vigilant eye out for ships, i spot a black form against the lights
of the city in front of me and realize it is a tug and barge and i also
realize (in the absence of visible nav lights) his small profile means he is
headed right at me and steaming.

i decide to tack the boat around 180 degrees and give him some
room........assuming (correctly) his course has 2 possiblities--he is going
to continue eastbound in the sound or he is going to turn north towards
eastchester bay to anchor his barge (partial mistake no.1?). he turns
northeast towards the barge anchorage, paralleling my course and i am east
of him and the barge anchorage- out of his way.

towards the east i spot another ship (freighter) steaming westbound for the
gate. he is north of the lane that most of the commerical ships take for the
bridge. and a quick visual calculation tells me i can cross his bow without
problem and also because he needs to turn behind my stern to set his course
for the bridge (and soon!) (partial mistake no.2?)

they are both aware that i am here-- million candle power lights
illuminating sails had a way of doing that. (my light)

1: the freighter, westbound, is not turning although i have crossed his
bow--only slightly and he'll end up passing beyond me, far too close and
moving fast.
2: the tug/barge decides to steer a circle around the barge anchorage and
end up eastbound again --off my port beam and close enough that i can see
the pilot. he has slowed down significantly at this point as i am now
between both vessels. (on a starboard tack)

3: they both passed "safely" at my stern, to the south of me the freigher
first, the tug next.

this was really too close for comfort, and i had my hands full sailing.
not to negate my responsiblity, i think constrained by draft here is a
relative term, if it even applies. they each had a mile of room to the south
(behind me) to manuveur and cannot understand why they would choose to
approach so closely, as my actions were clear, my course was appropriate and
consistent and meant to give each a wide berth

and for whatever it may be worth, i think everyone took the correct actions
i believe i was the stand on vessel
the freighter was 2nd in pecking order
the tug/barge gave way

what would you have done differently?

gf.

jeffies, it is my sailing waters for the last 12 years.

Its pretty clear the jax has never sailed in these waters ...
"JAXAshby" wrote in message
...
gf, that is a crock of squat.

a.) no barge coming out from under the Throgs Neck is heading *east* at
least
until it nears City Island a couple miles to the northeast, and


The Throgs Neck Bridge is almost exactly North/South, and the channel is
almost
exactly East/West. The tow may have begun to turn North, but is essentially
heading East as it passes under the bridge. And regardless of the exact
heading, vessels in the area would be described as "eastbound" or
"westbound."


b.) there is no ships traffic on western LIS except for
veeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeery occasionally, and

I've been through there a half dozen times in the last few years and have
encountered traffic each time. I was at King's Point last weekend and saw
commercial traffic go by.



c.) commercial traffic on that part of the Sound is limited to about 7
knots.

*if* you missed seeing an approaching barge you were asleep for quite some
time.

Unless, of course, it was hidden by Throgs Neck.

Of course, at 7 knots a mile goes by in less than 9 minutes.


don't give up your day job. fiction writing is not likely to make you any
money for the foreable future.

Hey jaxie, are you still claiming you sail nearby? Very doubtful, jaxie.



From: "gonefishiing"
Date: 8/15/2004 4:39 PM Eastern Daylight Time
Message-id:

out for a late night sail last week, which i do a lot of.
western edge of long island sound, ny
on a port tack heading southwest towards the throgs neck bridge.
slack tide.
particulary dark night.
full main and jib set
15 knots wind

keeping a vigilant eye out for ships, i spot a black form against the
lights
of the city in front of me and realize it is a tug and barge and i also
realize (in the absence of visible nav lights) his small profile means he
is
headed right at me and steaming.

i decide to tack the boat around 180 degrees and give him some
room........assuming (correctly) his course has 2 possiblities--he is
going
to continue eastbound in the sound or he is going to turn north towards
eastchester bay to anchor his barge (partial mistake no.1?). he turns
northeast towards the barge anchorage, paralleling my course and i am east
of him and the barge anchorage- out of his way.

towards the east i spot another ship (freighter) steaming westbound for
the
gate. he is north of the lane that most of the commerical ships take for
the
bridge. and a quick visual calculation tells me i can cross his bow
without
problem and also because he needs to turn behind my stern to set his
course
for the bridge (and soon!) (partial mistake no.2?)

they are both aware that i am here-- million candle power lights
illuminating sails had a way of doing that. (my light)

1: the freighter, westbound, is not turning although i have crossed his
bow--only slightly and he'll end up passing beyond me, far too close and
moving fast.
2: the tug/barge decides to steer a circle around the barge anchorage and
end up eastbound again --off my port beam and close enough that i can see
the pilot. he has slowed down significantly at this point as i am now
between both vessels. (on a starboard tack)

3: they both passed "safely" at my stern, to the south of me the freigher
first, the tug next.

this was really too close for comfort, and i had my hands full sailing.
not to negate my responsiblity, i think constrained by draft here is a
relative term, if it even applies. they each had a mile of room to the
south
(behind me) to manuveur and cannot understand why they would choose to
approach so closely, as my actions were clear, my course was appropriate
and
consistent and meant to give each a wide berth

and for whatever it may be worth, i think everyone took the correct
actions
i believe i was the stand on vessel
the freighter was 2nd in pecking order
the tug/barge gave way

what would you have done differently?

gf.

"JAXAshby" wrote in message
...
jeffies, it is my sailing waters for the last 12 years.

You claim that but then prove yourself a liar by not knowing which way the TN
bridge goes. Admit it, jaxie, you've never actually been on a boat, have you?

[yuk]






From: "Jeff Morris"
Date: 8/15/2004 7:45 PM Eastern Daylight Time
Message-id:

"JAXAshby" wrote in message
...
jeffies, it is my sailing waters for the last 12 years.

You claim that but then prove yourself a liar by not knowing which way the TN
bridge goes. Admit it, jaxie, you've never actually been on a boat, have
you?