After reading Roger "the old pirate lover" Long's posting that he is
planning on fogging [ oops, I meaning cruising ] to Canada and then also
reading another posting asking about going to the Bahama's .............

I got to thinking ???

I have never cruised outside of the USA. If you have, could you tell me/us
what and how all this works.

Specifically; what is the Flag thing all about? When/how do you and your
boat report to customs in the country you visit?

How much does it cost to visit the Bahama's? Canada? Does the USA also
charge when a boat from the Bahama's visits us? If not, why not.

How does this international cruising all work.

When entering Canada you have to clear customs at your first port of
landing. This can be done by telephone and if the authorities think it is
necessary, they will send a customs agent or the RCMP (Royal Canadian
Mounted Police) It is usually very painless but I have seen them give a
lot of attention to some very large power boats. Entering the US by yacht
requires a crusing permit, it is good for 12 months.


"NE Sailboat" wrote in message
news:7IcKh.9563$t8.4159@trndny02...
After reading Roger "the old pirate lover" Long's posting that he is
planning on fogging [ oops, I meaning cruising ] to Canada and then also
reading another posting asking about going to the Bahama's .............

I got to thinking ???

I have never cruised outside of the USA. If you have, could you tell
me/us what and how all this works.

Specifically; what is the Flag thing all about? When/how do you and your
boat report to customs in the country you visit?

How much does it cost to visit the Bahama's? Canada? Does the USA also
charge when a boat from the Bahama's visits us? If not, why not.

How does this international cruising all work.

I have sailed into Canada a few times both on the Great Lakes and the Gulf
of Maine (NB and NS). I have also sailed into the Bahamas, the Virgin
Islands (British and US), Martinique, Guadeloupe, St. Lucia, St. Vincent,
and Grenada.

The flag thing is the easy part. When entering a foreign port you fly the Q
flag from your starboard spreader to indicate that you are quarantined and
that no one can come aboard or leave the vessel except the skipper to go to
check in. The skipper goes to check in with the customs and the immigration
authorities on behalf of his vessel and his crew. When the proper check in
has been completed the Q flag is lowered and a courtesy flag is raised in
its place. The courtesy flag is a miniature version of the national flag of
the country checked into. When your visit is completed then you need to
check out of the country and lower the flag as you leave.

I cannot speak accurately about the fees involved because it has been a few
years since I have been to any of the above countries except Canada. There
are fees usually assessed to check into a country and some countries also
have a cruising fee which is based on the time that you will be in their
waters and sometimes on a per person basis.

Checking into Canada is relatively easy, usually during a call to the
customs people they will ask you the usual questions of do you have any
drugs, weapons, etc and how much booze are you carrying. If you answer
everything to their satisfaction they will check their computers to see if
you are some crazy and then they will give you a cruising permit number. You
have to give that number to any coasties who ask.

Ansley Sawyer
SV Pacem

NE Sailboat wrote:
After reading Roger "the old pirate lover" Long's posting that he is
planning on fogging [ oops, I meaning cruising ] to Canada and then also
reading another posting asking about going to the Bahama's .............

I got to thinking ???

I have never cruised outside of the USA. If you have, could you tell me/us
what and how all this works.

Specifically; what is the Flag thing all about? When/how do you and your
boat report to customs in the country you visit?

How much does it cost to visit the Bahama's? Canada? Does the USA also
charge when a boat from the Bahama's visits us? If not, why not.

How does this international cruising all work.



International cruising is not difficult. For the Bahamas you stop at the
first port with customs, hoist the 'Q' flag, present yourself with ships
papers (documentation, ships radio license) and everyone's passports,
fill out the paperwork, pay the fees and get your cruising permit good
for six months. Fee is $150 for boats up to 35' and $300 for over 35'.
They are talking about increasing the fee to $500 for over 35' this summer.

Cruising places like the leewards and windwards requires multiple
clearances in/out. The fees range from free to hundreds. An Anguilla
cruising permit is $150 per day. Say you sail the windwards from
Martinique to Grenada. To clear into Martinique with ships papers,
passports, four copies of crew list. Fee is $0. To leave go to customs
and get the clearance papers stamped for departure. Sail to Rodney Bay,
St. Lucia. Put up the 'Q' flag. Go to customs with ships papers, four
copies of crew list, passports, itinerary, list of ships stores,
firearms and ammo, alcohol and tobacco aboard. Fill out papers, pay fee
($35),get cruising permit, go to boat, take down 'Q' flag and hoist St.
Lucia flag. Cruise down to Marigot Bay, Pitons than clear out at
Souferre town. Sail to St. Vincent and the Grenadines. Clear in at
Bequea, sail to Mayreau, Tobago Cays, Little St Vincent then clear out
at Union Island. Sail to Carriacou, clear in for Granada, do Hillsboro,
Terrel Bay and Sandy Island then sail to Grenada.

On Thu, 15 Mar 2007 16:37:37 -0400, krj
wrote:

International cruising is not difficult. For the Bahamas you stop at the
first port with customs

As long as you do not stop or fish, you can fly the Q flag and
continue on to your chosen port of entry. This is true in the US
also.

On Thu, 15 Mar 2007 16:02:59 -0400, "Ansley W. Sawyer"
wrote:

I have sailed into Canada a few times both on the Great Lakes and the Gulf
of Maine (NB and NS). I have also sailed into the Bahamas, the Virgin
Islands (British and US), Martinique, Guadeloupe, St. Lucia, St. Vincent,
and Grenada.

The flag thing is the easy part. When entering a foreign port you fly the Q
flag from your starboard spreader to indicate that you are quarantined and
that no one can come aboard or leave the vessel except the skipper to go to
check in. The skipper goes to check in with the customs and the immigration
authorities on behalf of his vessel and his crew. When the proper check in
has been completed the Q flag is lowered and a courtesy flag is raised in
its place. The courtesy flag is a miniature version of the national flag of
the country checked into. When your visit is completed then you need to
check out of the country and lower the flag as you leave.

That just doesn't seem quite ceremonious enough
No piping customs aboard, or gun salutes?

--Vic

On Thu, 15 Mar 2007 17:37:25 -0400, Wayne.B
wrote:

On Thu, 15 Mar 2007 16:37:37 -0400, krj
wrote:

International cruising is not difficult. For the Bahamas you stop at the
first port with customs

As long as you do not stop or fish, you can fly the Q flag and
continue on to your chosen port of entry. This is true in the US
also.

FWIW
When we sailed to Sdydney, Australia from New Zealand years ago, we
flew the yellow Q flag. I don't think we have flown it since and I am
sure that most other cruising sailors fly it either. As to the
courtesy flag, we always fly that as we sail into a country's waters.
Sometimes we have even been sewing it up as we neared Customs.
Different countries have different fees and requirements that can be
looked up on Noonsite (www.noonsite.com) which is a great resource for
cruising sailors.

We always used to stamp out through Immigration, Port Clearance etc
but since Greece, we just sail away as nobody had ever asked us for
the Port Clearance document from the last port of call. Friends
usually do the same. The Caribbean is different. Apparently they all
want it (I have only entered Barbados, Grenada and Trinidad).

A lot has been written about small nations annoyance if someone
doesn't fly a courtesy flag. When I asked the Australian Customs
Officers who came on board what would happen if I didn't fly their
flag, the response was "We'll burn your bloody boat - Mate!!"
In my work with Malaysian Marine Customs, they couldn't care less
about yacht's courtesy flags; neither do those colleagues in
Indonesian Customs that I have asked. A quick look around the
anchorage at Langkawi island where yachts sail down from Thailand to
do a border run for visa purposes will often show the tricolour Thai
flag flown, not the Malaysian Crescent and stripes. In fact the only
time I have stopped a yacht under weigh about his lack of National
Flag and courtesy flag was when I thought it was a friend I knew and I
wished to give him a "hard time". The boat was unmarked at the stern
from which direction we approached. It wasn't he but the poor sod
raised the courtesy flag and then his National flag (Gibraltar) up
side down in his haste. I calmy called over the megaphone "your
national flag is upside down Sir. Are you in distress?

Incidentally, yachts can enter Malaysia with no paperwork being
required and can stay forever. People however get a 3 month visa
stamped in their passports. A border run to Thailand or over
toSingapore gives another 3 months and so on. Indonesia requires a
"Cruising Cait" which can cost, through an agent, up to $600 to
arrange. It allows the boat only 2 months in their waters and must be
shown at every port.

Peter
N.Z. Yacht Herodotus

On Fri, 16 Mar 2007 22:52:13 +1100, Peter Hendra
wrote:


FWIW
When we sailed to Sdydney, Australia from New Zealand years ago, we
flew the yellow Q flag. I don't think we have flown it since and I am
sure that most other cruising sailors fly it either. As to the
courtesy flag, we always fly that as we sail into a country's waters.
Sometimes we have even been sewing it up as we neared Customs.
Different countries have different fees and requirements that can be
looked up on Noonsite (www.noonsite.com) which is a great resource for
cruising sailors.


Sorry, lock on-lock out.
I intended to say that most other cruising sailors do not fly the Q
flag.

cheers
Peter

On Fri, 16 Mar 2007 23:29:35 -0400, Wayne.B
wrote:

On Fri, 16 Mar 2007 22:52:13 +1100, Peter Hendra
wrote:

When we sailed to Sdydney, Australia from New Zealand years ago, we
flew the yellow Q flag. I don't think we have flown it since

Local knowledge is a wonderful thing but when in doubt it is best to
go by the book. If you are following all of the rules to the letter
it is much less likely that you will have a problem with rampant
authority figures. Flying a Q flag at the right time is one of those
rules that is ridiculously easy to follow.

You only have to fly it after you enter the 12 mile limit and before
you clear in, not the entire trip.

For those going further afield than the Caribbean and Europe to places
where bribery and baksheesh are rife such as Indonesia, Sri Lanka and
Egypt, make it a rule to never pay bribes, baksheesh or "presents". In
Indonesia for example cruisers with Caits (cruising permits) usually
attest to being asked for a large monetary "presents" or additional
fees before being given back their papers. When passaging the Suez
canal it has become customary to give cartons of Marlborough
cigarettes or American dollars to the agent, the pilot, each pilot
boat that swaps over the pilot and so on. So much so that the canal is
oft refered to as "The Marlborough ditch" and "The greenback ditch".
Unfortunately Americans are making it worse and raising the stakes for
everyone else by giving greater and greater amounts. Possibly your
ready aquiessence is due to your custom of tipping at home whether the
service be good, bad or mediocre. Many big ships also have to make the
gifts. One Turkish captain told me of having given away a large box of
cartons and when he reached Suez, he balked at given a carton to the
small line tender vessel that was about to secure him to a mooring
buoy.

Following his refusal, the small boat's engine refused to start. The
crew calmly produced a set of oars and commenced towing the large ship
to the buoy under oar power alone. Only when the ship was in danger of
drifting aground did the Captain give in and threw down a carton. The
stakes went up. Now they demanded two. They got them. Instantly the
motor on the tender fired and the ship was secured.

My approach has been to always refuse, no matter what the temptation
is to give in. I merely say that I don't pay bribes as it is expressly
forbidden by the Prophet, and, when in Moslem countries, quote the
following verses from the Q'uran:

"He who gives a bribe is cursed"
"He who takes a bribe is cursed"
"And he who acts as the middleman, is doubly cursed"

I have always found that they back off straight away. The official may
be a crook and never attend the mosque for prayers, but I have always
found that they have an ingrained respect for someone who they believe
is a religious man - rather like the Christian (and most other
people's) respect for Catholic nuns.

Examples of this were that of the three yachts measured for fees at
Suez at the same time, ours was the largest, yet we paid under half of
what each of the other two paid. At Ismalia (half way point and
overnight stop), where other yachtees were bribing the police at the
gate so that they could get subsidised diesel ($US 0.06 per litre)
from the gas stations instead of paying the marina price, I paid
nothing and the officer even got one of his men to organise the taxi
and lift the jerry cans on board whereas others had to carry theirs
from the gate.

Universally, I find that when approaching an official, it pays to
smile and extend your hand to be shaken together with a verbal
greeting. This puts you in command at the outset.

You don't have to be a Moslem to use this technique. They won't know.
We come in all colours, shapes and sizes (please note that I have not
mis-spelled "colours". That is the correct spelling).

Peter H

On Fri, 16 Mar 2007 22:52:13 +1100, Peter Hendra
wrote:

When we sailed to Sdydney, Australia from New Zealand years ago, we
flew the yellow Q flag. I don't think we have flown it since

Local knowledge is a wonderful thing but when in doubt it is best to
go by the book. If you are following all of the rules to the letter
it is much less likely that you will have a problem with rampant
authority figures. Flying a Q flag at the right time is one of those
rules that is ridiculously easy to follow.

You only have to fly it after you enter the 12 mile limit and before
you clear in, not the entire trip.