Jet Ski overheating problem
 

"Gary" wrote in message
news:O1Yaf.407879$1i.39677@pd7tw2no...
Bill McKee wrote:
"Gary" wrote in message
news:yxXaf.404825$oW2.114246@pd7tw1no...

Bill McKee wrote:

"Matt Colie" wrote in message
...


Bill McKee wrote:


"Matt Colie" wrote in message
...



Bill McKee wrote:



"Jonathan Ganz" wrote in message
...




In article t,
Bill McKee bmckee=at-ix.netcom.com wrote:




"Jonathan Ganz" wrote in message
.. .




In article
.earthlink.net,
Bill McKee bmckee=at-ix.netcom.com wrote:




"Jonathan Ganz" wrote in message
.. .




Yeah, so? What's your point? I know the regs and clearly you
can quote
them. What are you trying to tell us here?

That you are an idiot.

Ah, a name caller. Well, ok then. You sure won that argument on
the
merits.


No, just stating the obvious.

Yes, it's quite obvious what you are and why you're doing
it... PWCER!!!!

--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com

Such anger. And my PWC has 350 CID and 330 hp. Big PWC.

Oh Billy,

What you have is still a little toy boat with the same engine my
mother had in her station wagon.

If it is a powered vessel less that 10kdwt or not over 4khp I won't
even list it my log as sea time.

You really should go take a safe boating course somewhere - anywhere.
In the mean time, if you really want to learn - go to

http://www.navcen.uscg.gov/mwv/navrules/navrules.htm

and buy or download a real copy of COMDTINST M16672.2
(by-the-by nothing you have said is supported between the covers.)

A man of much experience once said to me "The only thing required to
run one of those little motorboats is a credit rating."

Matt Colie
Lifelong Waterman and Licensed Mariner (Chf Stm & Mtr, Pilot 10k Grt
Lks, Mst VUS Offshore 100t)


So you are a drunk also.

Oh billy,
Again you show your true capability.
Please, quit while you still can.
You have demonstrated a amazingly clear lack of any understanding of
the sited Colregs. (This was a part of the exams for the cert listed.)
And, you have answered and proved finally and personaly to me a long
standing standing question I have had:

If man had not invented canned beer, would anybody have ever bother to
develop recreational powerboats?

You have just given proof positive on that account.

Now go play with your little toy boat that takes no skill to operate
(so impaired judgement is not and issue - so you believe - i.e.
requires much less capability than any sailing dink) and has less horse
power than my engines need to just crank (about a third of a bow
thruster)and be sure you watch out for those dangerous sailboats out
there.

Demand your rights on the water and please, tell all teh good people
here what water you inhabit so we may avoid your kingdom.

Matt - see prior sig


So you turn when a sailboat crosses in front of your ship?

You sound 5 short blasts, go hard astern and turn. That's all you can
do.

Doing nothing is not an option.

Gary


And you put your tanker on the rocks entering San Francisco bay.
Sure, we are all that stupid.

Sounds like you are.

Jet Ski overheating problem
 

"Gary" wrote in message
news:yxXaf.404825$oW2.114246@pd7tw1no...
Bill McKee wrote:
"Matt Colie" wrote in message
...


Bill McKee wrote:

"Matt Colie" wrote in message
...


Bill McKee wrote:


"Jonathan Ganz" wrote in message
...



In article t,
Bill McKee bmckee=at-ix.netcom.com wrote:



"Jonathan Ganz" wrote in message
...



In article . net,
Bill McKee bmckee=at-ix.netcom.com wrote:



"Jonathan Ganz" wrote in message
.. .



Yeah, so? What's your point? I know the regs and clearly you can
quote
them. What are you trying to tell us here?

That you are an idiot.

Ah, a name caller. Well, ok then. You sure won that argument on the
merits.


No, just stating the obvious.

Yes, it's quite obvious what you are and why you're doing
it... PWCER!!!!

--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com

Such anger. And my PWC has 350 CID and 330 hp. Big PWC.

Oh Billy,

What you have is still a little toy boat with the same engine my mother
had in her station wagon.

If it is a powered vessel less that 10kdwt or not over 4khp I won't
even list it my log as sea time.

You really should go take a safe boating course somewhere - anywhere.
In the mean time, if you really want to learn - go to

http://www.navcen.uscg.gov/mwv/navrules/navrules.htm

and buy or download a real copy of COMDTINST M16672.2
(by-the-by nothing you have said is supported between the covers.)

A man of much experience once said to me "The only thing required to
run one of those little motorboats is a credit rating."

Matt Colie
Lifelong Waterman and Licensed Mariner (Chf Stm & Mtr, Pilot 10k Grt
Lks, Mst VUS Offshore 100t)


So you are a drunk also.

Oh billy,
Again you show your true capability.
Please, quit while you still can.
You have demonstrated a amazingly clear lack of any understanding of the
sited Colregs. (This was a part of the exams for the cert listed.)
And, you have answered and proved finally and personaly to me a long
standing standing question I have had:

If man had not invented canned beer, would anybody have ever bother to
develop recreational powerboats?

You have just given proof positive on that account.

Now go play with your little toy boat that takes no skill to operate (so
impaired judgement is not and issue - so you believe - i.e. requires much
less capability than any sailing dink) and has less horse power than my
engines need to just crank (about a third of a bow thruster)and be sure
you watch out for those dangerous sailboats out there.

Demand your rights on the water and please, tell all teh good people here
what water you inhabit so we may avoid your kingdom.

Matt - see prior sig


So you turn when a sailboat crosses in front of your ship?

You sound 5 short blasts, go hard astern and turn. That's all you can do.

Doing nothing is not an option.

Gary

Does he have to use his horn, or does he do it naturally?

--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com

Jet Ski overheating problem
 

"Gary" wrote in message
news:pIWaf.404382$oW2.266485@pd7tw1no...
Jonathan Ganz wrote:
In article ,
DSK wrote:

Dr. Dr. Smithers wrote:


Doug,
Do you have any idea how narrow many channels are?
Take a look at the majority of the St. Law. Seaway.


Actually, that's VERY wide as channels go. Are you suggesting that you
cannot manage to drive your boat along a course and keep it within 100
yards or so of where it should be?

Are you also suggesting that going SLOW when close to other boat traffic
is not an option?


Don't know about St. Lawrence, but were we sail, the channel can be
less than 30 ft. wide in spots.

Is that the channel that you sail in? How small is your boat? In
channels like that it is even more important that you understand the basic
rules.
(b)In construing and complying with these Rules due regard shall be had to
all dangers of navigation and collision and to any special circumstances,
including the limitations of the vessels involved, which may make a
departure from these Rules necessary to avoid immediate danger.

Gary

Depends on the day. We usually sail in the SF bay, and there are channels in
the area that are quite narrow. Some less than 30 feet. Two boats can just
make passage at the same time.

I don't own a boat at the moment, but I teach on a Yamaha 30.

Where we keep her, the speed limit is 5 mph. Other places have nothing
posted, but it would be highly stupid to do much more than that.

--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com

Jet Ski overheating problem
 

"Bill McKee" wrote in message
nk.net...


"Peggie Hall" wrote in message
...
ENUFF AWREDDY!!!!!!



Well Peggy, most should read your book. They are full of crap.

Peggy, I'm truly sorry for annoying you by this thread, and I apologize for
Bill. He can't help himself.

--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com

Jet Ski overheating problem
 

On Sat, 05 Nov 2005 06:34:14 GMT, "Bill McKee"
wrote:


Doing nothing is not an option.

Gary


And you put your tanker on the rocks entering San Francisco bay.
Sure, we are all that stupid.

Sounds like you are.
[Bill]


I am tired of hearing you two bicker. Why don't you cut rec.boats.
building and rec.boats.cruising from your distribution?
Please?

PLEASE?

Brian Whatcott
p.s. You are both traceable - don't get me mad.

Jet Ski overheating problem
 

"Capt. JG" wrote in
:

Answer: PWCs are always at fault. They can't help it, they were built
that way.



I know someone who was passing a powerboat in a big PWC. The powerboat
idiot didn't look behind him to see who was passing him and turned to port,
into the PWC who ended up crashing into the port side of the powerboat.

The PWC rider successfully sued for a new ski, medical costs, lost wages,
etc., etc., after the DNR quoted the rules-of-the-road about maintaining
course and speed when being overtaken someone else posted here. DNR
investigated the accident and was not amused when the big powerboat rich
boy pointed out "It's just a PWC", as you hotheads infer.

The hotheaded attitudes displayed in this stupid thread over the hated PWC
is a mixture for disaster on the waterways. The PWC riders have just as
much rights to use the public's waterways as the millionaires in the
Azimuts. Just ask the PWCer's attorney....(c; Someone said he drooled
over this case when he found out how much money the powerboater was
worth...(c;

By the way, in SC, that PWC only needs be 50 ft away from your boat to run
full throttle past you....50 ft....Says so right in the boating manual.

Run over his little PWC. Make his day.....

--
Larry, 3rd Mate
S/V "Lionheart"

Jet Ski overheating problem
 

Jeff wrote in
:

proper to pass within 15 feet of boats doing 25 MPH shouldn't be out
there.


It's 50 ft in South Carolina...just like for a dock. 200' from the marina.

--
Larry

Jet Ski overheating problem
 

Here are a couple of the applicable rules to consider.
Note the specific rule for vessels less than 20 metres or a sailing
vessel (any length) in a narrow channel.
Note the specific rule on overtaking in narrow channels.
There are also rules on safe speed which I am happy to provide to help
the discussion.

People with more savvy than any of use created and continue to improve
the rules. It is up to us to learn them.

Rule 9

Narrow Channels--International

(a)A vessel proceeding along the course of a narrow channel or fairway
shall keep as near to the outer limit of the channel or fairway which
lies on her starboard side as is safe and practicable.

(b)A vessel of less than 20 metres in length or a sailing vessel shall
not impede the passage of a vessel which can safely navigate only within
a narrow channel or fairway.

(d)A vessel shall not cross a narrow channel or fairway if such crossing
impedes the passage of a vessel which can safely navigate only within
such channel or fairway. The latter vessel may use the sound signal
prescribed in Rule 34(d) if in doubt as to the intention of the crossing
vessel.

(e)(i)In a narrow channel or fairway when overtaking can take place only
if the vessel to be overtaken has to take action to permit safe passing,
the vessel intending to overtake shall indicate her intention by
sounding the appropriate signal prescribed in Rule 34(c)(i). The vessel
to be overtaken shall, if in agreement, sound the appropriate signal
prescribed in Rule 34(c)(ii) and take steps to permit safe passing. If
in doubt she may sound the signals prescribed in Rule 34(d).

(ii) This Rule does not relieve the overtaking vessel of her obligation
under Rule 13.

Rule 13

Overtaking--International

(a)Notwithstanding anything contained in the Rules of Part B, Sections I
and II, any vessel overtaking any other vessel shall keep out of the way
of the vessel being overtaken.

(d)Any subsequent alteration of the bearing between the two vessels
shall not make the overtaking vessel a crossing vessel within the
meaning of these Rules or relieve her of the duty of keeping clear of
the overtaken vessel until she is finally past and clear.

Jet Ski overheating problem
 

Brian Whatcott wrote:
On Sat, 05 Nov 2005 06:34:14 GMT, "Bill McKee"
wrote:



Doing nothing is not an option.

Gary


And you put your tanker on the rocks entering San Francisco bay.

Sure, we are all that stupid.

Sounds like you are.
[Bill]



I am tired of hearing you two bicker. Why don't you cut rec.boats.
building and rec.boats.cruising from your distribution?
Please?

PLEASE?

Brian Whatcott
p.s. You are both traceable - don't get me mad.

I hope I don't sound like I'm bickering. I am treating this thread as a
interesting Rules of the Road discussion and a bit of a review. It's
not often that I get to hear the point of view of amateurs or
recreational boaters on RofR situations. It is causing me to refer to
my books and think. Sorry if you aren't enjoying the thread.

Gary

Jet Ski overheating problem
 

"Bill McKee" wrote in message
ink.net...

"Scotty" wrote in message
...

"Don White" wrote
Not all sailors are familiar enough with the collision
regulations either.
In your case, sounds like you were overtaking him. You are
the
'giveway
boat'. That said, he has a responsibility to give you ample
time to
avoid a collision.

Well, he did, didn't he? Was there a collision?

SV



Barely.


But no collision, right?


Because I was not drunk like most times.


good for you.

SBV

Jet Ski overheating problem
 

"Bill McKee" wrote

Is it really *that* hard to turn a steering wheel, Bill? Do
you
have wimpy limp wrists?

SBV


You remind me of the sailor who decides to turn with no
signal and


Oh, you were serious about those turn signals.

SBV

Jet Ski overheating problem
 

Gary wrote in news:D44bf.417596$tl2.177416@pd7tw3no:

Narrow Channels--International


All this is great....if you're a ship from Le Havre. But, the jetski guy
has his South Carolina Dept of Natural Resources, Boater's Handbook. (The
guy on the sailboat probably doesn't have anything...and I'm serious.)
Whatever bureaucrats are in charge locally are the ones that set the rules
and bust them in the harbor and ICW. No boater safety course actually
teaches these International Rules.

So, the rules he goes by (assuming he goes by rules and is a nice guy with
family out for a PWC cruise, not some freak, which most of them really are
not) is the Boater's Handbook DNR handed him when he took his 2 sons to the
PWC training course DNR ran at the high school so the boys could get their
little DNR drivers permits. It says 50' from boats and docks and 200' from
marinas.

This nonsense of 8 layers of rule-making bureaucrats, all different in
every fiefdom you boat across, is REALLY STUPID!!

--
Larry

Jet Ski overheating problem
 

Larry wrote:
Gary wrote in news:D44bf.417596$tl2.177416@pd7tw3no:


Narrow Channels--International



All this is great....if you're a ship from Le Havre. But, the jetski guy
has his South Carolina Dept of Natural Resources, Boater's Handbook. (The
guy on the sailboat probably doesn't have anything...and I'm serious.)
Whatever bureaucrats are in charge locally are the ones that set the rules
and bust them in the harbor and ICW. No boater safety course actually
teaches these International Rules.

So, the rules he goes by (assuming he goes by rules and is a nice guy with
family out for a PWC cruise, not some freak, which most of them really are
not) is the Boater's Handbook DNR handed him when he took his 2 sons to the
PWC training course DNR ran at the high school so the boys could get their
little DNR drivers permits. It says 50' from boats and docks and 200' from
marinas.

This nonsense of 8 layers of rule-making bureaucrats, all different in
every fiefdom you boat across, is REALLY STUPID!!

You are right. There are really only two sets of over-arching rules,
the Colregs and the Inland Rules. Adhere to those and all is well. The
people that don't learn them cause us all to come to grief.

Jet Ski overheating problem
 

Gary wrote:


You are right. There are really only two sets of over-arching rules,
the Colregs and the Inland Rules. Adhere to those and all is well. The
people that don't learn them cause us all to come to grief.


It kills some of the yahoos that a slow moving sailboat has right of way
over their 300hp, gas guzzlin', air polluting monstrosity.

Jet Ski overheating problem
 

Don White wrote:
Gary wrote:


You are right. There are really only two sets of over-arching rules,
the Colregs and the Inland Rules. Adhere to those and all is well.
The people that don't learn them cause us all to come to grief.



It kills some of the yahoos that a slow moving sailboat has right of way
over their 300hp, gas guzzlin', air polluting monstrosity.
Kinda like pedestrians, bicycles and cars. Although might has right it
is not correct.

Jet Ski overheating problem
 

"Gary" wrote in message
news:5b4bf.407926$oW2.221802@pd7tw1no...
Brian Whatcott wrote:
On Sat, 05 Nov 2005 06:34:14 GMT, "Bill McKee"
wrote:



Doing nothing is not an option.

Gary


And you put your tanker on the rocks entering San Francisco bay.

Sure, we are all that stupid.

Sounds like you are. [Bill]



I am tired of hearing you two bicker. Why don't you cut rec.boats.
building and rec.boats.cruising from your distribution?
Please?

PLEASE?

Brian Whatcott
p.s. You are both traceable - don't get me mad.

I hope I don't sound like I'm bickering. I am treating this thread as a
interesting Rules of the Road discussion and a bit of a review. It's not
often that I get to hear the point of view of amateurs or recreational
boaters on RofR situations. It is causing me to refer to my books and
think. Sorry if you aren't enjoying the thread.

Gary

I think Brian is mostly referring to the bickering part - I apologize for my
part in it.

I think it's generally a worthwhile discussion of RofR situations. Sometimes
the situation is not straightforward of course, and it requires some quick
thinking. When I'm teaching, it's not atypical that we're in the midst of
significant traffic with a number of different types of vessels... anything
from tankers going in both directions, even three sometimes, to sailboats
and cabin cruiser types, to small dinghies and human power boats, and even
swimmers.

I'll typically ask my students, who has stand-on or give way status for a
particular boat, say port over starboard, then ask them about another boat
coming from a different direction, then about the ferry, then about the
kayaker, etc. It makes for an interesting sail if nothing else.


--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com

Jet Ski overheating problem
 

"Larry" wrote in message
...
"Capt. JG" wrote in
:

Answer: PWCs are always at fault. They can't help it, they were built
that way.



I know someone who was passing a powerboat in a big PWC. The powerboat
idiot didn't look behind him to see who was passing him and turned to
port,
into the PWC who ended up crashing into the port side of the powerboat.

The PWC rider successfully sued for a new ski, medical costs, lost wages,
etc., etc., after the DNR quoted the rules-of-the-road about maintaining
course and speed when being overtaken someone else posted here. DNR
investigated the accident and was not amused when the big powerboat rich
boy pointed out "It's just a PWC", as you hotheads infer.

The hotheaded attitudes displayed in this stupid thread over the hated PWC
is a mixture for disaster on the waterways. The PWC riders have just as
much rights to use the public's waterways as the millionaires in the
Azimuts. Just ask the PWCer's attorney....(c; Someone said he drooled
over this case when he found out how much money the powerboater was
worth...(c;

By the way, in SC, that PWC only needs be 50 ft away from your boat to run
full throttle past you....50 ft....Says so right in the boating manual.

Run over his little PWC. Make his day.....

--
Larry, 3rd Mate
S/V "Lionheart"

Larry, if you or anyone else really thought I was serious, then you have
more problems that can be solved here.

--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com

Jet Ski overheating problem
 

"Space Pope" wrote in message
...
On Sat, 05 Nov 2005 03:12:18 GMT, "Bill McKee"
wrote:

I never said I was a jetski.

Were you, or have you ever been, a jetski?

Now that's funny!

--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com

Jet Ski overheating problem
 

I think Brian is mostly referring to the bickering part - I
apologize for my
part in it.

I think it's generally a worthwhile discussion of RofR situations. Sometimes
the situation is not straightforward of course, and it requires some quick
thinking. When I'm teaching, it's not atypical that we're in the midst of
significant traffic with a number of different types of vessels... anything
from tankers going in both directions, even three sometimes, to sailboats
and cabin cruiser types, to small dinghies and human power boats, and even
swimmers.

I'll typically ask my students, who has stand-on or give way status for a
particular boat, say port over starboard, then ask them about another boat
coming from a different direction, then about the ferry, then about the
kayaker, etc. It makes for an interesting sail if nothing else.



When you are teaching multiple target situations, how do you prioritize
them? Do you run plots with time to CPA? I have a hard time explaining
to my watchkeepers that the closest is not always the most threatening
and that whatever they do it has to not compound the next situation.

Jet Ski overheating problem
 

"Larry" wrote in message
...
Jeff wrote in
:

proper to pass within 15 feet of boats doing 25 MPH shouldn't be out
there.


It's 50 ft in South Carolina...just like for a dock. 200' from the
marina.

--
Larry

Jet Ski overheating problem
 

"Larry" wrote in message
...
Jeff wrote in
:

proper to pass within 15 feet of boats doing 25 MPH shouldn't be out
there.


It's 50 ft in South Carolina...just like for a dock. 200' from the
marina.

--
Larry

I guess you never pass on a 2 lane road. Both oncoming and same direction
traffic.

Jet Ski overheating problem
 

"Don White" wrote in message
...
Gary wrote:


You are right. There are really only two sets of over-arching rules, the
Colregs and the Inland Rules. Adhere to those and all is well. The
people that don't learn them cause us all to come to grief.


It kills some of the yahoos that a slow moving sailboat has right of way
over their 300hp, gas guzzlin', air polluting monstrosity.

There is no "right of way" for boats. If there was as you state, a
sailboat, could make any turn he wanted at any time and he would never be at
fault. Look at Colregs section 17.

Jet Ski overheating problem
 

"Scotty" wrote in message
...
"Bill McKee" wrote

Is it really *that* hard to turn a steering wheel, Bill? Do
you
have wimpy limp wrists?

SBV


You remind me of the sailor who decides to turn with no
signal and


Oh, you were serious about those turn signals.

SBV


\

You need to be more creative in your writings.

Jet Ski overheating problem
 

"Gary" wrote in message
news:fd7bf.409721$oW2.156691@pd7tw1no...
I think Brian is mostly referring to the bickering part - I apologize
for my
part in it.

I think it's generally a worthwhile discussion of RofR situations.
Sometimes the situation is not straightforward of course, and it requires
some quick thinking. When I'm teaching, it's not atypical that we're in
the midst of significant traffic with a number of different types of
vessels... anything from tankers going in both directions, even three
sometimes, to sailboats and cabin cruiser types, to small dinghies and
human power boats, and even swimmers.

I'll typically ask my students, who has stand-on or give way status for a
particular boat, say port over starboard, then ask them about another
boat coming from a different direction, then about the ferry, then about
the kayaker, etc. It makes for an interesting sail if nothing else.



When you are teaching multiple target situations, how do you prioritize
them? Do you run plots with time to CPA? I have a hard time explaining
to my watchkeepers that the closest is not always the most threatening and
that whatever they do it has to not compound the next situation.

Not familiar with the term CPA. Since this is a teaching situation, I try
not to get them into a situation that is going to be overwhelming. We look
at potential collision courses of the targets first, then I have them sort
out plans of action. You're right of course. Many times, it's not the
closest that one needs to be mindful of.. we also try and make an assessment
about the level of knowledge on the other boat. Sometimes it's a shock when
they do or don't do the right thing. :-)

Jet Ski overheating problem
 

Capt. JG wrote:
"Gary" wrote in message
news:fd7bf.409721$oW2.156691@pd7tw1no...

I think Brian is mostly referring to the bickering part - I apologize
for my

part in it.

I think it's generally a worthwhile discussion of RofR situations.
Sometimes the situation is not straightforward of course, and it requires
some quick thinking. When I'm teaching, it's not atypical that we're in
the midst of significant traffic with a number of different types of
vessels... anything from tankers going in both directions, even three
sometimes, to sailboats and cabin cruiser types, to small dinghies and
human power boats, and even swimmers.

I'll typically ask my students, who has stand-on or give way status for a
particular boat, say port over starboard, then ask them about another
boat coming from a different direction, then about the ferry, then about
the kayaker, etc. It makes for an interesting sail if nothing else.



When you are teaching multiple target situations, how do you prioritize
them? Do you run plots with time to CPA? I have a hard time explaining
to my watchkeepers that the closest is not always the most threatening and
that whatever they do it has to not compound the next situation.


Not familiar with the term CPA. Since this is a teaching situation, I try
not to get them into a situation that is going to be overwhelming. We look
at potential collision courses of the targets first, then I have them sort
out plans of action. You're right of course. Many times, it's not the
closest that one needs to be mindful of.. we also try and make an assessment
about the level of knowledge on the other boat. Sometimes it's a shock when
they do or don't do the right thing. :-)


Closest Point of Approach

Jet Ski overheating problem
 

Capt. JG wrote:
When you are teaching multiple target situations, how do you
prioritize them? Do you run plots with time to CPA? I have a
hard time explaining to my watchkeepers that the closest
is not always the most threatening and
that whatever they do it has to not compound the next situation.

Not familiar with the term CPA.

Jeeze, Jon, how did you get that license? Did you take a course?
(must of just been 6-pak, not master) I could understand if someone
from FL didn't know it, but in your area, as well as mine, you should
take fog seriously.

Jet Ski overheating problem
 

"Jeff" wrote in message
. ..
Capt. JG wrote:
When you are teaching multiple target situations, how do you
prioritize them? Do you run plots with time to CPA? I have a
hard time explaining to my watchkeepers that the closest
is not always the most threatening and
that whatever they do it has to not compound the next situation.

Not familiar with the term CPA.

Jeeze, Jon, how did you get that license? Did you take a course? (must of
just been 6-pak, not master) I could understand if someone from FL didn't
know it, but in your area, as well as mine, you should take fog seriously.

Never saw closest point of approach abbreviated. Got the license in the
usual way... box of cereal, right?

Fog seriously? Naw, just the big ships in it.

--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com

Jet Ski overheating problem
 

"Gary" wrote in message
news:Rz9bf.420601$tl2.192513@pd7tw3no...
Capt. JG wrote:
"Gary" wrote in message
news:fd7bf.409721$oW2.156691@pd7tw1no...

I think Brian is mostly referring to the bickering part - I apologize
for my

part in it.

I think it's generally a worthwhile discussion of RofR situations.
Sometimes the situation is not straightforward of course, and it
requires some quick thinking. When I'm teaching, it's not atypical that
we're in the midst of significant traffic with a number of different
types of vessels... anything from tankers going in both directions, even
three sometimes, to sailboats and cabin cruiser types, to small dinghies
and human power boats, and even swimmers.

I'll typically ask my students, who has stand-on or give way status for
a particular boat, say port over starboard, then ask them about another
boat coming from a different direction, then about the ferry, then about
the kayaker, etc. It makes for an interesting sail if nothing else.



When you are teaching multiple target situations, how do you prioritize
them? Do you run plots with time to CPA? I have a hard time explaining
to my watchkeepers that the closest is not always the most threatening
and that whatever they do it has to not compound the next situation.


Not familiar with the term CPA. Since this is a teaching situation, I try
not to get them into a situation that is going to be overwhelming. We
look at potential collision courses of the targets first, then I have
them sort out plans of action. You're right of course. Many times, it's
not the closest that one needs to be mindful of.. we also try and make an
assessment about the level of knowledge on the other boat. Sometimes it's
a shock when they do or don't do the right thing. :-)


Closest Point of Approach

Ahh... thanks. We don't do formal ones during the on-the-water class.
Eyeball only.

--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com

Jet Ski overheating problem
 

Larry wrote:
Gary wrote in news:D44bf.417596$tl2.177416@pd7tw3no:


Narrow Channels--International



All this is great....if you're a ship from Le Havre. But, the jetski guy
has his South Carolina Dept of Natural Resources, Boater's Handbook. (The
guy on the sailboat probably doesn't have anything...and I'm serious.)
Whatever bureaucrats are in charge locally are the ones that set the rules
and bust them in the harbor and ICW. No boater safety course actually
teaches these International Rules.

So, the rules he goes by (assuming he goes by rules and is a nice guy with
family out for a PWC cruise, not some freak, which most of them really are
not) is the Boater's Handbook DNR handed him when he took his 2 sons to the
PWC training course DNR ran at the high school so the boys could get their
little DNR drivers permits. It says 50' from boats and docks and 200' from
marinas.

This nonsense of 8 layers of rule-making bureaucrats, all different in
every fiefdom you boat across, is REALLY STUPID!!



Naw, it's the only way to sentance young Johnny to a day or two of
trial and similar imprisonment or even fines for driving a jski like
a, well, you know.

Even just paying legal fees to not show up...

'snot worth a charter challenge, y'know?

To some the only real punishment possible is being kept waiting
beside the road for 20 minutes to sign for a ticket. Daddy's guy
pops a chzek, and I'm Bob's boy again!

But it gives an honest cop motivation to try to 'help' a few who
might just kill themselves if they don't get a good talking to,
possibly even to shoot a few suspects evading arrest.

Rule 1 in the book is really "Do everything you can to avoid a
collision, unless you are protecting the flag carrier."

New robotic insects will telemeter odours as well as high quality
vidio and audio to headquarters and nearby patrol vessels. Not all
them skeeters is real.

It's getting to be such a madhouse out here on the water that they
are going to install bouyed lanes, like streets, in some areas, with
speed limits and photoradar lights here and there, and helicopter
camera and gun ship patrols, who will soon be overburdened and
overbudgeted by medical rescues and evacuations. The photoradar
fines will show up in your income tax, property tax, auto permit
fees, and insurance premiums. They will even garnishee your X's
support payments, but not your child support. Sailboats are, of
course, to be avoided at all costs, have complete right of way, and
are not so regulated.

N'yah, N'yahh, N'ya N'ya N'Yahhhh!

International boundary crossings must be authorised by automatic
cell picturephone optional service documentation, six week setup
required, pay per use, paypal required, or those crossing the line
will be boarded. If your cell account application and passport
quality photograph isn't notarized, witnessed, vetted, approved,
enabled, vetted again and authorized, promulgated and verified
biometrically, you will be boarded.

Except for sailboats, who may zig zag wherever the hell they think
the wind, rocks and compass pertubations want them to, so there.
They have an express line to customs and a toll free number, too.
They have their own rules about survival in the wind, and how to
avoid each other. Some required turns could need to be initiated a
mile in advance of heavy vessels, for a sailor to avoid being
inadverdently mashed by an encumbered vessel in who's wind shadow
they could become becalmed, and it's you who must avoid their
attempts to non the less make time to weather, wherever their
anchorage may be. God rest them all, safe at hawser's end, and thee,
brother. Even if you have to go 100 extra yards to do it, even if
you have to back up in your lane to make a hole in traffic, you got
to do it. It's the law, Billy. God help you if you scratch their
gelcoat, even shake their stirred martinii with wake. Damages is
damages, and gin is expensive, too expensive to be ruined by you.

(insert razzzzzberry, here)

Sailors shouldn't need to look out for whirly gigs or steamboats, we
can't get away, and can't catch you. Most of you are too hard to
see, are our sails? All you need is to tongue your fly by wire
joystick and Mr. Scott will beam you past us, right? Behind us, that
is, it being safer, all 'round. Well clear. If the cook's flag is
flying, you must not over agitate the poaching eggs with a heavy
wake, right?

If you know sailing, it is easy to differentiate a true sailboat
from a stickboat, or motor sailer, who will endeavour to behave as a
powerboat, but who is still capable of being spun about by the wake
of a helicopter, or even broached, then reversed if they suddenly
and unexpected must turn ever so slightly to avoid you avoiding that
dead head he saw 20 minutes ago and still can't seem to get around,
what with the current, and wind shiftiness, and all.

Sailors called Kite skiers usually have the highest priority, being
essentially pedestrians, or potential aspiring pedestrians, most of
the time.

To whom would you bitch if you ran over some stupid swimmer's head
and the steel plate in his old veteran's head should scratch your
epoxy coated prop?

All considered, the best weapon on a boat is a yard sprayer full of
gasoline.

What about them Pelicans, eh?

Terry K

Jet Ski overheating problem
 

"Bill McKee" wrote in
ink.net:

I guess you never pass on a 2 lane road. Both oncoming and same
direction traffic.


This isn't about "me". I was simply stating the local rules.

--
Larry

Jet Ski overheating problem
 

"Capt. JG" wrote in
:

Larry, if you or anyone else really thought I was serious, then you have
more problems that can be solved here.

--


Oh. It's very hard to tell who's serious and who's just trolling, given
I've seen this belligerent attitude problem on both sides of the issue out
on the harbor.

--
Larry

Jet Ski overheating problem
 

"Bill McKee" wrote

I guess you never pass on a 2 lane road. Both oncoming and
same direction
traffic.


I sail in a bay, not on the road.

Does your little toy jet ski have wheels?

SBV

Jet Ski overheating problem
 

Gary wrote:
DSK wrote:
Bill McKee wrote:

I may get a minority of the blame

Nah, majority.

... but he CAN NOT CHANGE DIRECTION IN FRONT OF THE OVERTAKING BOAT!
He gets the majority of the fault.

Please cite the ColReg which says so.

DSK

Rule 17

Action by Stand-on Vessel

(a)(i) Where one of two vessels is to keep out of the way, the other
shall keep her course and speed.

You guys are being really silly.

The boat that is overtaking has to avoid the boat being overtaken
regardless of what the overtaken boat does. If the overtaking boat
does not avoid the boat he is overtaking then he is at fault.

Also the ColRegs advise that the overtaking boat should signal to
indicate intentions. How often is that done?

And I don't mean signaling like the menhaden boat that wanted to pass
us coming into the Greater Wicomico by giving 5 blasts on the horn
because he wanted to go straight up the river and didn't want to
deviate around us although he had plenty of room to do so since we
were on the extreme starboard edge of the marked channel. Technically
we should have maintained course and speed. But what we really did
was circle out of the marked channel (since there was sufficient water
over there)

Suppose there are two power boats in a narrow channel. Boat B is
behind boat A and wants to overtake. So Boat B expects Boat A to
maintain course and speed. BUT... the channel turns. Boat A is NOT
expected to maintain course and speed so that it runs into the channel
bank.

Moreover when passing in a narrow channel, it makes it much easier on
everyone if boat A cuts back on his speed to let boat B pass.
Regardless of what the ColRegs say.


grandma Rosalie

Jet Ski overheating problem
 

Bill McKee wrote:
I guess you never pass on a 2 lane road. Both oncoming and same direction
traffic.


Hey Bill.
Here it is for you ins very simple terms

A boat is NOT a car.

DSK

Jet Ski overheating problem
 

"DSK" wrote in message
.. .
Bill McKee wrote:
I guess you never pass on a 2 lane road. Both oncoming and same
direction traffic.

Hey Bill.
Here it is for you ins very simple terms

A boat is NOT a car.

DSK


But a car can be a boat.

--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com

Jet Ski overheating problem
 

"DSK" wrote in message
.. .
Bill McKee wrote:
I guess you never pass on a 2 lane road. Both oncoming and same
direction traffic.

Hey Bill.
Here it is for you ins very simple terms

A boat is NOT a car.

DSK


But passing is passing. And a car can be a boat. Both the Amphicar, and a
couple models lately out of Cuba, and did you ever see a 1957 Buick?

Jet Ski overheating problem
 

At this point, you've made it quite obvious that you are a clueless feeb
who is never going to get a clue, no matter how patiently it is
explained to you. But for the benefit of others, I'm going to go just a
bit further here.


A boat is NOT a car.


Bill McKee wrote:
But passing is passing.

No, it is not. If you would drive a boat at 60 mph just a few feet from
another boat... or any object in the water... then you should be
physically restrained from operating a boat since you are a deadly
hazard to yourself and others.

Are cars affected by wakes? Currents? Leeway? Do boats have brakes?

Suppose you "pass" another boat, just as you wuould in a car, at the
same moment a wake strikes that other boat and causes it to slew 20
degrees momentarily? Or just when your own boat meets a wake?

If you overtake another vessel in such a way that you cannot avoid that
vessel if his boat turns, or rolls, or side-slips, or has some minor
equipment failure, the *you* have acted dangerously and incompetently.

DSK

Jet Ski overheating problem
 

DSK you are a pompus ass.

"DSK" wrote in message
...
At this point, you've made it quite obvious that you are a clueless feeb
who is never going to get a clue, no matter how patiently it is explained
to you. But for the benefit of others, I'm going to go just a bit further
here.


A boat is NOT a car.


Bill McKee wrote:
But passing is passing.

No, it is not. If you would drive a boat at 60 mph just a few feet from
another boat... or any object in the water... then you should be
physically restrained from operating a boat since you are a deadly hazard
to yourself and others.

Are cars affected by wakes? Currents? Leeway? Do boats have brakes?

Suppose you "pass" another boat, just as you wuould in a car, at the same
moment a wake strikes that other boat and causes it to slew 20 degrees
momentarily? Or just when your own boat meets a wake?

If you overtake another vessel in such a way that you cannot avoid that
vessel if his boat turns, or rolls, or side-slips, or has some minor
equipment failure, the *you* have acted dangerously and incompetently.

DSK

Jet Ski overheating problem
 

"Bill McKee" wrote
I guess you never pass on a 2 lane road. Both oncoming and
same
direction traffic.

Hey Bill.
Here it is for you ins very simple terms

A boat is NOT a car.

DSK


But passing is passing.


Where Bill boats they have yellow lines painted on the water.
And traffic lights at the intersections.

I really believe he has turn signals on his boat.

SBV

Jet Ski overheating problem
 

Maybe, but he's right.

--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com

"Bert Robbins" wrote in message
. ..
DSK you are a pompus ass.

"DSK" wrote in message
...
At this point, you've made it quite obvious that you are a clueless feeb
who is never going to get a clue, no matter how patiently it is explained
to you. But for the benefit of others, I'm going to go just a bit further
here.


A boat is NOT a car.


Bill McKee wrote:
But passing is passing.

No, it is not. If you would drive a boat at 60 mph just a few feet from
another boat... or any object in the water... then you should be
physically restrained from operating a boat since you are a deadly hazard
to yourself and others.

Are cars affected by wakes? Currents? Leeway? Do boats have brakes?

Suppose you "pass" another boat, just as you wuould in a car, at the same
moment a wake strikes that other boat and causes it to slew 20 degrees
momentarily? Or just when your own boat meets a wake?

If you overtake another vessel in such a way that you cannot avoid that
vessel if his boat turns, or rolls, or side-slips, or has some minor
equipment failure, the *you* have acted dangerously and incompetently.

DSK