On Tue, 20 Jul 2010 20:08:42 -0700, "Califbill"
wrote:



"bpuharic" wrote in message
.. .
On Tue, 20 Jul 2010 19:20:56 -0400, wrote:


too bad the right wing destroyed the pension system in this country
and let the rich replace it with 401k's.



For those of in demand for jobs, 401k's were great. I was with NCR for 17.5
years.

no one cares about you. there are 100,000,000 americans who are as
self absorbed as you are.

less than 50% of companies even have a pension plan. and with the
massive turnovers in jobs, no one stays at a company long enough to
collect a pension.

the right has, at every turn, gutted the ability of the middle class
to earn a living wage or have a decent retirement

"bpuharic" wrote in message
...
On Tue, 20 Jul 2010 20:08:42 -0700, "Califbill"
wrote:



"bpuharic" wrote in message
. ..
On Tue, 20 Jul 2010 19:20:56 -0400, wrote:


too bad the right wing destroyed the pension system in this country
and let the rich replace it with 401k's.



For those of in demand for jobs, 401k's were great. I was with NCR for
17.5
years.

no one cares about you. there are 100,000,000 americans who are as
self absorbed as you are.

less than 50% of companies even have a pension plan. and with the
massive turnovers in jobs, no one stays at a company long enough to
collect a pension.

the right has, at every turn, gutted the ability of the middle class
to earn a living wage or have a decent retirement


Yup, no one cares about you and your finances. Even your 401k manager. So
you better learn to care for yourself. As my TI in USAF basic said, if you
can not take care of yourself, you can not take care of your buddy. And
those job changes and no able to vest in a pension makes 401k's even better.
As Gretwell says, look at your choices. The middle class has a living wage.
By definition they live in the middle. The problem you babyboomers /
GenXers have decided that a living wage is $200,000 a year. You have to be
able to afford a nice couple cars, nice boat, 3000 sq ft. home, and a 3 week
vacation in some really nice 4 star place. You are in error.

On Wed, 21 Jul 2010 09:51:31 -0700, "Califbill"
wrote:



"bpuharic" wrote in message
.. .
On Tue, 20 Jul 2010 20:08:42 -0700, "Califbill"
wrote:



no one cares about you. there are 100,000,000 americans who are as
self absorbed as you are.

less than 50% of companies even have a pension plan. and with the
massive turnovers in jobs, no one stays at a company long enough to
collect a pension.

the right has, at every turn, gutted the ability of the middle class
to earn a living wage or have a decent retirement


Yup, no one cares about you and your finances. Even your 401k manager.

absolutely true. but i care about the 100M americans in similar shape,
and how the right wing continues to sell us down the river

So
you better learn to care for yourself.

gee. guess you haven't noticed i am. first step

destroy the rigth wing.

THAT is taking care of myself!

As my TI in USAF basic said, if you
can not take care of yourself, you can not take care of your buddy. And
those job changes and no able to vest in a pension makes 401k's even better.
As Gretwell says, look at your choices. The middle class has a living wage.

bull****. it DIDNT have a living wage. THAT'S the problem! it hasnt
had a real wage increase on 10 years.

any other fairy tales you want to spread?

By definition they live in the middle. The problem you babyboomers /
GenXers have decided that a living wage is $200,000 a year. You have to be
able to afford a nice couple cars, nice boat, 3000 sq ft. home, and a 3 week
vacation in some really nice 4 star place. You are in error.


ah. blame the middle class. that's the right wing solution to
everyting.

protect the rich

blame the middle class

On 21/07/2010 3:26 PM, bpuharic wrote:
On Wed, 21 Jul 2010 09:51:31 -0700, "Califbill"
wrote:



wrote in message
...
On Tue, 20 Jul 2010 20:08:42 -0700, "Califbill"
wrote:



no one cares about you. there are 100,000,000 americans who are as
self absorbed as you are.

less than 50% of companies even have a pension plan. and with the
massive turnovers in jobs, no one stays at a company long enough to
collect a pension.

the right has, at every turn, gutted the ability of the middle class
to earn a living wage or have a decent retirement


Yup, no one cares about you and your finances. Even your 401k manager.

absolutely true. but i care about the 100M americans in similar shape,
and how the right wing continues to sell us down the river

So
you better learn to care for yourself.

gee. guess you haven't noticed i am. first step

destroy the rigth wing.

THAT is taking care of myself!

As my TI in USAF basic said, if you
can not take care of yourself, you can not take care of your buddy. And
those job changes and no able to vest in a pension makes 401k's even better.
As Gretwell says, look at your choices. The middle class has a living wage.

bull****. it DIDNT have a living wage. THAT'S the problem! it hasnt
had a real wage increase on 10 years.

any other fairy tales you want to spread?

By definition they live in the middle. The problem you babyboomers /
GenXers have decided that a living wage is $200,000 a year. You have to be
able to afford a nice couple cars, nice boat, 3000 sq ft. home, and a 3 week
vacation in some really nice 4 star place. You are in error.


ah. blame the middle class. that's the right wing solution to
everyting.

protect the rich

blame the middle class

CalifBill said it right, no one gives a crap that you lost. And you
lost because you were stupid.

--

Government has liberals, idealists and lawyers, but where is the common
sense?

On Wed, 21 Jul 2010 18:22:20 -0600, Canuck57
wrote:

On 21/07/2010 3:26 PM, bpuharic wrote:
On Wed, 21 Jul 2010 09:51:31 -0700, "Califbill"
wrote:


bull****. it DIDNT have a living wage. THAT'S the problem! it hasnt
had a real wage increase on 10 years.

any other fairy tales you want to spread?

By definition they live in the middle. The problem you babyboomers /
GenXers have decided that a living wage is $200,000 a year. You have to be
able to afford a nice couple cars, nice boat, 3000 sq ft. home, and a 3 week
vacation in some really nice 4 star place. You are in error.


ah. blame the middle class. that's the right wing solution to
everyting.

protect the rich

blame the middle class

CalifBill said it right, no one gives a crap that you lost. And you
lost because you were stupid.

no, i lost because i was middle class. you seem to forget that there
are 100M in the same shape i'm in

but, then, you're right wing. the problems of the middle class dont
interest you at all. not a bit

"bpuharic" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 21 Jul 2010 18:22:20 -0600, Canuck57
wrote:

On 21/07/2010 3:26 PM, bpuharic wrote:
On Wed, 21 Jul 2010 09:51:31 -0700, "Califbill"
wrote:


bull****. it DIDNT have a living wage. THAT'S the problem! it hasnt
had a real wage increase on 10 years.

any other fairy tales you want to spread?

By definition they live in the middle. The problem you babyboomers /
GenXers have decided that a living wage is $200,000 a year. You have
to be
able to afford a nice couple cars, nice boat, 3000 sq ft. home, and a 3
week
vacation in some really nice 4 star place. You are in error.


ah. blame the middle class. that's the right wing solution to
everyting.

protect the rich

blame the middle class

CalifBill said it right, no one gives a crap that you lost. And you
lost because you were stupid.

no, i lost because i was middle class. you seem to forget that there
are 100M in the same shape i'm in

but, then, you're right wing. the problems of the middle class dont
interest you at all. not a bit


Where the hell you get 100,000,000? Another factoid pulled out of your ass!
a 1/3 of the people in the us are not middle class workers. There were only
120,000,000 employed in 2008. Most people, middle class included had less
than $50k in savings and retirement funds when they retired. And that was
before the crash. Most did not lose much in the crash, as they had spent
all the money they made already. A few years ago, we discussed the cost of
boats on this group. At least one person said they did not care what the
boat cost, but what the payment per month were. They ignored the fact the
boat loan was for 15 years for a $9,000 boat. That attitude was and is
rampant in both the lower and middle class. Admit it, you made bad choices,
and are economically ignorant. We lost jobs because people decided a living
wage was required, and that living wage was enough to be upper middle class
in the last 60 years. the local transit district BART, pays a driver, who
sits and checks that no one is stuck in the doors at the stop and if the
control goes down will drive to the next station at 25 mph. Tracks, no
steering wheel. No crossing guard to worry about. Maybe a GED required.
$80k salary and $60k in benefits. The workers say they require a living
wage. No they don't require an upscale living wage. We have priced
ourselves out of the market. Our exports are airplanes and food. To things
we really build well, or have the skill and land to grow. How the hell are
you going to compete with an engineer in India that has better education to
equivalent to yours and will work for $40k? This is who we are competing
with. Those 3rd world countries are requiring their children to go to
school and learn. Not go to school part time and ignore homework etc. Not
like Washington DC with a 52% DROPOUT rate and the highest cost per student
in the US. Chicago with a 76% male African-American dropout rate. We are
racing to the bottom because of a bunch of spoiled whiners. You are a prime
example. No raise in 10 years, says you suck at your job. Go get another
one. Improve your performance and attitude. Only reason all those homes
sold for a 25% increase in price, was because a government required banks,
etc to loan money for home purchase regardless of ability to pay. And the
government bought those loans. So Clinton, Bush, etc. all were pushing the
bubble. And when the first person could not sell his house for more than
his cost and could not make the payment when the 1% 3 year or 5 year
interest only loan reset to actually be a loan, the house of cards started
crashing. 100% Democrat and Republican and Independent Congress peoples
fault. Not Wall Street, not the big banks. They were going along because
the government was giving them huge profits. Wall streets and the big banks
were greedy so they insured the loans and sold them for even more profit.
That was criminal, but all started because government gave away the house.

On Wed, 21 Jul 2010 21:28:20 -0700, "Califbill"
wrote:



"bpuharic" wrote in message
.. .
On Wed, 21 Jul 2010 18:22:20 -0600, Canuck57
wrote:

no, i lost because i was middle class. you seem to forget that there
are 100M in the same shape i'm in

but, then, you're right wing. the problems of the middle class dont
interest you at all. not a bit


Where the hell you get 100,000,000? Another factoid pulled out of your ass!
a 1/3 of the people in the us are not middle class workers. There were only
120,000,000 employed in 2008. Most people, middle class included had less
than $50k in savings and retirement funds when they retired. And that was
before the crash. Most did not lose much in the crash, as they had spent
all the money they made already.

the question is, what does this have to do with anything? the issue is
the situation of the middle class. that includes joblessness, decrease
in wealth (including 401K's, home assets, etc) and the fact we havent
had a raise in 30 years while the richest 1% have had a 500% increase
in income


A few years ago, we discussed the cost of
boats on this group. At least one person sid they did not care what the
boat cost, but what the payment per month were. They ignored the fact the
boat loan was for 15 years for a $9,000 boat. That attitude was and is
rampant in both the lower and middle class.

more proof that the right hates the middle class. nothing changed for
the middle class in terms of attiitudes. what DID change is the
financial sector's rapacious GREED in inventing new financial
instruments and using these to transfer MASSIVE amounts of wealth FROM
the middle class TO the rich by bush's tax cuts, lack of sharing
increases in productivity, etc

there's a reason the GINI coefficient, which measures income
inequality, is the WORST For the US vs other democracies. there's a
reason the middle class hasnt had a raise in 30 years....and that
reason is GREED on the part of wall street and others who control the
economy

you have NOTHING but emotion. no data. no facts. you have right wing
mythology, fables and fairy tales you use to comfort yourself about
why the rich are blessed of god while the middle class deserves
poverty

Admit it, you made bad choices,
and are economically ignorant. We lost jobs because people decided a living
wage was required, and that living wage was enough to be upper middle class
in the last 60 years.

PERFECT EXAMPLE of what i'm talking about...you insist that the US,
which has the POOREST GINI coefficient has a greedy middle class when
it's the RICH who are greedy.

you're very right wing. you're a PERFECT example of how ARROGANT the
right wing is.
No raise in 10 years, says you suck at your job

more right wing bull****

NOBODY in the middle class has had a raise; NOBODY

dooes the ENTIRE middle class suck at their jobs?

WHY is this ONLY in the US? is it ONLY the US middle class that sucks?

you are SO filled with bizarre right wing bull**** it's laughable!

.. 100% Democrat and Republican and Independent Congress peoples
fault. Not Wall Street, not the big banks.

really? CDO's went from 1 trillion in 1997 to SIXTY TWO TRILLION in
2007

the financial sector accounted for 40% of GDP in 2007. what value did
this bring to the US economy?

NOTHING! NOTHING at all. it was GREED. the numbers dont lie. but the
right wing DOES. they want to blame the middle class even though the
US middle class just takes it year after year after year.

They were going along because
the government was giving them huge profits.

WTF?? how does 'the government' give them big profits? they simply
wiped out all regulation, and stole everything not nailed down

and you blame the middle class!

Wall streets and the big banks
were greedy so they insured the loans and sold them for even more profit.
That was criminal, but all started because government gave away the house.

EXACTLY!! right wing BULL**** said 'smaller govt and less regulation
will give the free market a chance to work'

and THAT destroyed the US economy. the middle class was NOT at fault

"bpuharic" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 21 Jul 2010 18:22:20 -0600, Canuck57
wrote:

On 21/07/2010 3:26 PM, bpuharic wrote:
On Wed, 21 Jul 2010 09:51:31 -0700, "Califbill"
wrote:


bull****. it DIDNT have a living wage. THAT'S the problem! it hasnt
had a real wage increase on 10 years.

any other fairy tales you want to spread?

By definition they live in the middle. The problem you babyboomers /
GenXers have decided that a living wage is $200,000 a year. You have
to be
able to afford a nice couple cars, nice boat, 3000 sq ft. home, and a 3
week
vacation in some really nice 4 star place. You are in error.


ah. blame the middle class. that's the right wing solution to
everyting.

protect the rich

blame the middle class

CalifBill said it right, no one gives a crap that you lost. And you
lost because you were stupid.

no, i lost because i was middle class. you seem to forget that there
are 100M in the same shape i'm in

but, then, you're right wing. the problems of the middle class dont
interest you at all. not a bit


http://www.joebrower.com/PHILE_PILE/PIX/FR/crybaby_deluxe.gif

On Wed, 21 Jul 2010 20:47:53 -0400, bpuharic wrote:

On Wed, 21 Jul 2010 18:22:20 -0600, Canuck57
wrote:

On 21/07/2010 3:26 PM, bpuharic wrote:
On Wed, 21 Jul 2010 09:51:31 -0700, "Califbill"
wrote:


bull****. it DIDNT have a living wage. THAT'S the problem! it hasnt
had a real wage increase on 10 years.

any other fairy tales you want to spread?

By definition they live in the middle. The problem you babyboomers /
GenXers have decided that a living wage is $200,000 a year. You have to be
able to afford a nice couple cars, nice boat, 3000 sq ft. home, and a 3 week
vacation in some really nice 4 star place. You are in error.


ah. blame the middle class. that's the right wing solution to
everyting.

protect the rich

blame the middle class

CalifBill said it right, no one gives a crap that you lost. And you
lost because you were stupid.

no, i lost because i was middle class. you seem to forget that there
are 100M in the same shape i'm in

but, then, you're right wing. the problems of the middle class dont
interest you at all. not a bit

Well, perhaps Canuck was wrong. You weren't just stupid. You were 'middle class
stupid'.

I'm middle class, as are my friends (most of them) and neighbors. None of them
are whining about the money they lost. It's for damn sure they're not making
twenty posts a day trying to convince folks their own stupidity is someone
else's fault.


--

John H

On Thu, 22 Jul 2010 11:05:17 -0400, John H
wrote:

On Wed, 21 Jul 2010 20:47:53 -0400, bpuharic wrote:


blame the middle class

CalifBill said it right, no one gives a crap that you lost. And you
lost because you were stupid.

no, i lost because i was middle class. you seem to forget that there
are 100M in the same shape i'm in

but, then, you're right wing. the problems of the middle class dont
interest you at all. not a bit

Well, perhaps Canuck was wrong. You weren't just stupid. You were 'middle class
stupid'.

knowing that the right wing hates the middle class, i wear your insult
as a badge of honor


I'm middle class, as are my friends (most of them) and neighbors. None of them
are whining about the money they lost

that's because they believe the right wing bull****. sheep dont
protest as they're led to slaughter. you and your buddies are right
wing sheep. you bleat your love for the rich as you go to the
slaughterhouse

.. It's for damn sure they're not making
twenty posts a day trying to convince folks their own stupidity is someone
else's fault.

no surprise at all. they're too stupid to understand what's going on.