On 11/27/15 7:08 PM, Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 11/27/2015 6:52 PM, Keyser Söze wrote:
On 11/27/15 3:53 PM, Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 11/27/2015 3:24 PM, wrote:
On Fri, 27 Nov 2015 13:33:19 -0500, Keyser Söze
wrote:

wrote:
On Fri, 27 Nov 2015 12:56:26 -0500, Keyser Söze
wrote:

On 11/27/15 12:42 PM, wrote:
On Fri, 27 Nov 2015 12:02:23 -0500, John H.
wrote:

On Thu, 26 Nov 2015 18:38:18 -0500, wrote:

On Thu, 26 Nov 2015 17:23:43 -0500,

wrote:

On Thu, 26 Nov 2015 16:12:53 -0500, Keyser Söze
wrote:

The teachers
were not looking for anything massive, but the law said there
had to be
good faith negotiations...and the strikes helped make that
happen.

===

Unions willing to break the law are guilty of extortion.
Teachers
work hard for their money but salaries, and paticularly
benefits, have
gotten out of line with private industry. This will cause a
major
crisis at some point and force many local school districts into
bankruptcy.

I am not even upset at teacher salaries and benefits. What
****es me
off is they can't get rid of bad teachers, pay is not tied to
performance and the administration siphons 60% of the money away
before it ever trickles down to the actual classroom.

Sounds like you've been there and done that. You are correct.

A few years ago I did go through the school board budget, pretty
much
line for line and developed a summary of where the money was going.
Then I compared that to a few other places.
The striking thing was how much of the money is going to things
that
are not really education related.
In defense of the teachers themselves, I would say, they will not
make
any real money in the classroom compared to what they can make if
they
move downtown to the administration office.
Now you end up with a teacher who we may have been better off
keeping
in the classroom, being a mediocre administrator but that is how
the
career path is structured. You can't get a serious administrative
job
without being a teacher.

It is an entirely different skill set.

Charter schools are starting to demonstrate the flaws in the way we
run school systems, even though they are running with ankle
weights.



Good grief. You went through a local school board budget and
proclaimed
yourself an expert.

Hehehe.

It is simple math and math is a pure science.

...but you know that.

It is a simple fact that you can put a kid in the best secular
private
school in Lee County for what the school board is spending on them.



That you can do simple math doesn't mean you understand a school
budget,
but of course you are the world's greatest living expert.

It is not hard to understand when they break out where the money is
being spent. I am sorry that you underestimate the abilities of people
you disagree with but that does not make them wrong.



Harry cracks me up. When the subject is global warming or creationism,
math, science and statistics reign but when it comes to a social issue
dear to his heart, math, science and statistics go out the window and
the insults start.

You are absolutely correct. Two of our kids went to public high
schools, the third went to a highly rated private high school.

I just looked up the current public school budget and the "cost per
pupil" for the long list of budgetary line items. Then I looked up the
current tuition (inclusive of all student fees) for the private school
our third kid graduated from.

The total "cost per pupil" is actually slightly higher in the public
school than the tuition for the private. The private has a statistical
record of the highest percentage of graduates continuing on to college
and also has the higher average SAT scores.



It is a bit naive to compare cost per pupil between public and private
schools, since public schools in the main pay their staffs decently, and
are also burdened with trying to correct most of the ills of society
dumped on kids with impoverished parents, have to provide programs for
intellectually and emotionally challenged kids, and don't have the
advantage of cherry picking their students. But, hey, it's just math,
right?

Good grief. You are hopeless.



Yeah, because I'm taking into account the pressures on public school
systems versus the relative lack of pressure on private schools.

On 11/27/2015 7:19 PM, Keyser Söze wrote:
On 11/27/15 7:08 PM, Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 11/27/2015 6:52 PM, Keyser Söze wrote:
On 11/27/15 3:53 PM, Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 11/27/2015 3:24 PM, wrote:
On Fri, 27 Nov 2015 13:33:19 -0500, Keyser Söze
wrote:

wrote:
On Fri, 27 Nov 2015 12:56:26 -0500, Keyser Söze
wrote:

On 11/27/15 12:42 PM, wrote:
On Fri, 27 Nov 2015 12:02:23 -0500, John H.
wrote:

On Thu, 26 Nov 2015 18:38:18 -0500, wrote:

On Thu, 26 Nov 2015 17:23:43 -0500,

wrote:

On Thu, 26 Nov 2015 16:12:53 -0500, Keyser Söze

wrote:

The teachers
were not looking for anything massive, but the law said there
had to be
good faith negotiations...and the strikes helped make that
happen.

===

Unions willing to break the law are guilty of extortion.
Teachers
work hard for their money but salaries, and paticularly
benefits, have
gotten out of line with private industry. This will cause a
major
crisis at some point and force many local school districts into
bankruptcy.

I am not even upset at teacher salaries and benefits. What
****es me
off is they can't get rid of bad teachers, pay is not tied to
performance and the administration siphons 60% of the money away
before it ever trickles down to the actual classroom.

Sounds like you've been there and done that. You are correct.

A few years ago I did go through the school board budget, pretty
much
line for line and developed a summary of where the money was
going.
Then I compared that to a few other places.
The striking thing was how much of the money is going to things
that
are not really education related.
In defense of the teachers themselves, I would say, they will not
make
any real money in the classroom compared to what they can make if
they
move downtown to the administration office.
Now you end up with a teacher who we may have been better off
keeping
in the classroom, being a mediocre administrator but that is how
the
career path is structured. You can't get a serious administrative
job
without being a teacher.

It is an entirely different skill set.

Charter schools are starting to demonstrate the flaws in the
way we
run school systems, even though they are running with ankle
weights.



Good grief. You went through a local school board budget and
proclaimed
yourself an expert.

Hehehe.

It is simple math and math is a pure science.

...but you know that.

It is a simple fact that you can put a kid in the best secular
private
school in Lee County for what the school board is spending on them.



That you can do simple math doesn't mean you understand a school
budget,
but of course you are the world's greatest living expert.

It is not hard to understand when they break out where the money is
being spent. I am sorry that you underestimate the abilities of people
you disagree with but that does not make them wrong.



Harry cracks me up. When the subject is global warming or creationism,
math, science and statistics reign but when it comes to a social issue
dear to his heart, math, science and statistics go out the window and
the insults start.

You are absolutely correct. Two of our kids went to public high
schools, the third went to a highly rated private high school.

I just looked up the current public school budget and the "cost per
pupil" for the long list of budgetary line items. Then I looked up
the
current tuition (inclusive of all student fees) for the private school
our third kid graduated from.

The total "cost per pupil" is actually slightly higher in the public
school than the tuition for the private. The private has a statistical
record of the highest percentage of graduates continuing on to college
and also has the higher average SAT scores.



It is a bit naive to compare cost per pupil between public and private
schools, since public schools in the main pay their staffs decently, and
are also burdened with trying to correct most of the ills of society
dumped on kids with impoverished parents, have to provide programs for
intellectually and emotionally challenged kids, and don't have the
advantage of cherry picking their students. But, hey, it's just math,
right?

Good grief. You are hopeless.



Yeah, because I'm taking into account the pressures on public school
systems versus the relative lack of pressure on private schools.

Not what I was referring to or thinking.

Question: Do you *ever* have a positive thought or ever feel lucky and
privileged to live in the USA? I don't think I have ever known anyone
who is so negative ... about just about everything, except for maybe
your gun collection. Are you sure you are ok?

On Fri, 27 Nov 2015 14:05:17 -0500,
wrote:

On Fri, 27 Nov 2015 13:33:19 -0500, Keyser Söze
wrote:

wrote:
On Fri, 27 Nov 2015 12:56:26 -0500, Keyser Söze
wrote:

On 11/27/15 12:42 PM, wrote:
On Fri, 27 Nov 2015 12:02:23 -0500, John H.
wrote:

On Thu, 26 Nov 2015 18:38:18 -0500, wrote:

On Thu, 26 Nov 2015 17:23:43 -0500,
wrote:

On Thu, 26 Nov 2015 16:12:53 -0500, Keyser Söze
wrote:

The teachers
were not looking for anything massive, but the law said there had to be
good faith negotiations...and the strikes helped make that happen.

===

Unions willing to break the law are guilty of extortion. Teachers
work hard for their money but salaries, and paticularly benefits, have
gotten out of line with private industry. This will cause a major
crisis at some point and force many local school districts into
bankruptcy.

I am not even upset at teacher salaries and benefits. What ****es me
off is they can't get rid of bad teachers, pay is not tied to
performance and the administration siphons 60% of the money away
before it ever trickles down to the actual classroom.

Sounds like you've been there and done that. You are correct.

A few years ago I did go through the school board budget, pretty much
line for line and developed a summary of where the money was going.
Then I compared that to a few other places.
The striking thing was how much of the money is going to things that
are not really education related.
In defense of the teachers themselves, I would say, they will not make
any real money in the classroom compared to what they can make if they
move downtown to the administration office.
Now you end up with a teacher who we may have been better off keeping
in the classroom, being a mediocre administrator but that is how the
career path is structured. You can't get a serious administrative job
without being a teacher.

It is an entirely different skill set.

Charter schools are starting to demonstrate the flaws in the way we
run school systems, even though they are running with ankle weights.



Good grief. You went through a local school board budget and proclaimed
yourself an expert.

Hehehe.

It is simple math and math is a pure science.

...but you know that.

It is a simple fact that you can put a kid in the best secular private
school in Lee County for what the school board is spending on them.



That you can do simple math doesn't mean you understand a school budget,
but of course you are the world's greatest living expert.

===

Harry the schmuck blasts out yet another brain fart. It's too bad
that more people don't make an attempt to understand their school
budgets. They'd be appalled at how much gets spent to support obscure
special programs that benefit very few people - some of which are
federally mandated but funded locally. Public schools have turned
into a massive care system for children of all abilities with actual
education a second priority.

It is enough to just look at what they are spending down at the "metro
mall" (a regional mall the school board took over as an administration
office).
Then understand how many other administration related buildings they
have. it is almost 60% of the budget and the actual schools get the
other 40sumpin (cruises from 41-44% over the years).

On Fri, 27 Nov 2015 16:10:39 -0500,
wrote:

On Fri, 27 Nov 2015 15:53:35 -0500, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

The total "cost per pupil" is actually slightly higher in the public
school than the tuition for the private. The private has a statistical
record of the highest percentage of graduates continuing on to college
and also has the higher average SAT scores.

===

Private schools have a big advantage in the area of quality vs
dollars. Most importantly they don't have to accept or retain
everyone. That gets rid of the high cost or disruptive "problem"
students. Additionally they don't have to fund all of the high cost
"feel good" programs mandated by the feds.

I am sure Harry has that on a "cut and paste" for us but I need to
point out those western european countries he likes to wax on about do
the same thing.
If you are a dunce in Germany they send you to trade school or spin
you off to VW,
Criminals go to jail

On Fri, 27 Nov 2015 16:45:37 -0500, John H.
wrote:


Who appoints the sergeants, lieutenants, captains, etc. It all comes from the top,
Krause. And if the city council and/or mayor is corrupt, as we know they are in
Chicago, then the corruptness rolls downhill.

The cops are like the military. The enlisted folks tend to be based on
merit up until the E8-9 area. The "O" ranks start out on merit and
quickly become more political as you move up the scale the father you
get up on the "O" scale, the more political it gets.

On 11/27/15 7:32 PM, Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 11/27/2015 7:19 PM, Keyser Söze wrote:
On 11/27/15 7:08 PM, Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 11/27/2015 6:52 PM, Keyser Söze wrote:
On 11/27/15 3:53 PM, Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 11/27/2015 3:24 PM, wrote:
On Fri, 27 Nov 2015 13:33:19 -0500, Keyser Söze
wrote:

wrote:
On Fri, 27 Nov 2015 12:56:26 -0500, Keyser Söze
wrote:

On 11/27/15 12:42 PM, wrote:
On Fri, 27 Nov 2015 12:02:23 -0500, John H.

wrote:

On Thu, 26 Nov 2015 18:38:18 -0500, wrote:

On Thu, 26 Nov 2015 17:23:43 -0500,

wrote:

On Thu, 26 Nov 2015 16:12:53 -0500, Keyser Söze

wrote:

The teachers
were not looking for anything massive, but the law said there
had to be
good faith negotiations...and the strikes helped make that
happen.

===

Unions willing to break the law are guilty of extortion.
Teachers
work hard for their money but salaries, and paticularly
benefits, have
gotten out of line with private industry. This will cause a
major
crisis at some point and force many local school districts
into
bankruptcy.

I am not even upset at teacher salaries and benefits. What
****es me
off is they can't get rid of bad teachers, pay is not tied to
performance and the administration siphons 60% of the money
away
before it ever trickles down to the actual classroom.

Sounds like you've been there and done that. You are correct.

A few years ago I did go through the school board budget, pretty
much
line for line and developed a summary of where the money was
going.
Then I compared that to a few other places.
The striking thing was how much of the money is going to things
that
are not really education related.
In defense of the teachers themselves, I would say, they will not
make
any real money in the classroom compared to what they can make if
they
move downtown to the administration office.
Now you end up with a teacher who we may have been better off
keeping
in the classroom, being a mediocre administrator but that is how
the
career path is structured. You can't get a serious administrative
job
without being a teacher.

It is an entirely different skill set.

Charter schools are starting to demonstrate the flaws in the
way we
run school systems, even though they are running with ankle
weights.



Good grief. You went through a local school board budget and
proclaimed
yourself an expert.

Hehehe.

It is simple math and math is a pure science.

...but you know that.

It is a simple fact that you can put a kid in the best secular
private
school in Lee County for what the school board is spending on them.



That you can do simple math doesn't mean you understand a school
budget,
but of course you are the world's greatest living expert.

It is not hard to understand when they break out where the money is
being spent. I am sorry that you underestimate the abilities of
people
you disagree with but that does not make them wrong.



Harry cracks me up. When the subject is global warming or
creationism,
math, science and statistics reign but when it comes to a social issue
dear to his heart, math, science and statistics go out the window and
the insults start.

You are absolutely correct. Two of our kids went to public high
schools, the third went to a highly rated private high school.

I just looked up the current public school budget and the "cost per
pupil" for the long list of budgetary line items. Then I looked up
the
current tuition (inclusive of all student fees) for the private
school
our third kid graduated from.

The total "cost per pupil" is actually slightly higher in the public
school than the tuition for the private. The private has a
statistical
record of the highest percentage of graduates continuing on to college
and also has the higher average SAT scores.



It is a bit naive to compare cost per pupil between public and private
schools, since public schools in the main pay their staffs decently,
and
are also burdened with trying to correct most of the ills of society
dumped on kids with impoverished parents, have to provide programs for
intellectually and emotionally challenged kids, and don't have the
advantage of cherry picking their students. But, hey, it's just math,
right?

Good grief. You are hopeless.



Yeah, because I'm taking into account the pressures on public school
systems versus the relative lack of pressure on private schools.

Not what I was referring to or thinking.

Question: Do you *ever* have a positive thought or ever feel lucky and
privileged to live in the USA? I don't think I have ever known anyone
who is so negative ... about just about everything, except for maybe
your gun collection. Are you sure you are ok?



I'm supposed to guess your hidden meaning?

I don't live in the Republican bubble.

On Fri, 27 Nov 2015 18:52:56 -0500, Keyser Söze
wrote:

On 11/27/15 3:53 PM, Mr. Luddite wrote:


Harry cracks me up. When the subject is global warming or creationism,
math, science and statistics reign but when it comes to a social issue
dear to his heart, math, science and statistics go out the window and
the insults start.

You are absolutely correct. Two of our kids went to public high
schools, the third went to a highly rated private high school.

I just looked up the current public school budget and the "cost per
pupil" for the long list of budgetary line items. Then I looked up the
current tuition (inclusive of all student fees) for the private school
our third kid graduated from.

The total "cost per pupil" is actually slightly higher in the public
school than the tuition for the private. The private has a statistical
record of the highest percentage of graduates continuing on to college
and also has the higher average SAT scores.



It is a bit naive to compare cost per pupil between public and private
schools, since public schools in the main pay their staffs decently, and
are also burdened with trying to correct most of the ills of society
dumped on kids with impoverished parents, have to provide programs for
intellectually and emotionally challenged kids, and don't have the
advantage of cherry picking their students. But, hey, it's just math,
right?

You never disappoint ;-)

How about those charter schools that specialize on "special" students,
get less money and still provide superior results.

On Fri, 27 Nov 2015 18:54:39 -0500, Keyser Söze
wrote:

On 11/27/15 5:40 PM, John H. wrote:
On Fri, 27 Nov 2015 12:56:26 -0500, Keyser Söze wrote:

On 11/27/15 12:42 PM, wrote:
On Fri, 27 Nov 2015 12:02:23 -0500, John H.
wrote:

On Thu, 26 Nov 2015 18:38:18 -0500, wrote:

On Thu, 26 Nov 2015 17:23:43 -0500,
wrote:

On Thu, 26 Nov 2015 16:12:53 -0500, Keyser Söze
wrote:

The teachers
were not looking for anything massive, but the law said there had to be
good faith negotiations...and the strikes helped make that happen.

===

Unions willing to break the law are guilty of extortion. Teachers
work hard for their money but salaries, and paticularly benefits, have
gotten out of line with private industry. This will cause a major
crisis at some point and force many local school districts into
bankruptcy.

I am not even upset at teacher salaries and benefits. What ****es me
off is they can't get rid of bad teachers, pay is not tied to
performance and the administration siphons 60% of the money away
before it ever trickles down to the actual classroom.

Sounds like you've been there and done that. You are correct.

A few years ago I did go through the school board budget, pretty much
line for line and developed a summary of where the money was going.
Then I compared that to a few other places.
The striking thing was how much of the money is going to things that
are not really education related.
In defense of the teachers themselves, I would say, they will not make
any real money in the classroom compared to what they can make if they
move downtown to the administration office.
Now you end up with a teacher who we may have been better off keeping
in the classroom, being a mediocre administrator but that is how the
career path is structured. You can't get a serious administrative job
without being a teacher.

It is an entirely different skill set.

Charter schools are starting to demonstrate the flaws in the way we
run school systems, even though they are running with ankle weights.



Good grief. You went through a local school board budget and proclaimed
yourself an expert.

Hehehe.

And how many school board budgets have you analyzed, oh omniscient one?
--


Quite a few when I worked for the NEA, oh, retarded one.


UH Huh ... and you were not ****ed about how much money never trickled
down to your teachers? I suppose you got yours and **** the percentage
because the tax payers are an unlimited source of money. As long as
the top line is 10 digits, there was plenty left over.

On Fri, 27 Nov 2015 19:14:03 -0500,
wrote:

On Fri, 27 Nov 2015 18:53:37 -0500, Keyser Söze
wrote:

Well, hell, they got rid of you as a teacher.

Because I retired? What a stupid comment.
--

Call it whatever you want.

===

Why did the NEA get rid of you? That seems like it should have been a
good gig for your talents.

He retired ;-)

On 11/27/15 8:52 PM, wrote:
On Fri, 27 Nov 2015 19:14:03 -0500,
wrote:

On Fri, 27 Nov 2015 18:53:37 -0500, Keyser Söze
wrote:

Well, hell, they got rid of you as a teacher.

Because I retired? What a stupid comment.
--

Call it whatever you want.

===

Why did the NEA get rid of you? That seems like it should have been a
good gig for your talents.

He retired ;-)


The reality is that the Republican lobbyist the NEA affiliate had on
retainer in New York State sent my name and C.V. and a recommendation to
Jacob Javits, a Republican U.S. Senator who was looking for a new press
secretary, and the senator invited me down to D.C. for an interview. He
wasn't sure whether he was going to run for another term, and I was
reluctant to commit if he wasn't.

In those days, many Republican officeholders were decent people, and
progressive, and not crackpot conservatives. Javits was one of these
decent pols.

During the same trip to meet Javits, I had an interview with the then
biggest AAAA Ad and PR agency in DC, and that agency hired me as the
account exec on its labor union and political accounts, and two
commercial accounts. I took the job because I was weary of working for
the teachers union, and I had just completed two really significant
tasks: "roadie" PR manager for a woman running for NEA president elect
(successful) and merger of the NEA affiliate and the AFT affiliate in
New York State (successful).

Some years later, I was retained by the NEA to produce a series of
political ads and brochures.

I did have a lot of fun working for the teachers' unions in New York
State. I had a professional staff of seven working for me, and we did
our jobs. After I left, my first assistant took a job as director of PR
for the teachers' union in Hawaii, which had to be a dream gig.