I have been in contact with the "keeper" of the rec.boats FAQ.

It seems that he left the group a while ago for two reasons:
1.) He was tired of all the Off Topic posting
2.) He realised he was spending too much time on rec.boats, and not
enough time boating.

The FAQ is a wealth of boating (primarily sailing) knowledge. It is
obvious that the founders of this group loved boating. They put in
the time and effort.

PROPOSAL:

1.) That we, as a group, decide to return rec.boats to a "boating"
newsgroup.
2.) That we, as a group, acknowledge the importance of "chit-chat",
political argument, and general nonsense by supporting the creation of
rec.boats.lounge, or some similarly named group, where the
conversation is unlimited.

Personally, I have benefitted from other's boating knowledge in this
group.

I also admit (mea culpa) to participating in some OT threads. Ideas
and personalities are interesting, sometimes provocative, and
sometimes infuriating. It is also true that we have lost regs and
newbies because of the OT posts.

Can we take that portion of the experience next door?

I am willing to do the process (3 to 6 months) to create a discussion
group for rec.boats. Is there any support for this effort?

My personal opinion is that there is a tremendous wealth of boating
information and experience here. Far more than any individual could
hope to experience. This treasure is also often buried under tons of
political opinion. I think that this is a mistake.

This issue has been raised before. It has either never received
adequate support to move it forward, or the people involved have not
been able or willing to do it.

I am not suggesting "moderation" of rec.boats, simply an updated FAQ
and a seperate discussion group for OT stuff.

Response from posters and lurkers is appreciated. It's not worth the
effort if nobody cares.

Regards,
noah

Great post, Noah!

I didn't know there was a sole originator to the rec.boats NG, but I find it
sad that he left.

I have another suggestion for the idle "chit-chat" people might do on
rec.boats. Instead of another "lounge" type of NG, just have people take it to
email. That way two people can hold a conversation and not clog up the NG.
Norm Eckert and I do that frequently.... He'll email me, or I'll email him,
and we'll talk about boating or our families and such and what's the latest
goings on in our lives.

There are a lot of good people on this NG. But again, sadly, a lot of people
have left because of the signal-to-noise ratio.

I applaud you for the effort to try to bring rec.boats back to what it once
was.

Butch Ammon

Noah,
It is a very noble suggestion, and I hope you are successful in your
endeavor. I hope I am wrong, but the regulars don't want a rec.boats they
want rec.boats.flamewar.


"noah" wrote in message
...
I have been in contact with the "keeper" of the rec.boats FAQ.

It seems that he left the group a while ago for two reasons:
1.) He was tired of all the Off Topic posting
2.) He realised he was spending too much time on rec.boats, and not
enough time boating.

The FAQ is a wealth of boating (primarily sailing) knowledge. It is
obvious that the founders of this group loved boating. They put in
the time and effort.

PROPOSAL:

1.) That we, as a group, decide to return rec.boats to a "boating"
newsgroup.
2.) That we, as a group, acknowledge the importance of "chit-chat",
political argument, and general nonsense by supporting the creation of
rec.boats.lounge, or some similarly named group, where the
conversation is unlimited.

Personally, I have benefitted from other's boating knowledge in this
group.

I also admit (mea culpa) to participating in some OT threads. Ideas
and personalities are interesting, sometimes provocative, and
sometimes infuriating. It is also true that we have lost regs and
newbies because of the OT posts.

Can we take that portion of the experience next door?

I am willing to do the process (3 to 6 months) to create a discussion
group for rec.boats. Is there any support for this effort?

My personal opinion is that there is a tremendous wealth of boating
information and experience here. Far more than any individual could
hope to experience. This treasure is also often buried under tons of
political opinion. I think that this is a mistake.

This issue has been raised before. It has either never received
adequate support to move it forward, or the people involved have not
been able or willing to do it.

I am not suggesting "moderation" of rec.boats, simply an updated FAQ
and a seperate discussion group for OT stuff.

Response from posters and lurkers is appreciated. It's not worth the
effort if nobody cares.

Regards,
noah

On Sat, 13 Sep 2003 03:02:00 GMT, "Bill Cole"
wrote:

Noah,
It is a very noble suggestion, and I hope you are successful in your
endeavor. I hope I am wrong, but the regulars don't want a rec.boats they
want rec.boats.flamewar.

That may be, Bill, but I honestly don't think so.
Support from guys like you is very important.
If nobody supports change, there won't be any change.

To be honest, I've found the "politics" guys, for the most part, to be
reasonable, or at least, approachable. The fun, for them, is in
"kicking political *ss", and they may be agreeable to a change of
venue. I'm still exploring this, but it could be fun. It could also
be unfun. People need to speak up, one way or the other.

Regards,
noah

On Sat, 13 Sep 2003 03:08:05 GMT, bb wrote:

On Sat, 13 Sep 2003 03:02:00 GMT, "Bill Cole"
wrote:

I hope I am wrong, but the regulars don't want a rec.boats they
want rec.boats.flamewar.

What's that old parable about casting stones? You can't change
others actions, only your own.

bb

You won't get away that easily. )
Your opinion, please?
noah

noah wrote:


PROPOSAL:

1.) That we, as a group, decide to return rec.boats to a "boating"
newsgroup.
2.) That we, as a group, acknowledge the importance of "chit-chat",
political argument, and general nonsense by supporting the creation of
rec.boats.lounge, or some similarly named group, where the
conversation is unlimited.

Personally, I have benefitted from other's boating knowledge in this
group.

snip

Can we take that portion of the experience next door?

I am willing to do the process (3 to 6 months) to create a discussion
group for rec.boats. Is there any support for this effort?

My personal opinion is that there is a tremendous wealth of boating
information and experience here. Far more than any individual could
hope to experience. This treasure is also often buried under tons of
political opinion. I think that this is a mistake.

This issue has been raised before. It has either never received
adequate support to move it forward, or the people involved have not
been able or willing to do it.

I am not suggesting "moderation" of rec.boats, simply an updated FAQ
and a seperate discussion group for OT stuff.

Response from posters and lurkers is appreciated. It's not worth the
effort if nobody cares.

Regards,
noah

I lurk here most of the time and like to read "political opinions" of others
with mutual intrests. At least most of the "OT" are noted as such and the
thread pattern of posting is followed so if you want to follow the thread
you can. Most of the "OT" posts are not just copy & paste dribble from "I
read this so it must be so" that clutters political groups who start a new
(old) thread to get their name and subject back to the top of the header
view.
Sounds like a great idea,"rec.boats.lounge" would be a great name for the
group.
We could all do with less name calling, but some of the satire in this group
rivals Will Rogers or Mark Twain sometimes.
--
__________m___~¿õ____m_________________________
Rick

"noah" wrote in message
...
I have been in contact with the "keeper" of the rec.boats FAQ.

It seems that he left the group a while ago for two reasons:
1.) He was tired of all the Off Topic posting
2.) He realised he was spending too much time on rec.boats, and not
enough time boating.

The FAQ is a wealth of boating (primarily sailing) knowledge. It is
obvious that the founders of this group loved boating. They put in
the time and effort.

PROPOSAL:

1.) That we, as a group, decide to return rec.boats to a "boating"
newsgroup.
2.) That we, as a group, acknowledge the importance of "chit-chat",
political argument, and general nonsense by supporting the creation of
rec.boats.lounge, or some similarly named group, where the
conversation is unlimited.

Personally, I have benefitted from other's boating knowledge in this
group.

I also admit (mea culpa) to participating in some OT threads. Ideas
and personalities are interesting, sometimes provocative, and
sometimes infuriating. It is also true that we have lost regs and
newbies because of the OT posts.

Can we take that portion of the experience next door?

I am willing to do the process (3 to 6 months) to create a discussion
group for rec.boats. Is there any support for this effort?

My personal opinion is that there is a tremendous wealth of boating
information and experience here. Far more than any individual could
hope to experience. This treasure is also often buried under tons of
political opinion. I think that this is a mistake.

This issue has been raised before. It has either never received
adequate support to move it forward, or the people involved have not
been able or willing to do it.

I am not suggesting "moderation" of rec.boats, simply an updated FAQ
and a seperate discussion group for OT stuff.

Response from posters and lurkers is appreciated. It's not worth the
effort if nobody cares.

Regards,
noah


Go fer it!!!

Response from posters and lurkers is appreciated. It's not worth the
effort if nobody cares.

I think it's a great idea, if there is any way I can help please let me
know.

I think both discussions (OT and boating) are relevant -- as people have
said OT is like dockside chit-chat. But I agree that it would be nicer if
there was a slightly separate "place" for both. Sometimes, albeit rarely,
I'll peruse an OT post but mostly I just gather them up and delete them
before diving into the newsgroup. This would make everyone's life easier
(IMHO).

While I am new to this newsgroup, I am by no means new to usenet. Under
different identities I have participated in a variety of groups -- for
more than 10 years. My first browser was Mosaic.

Every group in which I've participated has run into this problem -- I
don't think there's a direct correlation, and even so, correlation does
not prove causation.

What's the point? Most posters are good about titling their posts so
that those of us who choose to participate in political newsgroups to
discuss politics can ignore the political posts here. This is a
significant improvement over other groups.

I don't know why the posters wish to discuss politics here, instead of
in the talk.* groups, but I also don't think anyone should stop them.
The only real choice is a moderator, or driving political posters out of
the group.

So I say leave the status quo, and as long as posters use "OT", those of
us who aren't interested can filter them.

Ok Noah, go for it! You got my vote.

Capt. Frank

noah wrote:

I have been in contact with the "keeper" of the rec.boats FAQ.

It seems that he left the group a while ago for two reasons:
1.) He was tired of all the Off Topic posting
2.) He realised he was spending too much time on rec.boats, and not
enough time boating.

The FAQ is a wealth of boating (primarily sailing) knowledge. It is
obvious that the founders of this group loved boating. They put in
the time and effort.

PROPOSAL:

1.) That we, as a group, decide to return rec.boats to a "boating"
newsgroup.
2.) That we, as a group, acknowledge the importance of "chit-chat",
political argument, and general nonsense by supporting the creation of
rec.boats.lounge, or some similarly named group, where the
conversation is unlimited.

Personally, I have benefitted from other's boating knowledge in this
group.

I also admit (mea culpa) to participating in some OT threads. Ideas
and personalities are interesting, sometimes provocative, and
sometimes infuriating. It is also true that we have lost regs and
newbies because of the OT posts.

Can we take that portion of the experience next door?

I am willing to do the process (3 to 6 months) to create a discussion
group for rec.boats. Is there any support for this effort?

My personal opinion is that there is a tremendous wealth of boating
information and experience here. Far more than any individual could
hope to experience. This treasure is also often buried under tons of
political opinion. I think that this is a mistake.

This issue has been raised before. It has either never received
adequate support to move it forward, or the people involved have not
been able or willing to do it.

I am not suggesting "moderation" of rec.boats, simply an updated FAQ
and a seperate discussion group for OT stuff.

Response from posters and lurkers is appreciated. It's not worth the
effort if nobody cares.

Regards,
noah