On May 17, 3:02*pm, wrote:
On Sat, 17 May 2008 13:45:22 -0700 (PDT), Jay wrote:
On May 17, 8:40*am, wrote:

Except for the part that says it's still ok when it's not squirting.... unless severe damage occurs lol! *I think Salty said it best ... "Truly bizarre".

I don't recall that statement (...it's still ok when it's not
squirting.... unless severe damage occurs...) being in the manual.

I think I would call a Suzuki mechanic (not a salesman) and get an explanation that makes sense.. And pin him down if necessary. That owners manual is as ambiguous as any I've heard about.

I already did contact a Suzuki mechanic and he confirmed that
Suzuki calls them pilot holes, not pee or tell-tale holes and that
they serve the same purpose as pee holes and/or tell-tale holes. *I
agree that sometimes things appear "bizarre" but sometimes they do
simply because some are not aware of them, not because they are
necessarily in error.

The manual states, "Cooling water is intermittently discharged from
the pilot water holes at medium engine speeds. *Water is not normally
discharged at other speeds even when the engine is operating
properly. *However, cooling system operation can be confirmed as
follows:

1---Place the shift selector lever in the NEUTRAL position with the
motor idling.
2---Increase and decrease the engine speed five or six times in
succession by opening and closing the throttle smoothly and without
stopping in any one throttle position.
3---If water is discharged from the pilot water holes under this
operating condition, the cooling system is working properly. *If
water
is not discharged, stop the engine as soon as possible and consult
your authorized Suzuki Marine dealer."

It then states: *CAUTION *Never OPERATE (perhaps they are referring to
having the motor in GEAR, not NEUTRAL as stated above) your outboard
motor when there is no water coming out of the pilot water holes or
severe damage can
result. *Before setting off, be sure that emergency stop switch
operates properly.

Perhaps there's a difference between having the motor idling in
neutral and operating the motor under stress in gear in regards to the
functionality and/or creating possible damage in regards to the
cooling system?

-Jay

The purpose of a tell-tale, regardless of what you want to call it, is to be a
CONSTANT indicator that the water pump is working.

So it makes no difference in this particular Suzuki model, first
designed and manufactured in 2006, whether or not the engine is under
load (i.e. in gear as opposed to idling in neutral) as to the
necessity of the water pump squirting water out of the pilot holes?


That is why ALL small outboards have them. If Suzuki has built an engine with a tell tale, pilot hole, or pee-hole that does not emit water under ALL operating conditions then the only answer is that they made a big mistake in their design, and should issue a recall to rectify it.

So therefore it's not at all possible that a new design created
just 18-24 months ago by Suzuki could have created a motor that is not
like ALL other motors and that no mistake at all was made?

There is no good reason on earth why the cooling water indicator on an outboard should ever stop squirting while the motor is running. That's a potentially fatal flaw.

Or perhaps there is no good reason I. you or several others can
think of at this time?

Not trying to disagree with what you're saying but just keeping an
open mind. I've found that I get used to things being a certain way
in other matters and sometimes have difficulty accepting they could be
done differently and be just as good, and not necessarily "wrong." I
guess the best way to resolve this issue is perhaps to write American
Suzuki Marine, P.O. Box 1100, Brea, CA 92822 and give 'em the what
for...lol.

Tell you what. I'll take the boat out soon, putt around the lake
and if no water squirts out all the time and the motor seizes up, I'll
feed it to Suzuki for lunch. If I putt around the lake and water
doesn't squirt out all the time and nothing overheats and/or seizes
up, I guess then I'll know that they didn't screw up and they did
design a motor to operate exactly as stated in the manual and that all
other fears basesd on other outboard motors are therefore groundless.
Does that sound reasonable?

-Jay

On May 17, 6:42*pm, wrote:
On Sat, 17 May 2008 18:31:51 -0700 (PDT), Jay wrote:
On May 17, 3:02*pm, wrote:
On Sat, 17 May 2008 13:45:22 -0700 (PDT), Jay wrote:
On May 17, 8:40*am, wrote:

Except for the part that says it's still ok when it's not squirting..... unless severe damage occurs lol! *I think Salty said it best ... "Truly bizarre".

I don't recall that statement (...it's still ok when it's not
squirting.... unless severe damage occurs...) being in the manual.

I think I would call a Suzuki mechanic (not a salesman) and get an explanation that makes sense.. And pin him down if necessary. That owners manual is as ambiguous as any I've heard about.

I already did contact a Suzuki mechanic and he confirmed that
Suzuki calls them pilot holes, not pee or tell-tale holes and that
they serve the same purpose as pee holes and/or tell-tale holes. *I
agree that sometimes things appear "bizarre" but sometimes they do
simply because some are not aware of them, not because they are
necessarily in error.

The manual states, "Cooling water is intermittently discharged from
the pilot water holes at medium engine speeds. *Water is not normally
discharged at other speeds even when the engine is operating
properly. *However, cooling system operation can be confirmed as
follows:

1---Place the shift selector lever in the NEUTRAL position with the
motor idling.
2---Increase and decrease the engine speed five or six times in
succession by opening and closing the throttle smoothly and without
stopping in any one throttle position.
3---If water is discharged from the pilot water holes under this
operating condition, the cooling system is working properly. *If
water
is not discharged, stop the engine as soon as possible and consult
your authorized Suzuki Marine dealer."

It then states: *CAUTION *Never OPERATE (perhaps they are referring to
having the motor in GEAR, not NEUTRAL as stated above) your outboard
motor when there is no water coming out of the pilot water holes or
severe damage can
result. *Before setting off, be sure that emergency stop switch
operates properly.

Perhaps there's a difference between having the motor idling in
neutral and operating the motor under stress in gear in regards to the
functionality and/or creating possible damage in regards to the
cooling system?

-Jay

The purpose of a tell-tale, regardless of what you want to call it, is to be a
CONSTANT indicator that the water pump is working.

So it makes no difference in this particular Suzuki model, first
designed and manufactured in 2006, whether or not the engine is under
load (i.e. in gear as opposed to idling in neutral) as to the
necessity of the water pump squirting water out of the pilot holes?

If the tell tale doesn't always have water coming out of it when the engine is
running I would consider that a defect, and a serious one.



That is why ALL small outboards have them. If Suzuki has built an engine with a tell tale, pilot hole, or pee-hole that does not emit water under ALL operating conditions then the only answer is that they made a big mistake in their design, and should issue a recall to rectify it.

One needs to be careful about something being the "only answer" to
any problem. And most would agree that if this motor, which has
powered thousands of boats since 2006, had a serious manufacturing
defect the boating world would most certainly have heard all about it
by now, the recall would have already been in progress and this thread
concerning the matter would never have existed.

So therefore it's not at all possible that a new design created
just 18-24 months ago by Suzuki could have created a motor that is not
like ALL other motors and that no mistake at all was made?

If that's the way it was intended, I would return the motor for a refund. I'm
quite serious. Would you accept an automobile where they told you the oil
pressure warning light would only indicate a problem if you pulled over to the
side of the road and performed a "procedure" to make it work?

I'm not totally disagreeing with your logic; however, in any
unusual situation one perhaps should consider that all things, even in
the same category (i.e. outboard motors) do not work nor are
constructed in exactly the same manner and the analogy between a car's
oil pressure and an outboard's cooling system would only be applicable
if both motorsd/engines were built exactly the same way and one was
talking about exactly the same system within those same motors..

There is no good reason on earth why the cooling water indicator on an outboard should ever stop squirting while the motor is running. *That's a potentially fatal flaw.

Or perhaps there is no good reason I. you or several others can
think of at this time?

Nope. I have this right with no exceptions.

And you very well may be but until you have thoroughtly
disassembled a DF2.5 Suzuki outboard and/or attained a thorough
understanding of how that particular model is constructed and
functions and if it is or isn't different than most outboards, then
your statement is based upon your long-time valuable experience with
outboard motors but NOT THIS ONE so therefore you may or may not "have
this right."

Not trying to disagree with what you're saying but just keeping an
open mind. *I've found that I get used to things being a certain way
in other matters and sometimes have difficulty accepting they could be
done differently and be just as good, and not necessarily "wrong." *I
guess the best way to resolve this issue is perhaps to write American
Suzuki Marine, P.O. Box 1100, Brea, CA 92822 and give 'em the what
for...lol.

Tell you what. *I'll take the boat out soon, putt around the lake
and if no water squirts out all the time and the motor seizes up, I'll
feed it to Suzuki for lunch. *If I putt around the lake and water
doesn't squirt out all the time and nothing overheats and/or seizes
up, I guess then I'll know that they didn't screw up and they did
design a motor to operate exactly as stated in the manual and that all
other fears basesd on other outboard motors are therefore groundless.
Does that sound reasonable?

Only to a fool. Good luck, anyway. That's all you have on your side.

No, that's incorrect. I have a written signed warranty in my hand
and an owner's manual that states exactly what I've reproduced here
and a cousin who's a great attorney. I think I have far more that
luck and would not consider myself a fool. I mean what better way to
prove your point about the motor being manufactured defectively than
to operate it as per the owner's manual and seize it up? And if it
doesn't fail when operating it according to that owner's manual,
well....oooops!

-Jay