On Wed, 21 Jul 2010 09:45:44 -0700, "Califbill"
wrote:



"bpuharic" wrote in message
.. .
On Tue, 20 Jul 2010 20:30:29 -0700, "Califbill"
wrote:

so at least you admit obama was not the problem. it's about time


Obama is a problem.

yeah. folks often say that about black folks

He got the Congress to pass massive overspending and
borrowing.

nope he didn't. the 2009 FY was the responsibility of the 2007
congress and GWB. that budget increased debt spending to about 9% of
GDP. he had nothing to do with it

the scope of the borrowing was defined by bush's treasury secretary
henry paulson.

so you're wrong

Same thing that has caused the Malaise in Japan to hang on for
over 20 years. But you blame the Republicans for all the problems. The
Democrats were in charge of the checkbook when the market and economy
started tanking.

the depression started in 2007. bush was president. paulson, who
worked for bush, was treasury secretary and INSiSTED congress give him
800B with NO accountability at all.

Both parties are guilty as hell. Bush sucked as
President. And Obama may make Carter look good, and that will be hard to
do

obama had nothing to do with it

you seem to think he's guilty of being president while being black

On Wed, 21 Jul 2010 09:51:31 -0700, "Califbill"
wrote:



"bpuharic" wrote in message
.. .
On Tue, 20 Jul 2010 20:08:42 -0700, "Califbill"
wrote:



no one cares about you. there are 100,000,000 americans who are as
self absorbed as you are.

less than 50% of companies even have a pension plan. and with the
massive turnovers in jobs, no one stays at a company long enough to
collect a pension.

the right has, at every turn, gutted the ability of the middle class
to earn a living wage or have a decent retirement


Yup, no one cares about you and your finances. Even your 401k manager.

absolutely true. but i care about the 100M americans in similar shape,
and how the right wing continues to sell us down the river

So
you better learn to care for yourself.

gee. guess you haven't noticed i am. first step

destroy the rigth wing.

THAT is taking care of myself!

As my TI in USAF basic said, if you
can not take care of yourself, you can not take care of your buddy. And
those job changes and no able to vest in a pension makes 401k's even better.
As Gretwell says, look at your choices. The middle class has a living wage.

bull****. it DIDNT have a living wage. THAT'S the problem! it hasnt
had a real wage increase on 10 years.

any other fairy tales you want to spread?

By definition they live in the middle. The problem you babyboomers /
GenXers have decided that a living wage is $200,000 a year. You have to be
able to afford a nice couple cars, nice boat, 3000 sq ft. home, and a 3 week
vacation in some really nice 4 star place. You are in error.


ah. blame the middle class. that's the right wing solution to
everyting.

protect the rich

blame the middle class

On Wed, 21 Jul 2010 09:57:46 -0700, "Califbill"
wrote:



"bpuharic" wrote in message
.. .
On Tue, 20 Jul 2010 22:27:41 -0400, "D.Duck" wrote:


since it's a standard part of a loan applcation. that's when

been renting all your life, i see


I may be wrong but I believe 401Ks are untouchable in bankruptcy
proceedings. You may have to list them on a loan app but they are
untouchable to a loan holder.


unless, of course, you're able to waive that...which many middle class
people did since it was a source of wealth that the rich wanted to get
their greedy hands on.

If you could not afford the loan without your 401k money, buy a cheaper
house.

yeah i can see you're a renter and never bought a house

it doesnt matter whether or not you're usin it as collateral. the loan
company STILL wants to know what y our assets are

they SELL your loan to investors. the more assets you have, the better
your loan is and the more money they get for it.

There was no way, anyone making $50k a year could purchase a $500k
house. Maybe you were too dumb to realize that.

and you're too dumb to apply for a mortgage


And the only reason the
banks etc. were loaning money on that ratio was the government told them to
and bought the loans from them.

more bull****. the govt never told them **** about the loans they had
to cover. wall street got greedy and set up loan companies to make bad
loans so they could package them, sell CDO's and clean up

there's a reason CDO's went from 1 trillion in 97 to SIXTY TWO
TRILLION in 2007

greed of the rich. it had NOTHING to do with the middle class

the middle class, having had static wages for 10 years, did the only
thing it could: borrowed.

The reason I own a million dollar house is
because of inflation. No way should my house be selling for a $1,000,000+
but that is what inflation and the government has brought us. Was a $36k
house in 1972. With a 450 addition and a pool which probably cost $5,500 to
build in 1974 the house would have valued at about $40k then. Now it is 25
times that value 36 years later. Way more than CPI indexed inflation and
that has been the measure for increased home value for all but the last 30
years.

you dont know **** about anything, let alone the middle class

On Wed, 21 Jul 2010 05:36:12 -0500, Jim wrote:

bpuharic wrote:


ah. so 100,000,000 americans are named 'bpuharic' since we all lost
our shirts


I'm still curious about the "100,000,000 middle class."
Can you pick that group from here?

http://sociology.ucsc.edu/whorulesam...er/wealth.html

Can't seem to break any of the charts down to get 100,000,000
in a group. But I didn't try too hard.
Seems the groups here are 1, 19, and 80 percent.

let's see....there are 115,000,000 working americans. about 80% make
less than 100K.

looks good to me.


Jim - Curious

On Wed, 21 Jul 2010 18:00:59 -0400, wrote:

On Wed, 21 Jul 2010 17:30:45 -0400, bpuharic wrote:

On Wed, 21 Jul 2010 05:36:12 -0500, Jim wrote:

bpuharic wrote:


ah. so 100,000,000 americans are named 'bpuharic' since we all lost
our shirts


I'm still curious about the "100,000,000 middle class."
Can you pick that group from here?

http://sociology.ucsc.edu/whorulesam...er/wealth.html

Can't seem to break any of the charts down to get 100,000,000
in a group. But I didn't try too hard.
Seems the groups here are 1, 19, and 80 percent.

let's see....there are 115,000,000 working americans. about 80% make
less than 100K.

looks good to me.

Most of those people are not "middle class". Half of them don't even
make enough money to pay income tax.

ah yes, the right wing mantra...they dont pay 'income' taxes....so
they're worthless

guess what, sport. the wealthy dont pay taxes AND they dont work. they
get govt socialism to pay for their wasted spending of $6000 umbrella
stands while the middle class pays taxes...sales taxes, FICA taxes,
state tax, etc.

so your rich buddies are the real criminals. not th emiddle class

By the definition of middle class established here ($125K - $250K) it
is more like several million.

nobody who makes 250K is middle class.

"Califbill" wrote in message
m...


"bpuharic" wrote in message
...
On Tue, 20 Jul 2010 20:30:29 -0700, "Califbill"
wrote:



"bpuharic" wrote in message
...
On Tue, 20 Jul 2010 17:33:31 -0600, Canuck57
wrote:

On 19/07/2010 5:23 PM, Larry wrote:
Canuck57 wrote:

I would ahve to agree. Obama is leading the longest depression in
modern times, his head is on the block and clearly Obamanomics is
failing.

canuck hates the black guy in the white house.

he's too stupid to realize the depression started in 2007. obama
wasn't president

but to the right wing, that's irrelevant. he still gets blamed. after
all, bush was white. and you can't blame a white guy if a black guy is
available


And the House and Senate were in the firm control of the Democrats.

which, of course, is irrelevant. the dem congress was guilty of
inaction. it was the GOP that passed massive tax cuts for the rich AND
deregulated the economy over 30 years. the myth of 'smaller govt' led
to wall street stealing the entire economy from under our feet

so at least you admit obama was not the problem. it's about time


Obama is a problem. He got the Congress to pass massive overspending and
borrowing. Same thing that has caused the Malaise in Japan to hang on for
over 20 years. But you blame the Republicans for all the problems. The
Democrats were in charge of the checkbook when the market and economy
started tanking. Both parties are guilty as hell. Bush sucked as
President. And Obama may make Carter look good, and that will be hard to
do.

Really? Like TARP? Bummer that he got Bush to get Congress to do that, so
that you can complain about him getting Congress to do that.

You know NOTHING about economics.

John H wrote:
On Tue, 20 Jul 2010 19:04:59 -0400, wrote:


John H wrote:

On Mon, 19 Jul 2010 23:10:30 -0400, wrote:



On Mon, 19 Jul 2010 19:46:34 -0400, "Harold"
wrote:



http://screen.yahoo.com/funds.html



and here is where you're confused. 401K's are managed by fund
managers...the funds they manage CAN do pretty well on an individual
basis. yet, unless you're a full time manager yourself, you have NO
idea which ones these are going to be.



Move your $40 to a money market fund and STFU.


You'd think all the Limo Liberals here would get up a collection for poor
bpuharic


notice how the right ignores the situation facing the middle class?

the rich are doing fine...so that's all that matters


Seriously, Bob, do you really think all the conservatives here, or anywhere, are
rich? Do you not think a bunch of us might be middle class? Yet you are the one
doing all the whining because you paid little attention to your investment.

I asked if your 401K had a money market fund. By putting your money in same, you
could have prevented the losses you took.


Don't they all? If he has/had a company match - it would be free money,
too!

I've noticed he won't answer a straightforward question.

I really think he's confused and paranoid.

bpuharic wrote:
On Tue, 20 Jul 2010 18:59:01 -0400, wrote:


bpuharic wrote:

On Mon, 19 Jul 2010 19:37:27 -0400, wrote:




Certain income funds are just as productive as money market funds. The
NAV will vary - even drop for a while, but you are adding shares through
reinvested dividends.


IOW buy low

sell high

who cudda guessed.


Evidently you didn't.

sorry sport. the right lied. the middle class died

Your generalizations seem to only suit your bad situation, Skippy.

bpuharic wrote:
On Tue, 20 Jul 2010 19:20:56 -0400, wrote:


On Tue, 20 Jul 2010 17:07:55 -0400, wrote:


and there as many HF managers who saw this coming as economists

MOST hedge fund managers were betting against housing in 2007, that is
what hedge funds do.

except, of course, they told no one. the fine against goldman sachs
that depressed their first quarter earnings was for exactly this type
of screwing around


BTW I was reading an old Fortune magazine at Jury duty today (jan/feb
2010) and they had a list of the funds that did get it right this
year, one was up 265%. They also listed 1000 with their results for a
year and 3 years. I was looking at the Fidelity funds and most of them
were up this year, about half up over the last 3.
I guess I will dig out my 401k statement and see how it really did.
I know the last time I looked it was double what it was when I stopped
contributing in 1996.

too bad the right wing destroyed the pension system in this country
and let the rich replace it with 401k's.



Where do you think pensions are invested (when they aren't skimmed by
the unions)?

bpuharic wrote:
On Tue, 20 Jul 2010 19:06:17 -0400, wrote:


bpuharic wrote:

On Tue, 20 Jul 2010 05:03:58 -0400, "Charles C."
wrote:


if, however, you're a baby boomer, well that's a different story



CC


So, in other words, I should be screaming and bitching about the "loss" of
money that I never earned or had. I see. Starting to understand how the
left thinks.


go ahead and try to get a loan using your 401K as collateral

see what happens



CC


When would any lender accept a 401K account as collateral?

since it's a standard part of a loan applcation. that's when

been renting all your life, i see


I'm going to try to guess what you meant to say...

Loan applications usually are interested in liquid assets. 401K
accounts don't count. I ralize they can be liquidated but loan officers
aren't interested in that.