On 26 Aug 2006 06:36:19 -0700, "basskisser"
wrote:


Jack Goff wrote:
On 25 Aug 2006 07:37:45 -0700, "basskisser"
wrote:


Jack Goff wrote:

Learn to express yourself more clearly. You wrote about VoIP: "The
signal goes out of your house just exactly as it does with a
landline."

The signal does not "go out of your house" in the same manner for
landline and VoIP at all. They use completely different transport
protocols and media.

My signal for my security system goes through the same exact wiring in
my house as it always has. My VOIP system is hooked seamlessly to those
same exact wires. Hence, the security system signal is through those
exact same wires.

Inside your house, the signal is the same. When it "goes out of your
house", the signal is *completely* different.


Of course, you realize that the alarm system is nothing but a modem,
and that VoIP is ill-suited for transporting modem signals. While it
may work today, there is absolutely no guarantee that it will work
tonight or tomorrow. If Vonage tweaks the codec they are using, or
the internet has some delay or dropped packets when the alarm tries to
connect, your intruder alert fails. There's no guarantee of delivery
of IP packets for VoIP. Your ear can deal with lots of dropped
packets when ordering pizza. The alarm modem can not.

Never, ever had a problem. My security company does a weekly test,
every Wednesday afternoon, it's always passed.

That's simply not true. Two problems with that statement:

1. A home monitoring company does not initiate a test. They can't.
If they tried, it would have to be by dialing your home number and
letting the alarm system answer, then doing a handshake. That's
simply not possible, as alarm systems don't do that. Something else,
like a person or an answering machine, would likely answer the call
first. The alarm box does not answer the phone.

Care to wager some money???
Sure. I just got off the phone with Susan at Brinks, and she informs
me that they *can not* call into their systems to check them. She
told me that I'm supposed to test it myself, just exactly as I told
you.


2. In another post, you identified Brinks as being your alarm service
provider. Well guess what, I use Brinks as well. The Brinks alarm
panel clearly indicates to "Test Weekly See Owner's Manual".
Furthermore, you test it by pressing the "Options" button five times
until "Test" is displayed, the entering your code. The system
initiates a test that includes calling into the service, then sounds
the alarm horn momentarily after the test. This is the operation of
the deluxe panel, the basic panel may be different.

Nope. Not mine.

If you really had a Brinks alarm, I suspect you'd know all of this.

If you had MY system, and knew you had the exact same system, then
you'd be in a position to make statements about my system.

Take a look at
http://www.brinkshomesecurity.com/ho...-equipment.htm

There you'll see what Brinks offers in home security. You should have
done your research before you started posting.


I "upgraded" about a year and a half ago from the initial Brinks
system.
Uh-huh. You got the special system. I'm sure they saw you coming.

Do you realize that in this day and age, that Brinks even provides, for
a fee, such things as WiFi cabling?
You're a hoot. You do realize that WiFi is *wireless*, right? There
is no WiFi cabling... that's the magic of it.

You were a court jester in a previous life, weren't you? I'll bet
they chopped your head off for lying.

I'm done with you.

On 26 Aug 2006 08:03:34 -0700, "JimH" wrote:


Sam D wrote:
"basskisser" wrote in message
ups.com...

Sam D wrote:
"basskisser" wrote in message
oups.com...

Harry Krause wrote:
JohnH wrote:
On Thu, 24 Aug 2006 11:17:38 -0400, Harry Krause

wrote:

basskisser wrote:
This morning the phones in the neighborhood where I live were all
out.
I didn't even know it, because I have comcast high speed and
vonage!
I
asked the Bellsouth Technician why he was checking the line in
front
of
my house, because I was going to tell him it's dead to my house
because
I don't have Bellsouth. He said he was checking because some
digital
device that serves the whole neighborhood went out, and they are
trying
to restore service!!!



Wonderful. Our security alarm system sent out a letter recently
advising
customers NOT to transfer to VOIP unless they leave a wired
traditional
phone line in place or subscribe to a special, new, expensive cell
service.

Wanna guess why?

The security company says it is working on a VOIP solution but so
far,
it "is not reliable."

If the security company isn't reliable, I'd get a new one.

You've identified many reasons why you can't switch to VOIP. That's
a
shame, and we all feel sorry for you.


Most of the major home security company connect lines do not work with
VOIP, I've since learned.

Why? The signal goes out of your house just exactly as it does with a
landline. Brinks works just great with VOIP

One is digital and the other analog. Not the same.

They both STILL go out of my house exactly the same. Same exact wiring.
Get it? Doubtful.


No, they don't. With POTS your alarm panel is wired directly to telephone
system. With cable/vonage the wiring goes from the alarm panel, then to your
Vonage modem, then to your cable modem, and out of the house through the
coax/fiber to your cable provider who then provides the connection to the
telephone network.

Get it?

Pssst........Sam...........you are trying to have a discussion with a
brick wall. ;-)

That's a slam on brick walls everywhere. Besides, I prefer to think
of him as a sack of hammers. :-)

"basskisser" wrote in message
ps.com...

Again, comprehension. In never said where ANY company said that VOIP is
"approved". For that matter, I just looked at my contract with my
security company, and it doesn't even say that Bell South is
"approved". Mine does, however work flawlessly with my VOIP.

There are FCC rules and regulations that cover every piece of equipment, the
POTS service itself, and the monitoring company in a home security system
that is connected to the POTS network. These rules and regs protect you and
give you legal standing if they fail to perform to specifications. Once you
disconnect the alarm system from POTS, your on your own, there are no FCC
rules and regulations that govern an alarm system connected to VOIP.

So, in a nutshell, your company does not have to "approve" Bellsouth as a
carrier since the performance of a monitored security system on POTS is
governed by Federal law.

"Sam D" wrote in message
newshZHg.1460$nR2.969@trnddc03...

"basskisser" wrote in message
ups.com...

Sam D wrote:
"basskisser" wrote in message
oups.com...

Harry Krause wrote:
JohnH wrote:
On Thu, 24 Aug 2006 11:17:38 -0400, Harry Krause

wrote:

basskisser wrote:
This morning the phones in the neighborhood where I live were all
out.
I didn't even know it, because I have comcast high speed and
vonage!
I
asked the Bellsouth Technician why he was checking the line in
front
of
my house, because I was going to tell him it's dead to my house
because
I don't have Bellsouth. He said he was checking because some
digital
device that serves the whole neighborhood went out, and they are
trying
to restore service!!!



Wonderful. Our security alarm system sent out a letter recently
advising
customers NOT to transfer to VOIP unless they leave a wired
traditional
phone line in place or subscribe to a special, new, expensive cell
service.

Wanna guess why?

The security company says it is working on a VOIP solution but so
far,
it "is not reliable."

If the security company isn't reliable, I'd get a new one.

You've identified many reasons why you can't switch to VOIP. That's
a
shame, and we all feel sorry for you.


Most of the major home security company connect lines do not work
with
VOIP, I've since learned.

Why? The signal goes out of your house just exactly as it does with a
landline. Brinks works just great with VOIP

One is digital and the other analog. Not the same.

They both STILL go out of my house exactly the same. Same exact wiring.
Get it? Doubtful.


No, they don't. With POTS your alarm panel is wired directly to telephone
system. With cable/vonage the wiring goes from the alarm panel, then to
your Vonage modem, then to your cable modem, and out of the house through
the coax/fiber to your cable provider who then provides the connection to
the telephone network.

Get it?

Kevin couldn't find a clue if a dump truck dropped a load of them in his
driveway.

Sam D wrote:
"basskisser" wrote in message
ups.com...

Sam D wrote:
"basskisser" wrote in message
oups.com...

Harry Krause wrote:
JohnH wrote:
On Thu, 24 Aug 2006 11:17:38 -0400, Harry Krause

wrote:

basskisser wrote:
This morning the phones in the neighborhood where I live were all
out.
I didn't even know it, because I have comcast high speed and
vonage!
I
asked the Bellsouth Technician why he was checking the line in
front
of
my house, because I was going to tell him it's dead to my house
because
I don't have Bellsouth. He said he was checking because some
digital
device that serves the whole neighborhood went out, and they are
trying
to restore service!!!



Wonderful. Our security alarm system sent out a letter recently
advising
customers NOT to transfer to VOIP unless they leave a wired
traditional
phone line in place or subscribe to a special, new, expensive cell
service.

Wanna guess why?

The security company says it is working on a VOIP solution but so
far,
it "is not reliable."

If the security company isn't reliable, I'd get a new one.

You've identified many reasons why you can't switch to VOIP. That's
a
shame, and we all feel sorry for you.


Most of the major home security company connect lines do not work with
VOIP, I've since learned.

Why? The signal goes out of your house just exactly as it does with a
landline. Brinks works just great with VOIP

One is digital and the other analog. Not the same.

They both STILL go out of my house exactly the same. Same exact wiring.
Get it? Doubtful.


No, they don't. With POTS your alarm panel is wired directly to telephone
system.

Exactly!

With cable/vonage the wiring goes from the alarm panel, then to your
Vonage modem, then to your cable modem, and out of the house through the
coax/fiber to your cable provider who then provides the connection to the
telephone network.

Get it?

Where you are in error is first, your reading comprehension. My vonage
system is hooked DIRECTLY to my house phone hard lines. I can plug a
phone into any and all jacks in my house and have dial tone. My alarm
system is, and always has been, hooked directly to those hard lines.

Get it?

Harry Krause wrote:
Gene Kearns wrote:
On Fri, 25 Aug 2006 14:38:16 -0400, JohnH wrote:

Did you do any speed tests while undergoing these problems? Slow speeds
create havoc. Luckily, Cox has done pretty fair with the speed.

Speed wasn't the problem, I've got really good connect rates. What
*was* the problem was a complete lack of tech support. I never had to
recycle the modem between "outages." Vonage would run fine for 2-3
months and then just quit..... and I'd be without phone service for
3-4 days. They had no clue what the problem was and had no idea how to
fix it. They also had no clue why it started working again.

My current VoIP is flawless.....

Unplug and plug *once* wouldn't have been a problem. Plugging and
unplugging for 2 hours straight... until the cell phone died *WAS* a
problem.
--

Grady-White Gulfstream, out of Southport, NC.
http://myworkshop.idleplay.net/
-----------------
www.Newsgroup-Binaries.com - *Completion*Retention*Speed*
Access your favorite newsgroups from home or on the road
-----------------


Gosh, Gene, your experience flies in the face of so many others. How
could this possibly have happened? :}


Harry,
It is possible that Gene's experience and the experience of others are
all correct, they represent the experiences each individual faced when
dealing with Vonage or VOIP.

I can think of no reason why Gene would lie about his experience, and I
can not think of any reason why any of the other people would lie about
their experience using Vonage or VOIP. I know if I had Gene's problems
I would be relating my experience to everyone I talked to.

The only two times I had to contact Vonage Customer Service is when I
first set the phone system up, it went very smoothly and quickly. The
2nd time was when I replaced my computer and had to reestablish my modem
IP. I had tried to reboot the modem on my own unsuccessfully, the tech
recommended I disconnect both modems, reboot my cable modem first, then
plug my telephone modem in second. That was the last time I had to
contact their Customer Service. My total time on the phone was about
10-15 min. the first time, and about 5-8 min. the 2nd time. When I
returned my Dell and purchased my Gateway, I didn't have to contact
Vonage Customer Service, I just booted my cable modem first, then my
telephone modem once the cable modem was up and running. I takes about
10 secs for each modem to reboot.

My experience might not be typical, Gene's experience might not be
typical, or it is possible that they have a wide range of service
levels. .

The one thing I am fairly certain of is no one in here is lying about
their experience in using VOIP.

Why do you think there is anything unusual in Gene's experience being
different than the others?

Harry Krause wrote:

Gosh, Gene, your experience flies in the face of so many others. How
could this possibly have happened? :}

It certainly does. Everyone here who has it is very happy with it, and
never has problems with it, EXCEPT for Gene.

"Reginald P. Smithers III" wrote in message
...
Harry Krause wrote:
Gene Kearns wrote:
On Fri, 25 Aug 2006 14:38:16 -0400, JohnH wrote:

Did you do any speed tests while undergoing these problems? Slow speeds
create havoc. Luckily, Cox has done pretty fair with the speed.

Speed wasn't the problem, I've got really good connect rates. What
*was* the problem was a complete lack of tech support. I never had to
recycle the modem between "outages." Vonage would run fine for 2-3
months and then just quit..... and I'd be without phone service for
3-4 days. They had no clue what the problem was and had no idea how to
fix it. They also had no clue why it started working again.

My current VoIP is flawless.....

Unplug and plug *once* wouldn't have been a problem. Plugging and
unplugging for 2 hours straight... until the cell phone died *WAS* a
problem.
--
Grady-White Gulfstream, out of Southport, NC.
http://myworkshop.idleplay.net/
-----------------
www.Newsgroup-Binaries.com - *Completion*Retention*Speed*
Access your favorite newsgroups from home or on the road
-----------------


Gosh, Gene, your experience flies in the face of so many others. How
could this possibly have happened? :}


Harry,
It is possible that Gene's experience and the experience of others are all
correct, they represent the experiences each individual faced when dealing
with Vonage or VOIP.

I can think of no reason why Gene would lie about his experience, and I
can not think of any reason why any of the other people would lie about
their experience using Vonage or VOIP. I know if I had Gene's problems I
would be relating my experience to everyone I talked to.

The only two times I had to contact Vonage Customer Service is when I
first set the phone system up, it went very smoothly and quickly. The 2nd
time was when I replaced my computer and had to reestablish my modem IP.
I had tried to reboot the modem on my own unsuccessfully, the tech
recommended I disconnect both modems, reboot my cable modem first, then
plug my telephone modem in second. That was the last time I had to
contact their Customer Service. My total time on the phone was about
10-15 min. the first time, and about 5-8 min. the 2nd time. When I
returned my Dell and purchased my Gateway, I didn't have to contact Vonage
Customer Service, I just booted my cable modem first, then my telephone
modem once the cable modem was up and running. I takes about 10 secs for
each modem to reboot.

My experience might not be typical, Gene's experience might not be
typical, or it is possible that they have a wide range of service levels.
.

The one thing I am fairly certain of is no one in here is lying about
their experience in using VOIP.

Why do you think there is anything unusual in Gene's experience being
different than the others?


You have spent your whole morning here trying to pick a fight with Harry.

Do you have a boat? I have never read any posts from you about it or your
boating experiences. Instead your days here are filled trying to start
fights with folks.

You are, in fact, starting to act quite 'Kevinesque'.

Sam D wrote:
"basskisser" wrote in message
ps.com...

Again, comprehension. In never said where ANY company said that VOIP is
"approved". For that matter, I just looked at my contract with my
security company, and it doesn't even say that Bell South is
"approved". Mine does, however work flawlessly with my VOIP.

There are FCC rules and regulations that cover every piece of equipment, the
POTS service itself, and the monitoring company in a home security system
that is connected to the POTS network. These rules and regs protect you and
give you legal standing if they fail to perform to specifications. Once you
disconnect the alarm system from POTS, your on your own, there are no FCC
rules and regulations that govern an alarm system connected to VOIP.

So, in a nutshell, your company does not have to "approve" Bellsouth as a
carrier since the performance of a monitored security system on POTS is
governed by Federal law.

And my company also doesn't have to "approve" Vonage. It works
flawlessly!

Jack Goff wrote:
On 26 Aug 2006 06:36:19 -0700, "basskisser"
wrote:


Jack Goff wrote:
On 25 Aug 2006 07:37:45 -0700, "basskisser"
wrote:


Jack Goff wrote:

Learn to express yourself more clearly. You wrote about VoIP: "The
signal goes out of your house just exactly as it does with a
landline."

The signal does not "go out of your house" in the same manner for
landline and VoIP at all. They use completely different transport
protocols and media.

My signal for my security system goes through the same exact wiring in
my house as it always has. My VOIP system is hooked seamlessly to those
same exact wires. Hence, the security system signal is through those
exact same wires.

Inside your house, the signal is the same. When it "goes out of your
house", the signal is *completely* different.


Of course, you realize that the alarm system is nothing but a modem,
and that VoIP is ill-suited for transporting modem signals. While it
may work today, there is absolutely no guarantee that it will work
tonight or tomorrow. If Vonage tweaks the codec they are using, or
the internet has some delay or dropped packets when the alarm tries to
connect, your intruder alert fails. There's no guarantee of delivery
of IP packets for VoIP. Your ear can deal with lots of dropped
packets when ordering pizza. The alarm modem can not.

Never, ever had a problem. My security company does a weekly test,
every Wednesday afternoon, it's always passed.

That's simply not true. Two problems with that statement:

1. A home monitoring company does not initiate a test. They can't.
If they tried, it would have to be by dialing your home number and
letting the alarm system answer, then doing a handshake. That's
simply not possible, as alarm systems don't do that. Something else,
like a person or an answering machine, would likely answer the call
first. The alarm box does not answer the phone.

Care to wager some money???
Sure. I just got off the phone with Susan at Brinks, and she informs
me that they *can not* call into their systems to check them. She
told me that I'm supposed to test it myself, just exactly as I told
you.


2. In another post, you identified Brinks as being your alarm service
provider. Well guess what, I use Brinks as well. The Brinks alarm
panel clearly indicates to "Test Weekly See Owner's Manual".
Furthermore, you test it by pressing the "Options" button five times
until "Test" is displayed, the entering your code. The system
initiates a test that includes calling into the service, then sounds
the alarm horn momentarily after the test. This is the operation of
the deluxe panel, the basic panel may be different.

Nope. Not mine.

If you really had a Brinks alarm, I suspect you'd know all of this.

If you had MY system, and knew you had the exact same system, then
you'd be in a position to make statements about my system.

Take a look at
http://www.brinkshomesecurity.com/ho...-equipment.htm

There you'll see what Brinks offers in home security. You should have
done your research before you started posting.

I know what I have! You, however, must not.


I "upgraded" about a year and a half ago from the initial Brinks
system.
Uh-huh. You got the special system. I'm sure they saw you coming.

Idiot. Plain and simple.

Do you realize that in this day and age, that Brinks even provides, for
a fee, such things as WiFi cabling?
You're a hoot. You do realize that WiFi is *wireless*, right? There
is no WiFi cabling... that's the magic of it.

Really? Are you REALLY saying that? Oh, I get it, you got caught on the
"wireless" word, huh? So, in your head, you think that there never is
any wiring involved in setting up a whole house WiFi, right?


I'm done with you.

Good!