Wayne.B wrote in
:

Yes, that's always a risk. This bozo may turn out be a cousin of the
governor's wife or some other politically incestuous relationship.
Still, if enough people make waves, something good might come of it.
And if no one makes waves, it is guaranteed that nothing will change.
You just have to take a chance that the system can be made to work
sometimes.



Wrong email with YouTube URL.....Send it to the Venice Chamber of Commerce,
where the real power of the throne in any city resides. "Here's why we're
never coming back to Venice, FL, and are telling everyone we see: (youtube
url here).



Larry
--
Vista has been out a week.
Is Service Pack 1 ready yet?

Here's some good contact information:
_______________________________
The Florida Fish and Wildlife Conservation Commission is a creature of
the
Florida Constitution. It does not report directly to the Governor,
but has
its own executive powers. You can learn about the FWC at:

http://myfwc.com/

There are a list of contact possibilities at:

http://myfwc.com/Contact/


Perhaps most promising is a specific place to file a complaint about
an
employee. The guy causing all the problems was identified by name
yesterday
I believe. Go to the following place to file a complaint concerning
his
actions:

http://myfwc.com/IG/complaint_form.htm

While a single compliant probably won't have much impact, if those
with
experiences do take the time to complain at the correct spot, the
shear
numbers would require some investigation and, if appropriate, change
in the
way things are being done.

I still say a good video camera is the best weapon against bad cops. Take a
look at some of the recent cases.

Just the other night a cop was shown pulling a young lady out of her car and
slamming her on the ground, pulling her by her hair .. etc.

This was for a "speeding ticket".

Keep a video camera at the ready. If every boat in Venice, FL had one
onboard, and kept a watch out for this rogue cop.
His behavior will take care of the rest. Just make sure whenever you see
him that you wave your camera at him.

Tell the local authorities that you all are watching him.

Just that alone should be enough to get him a desk,,, in the cellar of the
office.


No police department wants to see their job embarrassed by a dope.

Most boats ,, homes, just about everyone has a video camera ... time to use
it.


===========



"Keith" wrote in message
oups.com...
Here's some good contact information:
_______________________________
The Florida Fish and Wildlife Conservation Commission is a creature of
the
Florida Constitution. It does not report directly to the Governor,
but has
its own executive powers. You can learn about the FWC at:

http://myfwc.com/

There are a list of contact possibilities at:

http://myfwc.com/Contact/


Perhaps most promising is a specific place to file a complaint about
an
employee. The guy causing all the problems was identified by name
yesterday
I believe. Go to the following place to file a complaint concerning
his
actions:

http://myfwc.com/IG/complaint_form.htm

While a single compliant probably won't have much impact, if those
with
experiences do take the time to complain at the correct spot, the
shear
numbers would require some investigation and, if appropriate, change
in the
way things are being done.

"NE Sailboat" wrote in
newsmhDh.6441$lo1.808@trndny05:

Just the other night a cop was shown pulling a young lady out of her
car and slamming her on the ground, pulling her by her hair .. etc.



In Aaron Russo's documentary "America - Freedom to Fascism", there is a
cop car camera video of a traffic stop in which a black lady, driving
alone in a Ford Exploder cannot produce her driver's license. The cop is
yelling at her at the top of his lungs to get out of the car. She is,
obviously, terrified at his attitude. He threatens and finally does
TAZER her through the open door to force her out of her SUV. She's
jerked out by the high voltage electricity and writhing in pain,
screaming, on the filthy road surface while he continues to scream at her
to "get up, GET UP!" The second cop, who was on the other side of her
SUV threatening her from the right side, comes around and the two cops
haul her shaking, quaking body, unable to move from the Tazer, back
towards the cop car.

Every American needs to see this movie, and this video, as many times as
it takes to put a stop to it. Driving with no license or under
suspension is NO EXCUSE to be treated like a Nazi POW by ANY cops.

It makes you want to shove that damned Tazer up the cops ass and pull the
trigger, over and over..... Cops shouldn't be allowed to possess torture
weaponry like this. An old lady in her 80's was killed by a Tazer in
Rock Hill, SC, a couple of years back. She came into an old folks home
in Rock Hill to see her friend, who had been moved to another home but
this home wouldn't tell her where. She panicked and kept after them.
They call the cops. The STUPID cop shot her with the Tazer and she died
of the heart attack it caused, never finding her old friend to even say
goodbye. THAT cop should be FIRST in line....

Aaron Russo produced big Hollywood films like "The Rose" with Bette
Midler and this documentary came out of his curiosity about the Income
Tax law and 16th Amendment, which was never ratified by the required
number of states. It's an amazing film of FACT, doggedly followed up and
documented, not some nutcase. It's an amazing film all Americans should
see about our new Nazi state.

PS - Income Tax is on Corporate Profits, not wages. There is no law
taxing wages of anyone. Try to find it. It doesn't exist.

Larry
--

On Thu, 22 Feb 2007 11:41:49 -0500, Larry wrote:

"NE Sailboat" wrote in
newsmhDh.6441$lo1.808@trndny05:

Just the other night a cop was shown pulling a young lady out of her
car and slamming her on the ground, pulling her by her hair .. etc.



In Aaron Russo's documentary "America - Freedom to Fascism", there is a
cop car camera video of a traffic stop in which a black lady, driving
alone in a Ford Exploder cannot produce her driver's license. The cop is
yelling at her at the top of his lungs to get out of the car. She is,
obviously, terrified at his attitude. He threatens and finally does
TAZER her through the open door to force her out of her SUV. She's
jerked out by the high voltage electricity and writhing in pain,
screaming, on the filthy road surface while he continues to scream at her
to "get up, GET UP!" The second cop, who was on the other side of her
SUV threatening her from the right side, comes around and the two cops
haul her shaking, quaking body, unable to move from the Tazer, back
towards the cop car.

Every American needs to see this movie, and this video, as many times as
it takes to put a stop to it. Driving with no license or under
suspension is NO EXCUSE to be treated like a Nazi POW by ANY cops.

It makes you want to shove that damned Tazer up the cops ass and pull the
trigger, over and over..... Cops shouldn't be allowed to possess torture
weaponry like this. An old lady in her 80's was killed by a Tazer in
Rock Hill, SC, a couple of years back. She came into an old folks home
SNIP

First to clear the air, I'm a cop.

Second I agree with what's been written about the Venice, FL water
(wanna' be) cop. It's the few like that that give us a bad name. You
know, like "all teenagers are (insert whatever bad thing you want)".

Third. While I have no info about the young lady pulled out nor the
80's lady, I do know about the Taser case above. It was 100% justified
and proper. I'm sure Mr. Russo had his own agenda and selected the
parts of the footage to further that agenda.

Two cases. Remember the news footage with the very overweight guy? It
showed a bunch of cops yelling and using some very odd baton strikes.
No one seemed to notice there was a wall so one could only see the
cops standing and pounding, but not the subject, who was lying down.
Well, the unit (cop car) video showed the whole thing. The cops were
striking the concrete with the batons to make noise. Not a one struck
the subject. The reason, BTW, for yelling and generally making noise
is that in stressful stiuations ones senses tend to dull, including
hearing. That's also why nurse and doctors speak very close and loud
to patients. Otherwise they simply will not hear.

The second case was the news video of cops escorting a hancuffed teen.
There was one on each side and one right behind the teen. The video
showed the cop in back suddenly slaming the teen against a car hood
and "beating on him". Some civil rights big guns came to town. They
were shown the videos not shown on the news, apologized and left. What
happened was the teen, who was handcuffed with his hands behind as
SOP, reached back and grabbed the cop by the NUTS! No sound on the
news video, but he was yelling to "Let go!" as he was
closed-fist-edge-of-hand striking him on the brachial plexus clavicle
notch (On top of shoulder near neck). This is a "pressure point" that
will temorarily paralyze the arm on that side, with no lasting
effects. The teen let go and that was the end of it.

As far as Tasers being "torture weaponry", that's a bunch of bull. We
have to get Tasered as part of the certification to use one. Yes
Virginia, we have to go through a course and get Tasered to be able to
carry/use one - they don't just hand us one and say go shoot somebody.

The Taser is high voltage at very low current. About the same voltage
and even lower current than those old joke "books" that when you
opened shocked you. The way it does it's job is that it's pulsed at a
proper sequence to block out and override the electrical impluses from
the brain that goes through the nerves and controls our muscles. It
stays on for 5 seconds, then turns off. It can be turned on again if
necesary. The 5 seconds is enough time to handcuff the subject. It is
sometimes painful and sometimes not, but it will usually make you fall
down (you can't control your muscles to balance) and it will make your
arms and legs flop around most of the time (sending pulses though the
nerves) and it usually makes you make um-um-um noises and sometimes
even scream. We had the whole range of reactions from officers in our
class, including one guy who asked, "When are you going to turn the
damn thing on?" when hit. Oh yeah. The Taser keeps a record of when,
how long and how many times it was on.

There have been accusations of Tasers killing people, usually due to
heart attack. The news types really jump on this. There has never been
one proven case. The news types suddenly don't seem to be interested
anymore.

The Taser is one of the best, most humane, intermediate (non-deadly)
weapons ever made (other intermediate weapons are the baton
(nightstick) and chemical spray. Either of which are a lot more
painful. Tasers and the others can only be used if the threat to the
officer is injury or to prevent the subject from injuring him/herself.

Oh yeah. In the case of that "obviously terrified" black lady, she
threated to punch the officer and did take a swing at him. I've taken
down 6'2" guys who became suddenly "obviously terrifed" after they ate
some concrete and were handcuffed. It always amazes me when someone
who has been cussin' me out, threatening to kill me and then doing his
best to do so, suddenly whines that I hurt him, he didn't do nothin',
how come I threw him down on the ground, the handcuffs are hurting
him, etc.

Yes there are cops who should be living in jail instead of bringing
people there. They are rare and they will be found out and dealt with.
All departments have an IA, Internal Affairs, division and those guys
are very vigilant. If you're wronged, report it. It may seem nothing
is being done, but it is. In some cases there's not enough solid
evidence but you can bet that officer will be watched and evidence
will mount up over time if he's dirty.

Rick

PS: If someone tries to "stick a Taser" up my ass, I'll switch to my
Sig.

Rick Morel wrote:

SNIP

First to clear the air, I'm a cop.

Second I agree with what's been written about the Venice, FL water
(wanna' be) cop. It's the few like that that give us a bad name. You
know, like "all teenagers are (insert whatever bad thing you want)".

Yep, its the small percentage bad cops that screw
it up for the vast majority of professional LEO's
who are trying to do a good job. That's why the
departments should go after them and make examples
out of them.

snip a bunch of stuff

As far as Tasers being "torture weaponry", that's a bunch of bull. We
have to get Tasered as part of the certification to use one. Yes
Virginia, we have to go through a course and get Tasered to be able to
carry/use one - they don't just hand us one and say go shoot somebody.

In Austin, the police recruits have to be tasered,
and shot in the face with MACE. Not fun, but they
all go through it before they get a badge.

snip

Yes there are cops who should be living in jail instead of bringing
people there. They are rare and they will be found out and dealt with.
All departments have an IA, Internal Affairs, division and those guys
are very vigilant. If you're wronged, report it. It may seem nothing
is being done, but it is. In some cases there's not enough solid
evidence but you can bet that officer will be watched and evidence
will mount up over time if he's dirty.

Thanks for presenting the other side of the story.


Rick

It does seem to me that our society is in an
unfortunate trend of becoming more polarized and
more militant. Our "war on drugs" which started
about 26 years ago is responsible for a lot of it,
but there are other factors at work as well.

Don W.

Rick Morel wrote in
:

The Taser is high voltage at very low current. About the same voltage
and even lower current than those old joke "books" that when you
opened shocked you. The way it does it's job is that it's pulsed at a
proper sequence to block out and override the electrical impluses from
the brain that goes through the nerves and controls our muscles. It
stays on for 5 seconds, then turns off. It can be turned on again if
necesary. The 5 seconds is enough time to handcuff the subject. It is
sometimes painful and sometimes not, but it will usually make you fall
down (you can't control your muscles to balance) and it will make your
arms and legs flop around most of the time (sending pulses though the
nerves) and it usually makes you make um-um-um noises and sometimes
even scream. We had the whole range of reactions from officers in our
class, including one guy who asked, "When are you going to turn the
damn thing on?" when hit. Oh yeah. The Taser keeps a record of when,
how long and how many times it was on.


The Taser works on the same technology as the defibrillator machine,
pulsed current through muscle tissue. Its output is measured on watt-
seconds, as is the defib.

My Tesla coil is high voltage at low current, somewhere around 800KV on a
dry day at 1-2 microamps. It causes no muscle spasms, only slight RF
burns if the arc touches your skin. Feels like a pin prick from the
burning, not the current. In order to cause muscle spasms in humans, you
need 20-40 milliamps, a good shock from a defective 115VAC appliance
comes to mind. To cause muscle lockups, like the Taser produces, you
need around 60-80 ma. Death occurs at from 100-200ma, depending on the
victim's physical condition no cop is licensed to diagnose.

Does your cop training REALLY tell you to Tase us at traffic stops if our
"Papers Please" response to the storm troopers is insufficient, our taxes
not properly paid? The lady on the cop video had not attacked the
officers in any manner. She was sitting in her driver's seat, terrified,
and refusing to exit her vehicle for fear of being beaten up, like CNN
shows on TV quite often. Being alone and indefensible against a male
attack by a cop so mad he's screaming at her, one can only imagine her
state of fear at this screaming madman.

I think NOT....This isn't Nazi-occupied France.

....Yet.

Larry
--
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fEJmc...elated&search=

On Thu, 22 Feb 2007 15:27:00 -0500, Larry wrote:

The Taser works on the same technology as the defibrillator machine,
pulsed current through muscle tissue. Its output is measured on watt-
seconds, as is the defib.

No it doesn't. No it isn't.

My Tesla coil is high voltage at low current, somewhere around 800KV on a
dry day at 1-2 microamps. It causes no muscle spasms, only slight RF
burns if the arc touches your skin. Feels like a pin prick from the
burning, not the current. In order to cause muscle spasms in humans, you
need 20-40 milliamps, a good shock from a defective 115VAC appliance
comes to mind. To cause muscle lockups, like the Taser produces, you
need around 60-80 ma. Death occurs at from 100-200ma, depending on the
victim's physical condition no cop is licensed to diagnose.

A Tesla coil is totally different. It puts out RF. AC skin effect
keeps the current on the surface of the skin. It WILL burn you, as you
said above about "slight RF burns". A Taser doesn't cause muscle
spasms for shock, it "masks" the normal electrical signals in all
living things and superimposes other signals.

Some specs from spec sheets:

Taser:

1. Output characteristics:
Wave form: Complex shaped pulse
Pulse rate: 19 PPS
Pulse duration: 100 microseconds
The trigger activates a 5-second cycle. The cycle can be
stopped by placing the safety lever in the “S” position.
Peak open circuit arcing voltage: 50,000 V
Peak loaded voltage: 1,200 V
Current: 2.1 mA average
Energy per pulse: Nominal at main capacitors: 0.36 joules
Delivered into load: 0.07 joules
Power rating: Nominal at main capacitors: 7 watts
Delivered into load: 1.3 watts



AED Defibrillator:

The Data-PakTM battery will operate the Samaritan® AED for over 12
hours of continuous ECG monitoring or 120 shocks at 200 Joules.


Note the current and loaded voltage. Yes it's 50,000V open air, but
drops to 1,200 V under load. The load is the human.

Also note the energy delivered into that human is 0.07 Joules and the
defib is 200 Joules - 2,857 times as much power! That is two thousand
eight hundred fifty seven. Guess the EMT's also go around killing
people, huh?


Does your cop training REALLY tell you to Tase us at traffic stops if our
"Papers Please" response to the storm troopers is insufficient, our taxes
not properly paid? The lady on the cop video had not attacked the
officers in any manner. She was sitting in her driver's seat, terrified,
and refusing to exit her vehicle for fear of being beaten up, like CNN
shows on TV quite often. Being alone and indefensible against a male
attack by a cop so mad he's screaming at her, one can only imagine her
state of fear at this screaming madman.

I think NOT....This isn't Nazi-occupied France.

...Yet.

Larry

No, our training makes it quite clear when and how much force to use.
The cop wasn't mad at all, he was using proper procedure under the
circumstances - someone threatening him and in a very excited and
agitated state. Same as an EMT, nurse or doctor would have. Okay, not
as loudly, but different circumstances. Maybe you should see if you
can find the _COMPLETE_, unedited version of the video.

Rick