Jet Ski overheating problem
 

"Jonathan Ganz" wrote in message
...
Suggestion: Get a copy of the Colregs and the Rules of the Road,
specifically. Then, get back to us.
--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com

Jonathan, there is no such thing as getting a copy of "the Rules of the
Road," there is ONLY the Collision Regulations.

Jim

Jet Ski overheating problem
 

In article ,
Jim Carter wrote:

"Jonathan Ganz" wrote in message
...
Suggestion: Get a copy of the Colregs and the Rules of the Road,
specifically. Then, get back to us.
--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com

Jonathan, there is no such thing as getting a copy of "the Rules of the
Road," there is ONLY the Collision Regulations.

Shhhhh.....

--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com

Jet Ski overheating problem
 

"Jonathan Ganz" wrote in message
...
In article ,
Jim Carter wrote:

"Jonathan Ganz" wrote in message
...
Suggestion: Get a copy of the Colregs and the Rules of the Road,
specifically. Then, get back to us.
--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com

Jonathan, there is no such thing as getting a copy of "the Rules of the
Road," there is ONLY the Collision Regulations.

Shhhhh.....

--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com

OK....Sorry...... ;-)

Jim

Jet Ski overheating problem
 

In article ,
Jonathan Ganz wrote:
In article ,
Jim Carter wrote:

"Jonathan Ganz" wrote in message
...
Suggestion: Get a copy of the Colregs and the Rules of the Road,
specifically. Then, get back to us.
--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com

Jonathan, there is no such thing as getting a copy of "the Rules of the
Road," there is ONLY the Collision Regulations.

Shhhhh.....

Actually, here's what I was talking about....

http://www.sailingusa.info/rules_of_...lesofroad.html


--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com

Jet Ski overheating problem
 

In article ,
Peter Wiley wrote:
In article , Jonathan Ganz
wrote:
Yeah. Get a sailing dinghy. Not only will it cost less to buy than a
PWC, it'll cost a lot less to run, too, even with a 2HP Honda 4 stroke
outboard.

I had a 4HP, 2 stroke on mine. I guess I'm a jet-skier... sigh.

But people like this one don't do that, because they not only want to
be on the water, they also want to go fast without learning sailing
skills.

Amended: boating skills. We wouldn't want to exclude Doug. :-)

--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com

Jet Ski overheating problem
 

"Jonathan Ganz" wrote in message
...
In article et,
Bill McKee bmckee=at-ix.netcom.com wrote:
You better read the Colregs. A sailboat with the motor running, is a
power
boat. And all boats are to avoid collisions. The sailboat has to keep
going in a passing situation. They can not turn when they desire. I
guess
you figure you get to make the big tanker going up / down the channel to
turn to avoid you.

Yeah, so? What's your point? I know the regs and clearly you can quote
them. What are you trying to tell us here?



--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com



That you are an idiot.

Jet Ski overheating problem
 

"Jonathan Ganz" wrote in message
...
In article et,
Bill McKee bmckee=at-ix.netcom.com wrote:
I see you do not know what happens when the tanker T bones you. And if
your
sailboat is of any size, you will get Teed. And what about your sailboat
with sails up and motor running?

Well, having never actually experienced it, I can only go by what a
local CG offical told us at a seminar. I'm sure he could be wrong.

What about it? It's in the regs. Is the engine engaged or just
running? Are you talking about the propulsion system or the genset?
What about electric engines that are engaged and running but only
regenerating the batteries?

Do you know how you're supposed to tell other boats what you're doing
when your engine is engaged and your sails are up after dark? How
about during the day?



--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com



If your gas engine is running, you are a power boat! If you are in neutral,
engine running, you are a power boat, if your sails are up and your motor is
running, you are a powerboat.

Jet Ski overheating problem
 

In article . net,
Bill McKee bmckee=at-ix.netcom.com wrote:

"Jonathan Ganz" wrote in message
...
Yeah, so? What's your point? I know the regs and clearly you can quote
them. What are you trying to tell us here?

That you are an idiot.

Ah, a name caller. Well, ok then. You sure won that argument on the
merits.




--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com

Jet Ski overheating problem
 

In article . net,
Bill McKee bmckee=at-ix.netcom.com wrote:
What about it? It's in the regs. Is the engine engaged or just
running? Are you talking about the propulsion system or the genset?
What about electric engines that are engaged and running but only
regenerating the batteries?

Do you know how you're supposed to tell other boats what you're doing
when your engine is engaged and your sails are up after dark? How
about during the day?



--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com



If your gas engine is running, you are a power boat! If you are in neutral,
engine running, you are a power boat, if your sails are up and your motor is
running, you are a powerboat.

What about the other questions.... come on, show us you know the regs.




--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com

Jet Ski overheating problem
 

"Jonathan Ganz" wrote in message
...
In article et,
Bill McKee bmckee=at-ix.netcom.com wrote:
I suggest you read the Colregs yourself, and get back to us as to when a
sailboat can turn and go in front of any other non sailboat when ever they
desire. Danger be danged.

Bill, sounds like you're unsure who is stand on vessel in the case you
describe; otherwise, you would know that a sailboat can not turn in
front of any other boat (sail or power) and have stand-on status.

What do you mean by danger be danged? Does this mean you would run
your boat up on the rocks or turn in front of another boat as a last
resort? Why did you get in that spot to begin with?

Please tell us.



--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com



I see you can not comprehend what you read either. The sailboat as it says
in the posting turns in front of the non sailboat. Who is the stand on
vessel? Your opinion, with substantiation is required. You are the one in
the sailboat. You going to run up on the rocks or turn in front of the 40'
fishing boat?

Jet Ski overheating problem
 

"Don White" wrote in message
...
Bill McKee wrote:
"Don White" wrote in message
...

Bill McKee wrote:

"ladysailor" wrote in message
egroups.com...


You're right, I take off my hat and gloves when I'm being harassed by
obnoxious morons and turn straight away into a ****ed off sailor.



Probably like a lot if sailors, you turn when ever you want, and then
yell at a power boat for impeding you.

If you don't like the collision regulations, sell that stinkpot and take
up golf.


Another "sailor". It is also up to the sailboat to avoid a collision. I
have heard "sailors" declare they have the right of way over a tanker
entering the Golden Gate. There is no right of way, and the tanker has
preference, and if they collide, the sailor's estate may have to pay to
fix the scratches in the paint of the tankers hull.
Not all sailors are familiar enough with the collision regulations either.
In your case, sounds like you were overtaking him. You are the 'giveway
boat'. That said, he has a responsibility to give you ample time to avoid
a collision.

He has to avoid the tanker in the channel. If he causes the tanker to run
aground or hit a bridge piling to avoid the collision, the sailboat is going
to be liable for all damages. The tanker, the bridge, all the damage.

Jet Ski overheating problem
 

"Jim Carter" wrote in message
...

"Bill McKee" wrote in message news:fkaaf.4109
I
know what is involved with sailing. Married a good sailors daughter and
used to windsurf. But too many "sailors" figure they have the right of
way
as they have a sailboat. I have had "sailors" do a 90 degree in front of
me
when lifting the sails and the iron sail is still running, and then yell
at
me. They would yell even louder if I collided with them and when they
had
to pay enormous sums of money to me.

Bill, if "you" collided with them, "you" would be at fault. It is your
responsibility, under Rule 8, the collision regulations, to avoid a
collision.
Jim



Not when he is 15' from me and makes a 90 degree turn in front of a boat
moving 25 miles per hour. His responsibility requires him to avoid the
collision and has to keep in a continous direction when being overtaken.

Jet Ski overheating problem
 

"Jonathan Ganz" wrote in message
...
In article ,
Jonathan Ganz wrote:
In article ,
Jim Carter wrote:

"Jonathan Ganz" wrote in message
...
Suggestion: Get a copy of the Colregs and the Rules of the Road,
specifically. Then, get back to us.
--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com

Jonathan, there is no such thing as getting a copy of "the Rules of the
Road," there is ONLY the Collision Regulations.

Shhhhh.....

Actually, here's what I was talking about....

http://www.sailingusa.info/rules_of_...lesofroad.html


--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com



And that has what legal validity?

Jet Ski overheating problem
 

In article . net,
Bill McKee bmckee=at-ix.netcom.com wrote:

"Jonathan Ganz" wrote in message
...
I see you can not comprehend what you read either. The sailboat as it says
in the posting turns in front of the non sailboat. Who is the stand on
vessel? Your opinion, with substantiation is required. You are the one in
the sailboat. You going to run up on the rocks or turn in front of the 40'
fishing boat?

I would say the sailboat, since your fishing boat would collide with
it, not the other way around. However, both boats would be at fault.
Of course, you're assuming that I have a sailboat smaller than 40',
not that it matter much.



--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com

Jet Ski overheating problem
 

In article t,
Bill McKee bmckee=at-ix.netcom.com wrote:
He has to avoid the tanker in the channel. If he causes the tanker to run
aground or hit a bridge piling to avoid the collision, the sailboat is going
to be liable for all damages. The tanker, the bridge, all the damage.

Bzzzzt. The tanker will not hit a bridge piling to avoid the
collision.

Bzzzzt. The tanker will not be damanged.

Bzzzzt. The tanker will not leave the channel.

Bill... who has stand-on status on the ocean?

Suggestion (not a hint): Stay away from tankers.

--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com

Jet Ski overheating problem
 

In article et,
Bill McKee bmckee=at-ix.netcom.com wrote:
Bill, if "you" collided with them, "you" would be at fault. It is your
responsibility, under Rule 8, the collision regulations, to avoid a
collision.
Jim



Not when he is 15' from me and makes a 90 degree turn in front of a boat
moving 25 miles per hour. His responsibility requires him to avoid the
collision and has to keep in a continous direction when being overtaken.

15 feet? 25 MPH? So, we're talking about 1/2 seconds? I find this hard
to believe somehow. Do you want to try for second prize?



--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com

Jet Ski overheating problem
 

In article et,
Bill McKee bmckee=at-ix.netcom.com wrote:

"Jonathan Ganz" wrote in message
...
In article ,
Jonathan Ganz wrote:
In article ,
Jim Carter wrote:

"Jonathan Ganz" wrote in message
...
Suggestion: Get a copy of the Colregs and the Rules of the Road,
specifically. Then, get back to us.
--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com

Jonathan, there is no such thing as getting a copy of "the Rules of the
Road," there is ONLY the Collision Regulations.

Shhhhh.....

Actually, here's what I was talking about....

http://www.sailingusa.info/rules_of_...lesofroad.html


--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com



And that has what legal validity?

The colregs do. Did you actually go to the link? I bet you didn't.



--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com

Jet Ski overheating problem
 

In article ,
Jonathan Ganz wrote:
The colregs do. Did you actually go to the link? I bet you didn't.

Well, have a great evening... I'm outta here until tomorrow
evening. Guess I'll go sailing and see if there are any jetskiers out
there who know the rules of the road.

--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com

Jet Ski overheating problem
 

"Bill McKee" wrote in message
nk.net...

"Jim Carter" wrote in message
...
Bill, if "you" collided with them, "you" would be at fault. It is
your
responsibility, under Rule 8, the collision regulations, to avoid a
collision.
Jim
Not when he is 15' from me and makes a 90 degree turn in front of a boat
moving 25 miles per hour. His responsibility requires him to avoid the
collision and has to keep in a continous direction when being overtaken.

Yes Bill, You would still be at fault in this instance.

You are breaking several of the Collision Regulations. rule 5, rule 6, rule
7, and rule 8. You have disregarded all of these.
How? You were not paying attention in rule 5, and allowed yourself to get
too close to the sailboat. You were going to fast to avoid the collision
which is in contradiction of rule 6. You, most definitely broke rule 7,
(part a.) in as much as you collided with the sailboat. You broke rule 8
because you did not take action to avoid the collision.

Jim

Jet Ski overheating problem
 

"Jonathan Ganz" wrote in message
...
In article . net,
Bill McKee bmckee=at-ix.netcom.com wrote:
What about it? It's in the regs. Is the engine engaged or just
running? Are you talking about the propulsion system or the genset?
What about electric engines that are engaged and running but only
regenerating the batteries?

Do you know how you're supposed to tell other boats what you're doing
when your engine is engaged and your sails are up after dark? How
about during the day?



--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com



If your gas engine is running, you are a power boat! If you are in
neutral,
engine running, you are a power boat, if your sails are up and your motor
is
running, you are a powerboat.

What about the other questions.... come on, show us you know the regs.




--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com



Was up to you to show the regs.

Jet Ski overheating problem
 

"Jonathan Ganz" wrote in message
...
In article . net,
Bill McKee bmckee=at-ix.netcom.com wrote:

"Jonathan Ganz" wrote in message
...
Yeah, so? What's your point? I know the regs and clearly you can quote
them. What are you trying to tell us here?

That you are an idiot.

Ah, a name caller. Well, ok then. You sure won that argument on the
merits.




--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com



No, just stating the obvious.

Jet Ski overheating problem
 

"Jonathan Ganz" wrote in message
...
In article . net,
Bill McKee bmckee=at-ix.netcom.com wrote:

"Jonathan Ganz" wrote in message
...
I see you can not comprehend what you read either. The sailboat as it
says
in the posting turns in front of the non sailboat. Who is the stand on
vessel? Your opinion, with substantiation is required. You are the one
in
the sailboat. You going to run up on the rocks or turn in front of the
40'
fishing boat?

I would say the sailboat, since your fishing boat would collide with
it, not the other way around. However, both boats would be at fault.
Of course, you're assuming that I have a sailboat smaller than 40',
not that it matter much.



--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com



I assume you own a small, cheap sailboat. And the 40' was the fishing boat
if you go back and try to read for comprehension. And as to majority if
fault. The sailboat gets it. They did not continue in a line while being
overtaken. You better re read the Colregs.

Jet Ski overheating problem
 

Not when he is 15' from me and makes a 90 degree turn in front of a boat
moving 25 miles per hour. His responsibility requires him to avoid the
collision and has to keep in a continous direction when being overtaken.


???

There is NO obligation for any vessel to "keep in a continuous direction
when being overtaken."

The overtakING vessel is burdened to keep clear, which means that you
must slow down and be ready to take avoiding action.


Jim Carter wrote:
Yes Bill, You would still be at fault in this instance.

You are breaking several of the Collision Regulations. rule 5, rule 6, rule
7, and rule 8. You have disregarded all of these.

It's quite true but I suspect that Bill (and many other motorheads) will
never ever believe it.

How? You were not paying attention in rule 5, and allowed yourself to get
too close to the sailboat. You were going to fast to avoid the collision
which is in contradiction of rule 6. You, most definitely broke rule 7,
(part a.) in as much as you collided with the sailboat. You broke rule 8
because you did not take action to avoid the collision.


Most motorheads think that any other boat who "gets in their way" must
be at fault and/or in violation of something. Plenty also think that
sailboats deliberately turn in front of them for fun.

Unfortunately there's no rule against stupidity.

DSK

Jet Ski overheating problem
 

"Jonathan Ganz" wrote in message
...
In article t,
Bill McKee bmckee=at-ix.netcom.com wrote:
He has to avoid the tanker in the channel. If he causes the tanker to run
aground or hit a bridge piling to avoid the collision, the sailboat is
going
to be liable for all damages. The tanker, the bridge, all the damage.

Bzzzzt. The tanker will not hit a bridge piling to avoid the
collision.

Bzzzzt. The tanker will not be damanged.

Bzzzzt. The tanker will not leave the channel.

Bill... who has stand-on status on the ocean?

Suggestion (not a hint): Stay away from tankers.

--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com



Bzzt. A tanker hit the San Raphael bridge earlier this year avoiding a
boat. The boat is and has been held liable. Look at the SFCG site, and you
will probably find the info.

Bzzt. A freighter ran aground somewhere back east avoiding a boat earlier
this year. You will have to google up that one.

Jet Ski overheating problem
 

"Jim Carter" wrote in message
...

"Bill McKee" wrote in message
nk.net...

"Jim Carter" wrote in message
...
Bill, if "you" collided with them, "you" would be at fault. It is
your
responsibility, under Rule 8, the collision regulations, to avoid a
collision.
Jim
Not when he is 15' from me and makes a 90 degree turn in front of a boat
moving 25 miles per hour. His responsibility requires him to avoid the
collision and has to keep in a continous direction when being overtaken.

Yes Bill, You would still be at fault in this instance.

You are breaking several of the Collision Regulations. rule 5, rule 6,
rule
7, and rule 8. You have disregarded all of these.
How? You were not paying attention in rule 5, and allowed yourself to get
too close to the sailboat. You were going to fast to avoid the collision
which is in contradiction of rule 6. You, most definitely broke rule 7,
(part a.) in as much as you collided with the sailboat. You broke rule 8
because you did not take action to avoid the collision.

Jim



Bzzt: Sailboat made a bad move. Prove I was not paying attention, and that
an illegal direction change while being overtaken did not cause the
accident.

Jet Ski overheating problem
 

"DSK" wrote in message
.. .
Not when he is 15' from me and makes a 90 degree turn in front of a boat
moving 25 miles per hour. His responsibility requires him to avoid the
collision and has to keep in a continous direction when being overtaken.
???
There is NO obligation for any vessel to "keep in a continuous direction
when being overtaken."

The overtakING vessel is burdened to keep clear, which means that you
must slow down and be ready to take avoiding action.
Jim Carter wrote:
Yes Bill, You would still be at fault in this instance.

You are breaking several of the Collision Regulations. rule 5, rule 6,
rule
7, and rule 8. You have disregarded all of these.

It's quite true but I suspect that Bill (and many other motorheads) will
never ever believe it.

How? You were not paying attention in rule 5, and allowed yourself to
get
too close to the sailboat. You were going to fast to avoid the
collision
which is in contradiction of rule 6. You, most definitely broke rule
7,
(part a.) in as much as you collided with the sailboat. You broke rule
8
because you did not take action to avoid the collision.
Most motorheads think that any other boat who "gets in their way" must
be at fault and/or in violation of something. Plenty also think that
sailboats deliberately turn in front of them for fun.

Unfortunately there's no rule against stupidity.

DSK

Thank you for confirming what I thought was obvious. It's too bad that
Bill and many others have the mistaken belief that their power boats have
the "right of might" over sailing vessels.

Jim Carter
"The Boat"
Bayfield

Jet Ski overheating problem
 

"Jonathan Ganz" wrote in message
...
In article et,
Bill McKee bmckee=at-ix.netcom.com wrote:

"Jonathan Ganz" wrote in message
...
In article ,
Jonathan Ganz wrote:
In article ,
Jim Carter wrote:

"Jonathan Ganz" wrote in message
...
Suggestion: Get a copy of the Colregs and the Rules of the Road,
specifically. Then, get back to us.
--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com

Jonathan, there is no such thing as getting a copy of "the Rules of the
Road," there is ONLY the Collision Regulations.

Shhhhh.....

Actually, here's what I was talking about....

http://www.sailingusa.info/rules_of_...lesofroad.html


--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com



And that has what legal validity?

The colregs do. Did you actually go to the link? I bet you didn't.



--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com



And your "Rules of the Road" have legal validity. I did not go to the site.
AS YOU STATED BOTH Colregs and your "Rules of the Road" for legality. So
you "Rules of the Road" are nada as to concern. It may be a restatement or
interpretation of the Colregs, but other than that they are meaningless.

Jet Ski overheating problem
 

"Jonathan Ganz" wrote in message
...
In article ,
Jonathan Ganz wrote:
The colregs do. Did you actually go to the link? I bet you didn't.

Well, have a great evening... I'm outta here until tomorrow
evening. Guess I'll go sailing and see if there are any jetskiers out
there who know the rules of the road.

--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com



Better not get in front of a tanker. Your posting will come back to haunt
you.

Jet Ski overheating problem
 

"Bill McKee" wrote in message
.net...

"Jim Carter" wrote in message
...

"Bill McKee" wrote in message
nk.net...

"Jim Carter" wrote in message
...
Bill, if "you" collided with them, "you" would be at fault. It is
your
responsibility, under Rule 8, the collision regulations, to avoid a
collision.
Jim
Not when he is 15' from me and makes a 90 degree turn in front of a
boat
moving 25 miles per hour. His responsibility requires him to avoid the
collision and has to keep in a continous direction when being
overtaken.

Yes Bill, You would still be at fault in this instance.

You are breaking several of the Collision Regulations. rule 5, rule 6,
rule
7, and rule 8. You have disregarded all of these.
How? You were not paying attention in rule 5, and allowed yourself to
get
too close to the sailboat. You were going to fast to avoid the
collision
which is in contradiction of rule 6. You, most definitely broke rule
7,
(part a.) in as much as you collided with the sailboat. You broke rule
8
because you did not take action to avoid the collision.

Jim



Bzzt: Sailboat made a bad move. Prove I was not paying attention, and
that
an illegal direction change while being overtaken did not cause the
accident.
Bill, here is the proof for you. If "you" hit the sailboat that means that
you were not paying attention to various factors, those factors being your
speed & your proximity to the sailboat. Ergo.......your broke Rule 5. The
sailboat making a bad move has nothing to do with it. You were too close!
You were going too fast! You hit the sailboat! You're in the
wrong.......

Jim Carter
"The Boat"
Bayfield.

Jet Ski overheating problem
 

"Jim Carter" wrote in message
.. .

"DSK" wrote in message
.. .
Not when he is 15' from me and makes a 90 degree turn in front of a
boat
moving 25 miles per hour. His responsibility requires him to avoid the
collision and has to keep in a continous direction when being
overtaken.
???
There is NO obligation for any vessel to "keep in a continuous direction
when being overtaken."

The overtakING vessel is burdened to keep clear, which means that you
must slow down and be ready to take avoiding action.
Jim Carter wrote:
Yes Bill, You would still be at fault in this instance.

You are breaking several of the Collision Regulations. rule 5, rule 6,
rule
7, and rule 8. You have disregarded all of these.

It's quite true but I suspect that Bill (and many other motorheads) will
never ever believe it.

How? You were not paying attention in rule 5, and allowed yourself to
get
too close to the sailboat. You were going to fast to avoid the
collision
which is in contradiction of rule 6. You, most definitely broke rule
7,
(part a.) in as much as you collided with the sailboat. You broke rule
8
because you did not take action to avoid the collision.
Most motorheads think that any other boat who "gets in their way" must
be at fault and/or in violation of something. Plenty also think that
sailboats deliberately turn in front of them for fun.

Unfortunately there's no rule against stupidity.

DSK

Thank you for confirming what I thought was obvious. It's too bad that
Bill and many others have the mistaken belief that their power boats have
the "right of might" over sailing vessels.

Jim Carter
"The Boat"
Bayfield



The boat being overtaken has to continue in the same general direction,
allowing the safe passing. Review the Colregs. Maybe not an exact straigh
line.

Jet Ski overheating problem
 

"Jim Carter" wrote in message
.. .

"Bill McKee" wrote in message
.net...

"Jim Carter" wrote in message
...

"Bill McKee" wrote in message
nk.net...

"Jim Carter" wrote in message
...
Bill, if "you" collided with them, "you" would be at fault. It is
your
responsibility, under Rule 8, the collision regulations, to avoid a
collision.
Jim
Not when he is 15' from me and makes a 90 degree turn in front of a
boat
moving 25 miles per hour. His responsibility requires him to avoid
the
collision and has to keep in a continous direction when being
overtaken.

Yes Bill, You would still be at fault in this instance.

You are breaking several of the Collision Regulations. rule 5, rule 6,
rule
7, and rule 8. You have disregarded all of these.
How? You were not paying attention in rule 5, and allowed yourself to
get
too close to the sailboat. You were going to fast to avoid the
collision
which is in contradiction of rule 6. You, most definitely broke rule
7,
(part a.) in as much as you collided with the sailboat. You broke rule
8
because you did not take action to avoid the collision.

Jim



Bzzt: Sailboat made a bad move. Prove I was not paying attention, and
that
an illegal direction change while being overtaken did not cause the
accident.
Bill, here is the proof for you. If "you" hit the sailboat that means
that
you were not paying attention to various factors, those factors being your
speed & your proximity to the sailboat. Ergo.......your broke Rule 5.
The
sailboat making a bad move has nothing to do with it. You were too
close!
You were going too fast! You hit the sailboat! You're in the
wrong.......

Jim Carter
"The Boat"
Bayfield.



I may get a minority of the blame, but he CAN NOT CHANGE DIRECTION IN FRONT
OF THE OVERTAKING BOAT! He gets the majority of the fault.

Jet Ski overheating problem
 

Bill McKee wrote:
I may get a minority of the blame

Nah, majority.

... but he CAN NOT CHANGE DIRECTION IN FRONT
OF THE OVERTAKING BOAT! He gets the majority of the fault.


Please cite the ColReg which says so.

DSK

Jet Ski overheating problem
 

"DSK" wrote in message
.. .
Bill McKee wrote:
I may get a minority of the blame

Nah, majority.

... but he CAN NOT CHANGE DIRECTION IN FRONT OF THE OVERTAKING BOAT! He
gets the majority of the fault.

Please cite the ColReg which says so.

DSK


Rule 17 a) i)

Jet Ski overheating problem
 

I'd support letting PWC back on the water if and only if they came
equipped with an explosive charge that detonated if the vehicle
exceeded the speed limits in mooring fields or other slow speed zones,
or within say 50m of the shoreline. Those who want to play chicken with
boats underway, I'd leave to the shotgun and rifle owning fraternity.

Actually these days it wouldn't be all that difficult to wire the
things to a mobile phone or datalogger with GPS. Then if a complaint
was made, it'd be easy to check the data and either fine or confiscate
the PWC.

PDW

In article . com,
wrote:

Fortunately, these days I live in a place where jetskis are banned.
Long may it stay that way. Guess why they got banned? Noisy offensive
buzzing insects driven by morons who broke every rule in the book

Okay, fine, but do me a favor, suppose this hypothetically:

What if, in recognition of existing problems, and in an effort to get
into your
town's good graces, and most importantly, to be allowed onto your
beautiful
waterways (where we pay the same taxes to support launch ramps and
other
boating-related services as do other boaters), the pwc-owning community
and
industry (not that powerful a lobbying bloc, there are only four
manufacturers),
took certain steps, for instance....

Suppose they/we actively and successfully supported and promoted
mandatory
education and licensing requirements for pwc operators, and as a
result, pwc-related
accident and injury statistics dropped for multiple years in a row, as
has happened in states where such laws have been enacted over the past
five or six years, including New York, New Jersey and Connecticut; and
also, young or new pwc owners and operators were, increasingly,
demonstrably and enforceably, at least acquainted with the basics of
boating safety, courtesy and regulations before they could legally
operate a vehicle...(unlike with any other kind of boats, I might add
parenthetically)

Now, suppose further, bear with me here, that in addition, for more
than five years, the entire industry had been on a continuous and
highly effective campaign to make their 'skis dramatically quieter,
cleaner-running, vastly more fuel-efficient and with provably
far-reduced pollution and impact on wildlife and the environment (in
the end comparing at the very least favorably in those areas with
pretty much all other new power boats in the market). Let's say the
new 'skis were found to be 75% quieter than those from five years ago,
with (obviously) the ratio of these newer, clean./quiet models to
older/louder/dirtier boats out on the water, inevitably increased year
by year, obviously that trend stretching into the future...

Now, do you think it would be reasonable to ask those in your
community, those who'd voted for the pwc bans in the first place,
especially those with an interest in boating in general, to be informed
and aware of, and to acknowledge, these developments, and in fact to
reevaluate their impressions of pwc's and their riders, with these
changes in mind, after a number of years?

Would you yourself be willing to do that? To update your level of
knowledge in the topic even though it may not seem to affect you
personally (you never plan to buy a pwc), and to take the banned
community's responses and efforts to improve their reputation and the
entire situation, into account....would you ever be willing to
reconsider and revisit the issue in the name of simple fairness, even
regularly, every five years; would you be able to have your notions on
the matter changed over time by new information?

OR, would you stubbornly cling to your original perceptions and notions
about pwc's, refusing to be swayed by or bothered with ongoing changes
such as these, in your attitudes and policies toward the machines and
their riders.....always basing your final evaluation on the older,
original data on the basis of which you first formed your impressions
years ago? Would you in fact, in your mind, even possibly, tend to
unfairly prejudge and stereotype pwc's and the majority of their riders
based on conditions you observed anecdotally before any of these
changes (in statistics; in technology; in law; in a large percentage of
the riders themselves) had come about?

Rhetorical questions obviously. Just take a look at yourself, man, and
your attitude.

Remember we are all in this together when you talk about bans. There
are plenty of people who would love to see all power boats banned from
our waterways entirely....they are the ones who at FIRST seemed to be
succeeding with national park bans enacted back in the late '90s, until
science and reality bore out the fact that pwc's were not intrinsically
different from any other power boats, the results of the parks' own
studies causing these bans to be rolled back in the last couple years,
one after another....do you think the environmental extremists who
initiated these laws would have stopped at pwc's?

I just know I share a love of the water, and a great number of
responsibilities and concerns, with everybody on this newsgroup, and
every other boater and pwc enthusiast out on the water. Here's
another question: out of pwc's versus boaters at large, which group
more often has a beer in the hand of every person you seem to see on a
vessel underway? How about this: which group has a greater percentage
of always having life vests on? There is stupidity, irresposnbility,
and dangerous, illegal behavior perpretrated by boaters of ALL STRIPES
on all sizes and shapes of boats, but it is WRONG and UNFAIR to
prejudicially make statements painting all those boaters with the same
brush based on the behavior of the idiotic ones. It is just wrong.
And "banning" any type of vehicle based on the illegal behavior of
whatever percentage of its users, is even more wrong....you just might
not know it yet if hasn't affected you personaly with your "choice of
toy."

richforman

Jet Ski overheating problem
 

In article , Jonathan Ganz
wrote:

In article .com,
wrote:

IN fact, I'd say the only thing you could deduce about somebody who has
a pwc vs. someone with a bigger boat
is that the pwc guy probably has a little less money. They're

Bigger? What about a smaller sailboat boat?

Yeah. Get a sailing dinghy. Not only will it cost less to buy than a
PWC, it'll cost a lot less to run, too, even with a 2HP Honda 4 stroke
outboard.

But people like this one don't do that, because they not only want to
be on the water, they also want to go fast without learning sailing
skills.

cigar boats) that zoom around, but not in an anchorage, because they
know better.

Now you're just showing your die-hard, inflexible, anti-pwc prejudice
loud and clear.

Why's that? Am I not allowed to be annoyed by bad behavior? Who the
f*ck made you god?

of the road, and who DRINK WHILE BOATING CONSTANTLY....almost EVERYBODY

What is up with this drinkin and drivin thing? I just don't get that?
What point are you trying to make?

Here's another take. A small sailboat is moving at 5 knots if you're
lucky. Jetskis top out at over 50 mph. 10X the speed. You need 1/10 of
the time to react to running someone or something over, and any impact
is going to result in an energy transfer *100* times greater for the
PWC than the sailboat. Short form, you could be ****ed as a newt in a
small sailboat and not do anyone or anything much damage. Not so in a
fast power vessel.


By the way....are you saying above that you don't think there are many,
many boaters
in your area who are drinking while they're boating and go untouched by
law enforcement? That it's

I'm saying that they are not very obvious if they are drinking and
driving. I'd say that the vast majority don't drink and drive, just
like the vast majority of car owners don't.

That I'd have to see to believe.

Well, you need to get out more... well, I take that back. You have a
PWC.

Oh no... here comes the missing sense of humor.....

Who gives a rat's, Jon. He has a PWC.

PDW

Jet Ski overheating problem
 

"Bill McKee" wrote in message
nk.net...

"DSK" wrote in message
.. .
Bill McKee wrote:
I may get a minority of the blame

Nah, majority.

... but he CAN NOT CHANGE DIRECTION IN FRONT OF THE OVERTAKING BOAT!
He
gets the majority of the fault.

Please cite the ColReg which says so.

DSK


Rule 17 a) i)

Wrong again Bill. Did you not read Rule 13 part (a)? If not, here it is
for you.
"Notwithstanding anything contained in the Rules of Part B, Sections I and
II, any vessel overtaking any other vessel shall keep out of the way of the
vessel being overtaken."

This means that you were, at 25 feet behind the sailboat, and going 25 MPH,
you were not in a position to "keep out of the way". Right Bill? Proof of
this is in Rule 17 (b) . Did you read this part Bill? If not, here it is
for you.
"When, from any cause, the vessel required to keep her course and speed
finds herself so close that collision cannot be avoided by the action of the
give-way vessel alone, she shall take such action as will best aid to avoid
collision. This could be the reason for her turning. Right Bill?

This means Bill, that if you collided with the sailboat, the majority of the
blame is YOURS.

Jim Carter
"The Boat"
Bayfield.

Jet Ski overheating problem
 

Capt Joe,
All security experts strongly recommend you do not include your address and
phone number in your UseNet Posts.


"Captain Joe Redcloud" wrote in message
...
On 2 Nov 2005 16:47:08 -0800, lid (Jonathan Ganz) wrote:

In article . net,
Bill McKee bmckee=at-ix.netcom.com wrote:

"Jonathan Ganz" wrote in message
...
Yeah, so? What's your point? I know the regs and clearly you can quote
them. What are you trying to tell us here?

That you are an idiot.

Ah, a name caller. Well, ok then. You sure won that argument on the
merits.

Yes, you can be sure that Jon Gayanzy has NEVER resorted to name calling
when it
suited his own purposes.


Captain Joe Redcloud
1882 Chestnut Hill Road
Mohnton PA
(610) 856-7118

Jet Ski overheating problem
 

Jon,
In a passing situation both boats must maintain their course and heading.
Some boaters, both power and sail do not understand the ColRegs, the biggest
problem some sail boaters make is assuming they are a sailboat when they are
under power, and assuming they have the right of way under all conditions
when they are under sail.


"Jonathan Ganz" wrote in message
...
In article . net,
Bill McKee bmckee=at-ix.netcom.com wrote:

"Jonathan Ganz" wrote in message
...
Yeah, so? What's your point? I know the regs and clearly you can quote
them. What are you trying to tell us here?

That you are an idiot.

Ah, a name caller. Well, ok then. You sure won that argument on the
merits.




--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com

Jet Ski overheating problem
 

JimC,
If there is a collision and both boats could have avoided the collision,
both boats can be held partially reasonable. If the sailboat in a passing
situation turns in front of another boat and it is not reasonable for the
other boater to avoid the collision, the powerboater will not be held
responsible.


"Jim Carter" wrote in message
...

"Bill McKee" wrote in message news:fkaaf.4109
I
know what is involved with sailing. Married a good sailors daughter and
used to windsurf. But too many "sailors" figure they have the right of
way
as they have a sailboat. I have had "sailors" do a 90 degree in front of
me
when lifting the sails and the iron sail is still running, and then yell
at
me. They would yell even louder if I collided with them and when they
had
to pay enormous sums of money to me.

Bill, if "you" collided with them, "you" would be at fault. It is your
responsibility, under Rule 8, the collision regulations, to avoid a
collision.
Jim

Jet Ski overheating problem
 

Doug,

When a sailboat or powerboat turns in front of a ship and the ship runs over
the boat, the ship's captain will not be held liable if a qualified,
reasonable qualified captain could not have avoided the collision. There
are many reasons why a qualified captain can have a collision and be found
free of responsibility for the collision.


"DSK" wrote in message
.. .
Not when he is 15' from me and makes a 90 degree turn in front of a boat
moving 25 miles per hour. His responsibility requires him to avoid the
collision and has to keep in a continous direction when being overtaken.


???

There is NO obligation for any vessel to "keep in a continuous direction
when being overtaken."

The overtakING vessel is burdened to keep clear, which means that you must
slow down and be ready to take avoiding action.


Jim Carter wrote:
Yes Bill, You would still be at fault in this instance.

You are breaking several of the Collision Regulations. rule 5, rule 6,
rule
7, and rule 8. You have disregarded all of these.

It's quite true but I suspect that Bill (and many other motorheads) will
never ever believe it.

How? You were not paying attention in rule 5, and allowed yourself to
get
too close to the sailboat. You were going to fast to avoid the
collision
which is in contradiction of rule 6. You, most definitely broke rule 7,
(part a.) in as much as you collided with the sailboat. You broke rule 8
because you did not take action to avoid the collision.


Most motorheads think that any other boat who "gets in their way" must be
at fault and/or in violation of something. Plenty also think that
sailboats deliberately turn in front of them for fun.

Unfortunately there's no rule against stupidity.

DSK