On Mon, 11 Aug 2008 15:09:07 -0400, in message

"Roger Long" wrote:

"RichH" wrote

If possible, I only buy fuel from a marina as the very last resort; Id
rather 'jug
it' from a truck stop as the chances of fresh uncontaminated fuel is much
much less. :-)

That's what I'm doing. I've got enough on board to motor for 75% of my
planned route so I shouldn't need to re-fuel this cruise.

On a twentyfive litre jug and a twenty cent a litre premium, that's
five bucks a jug, or about a buck an hour to run my Atomic 4, making
the convenience of a marina fill-up one of the cheapest things I can
buy for the boat.

As for fuel freshness, our gas dock clears the tanks in about a week.

Ryk

On 2008-08-11 06:17:56 -0400, "Roger Long" said:

"RichH" wrote

A furler usually cannot tolerate heavy luff loads, as would be
necessary to change the luff entry shape (the 'forward curve shape' at
the luff) of a jib/genoa; crank on luff tension to a furler with a
halyard and to *Jam*. ..... probably the prime reason that you'll
never ever see a genoa/jib furler on a serious racing boat.

This somewhat depends on halyard geometry. You see some setups where the
halyard leads at an angle from the foil. This is good for minimizing
halyard wraps but pulls the end of the foil against the stay.

Oh, good point! I forgot another reason I love the CDI: The halyard is
internal to the luff, so no possibility of halyard wrap. The luff
tension is controlled at the foot, with about 6:1 leverage from the
multiple loops of light line and gravity helping rather than hurting.
It's real easy to over-tension the luff with a CDI, particularly as the
halyard is wire.

--
Jere Lull
Xan-à-Deux -- Tanzer 28 #4 out of Tolchester, MD
Xan's pages: http://web.mac.com/jerelull/iWeb/Xan/
Our BVI trips & tips: http://homepage.mac.com/jerelull/BVI/

On 2008-08-11 09:57:02 -0400, Dave said:

On Sun, 10 Aug 2008 21:51:51 -0700 (PDT), RichH said:

A headsail on a 'furler' can only be reduced by 30% SA and still
retain any good shape. Beyond 30% reduction and you wind up with a
'BAG" shape instead of a usable sail shape for any 'upwind' work.
135 X .70 = 95% So, you can reduce a 135 down to a 'working
jib' (100%) size without shape problems. A 150 can usually only be
reduced to a 105, et

That's consistent with what I've experienced. I generally end up taking a
second reef in the main before rolling any of the 150 in.

On any masthead rig, that's the way to go. The foresail is more
efficient than the main.

Additionally, when properly reefed, the main gets flatter (less heel
and weather helm) and more efficient, with less drag.

--
Jere Lull
Xan-à-Deux -- Tanzer 28 #4 out of Tolchester, MD
Xan's pages: http://web.mac.com/jerelull/iWeb/Xan/
Our BVI trips & tips: http://homepage.mac.com/jerelull/BVI/

In article ,
Dave wrote:
On Sun, 10 Aug 2008 21:51:51 -0700 (PDT), RichH said:

A headsail on a 'furler' can only be reduced by 30% SA and still
retain any good shape. Beyond 30% reduction and you wind up with a
'BAG" shape instead of a usable sail shape for any 'upwind' work.
135 X .70 = 95% So, you can reduce a 135 down to a 'working
jib' (100%) size without shape problems. A 150 can usually only be
reduced to a 105, et

That's consistent with what I've experienced. I generally end up taking a
second reef in the main before rolling any of the 150 in.

Doesn't that give you a fairly unbalanced helm? That's a lot of CE forward.

Doesn't that give you a fairly unbalanced helm? That's a lot of CE forward.

Not on a cutter rig (mast at ~40-50% LOA) where the combined CE is
usually in front of the mast.

In article ,
RichH wrote:
Doesn't that give you a fairly unbalanced helm? That's a lot of CE forward.

Not on a cutter rig (mast at ~40-50% LOA) where the combined CE is
usually in front of the mast.

With a lot of CE forward, it seems to make sense that one would have lee helm.
This in and of itself seems unbalanced to me. I'd much rather have a bit of
weather helm vs. lee helm.

On 2008-08-12 01:14:53 -0400, lid (Jonathan Ganz) said:

In article ,
RichH wrote:
Doesn't that give you a fairly unbalanced helm? That's a lot of CE forward.

Not on a cutter rig (mast at ~40-50% LOA) where the combined CE is
usually in front of the mast.

With a lot of CE forward, it seems to make sense that one would have lee helm.
This in and of itself seems unbalanced to me. I'd much rather have a bit of
weather helm vs. lee helm.

As I recall, cutter rigs place the the mast further aft.

What's determines "helm" is the balance among the CEs of the sails,
keel, and hull.

--
Jere Lull
Xan-à-Deux -- Tanzer 28 #4 out of Tolchester, MD
Xan's pages: http://web.mac.com/jerelull/iWeb/Xan/
Our BVI trips & tips: http://homepage.mac.com/jerelull/BVI/

With a lot of CE forward, it seems to make sense that one would have lee helm.
This in and of itself seems unbalanced to me. I'd much rather have a bit of
weather helm vs. lee helm.

On most 'true' cutters (not double headed sloops where the mast is
further forward) the combined CE is properly located above the
CLR ..... But then again the CE is a static (necessary) concept and
can be **dynamically** changed by how one 'shapes' the sails (sum or
all vectors). All depends on the design and how it performs when
heeled etc.

On 2008-08-11 13:22:54 -0400, lid (Jonathan Ganz) said:

In article ,
Dave wrote:

That's consistent with what I've experienced. I generally end up taking
a second reef in the main before rolling any of the 150 in.

Doesn't that give you a fairly unbalanced helm? That's a lot of CE forward.

Typically, it improves the boat's balance and unloads the helm somewhat.

If a particular boat picks up lee helm, the rules are different of course.

--
Jere Lull
Xan-à-Deux -- Tanzer 28 #4 out of Tolchester, MD
Xan's pages: http://web.mac.com/jerelull/iWeb/Xan/
Our BVI trips & tips: http://homepage.mac.com/jerelull/BVI/

In article 2008081121315716807-jerelull@maccom,
Jere Lull wrote:
On 2008-08-11 13:22:54 -0400, lid (Jonathan Ganz) said:

In article ,
Dave wrote:

That's consistent with what I've experienced. I generally end up taking
a second reef in the main before rolling any of the 150 in.

Doesn't that give you a fairly unbalanced helm? That's a lot of CE forward.

Typically, it improves the boat's balance and unloads the helm somewhat.

If a particular boat picks up lee helm, the rules are different of course.

It sure wouldn't on my boat, especially in 20+ air. I typically sail with a single
reef in the main and a full masthead (working) jib (it has a high foot).