I have a little flare pistol on my boat (in New York State, Lake Ontario). I believe this is required by US Coast Guard. I was told by West Marine that we cannot take these to Canada as they are "weapons." Is this true? Can this pistol be used as a weapon? Can it shoot regular shot gun shells? Are the flare shells lethal? Is it a danger to anyone? Does anyone know anything about this? I'd appreciate any info?

--
Steve

A link to Pat's most excellent site ... http://boating.ncf.ca/equipment.html ... and a link to transport canada .... http://www.tc.gc.ca/BoatingSafety/sbg-gsn/distress.htm ... take a look at type B, multi-star.
"Steve Schwartz" wrote in message ...
I have a little flare pistol on my boat (in New York State, Lake Ontario). I believe this is required by US Coast Guard. I was told by West Marine that we cannot take these to Canada as they are "weapons." Is this true? Can this pistol be used as a weapon? Can it shoot regular shot gun shells? Are the flare shells lethal? Is it a danger to anyone? Does anyone know anything about this? I'd appreciate any info?

--
Steve

I have been sailing in Canada (40 yrs) and have had a flare pistol aboard (coast guard inspected) for the last 15 yrs. They are commonly used here.
Yes, they are a danger if pointed at a person. About lethal, I can't comment, other than to suggest that any flare launched at a person would be a very serious incident.
"Steve Schwartz" wrote in message ...
I have a little flare pistol on my boat (in New York State, Lake Ontario). I believe this is required by US Coast Guard. I was told by West Marine that we cannot take these to Canada as they are "weapons." Is this true? Can this pistol be used as a weapon? Can it shoot regular shot gun shells? Are the flare shells lethal? Is it a danger to anyone? Does anyone know anything about this? I'd appreciate any info?

--
Steve

I have crossed the border into Canada several times with flare pistols
and bear spray and noxious cleaning chemicals and who knows what else I
could get in trouble with in Canada. I have had no trouble and I declare
all when I cross the border. I also bring some documentation about the
bear spray and a float plan showing I'm off to the remote sections of
Alaska or Ontario, not some bar in Vancouver.

I've had a lot less trouble with Canadian authorities than I have with
the folks on the US side.

Yes, flare pistols can be a weapon, as can boat hooks, anchors, regular
flares, chlorine, hot oil, an anchor rode and any number of the devices
and chemicals I have onboard.

Be straight with these folks and you won't have any trouble.

Capt. Jeff

On Sat, 09 Oct 2004 23:46:38 GMT, "Steve Schwartz"
wrote:

I have a little flare pistol on my boat (in New York State, Lake Ontario). I believe this is required by US Coast Guard.
Yep, same here, depending on the boat size. Probably Orion brand.

I was told by West Marine that we cannot take these to Canada as they
are "weapons."

Well, maybe they can be "weapons", but so can my fid if I jam it in an
eye socket. I am not aware that Canada gives a damn about flare
pistols...as long as it IS a flare pistol (plasticy orange things) and
not a sawed-off shotgun...which could be conceivably USED as a flare
pistol. G

Is this true? Can this pistol be used as a weapon?

It was in the movie "Dead Calm", but I won't spoil the ending for you.
Sure, why not? Those shells are powerful enough to get to a couple of
hundred feet up, so I bet getting one in the nads at close range would
compromise fatherhood and lead to a blinding headache. Also, I recall
that older flare pistols were metal and generally heavier. They might
be able to take a real 12-gauge shotgun shell, and thus would make a
plausible weapon. Lousy aim, though.


Can it shoot regular shot gun shells?

Maybe once out of an Orion flare pistol, before it melted, blew apart
or fell to pieces. The "standard" modern flare gun is "light-duty"
only. A shotgun shell is more powerful by far than a flare shell. They
are, however, the same size, I believe.


Are the flare shells lethal?


See above. Picture maybe 20 firecrackers in one package.

Is it a danger to anyone?

If one goes off in the boat, it's bad. If all twelve in a standard
package go off due to a fire or something, it would probably kill crew
with the toxic smoke and the burning of the flare in an enclosed space
might set the fiberglass on fire...certainly the settees...


Does anyone know anything about this? I'd appreciate any info?

All I know is from "flare-offs" run by my boat club in which
out-of-date flares are disposed of under supervision. We are adjacent
to a small airport, and we had to get permission from them (because
firing into a flight path would be nasty) and from the cops because we
wanted them to ignore what looked like about a hundred SOS signals in
five minutes.

Very festive, loud and it took a week for the gulls to resume
crapping.

R.

"rhys" wrote in message
...


hugh snip

All I know is from "flare-offs" run by my boat club in which
out-of-date flares are disposed of under supervision. We are adjacent
to a small airport, and we had to get permission from them (because
firing into a flight path would be nasty) and from the cops because we
wanted them to ignore what looked like about a hundred SOS signals in
five minutes.

Very festive, loud and it took a week for the gulls to resume
crapping.

R.


That should give Parallax food for thought!

On Sat, 09 Oct 2004 23:46:38 GMT, "Steve Schwartz"
wrote (with possible editing):

I have a little flare pistol on my boat (in New York State, Lake Ontario). I believe this is required by US Coast Guard. I was told by West Marine that we cannot take these to Canada as they are "weapons." Is this true? Can this pistol be used as a weapon? Can it shoot regular shot gun shells? Are the flare shells lethal? Is it a danger to anyone? Does anyone know anything about this? I'd appreciate any info?

I am not a lawyer but:

I can't imagine that they are considered a weapon since they are
REQUIRED by Canadian authorities. See them discussed he
http://www.tc.gc.ca/BoatingSafety/sbg-gsn/distress.htm

and the regulation he

http://www.tc.gc.ca/acts-regulations...BFBE.XEFTID.E2

see section 16.02.

--

Larry
Email to rapp at lmr dot com

On Sun, 10 Oct 2004 02:18:17 -0400,
rhys wrote:
On Sat, 09 Oct 2004 23:46:38 GMT, "Steve Schwartz"
wrote:

I have a little flare pistol on my boat (in New York State, Lake Ontario). I believe this is required by US Coast Guard.
Yep, same here, depending on the boat size. Probably Orion brand.

I was told by West Marine that we cannot take these to Canada as they
are "weapons."

Well, maybe they can be "weapons", but so can my fid if I jam it in an
eye socket. I am not aware that Canada gives a damn about flare
pistols...as long as it IS a flare pistol (plasticy orange things) and
not a sawed-off shotgun...which could be conceivably USED as a flare
pistol. G


Our flare pistol (well, one, we have a backup also) is an old USN issue
from WWII era, and while I don't think I'd want to be the one pulling
the trigger, (the breach looks none too secure for the higher pressures
of a 12ga shell) It *will* chamber, and I presume, would fire.

Is this true? Can this pistol be used as a weapon?

It was in the movie "Dead Calm", but I won't spoil the ending for you.
Sure, why not? Those shells are powerful enough to get to a couple of
hundred feet up, so I bet getting one in the nads at close range would
compromise fatherhood and lead to a blinding headache. Also, I recall
that older flare pistols were metal and generally heavier. They might
be able to take a real 12-gauge shotgun shell, and thus would make a
plausible weapon. Lousy aim, though.


Can it shoot regular shot gun shells?

Maybe once out of an Orion flare pistol, before it melted, blew apart
or fell to pieces. The "standard" modern flare gun is "light-duty"
only. A shotgun shell is more powerful by far than a flare shell. They
are, however, the same size, I believe.




Actually, flares of this type, are shorter than std 12ga shells, and
thus, most of the plastic doodads won't chamber a 12ga shell. Then this
company in Mexico (I think) started making mini length 12ga shells...

But the plastic flare projectors would last just long enough to blow up
in your hand. No way could the barrel or breech contain that pressure
level.

snip


--
Jim Richardson http://www.eskimo.com/~warlock
To err is human...to really foul up requires the root password.

From what I understand a flare will generally bounce off the chest of a
person. Not a good weapon. You can purchase an insert that will
accomodate a .410 shell to be used in a 25mm flaregun, but not the
cheezy plastic flare guns.

Doug
s/v Callista

"Steve Schwartz" wrote in message ...
I have a little flare pistol on my boat (in New York State, Lake Ontario). I believe this is required by US Coast Guard. I was told by West Marine that we cannot take these to Canada as they are "weapons." Is this true? Can this pistol be used as a weapon? Can it shoot regular shot gun shells? Are the flare shells lethal? Is it a danger to anyone? Does anyone know anything about this? I'd appreciate any info?

--
Steve

I think that was a parachute flare, AKA rocket that they used in that movie.
Still doubt it would have the effect in real life as it did in the cinema.

If you tried to fire a regular 12 gage shell in a flare gun, I bet you'd
lose your hand when it blew up. It would be about the same as if you just
held the shell in a pair of vice grips and hit the primer with a hammer.
Someone used to make a metal sleeve for this purpose though. You just
inserted it into the plastic barrell and it supposedly was strong enough for
you to fire a 12 gage shell. Don't know where you could find one though.

I suppose in a pinch it's better than nothing, but if somebody is coming at
you armed, it'd probably just **** them off and make them kill you.

--


Keith
__
Learn from the mistakes of others. You won't live long enough to make all of
them yourself.


It was in the movie "Dead Calm", but I won't spoil the ending for you.
Sure, why not? Those shells are powerful enough to get to a couple of
hundred feet up, so I bet getting one in the nads at close range would
compromise fatherhood and lead to a blinding headache. Also, I recall
that older flare pistols were metal and generally heavier. They might
be able to take a real 12-gauge shotgun shell, and thus would make a
plausible weapon. Lousy aim, though.


Can it shoot regular shot gun shells?