Gas prices .. some good news
 

"Canuck57" wrote in message
...

"JR North" wrote in message
...
Gas your pigs up while you can. Not gonna tow Cruis'n Rulz! to the pump.
Gonna just get 5 gal at a time and fill her up at home. Don't expect the
prices will hold till next spring. If you wait, you might just find it
back to $4
JR

You are likely right. Any market recovery and oil will go right past
$100/barrel in light speed due to anticipation of demand. If China kicks
in it will be sooner than we think.

Too bad gasoline does not keep and if I had a 5000 gallon tank to hold it.

Switch to diesel power. Diesel fuel will store for a very long time,
properly conditioned.

Eisboch

Gas prices .. some good news
 

"Canuck57" wrote in message
...


I am going to keep my F150 thank you. Nice ride and pulls a boat and has
4x4 for the winter. Try that with a pint sized electric car up a long
hill.


Harry had a F-150 not too long ago and often reported in this NG what a
great truck it was.

That's before he sharpened his political correctness.

Now a US made truck is crap because he owns a Japanese model.


Eisboch

Gas prices .. some good news
 

"tin cup" wrote in message
...

wrote:

Ford and GM took a look at trying to compete with Honda, Toyota and
Nissan in the small, efficient cars ten years ago. They were
completely unable to compete because of the labor cost in their
vehicles compared to their competion, thanks to the UAW.

Their only way to make enough money to continue to meet the finacial
obligation forced on them by union labor was to continue to build high
profit SUVs and trucks. Now that that's over, the UAW slobs with
barely a high school education living on easy street may have to
tighten their belts to allow the auto makers to survive. Heh.. will
that happen? Of course not... the unions say screw everyone else, we
got ours!


UAW slobs??
How white of you. In your world only Investment Bankers should make a
decent living.
The average wage was around 58,000.00 a year. So you want them to make
20,000.00 or 10,000.00?
The UAW is not the problem. The problem is the bean counters building cars
that are not desirable as we want at too high a markup and interest rates
that may be, in total as much again as the price of the vehicle. Global
Wall Street demands for too high a return on investment, and then their
gambling with worthless, imaginary values causing a collapse is the
problem.

I don't consider UAW members "slobs", but I agree with his overall
assesment.
The auto industry has signed up to some very expensive union contracts over
the years,
providing pay and benefit packages far in excess to those earned by
non-union workers with a similar education. This was done in robust
economic times and the high margin vechicles contributed the most towards
covering the costs of the benefit packages.

The small, fuel efficient cars are low margin products. Now that they have
become "desireable", GM, Ford and Chrysler are facing bankrupcy. The whole
structure has to change. Nobody in their right mind is going to pay $50K
for a fuel efficient, Ford Focus, nor should they.

Eisboch

Gas prices .. some good news
 

"Wayne.B" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 12 Nov 2008 22:40:09 -0500, tin cup wrote:

The average wage was around 58,000.00 a year.

That's misleading, benefits add at least another 20,000. That is
pretty good pay for unskiled labor, about 2 or 3 times what most
factory workers get.


I saw a news clip recently of a GM "worker" standing beside a console on
the assembly line, supervising a bunch of robotic arms assembling a car. His
primary job was to hit the red "Emergency Off" button, if something went
screwy or was called to do so.

His "package" (including benefits) was in excess of $85k/year and upon
retirement could look forward to full, GM financed health coverage along
with his pension.

I don't deny anybody the right to hold a good job with decent pay and
benefits, but it really should be in concert with the person's initiative to
prepare him/her self for that career. I am sorry, but standing around
watching an automated assembly line put cars together for that kind of pay
and benefits just doesn't do it for me, especially when I see others who
have worked hard to educate and qualify themselves for a trade making far
less.

Eisboch

Gas prices .. some good news
 

"br" wrote in message
...
On Nov 12, 7:49 pm, "Calif Bill" wrote:

... As well as the union negotiated pay for no work.

You blame unions for asking for it but not management for giving it?
Interesting.


Management can't go on strike to twist arms.

Eisboch

Gas prices .. some good news
 

"Wayne.B" wrote in message
...

On Wed, 12 Nov 2008 16:26:46 -0500, "Eisboch"
wrote:

That may change (and it should), but the point is .... Detroit builds what
people buy.

Right up until they don't.

Detroit made two big mistakes:

1. They thought they could keep pushing profitable big iron forever.

2. They could never figure out how to build a small, high quality,
economical car at a reasonable price. Given the high cost of their
labor content it may have been impossible but they never really tried.

Is there any reason why GM could not have produced something like a
Toyota Corolla or a small pickup truck even if they had to build it
offshore? People have certainly bought plenty of them from Toyota so
we can't claim the demand wasn't there.


It's the margins. The small cars don't produce enough to cover the total
company costs.
Never have.

Build offshore? Now, there's a UAW strike in the making.

Actually, the Ford Ranger has been a very successful product for Ford over
the years. It's really a Mazda.
To a lesser degree, GM's S-10 series has been a good seller. I believe
it's also based on a Japanese platform (Isuzu ?)

Eisboch

Gas prices .. some good news
 

"Tom Francis - SWSports" wrote in
message ...
On Thu, 13 Nov 2008 00:30:19 -0500, Wayne.B
wrote:

snip

Taxi drivers there told me they got 34 mph on
average - which is pretty damn decent.

Are you sure is wasn't kilometers per *hour*. Or maybe kilometer's per
liter?

I know, I know, you're not used to being up so late. 8)

Gas prices .. some good news (Union highlights)
 

Gas prices .. some good news
 

Boater wrote:
wrote:
On Nov 12, 4:38 pm, "Eisboch" wrote:
"Boater" wrote in message

...





Eisboch wrote:
"Boater" wrote in message
...
Eisboch wrote:
"JR North" wrote in message
...
Gas your pigs up while you can. Not gonna tow Cruis'n Rulz! to the
pump. Gonna just get 5 gal at a time and fill her up at home. Don't
expect the prices will hold till next spring. If you wait, you
might
just find it back to $4
JR
Nobody likes a spoilsport.
You're gonna give "O" some ideas of things to raise taxes on in
order
to force you to
buy an oversized golf cart which is what he's gonna force Ford,
GM and
Chrysler to build if they want a bailout.
Eisboch
Heaven forbid U.S. car makers produce mostly high quality,
smaller, fuel
efficient cars that people want to buy and dump most of the
oversized,
overpowered, mediocre quality V8's behemoths that get 13 mpg. Or
less.
Again, you get it wrong. If the vast majority of people wanted to buy
smaller, fuel efficient cars,
Detroit would have been be turning them out by the millions for
years.
That may change (and it should), but the point is .... Detroit builds
what people buy.
Eisboch
Apparently Detroit builds what people don't what to buy.
sigh

Correct. This year. Or, more accurately the past 6 months.

Eisboch

Ford and GM took a look at trying to compete with Honda, Toyota and
Nissan in the small, efficient cars ten years ago. They were
completely unable to compete because of the labor cost in their
vehicles compared to their competion, thanks to the UAW.

Their only way to make enough money to continue to meet the finacial
obligation forced on them by union labor was to continue to build high
profit SUVs and trucks. Now that that's over, the UAW slobs with
barely a high school education living on easy street may have to
tighten their belts to allow the auto makers to survive. Heh.. will
that happen? Of course not... the unions say screw everyone else, we
got ours!


Such hatred for the working man and woman...typical.
Oh...the Japanese aren't saddled with the high cost of providing health
care for their employees and retirees.

Come on asshole. There is nothing wrong with EARNING high pay and being
showered with benefits. There is no incentive for union employees to
EARN their keep. They get paid the same weather they do excellent work,
mediocre work, or no work. Have you found that little surprise on the
Union web site yet? I wish I could be there when you discover it.

Gas prices .. some good news
 

Eisboch wrote:
"Canuck57" wrote in message
...

I am going to keep my F150 thank you. Nice ride and pulls a boat and has
4x4 for the winter. Try that with a pint sized electric car up a long
hill.


Harry had a F-150 not too long ago and often reported in this NG what a
great truck it was.

That's before he sharpened his political correctness.

Now a US made truck is crap because he owns a Japanese model.


Eisboch



I haven't owned an F150 for nearly 10 years. It was a good truck. The
Toyota truck that replaced it was better. I doubt I ever stated the
US-made truck was "crap." I have heard those sorts of allegations,
however, from SW Tom and I believe from you.