For TJ: Health Care Proposals
 

For TJ: Health Care Proposals
 

"hk" wrote in message
...
Eisboch wrote:
"hk" wrote in message
. ..

I think I am a bit closer to the labor force than you are.



Union labor force maybe.

Small business employees ..... no way.

Eisboch


I doubt it. I frequently go out on organizing calls with union reps, and
the companies and employees we visit are not members of unions.



You call that being *close* to labor?
How about *being* labor for several years .... punching a time clock,
wearing company issued uniforms with your name on the shirt, working with,
eating lunch with, drinking on Friday nights with, etc.?


Maybe we have met.

I'll share a little story with you.

Back when the "Big Dig" was in high gear up here, welders/fabricators were
in short supply for the project.
The local unions started a less than covert recruitment drive to find and
sign up qualified welders wherever they could find them.

We had several good, experienced welder/fabricators at my company. The
supervisor, "Big Ed" was a seasoned veteran, having done his time as a union
welder at the old Fore River Shipyard in Quincy, MA back in the 60's. Big
Ed is nearing retirement but still stands about 6'5" and has forearms the
size of my thighs.

One day someone came into my office and told me there were two union
organizers out in the shop. We had a conventional lobby/reception area
where visitors were supposed to sign in, get a badge and safety glasses, but
these guys had snuck around back and entered through one of the shop
overhead doors.

I entered the shop just in time to see "Big Ed" escorting the two union
dudes out the door. He had both by the back of their belts and was half
dragging, half carrying them out. One guy dropped the folder full of
propaganda he was carrying and another of our guys picked it up and threw it
in a dumpster.

They were handing out information on the local union and job offers for the
Big Dig. I've been told this is not normal practice, and I believe it, but
they tried and didn't get very far.

We lost only one employee to the Big Dig project and he returned a little
over a year later, fed up. We simply could not afford to match the pay and
overtime offered to him by the union.

Eisboch

For TJ: Health Care Proposals
 

"hk" wrote in message
. ..

wrote:

"hk" wrote in message
. ..

I think I am a bit closer to the labor force than you are.D'oh.


Union labor force maybe.
Small business employees ..... no way.
Eisboch



D'oh. We don't meet on the premises, and typically we respond to requests
from employees for a visit. First meetings usually are held at a local
eatery where the employees go for lunch or dinner, or anywhere else
convenient to the place of employment.


Bull**** alert

More like the perimeter of the company's parking lot at the end of the
workday .... *if* they are playing by their own rules.



Eisboch

For TJ: Health Care Proposals
 

Eisboch wrote:
"hk" wrote in message
...
Eisboch wrote:
"hk" wrote in message
. ..
I think I am a bit closer to the labor force than you are.


Union labor force maybe.

Small business employees ..... no way.

Eisboch

I doubt it. I frequently go out on organizing calls with union reps, and
the companies and employees we visit are not members of unions.



You call that being *close* to labor?
How about *being* labor for several years .... punching a time clock,
wearing company issued uniforms with your name on the shirt, working with,
eating lunch with, drinking on Friday nights with, etc.?


Maybe we have met.

I'll share a little story with you.

Back when the "Big Dig" was in high gear up here, welders/fabricators were
in short supply for the project.
The local unions started a less than covert recruitment drive to find and
sign up qualified welders wherever they could find them.

We had several good, experienced welder/fabricators at my company. The
supervisor, "Big Ed" was a seasoned veteran, having done his time as a union
welder at the old Fore River Shipyard in Quincy, MA back in the 60's. Big
Ed is nearing retirement but still stands about 6'5" and has forearms the
size of my thighs.

One day someone came into my office and told me there were two union
organizers out in the shop. We had a conventional lobby/reception area
where visitors were supposed to sign in, get a badge and safety glasses, but
these guys had snuck around back and entered through one of the shop
overhead doors.

I entered the shop just in time to see "Big Ed" escorting the two union
dudes out the door. He had both by the back of their belts and was half
dragging, half carrying them out. One guy dropped the folder full of
propaganda he was carrying and another of our guys picked it up and threw it
in a dumpster.

They were handing out information on the local union and job offers for the
Big Dig. I've been told this is not normal practice, and I believe it, but
they tried and didn't get very far.

We lost only one employee to the Big Dig project and he returned a little
over a year later, fed up. We simply could not afford to match the pay and
overtime offered to him by the union.

Eisboch




Union organizers typically do not go onto the premises unless management
invites them. Being invited, however, is not that unusual in the
construction trades, especially at the smaller subcontractor shops,
because typically the owner of the shop was and is a union member
himself, and most unions allow the non-union owners and white collar
employees of such operations to participate in the health insurance
program.

The guys who visited your site were in error. They should have put
flyers on the windshields of those worker cars on public property, or
handed out flyers while on public property to workers leaving their shifts.

Your "Big Ed" was out of line, too, by the way.

For TJ: Health Care Proposals
 

Eisboch wrote:
"hk" wrote in message
. ..

wrote:

"hk" wrote in message
. ..

I think I am a bit closer to the labor force than you are.D'oh.


Union labor force maybe.
Small business employees ..... no way.
Eisboch


D'oh. We don't meet on the premises, and typically we respond to requests
from employees for a visit. First meetings usually are held at a local
eatery where the employees go for lunch or dinner, or anywhere else
convenient to the place of employment.


Bull**** alert

More like the perimeter of the company's parking lot at the end of the
workday .... *if* they are playing by their own rules.



Eisboch




We're talking about two different venues here. I'm talking about
meetings, not handing out flyer invitations to attend a meeting. I
attended a union meeting at Panera Bread a few weeks ago. We were not
organizing the Panera employees, although a couple seemed very interested.

For TJ: Health Care Proposals
 

hk wrote:
Eisboch wrote:
"hk" wrote in message
. ..

I think I am a bit closer to the labor force than you are.



Union labor force maybe.

Small business employees ..... no way.

Eisboch



I doubt it. I frequently go out on organizing calls with union reps, and
the companies and employees we visit are not members of unions.


Harry,
At one time you may have frequently gone out on calls, but for the last
10 years, you are posting in rec.boats 360 days a year.

For TJ: Health Care Proposals
 

hk wrote:
Eisboch wrote:
"hk" wrote in message
. ..

wrote:

"hk" wrote in message
. ..

I think I am a bit closer to the labor force than you are.D'oh.


Union labor force maybe.
Small business employees ..... no way.
Eisboch


D'oh. We don't meet on the premises, and typically we respond to
requests from employees for a visit. First meetings usually are held
at a local eatery where the employees go for lunch or dinner, or
anywhere else convenient to the place of employment.


Bull**** alert

More like the perimeter of the company's parking lot at the end of the
workday .... *if* they are playing by their own rules.



Eisboch


BTW, you are projecting your experience and not considering everyone
else's. I've worked with and for unions since 1971, I think, and have
been out on dozens and dozens of organizing drives, and been involved in
campaigns that lasted days, weeks, months, and in one case, more than a
year. All manner of employees, too...white collar, blue collar and
mixed, and not easy work in the sort of anti-worker, anti-union country
this is.

For TJ: Health Care Proposals
 

"hk" wrote in message
. ..


Union organizers typically do not go onto the premises unless management
invites them. Being invited, however, is not that unusual in the
construction trades, especially at the smaller subcontractor shops,
because typically the owner of the shop was and is a union member himself,
and most unions allow the non-union owners and white collar employees of
such operations to participate in the health insurance program.

The guys who visited your site were in error. They should have put flyers
on the windshields of those worker cars on public property, or handed out
flyers while on public property to workers leaving their shifts.

Your "Big Ed" was out of line, too, by the way.




"Big Ed" got a round of applause and a few high 5's from many of the other
shop employees.
A good shop is self-policing. Management usually doesn't need to get
involved.

If successful, those union guys would have wiped out the company, causing
many others to suffer.

Eisboch

For TJ: Health Care Proposals
 

"hk" wrote in message
. ..


BTW, you are projecting your experience and not considering everyone
else's. I've worked with and for unions since 1971, I think, and have been
out on dozens and dozens of organizing drives, and been involved in
campaigns that lasted days, weeks, months, and in one case, more than a
year. All manner of employees, too...white collar, blue collar and mixed,
and not easy work in the sort of anti-worker, anti-union country this is.


Well, if nothing else, this little exchange has been enlightening. I can
see now where and how many of your beliefs and opinions come from. With
all due respect (and I mean that) I think your experiences has resulted in
a bit of narrow mindedness.

Unions aren't for everybody. In fact, they aren't for most.

Eisboch

For TJ: Health Care Proposals
 

On Aug 21, 12:37*pm, "Eisboch" wrote:
"hk" wrote in message

. ..



BTW, you are projecting your experience and not considering everyone
else's. I've worked with and for unions since 1971, I think, and have been
out on dozens and dozens of organizing drives, and been involved in
campaigns that lasted days, weeks, months, and in one case, more than a
year. All manner of employees, too...white collar, blue collar and mixed,
and not easy work in the sort of anti-worker, anti-union country this is.

Well, if nothing else, this little exchange has been enlightening. * I can
see now where and how many of your beliefs and opinions come from. * With
all due respect (and I mean that) *I think your experiences has resulted in
a bit of narrow mindedness.

Unions aren't for everybody. *In fact, they aren't for most.

Eisboch

But you've got to understand, if Harry thinks they are good, then that
means they are good for everyone, and everyone better damned well get
with the program, just ask him. If you don't agree with him 100%,
he'll start calling you names and telling lies about you.