Harry Krause wrote:
basskisser wrote:
Harry Krause wrote:
basskisser wrote:
Harry Krause wrote:
JohnH wrote:
On Thu, 24 Aug 2006 11:17:38 -0400, Harry Krause
wrote:

basskisser wrote:
This morning the phones in the neighborhood where I live were all out.
I didn't even know it, because I have comcast high speed and vonage! I
asked the Bellsouth Technician why he was checking the line in front of
my house, because I was going to tell him it's dead to my house because
I don't have Bellsouth. He said he was checking because some digital
device that serves the whole neighborhood went out, and they are trying
to restore service!!!

Wonderful. Our security alarm system sent out a letter recently advising
customers NOT to transfer to VOIP unless they leave a wired traditional
phone line in place or subscribe to a special, new, expensive cell service.

Wanna guess why?

The security company says it is working on a VOIP solution but so far,
it "is not reliable."
If the security company isn't reliable, I'd get a new one.

You've identified many reasons why you can't switch to VOIP. That's a
shame, and we all feel sorry for you.
Most of the major home security company connect lines do not work with
VOIP, I've since learned.
Why? The signal goes out of your house just exactly as it does with a
landline. Brinks works just great with VOIP

Well, despite advice to the contrary from Reggie and his boy Herring,
ADT says the following:

Perhaps you should change your security company to one that is up to
date and able to work with new fangled equipment!



I'm not interested in changing from the reliable telephone service that
has served me admirably for these many years for VOIP so I can save $25
a month. There are all manner of problems possible with VOIP, none of
which appeal to me, including crappy sound quality, downtime when the
internet connection is down, and its inability to perform properly with
my home security sytem.

My sound is as good as the landline EVER was. My downtime has actually
stayed about the same, that is, not hardly ever, and it works
flawlessly with my security system. It isn't all about saving $25 a
month, but more about the ma bells being complete rip offs. Also, that
$25 dollars buys a lot of live bait!
Take a look at your phone bill carefully, and look at all of the total
rip off charges that are on there.

Jack Goff wrote:
On 25 Aug 2006 04:50:11 -0700, "basskisser"
wrote:


Harry Krause wrote:
basskisser wrote:
Harry Krause wrote:
JohnH wrote:
On Thu, 24 Aug 2006 11:17:38 -0400, Harry Krause
wrote:

basskisser wrote:
This morning the phones in the neighborhood where I live were all out.
I didn't even know it, because I have comcast high speed and vonage! I
asked the Bellsouth Technician why he was checking the line in front of
my house, because I was going to tell him it's dead to my house because
I don't have Bellsouth. He said he was checking because some digital
device that serves the whole neighborhood went out, and they are trying
to restore service!!!


Wonderful. Our security alarm system sent out a letter recently advising
customers NOT to transfer to VOIP unless they leave a wired traditional
phone line in place or subscribe to a special, new, expensive cell service.

Wanna guess why?

The security company says it is working on a VOIP solution but so far,
it "is not reliable."
If the security company isn't reliable, I'd get a new one.

You've identified many reasons why you can't switch to VOIP. That's a
shame, and we all feel sorry for you.

Most of the major home security company connect lines do not work with
VOIP, I've since learned.

Why? The signal goes out of your house just exactly as it does with a
landline. Brinks works just great with VOIP


Well, despite advice to the contrary from Reggie and his boy Herring,
ADT says the following:

Perhaps you should change your security company to one that is up to
date and able to work with new fangled equipment!

What company is that, bass? The one you use? Who is it? I'm not
aware of any that say the use of VoIP phone service is approved.

Again, comprehension. In never said where ANY company said that VOIP is
"approved". For that matter, I just looked at my contract with my
security company, and it doesn't even say that Bell South is
"approved". Mine does, however work flawlessly with my VOIP.

Jack Goff wrote:
On 25 Aug 2006 04:55:55 -0700, "basskisser"
wrote:


Jack Goff wrote:
On Thu, 24 Aug 2006 19:30:53 -0400, JohnH wrote:

On Thu, 24 Aug 2006 18:51:22 -0400, Harry Krause
wrote:

JimH wrote:
"Harry Krause" wrote in message
...
basskisser wrote:
Harry Krause wrote:
JohnH wrote:
On Thu, 24 Aug 2006 11:17:38 -0400, Harry Krause

wrote:

basskisser wrote:
This morning the phones in the neighborhood where I live were all
out.
I didn't even know it, because I have comcast high speed and vonage!
I
asked the Bellsouth Technician why he was checking the line in front
of
my house, because I was going to tell him it's dead to my house
because
I don't have Bellsouth. He said he was checking because some digital
device that serves the whole neighborhood went out, and they are
trying
to restore service!!!

Wonderful. Our security alarm system sent out a letter recently
advising
customers NOT to transfer to VOIP unless they leave a wired
traditional
phone line in place or subscribe to a special, new, expensive cell
service.

Wanna guess why?

The security company says it is working on a VOIP solution but so far,
it "is not reliable."
If the security company isn't reliable, I'd get a new one.

You've identified many reasons why you can't switch to VOIP. That's a
shame, and we all feel sorry for you.
Most of the major home security company connect lines do not work with
VOIP, I've since learned.
Why? The signal goes out of your house just exactly as it does with a
landline. Brinks works just great with VOIP

Well, despite advice to the contrary from Reggie and his boy Herring, ADT
says the following:

snip


From http://www.vonage.com/features_terms_service.php
================================================
2.16 Incompatibility With Other Services.

(a) Home Security Systems. The Service may not be compatible with home
security systems. You may be required to maintain a telephone connection
through your local exchange carrier in order to use any alarm monitoring
functions for any security system installed in your home or business. You
are responsible for contacting the alarm monitoring company to test the
compatibility of any alarm monitoring or security system with the Service.
================================================== =




Well, of course, Reggie and his boy Herring know better.

Which is why we told you to stick with what you've got!

Reading comprehension?

Harry is old and confused. It was actually BK that said that VoIP and
"landline" phone lines are the same, but Harry couldn't keep up.

No, I didn't. I said that my security system works exactly the same
with VOIP as it does with landline phone systems. Please learn to
comprehend what you read.

Learn to express yourself more clearly. You wrote about VoIP: "The
signal goes out of your house just exactly as it does with a
landline."

The signal does not "go out of your house" in the same manner for
landline and VoIP at all. They use completely different transport
protocols and media.

My signal for my security system goes through the same exact wiring in
my house as it always has. My VOIP system is hooked seamlessly to those
same exact wires. Hence, the security system signal is through those
exact same wires.

Of course, you realize that the alarm system is nothing but a modem,
and that VoIP is ill-suited for transporting modem signals. While it
may work today, there is absolutely no guarantee that it will work
tonight or tomorrow. If Vonage tweaks the codec they are using, or
the internet has some delay or dropped packets when the alarm tries to
connect, your intruder alert fails. There's no guarantee of delivery
of IP packets for VoIP. Your ear can deal with lots of dropped
packets when ordering pizza. The alarm modem can not.

Never, ever had a problem. My security company does a weekly test,
every Wednesday afternoon, it's always passed.

"Jack Goff" wrote in message
...
On 25 Aug 2006 04:50:11 -0700, "basskisser"
wrote:


Harry Krause wrote:
basskisser wrote:
Harry Krause wrote:
JohnH wrote:
On Thu, 24 Aug 2006 11:17:38 -0400, Harry Krause

wrote:

basskisser wrote:
This morning the phones in the neighborhood where I live were all
out.
I didn't even know it, because I have comcast high speed and
vonage! I
asked the Bellsouth Technician why he was checking the line in
front of
my house, because I was going to tell him it's dead to my house
because
I don't have Bellsouth. He said he was checking because some
digital
device that serves the whole neighborhood went out, and they are
trying
to restore service!!!


Wonderful. Our security alarm system sent out a letter recently
advising
customers NOT to transfer to VOIP unless they leave a wired
traditional
phone line in place or subscribe to a special, new, expensive cell
service.

Wanna guess why?

The security company says it is working on a VOIP solution but so
far,
it "is not reliable."
If the security company isn't reliable, I'd get a new one.

You've identified many reasons why you can't switch to VOIP. That's
a
shame, and we all feel sorry for you.

Most of the major home security company connect lines do not work
with
VOIP, I've since learned.

Why? The signal goes out of your house just exactly as it does with a
landline. Brinks works just great with VOIP


Well, despite advice to the contrary from Reggie and his boy Herring,
ADT says the following:

Perhaps you should change your security company to one that is up to
date and able to work with new fangled equipment!

What company is that, bass? The one you use? Who is it? I'm not
aware of any that say the use of VoIP phone service is approved.

It looks like Kevin does not understand the difference between a "security"
company and a "central station alarm monitoring" company.

BTW, I called Brinks and they said they would not recommend their service
when one uses VOIP and they could not offer any guarantee they could or
would receive the signal. ;-)

basskisser wrote:
Jack Goff wrote:
On 25 Aug 2006 04:55:55 -0700, "basskisser"
wrote:

Jack Goff wrote:
On Thu, 24 Aug 2006 19:30:53 -0400, JohnH wrote:

On Thu, 24 Aug 2006 18:51:22 -0400, Harry Krause
wrote:

JimH wrote:
"Harry Krause" wrote in message
...
basskisser wrote:
Harry Krause wrote:
JohnH wrote:
On Thu, 24 Aug 2006 11:17:38 -0400, Harry Krause

wrote:

basskisser wrote:
This morning the phones in the neighborhood where I live were all
out.
I didn't even know it, because I have comcast high speed and vonage!
I
asked the Bellsouth Technician why he was checking the line in front
of
my house, because I was going to tell him it's dead to my house
because
I don't have Bellsouth. He said he was checking because some digital
device that serves the whole neighborhood went out, and they are
trying
to restore service!!!

Wonderful. Our security alarm system sent out a letter recently
advising
customers NOT to transfer to VOIP unless they leave a wired
traditional
phone line in place or subscribe to a special, new, expensive cell
service.

Wanna guess why?

The security company says it is working on a VOIP solution but so far,
it "is not reliable."
If the security company isn't reliable, I'd get a new one.

You've identified many reasons why you can't switch to VOIP. That's a
shame, and we all feel sorry for you.
Most of the major home security company connect lines do not work with
VOIP, I've since learned.
Why? The signal goes out of your house just exactly as it does with a
landline. Brinks works just great with VOIP
Well, despite advice to the contrary from Reggie and his boy Herring, ADT
says the following:

snip


From http://www.vonage.com/features_terms_service.php
================================================
2.16 Incompatibility With Other Services.

(a) Home Security Systems. The Service may not be compatible with home
security systems. You may be required to maintain a telephone connection
through your local exchange carrier in order to use any alarm monitoring
functions for any security system installed in your home or business. You
are responsible for contacting the alarm monitoring company to test the
compatibility of any alarm monitoring or security system with the Service.
================================================== =



Well, of course, Reggie and his boy Herring know better.
Which is why we told you to stick with what you've got!

Reading comprehension?
Harry is old and confused. It was actually BK that said that VoIP and
"landline" phone lines are the same, but Harry couldn't keep up.

No, I didn't. I said that my security system works exactly the same
with VOIP as it does with landline phone systems. Please learn to
comprehend what you read.
Learn to express yourself more clearly. You wrote about VoIP: "The
signal goes out of your house just exactly as it does with a
landline."

The signal does not "go out of your house" in the same manner for
landline and VoIP at all. They use completely different transport
protocols and media.

My signal for my security system goes through the same exact wiring in
my house as it always has. My VOIP system is hooked seamlessly to those
same exact wires. Hence, the security system signal is through those
exact same wires.

Of course, you realize that the alarm system is nothing but a modem,
and that VoIP is ill-suited for transporting modem signals. While it
may work today, there is absolutely no guarantee that it will work
tonight or tomorrow. If Vonage tweaks the codec they are using, or
the internet has some delay or dropped packets when the alarm tries to
connect, your intruder alert fails. There's no guarantee of delivery
of IP packets for VoIP. Your ear can deal with lots of dropped
packets when ordering pizza. The alarm modem can not.

Never, ever had a problem. My security company does a weekly test,
every Wednesday afternoon, it's always passed.


Bassy,

When I first started asking about VOIP I was not really concerned about
saving money, but making sure MaBell had viable competition. We all
have seen what has happened to Long Distance since MaBell had viable
competition. Some people talk about saving $25 a month, but the savings
can be substantially more based upon free long distance calls including
free calls to Canada and Europe, and all the extra bells and whistles
Vonage throws in for free.

If you do not have a reliable ISP VOIP is not an option, but if I did
not have a reliable ISP, I would be looking for a new ISP even if I
didn't want VOIP.

If you do have a reliable ISP, Vonage or any of the other highly rated
VOIP are good alternatives to MaBell, will save you money, and you
probably won't be able to tell the difference between MaBell and Vonage.

Gene Kearns wrote:
On Fri, 25 Aug 2006 10:46:55 -0400, " JimH" not telling you @
pffftt.com wrote:


BTW, I called Brinks and they said they would not recommend their service
when one uses VOIP and they could not offer any guarantee they could or
would receive the signal. ;-)


I would hazard a guess that no company would "guarantee" their
performance based on the reliance of performance of a third
company....

However, based on personal experience, I wouldn't even "expect" that
Vonage could reliably carry voice communication.....

...go figure....
--


Grady-White Gulfstream, out of Southport, NC. http://myworkshop.idleplay.net/
-----------------
www.Newsgroup-Binaries.com - *Completion*Retention*Speed*
Access your favorite newsgroups from home or on the road
-----------------
Gene,
What personal experience leads you to believe Vonage can not reliably
carry voice communications? I am not really a "techie", but I would
think Vonage's quality would be a direct correlation to the quality of
your ISP or am I missing something?

JimH wrote:
"Jack Goff" wrote in message
...
On 25 Aug 2006 04:50:11 -0700, "basskisser"
wrote:


Harry Krause wrote:
basskisser wrote:
Harry Krause wrote:
JohnH wrote:
On Thu, 24 Aug 2006 11:17:38 -0400, Harry Krause

wrote:

basskisser wrote:
This morning the phones in the neighborhood where I live were all
out.
I didn't even know it, because I have comcast high speed and
vonage! I
asked the Bellsouth Technician why he was checking the line in
front of
my house, because I was going to tell him it's dead to my house
because
I don't have Bellsouth. He said he was checking because some
digital
device that serves the whole neighborhood went out, and they are
trying
to restore service!!!


Wonderful. Our security alarm system sent out a letter recently
advising
customers NOT to transfer to VOIP unless they leave a wired
traditional
phone line in place or subscribe to a special, new, expensive cell
service.

Wanna guess why?

The security company says it is working on a VOIP solution but so
far,
it "is not reliable."
If the security company isn't reliable, I'd get a new one.

You've identified many reasons why you can't switch to VOIP. That's
a
shame, and we all feel sorry for you.

Most of the major home security company connect lines do not work
with
VOIP, I've since learned.

Why? The signal goes out of your house just exactly as it does with a
landline. Brinks works just great with VOIP


Well, despite advice to the contrary from Reggie and his boy Herring,
ADT says the following:

Perhaps you should change your security company to one that is up to
date and able to work with new fangled equipment!

What company is that, bass? The one you use? Who is it? I'm not
aware of any that say the use of VoIP phone service is approved.

It looks like Kevin does not understand the difference between a "security"
company and a "central station alarm monitoring" company.

BTW, I called Brinks and they said they would not recommend their service
when one uses VOIP and they could not offer any guarantee they could or
would receive the signal. ;-)

Jim, you are so full of ****!!!! Who did you talk to at Brinks? give me
a name, and a number, you liar!
I can tell you for a fact, I have VOIP, AND Brinks, and they work
flawlessly. Your petty diatribe above is just fluff.

Reginald P. Smithers III wrote:
Gene Kearns wrote:
On Fri, 25 Aug 2006 10:46:55 -0400, " JimH" not telling you @
pffftt.com wrote:


BTW, I called Brinks and they said they would not recommend their service
when one uses VOIP and they could not offer any guarantee they could or
would receive the signal. ;-)


I would hazard a guess that no company would "guarantee" their
performance based on the reliance of performance of a third
company....

However, based on personal experience, I wouldn't even "expect" that
Vonage could reliably carry voice communication.....

...go figure....
--


Grady-White Gulfstream, out of Southport, NC. http://myworkshop.idleplay.net/
-----------------
www.Newsgroup-Binaries.com - *Completion*Retention*Speed*
Access your favorite newsgroups from home or on the road
-----------------
Gene,
What personal experience leads you to believe Vonage can not reliably
carry voice communications? I am not really a "techie", but I would
think Vonage's quality would be a direct correlation to the quality of
your ISP or am I missing something?

Mine has never gone out. I can't WAIT for JimH to give the the number
and the name of the person he spoke to at Brinks!!!
He claims that person said they couldn't "guarantee" it will work with
VOIP. Do the "guarantee" that it will work with each and every land
line??

Gene Kearns wrote:
On Fri, 25 Aug 2006 11:14:11 -0400, "Reginald P. Smithers III"
wrote:

Gene,
What personal experience leads you to believe Vonage can not reliably
carry voice communications? I am not really a "techie", but I would
think Vonage's quality would be a direct correlation to the quality of
your ISP or am I missing something?

I installed Vonage and it took about three days to get it going... and
I suppose it just fixed itself.....

I couldn't get a "phone" light, so I called tech (non)support and
attempted in my best American/farci/hindi to communicate the problem.

To make a L-O-O-O-O-O-O-O-N-G story short, through all of the levels
of foreign tech (non)support, all they could suggest to fix the
problem was to unplug the power cord to the cable modem and the vonage
modem, wait, and reconnect. They always managed to stall longer than
my cell phone batteries would last. American tech support (higher
levels) could "see" the modem, saw no reason it shouldn't work, and
could only offer the same plug-unplug scenario.

So, I was ready to take the whole mess back where I got it and
miraculously it started working! When it worked, it worked well... and
it *was* affordable.

After a few months we had a power glitch and we went through the same
scenario we endured when we first bought the modem. Again, another
miracle and it started working.

Then we had the stutter tone indicating we had voice messages get
stuck and they suggested.... see this coming? Unplug-plug.... and the
phone went down again. Same scenario.

Another electrical glitch and the same scenario.... except after 2
weeks it still didn't work. After, literally, hours of unplugging and
plugging I finally asked one of the highest level techs what the hell
he though would be different about unplug-plug *THIS* time if it
didn't work the last 200 times.... "Sir, if you would just unplug...."

I resolved to dump vonage.....Now enter the next level of idiocy

I called Road Runner and had them port my number. We made an
appointment for installation that was 3 weeks in the future. 3 weeks?
"Yes," they said, "it takes Vonage extra time to port numbers. We
don't know why but it will take every bit of three weeks." Well, it
actually took Vonage extra, extra time and we had to reschedule
because Vonage had not yet released the number. It took 4 weeks to the
day...

RoadRunner came, made an installation and we have had flawless service
since. The vonage nightmare over with? Not by a long shot....

We kept being billed by vonage and we find that our account is still
"active." Ported, now, mind you, impossible to receive service, but
active.... Now, we find that service can only be cancelled by calling
a special number.... which (surprise) is always busy (but they'll let
you hold) and is not 24/7. After dozens of calls, my wife finally got
through and after holding (collectively) for hours, they gave us a lot
of grief, but finally closed the account. They had no real explanation
for keeping an account alive without a telephone number nor for not
closing the account when a number is ported.

If they work for you, great. I think they suck out loud.

This service was recommended on a radio show called "The Clark Howard
Show." I called the show, explained the problem, and was told that I
would be contacted to give more particulars. Never heard another word.
Apparently, at least as far as vonage is concerned, Clark Howard also
has a customer no-service policy.....

.....go figure.....
--


Grady-White Gulfstream, out of Southport, NC. http://myworkshop.idleplay.net/
-----------------
www.Newsgroup-Binaries.com - *Completion*Retention*Speed*
Access your favorite newsgroups from home or on the road
-----------------


Gene,
I am curious, how long ago was this disaster with Vonage? I listen to
Clark Howard and I know the love to jump all over any company that is
not providing good service. Based upon your history, I would not be
making any changes in the near future. I am glad my history has been
the exact opposite. It was the Clark Howard Show that made me even
think about making the change, they have had users calling in for months
talking about the quality and the ease of set up. I think it was Bassy
and and a few others in rec.boats that convinced me to try it. With the
30 day free trial period, it was a painless way to 'test" VOIP. I
didn't port over my phone number until I was comfortable with the
quality of the line and Vonage overall service.

On Thu, 24 Aug 2006 21:20:51 -0400, Harry Krause
wrote:

JohnH wrote:
On Thu, 24 Aug 2006 18:37:01 -0400, Harry Krause
wrote:

basskisser wrote:
Harry Krause wrote:
JohnH wrote:
On Thu, 24 Aug 2006 11:17:38 -0400, Harry Krause
wrote:

basskisser wrote:
This morning the phones in the neighborhood where I live were all out.
I didn't even know it, because I have comcast high speed and vonage! I
asked the Bellsouth Technician why he was checking the line in front of
my house, because I was going to tell him it's dead to my house because
I don't have Bellsouth. He said he was checking because some digital
device that serves the whole neighborhood went out, and they are trying
to restore service!!!

Wonderful. Our security alarm system sent out a letter recently advising
customers NOT to transfer to VOIP unless they leave a wired traditional
phone line in place or subscribe to a special, new, expensive cell service.

Wanna guess why?

The security company says it is working on a VOIP solution but so far,
it "is not reliable."
If the security company isn't reliable, I'd get a new one.

You've identified many reasons why you can't switch to VOIP. That's a
shame, and we all feel sorry for you.
Most of the major home security company connect lines do not work with
VOIP, I've since learned.
Why? The signal goes out of your house just exactly as it does with a
landline. Brinks works just great with VOIP

Well, despite advice to the contrary from Reggie and his boy Herring,
ADT says the following:
snipped

*I* advised you to switch? Reggie advised you to switch?

Both of us told you *not* to switch due to all the problems you have.
--
******************************************
***** Hope your day is great! *****
******************************************

John


D'oh. When did I ever say I was going to switch to VOIP?

D'oh, well to what 'advice to the contrary' are you referring, Harry?
--
******************************************
***** Hope your day is great! *****
******************************************

John