Suuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuure. I beleive you -NOT!

Hahhahahahah

Cheers MC

Scout wrote:

hey, we don't have those in philly, whatsamattafayou?
Scout

"The_navigator_©"
wrote in message
...
!!!

what has happened to the neighbourhood!

Cheers MC

Same thing happened to me, only it was in a gay biker bar in Philly



I have been nearly struck 3 times...thrown to the ground once...

Is that any way to talk about the Oz family home?

Cheers MC

Oz1 wrote:

On Thu, 10 Jul 2003 22:20:04 +0930, Flying Tadpole
wrote:



Well I was, for a while, witht the original Flying Tadpole. But
trying to sail her on the middle harbour was a nightmare, as all
the gin palaces would rush over to get a close look. In the end
we gave up and just terrorised the canoes in Iron Cove, which was
our home ground anyway (Rozelle loony bin and all).

Flying Tadpole



I thought you'd always been a mexican.
My sister lived in Maida St Lilyfield.
Right opposite the nut factory.


Oz1...of the 3 twins.
I welcome you to crackerbox palace,We've been expecting you.

Explain why so many cats break up and sink after capsize?

Cheers MC

Jonathan Ganz wrote:

Wrong again Neal. A mono will right it self to be sure.
Occasionally, on the bottom. The catamaran won't
right it self, but it'll still be floating. Also, you don't have
to washing machine effect in a cat. If you flip, you stay
flipped. If you prepare for that possibility, survivability
goes way up, because you can stay with the boat. You
don't need to purchase an expensive liferaft. The boat
becomes the liferaft, as it should.

"Simple Simon" wrote in message
...


IN EVERY WAY THAT MATTERS, I should have said.
The items you listed like limited cabin space, small cockpits
etc. don't matter to real sailors. As a matter of fact limited
cabin space is better and a small cockpit is better as far
as real sailors are concerned. We don't want a floating
condo or a condo ashore for that matter like you lubbers
do. We want something safe and secure in which to sail.

Any multi-hull is markedly inferior as far as seaworthiness
is concerned compared to a proper monomaran. The reason
for this is well known and is because as proper monomaran
will recover from a capsize while a multimaran will remain
upside down. Try sailing an upside-down boat sometime,
that is, if you live through the violent turning and jarring that
occurs from the cornerish nature of a multimaran.

Your example of tens of thousands of cruising cats
is 'ludicrisp' (Mike Tysonspeak). It proves your lubberly
proclivities. Why else would the mention of 'folding' even
be imagined. One need only fold when one places a
cat near shore or ashore.

Priorities, lubberboy, priorities!

"Jeff Morris" jeffmo@NoSpam-sv-lokiDOTcom wrote in message


...


Superior in every way? Are you daft?

Tris have a few advantages over cats: they tack better, they're usually


faster in light


air, there are some very neat folding designs. But overall, they don't


make it as a


cruising boat. Perhaps you've noticed that tens of thousands of


cruising cats have been


built, but there are virtually no cruising tris.

A few reasons: they bounce back and forth on the amas, they have limited


visibility,


they're hard to get into, they have limited cabin space, the cockpit is


usually very


small. When they are overloaded they become dangerous. These are not


drawbacks for a


racing boat, but they certainly don't help a cruiser.

On top of this, tris are much easier to capsize than cats; in fact the


vast majority of


multihull capsizes are tris.

Once again you've demonstrated a complete lack of understanding on the


topic. At least


you're consistent.

-jeff


"Simple Simon" wrote in message
...


Tris are superior to cats in every way.

"Oz1" wrote in message


...


But a tri is OK!

You just shrunk CM

Cheers MC

Capt. Mooron wrote:

You were always 10 feet tall in my opinion Taddy..... but I doubt I'm a
news group heavy.

CM

"Flying Tadpole" wrote in message
...
| At last! Finally!! A newsgroup heavy accepts that I'm more than
| ten feet tall!!! Now all I gotta do is get this here mirror
| right....
|
| Flying Tadpole
|
| "Capt. Mooron" wrote:
|
| The beauty of sailing in a shallow pond is the option to walk home if
the
| boat sinks.....
|
| CM
|
| "Flying Tadpole" wrote in message
| ...
| | I don't. I'm always tethered to a boat with full positive
| | buoyancy. I did start to wonder whether to stick one on Sunday
| | last, though. Especially when I mistimed a tack and the horizon
| | appeared under the bow, followed by shipping it brown over the
| | deck...
| |
| | FT
| |
| | "Capt. Mooron" wrote:
| |
| | You should have them on at all times while underway anyway.....
| |
| | CM
| |
| | "Njord" wrote in message
| | news:B2XOa.11$ob1.3@lakeread07...
| | | No one mentioned it yet, but I think it would be a good idea to
don
| life
| | | jackets. Hopefully, you won't need them, but it is better to put
them
| on
| | and
| | | not need them then to not put them on an wish you had. If you have
the
| | room,
| | | you might also consider coming off the wind on a beam or broad
reach
| to
| | | reduce the apparent wind.
| | |
| | | --
| | |
| | | Njord
| | |
| | | I must go down to the seas again, for the call of the running tide
| | | Is a wild call and a clear call that may not be denied;
| | | And all I ask is a windy day with the white clouds flying,
| | | And the flung spray and the blown spume, and the sea-gulls crying.
| | |
| | | From Sea-Fever by John Masefield
| | |
| | |

That's survival in a cat? Sheesh -most monos would havejust sailed on.

Cheers MC

Jonathan Ganz wrote:

No way. You can always use the emergency hatch, and boats
are rarely air tight, especially after getting flipped.

I talked to a guy who survived a hurricane in a catamaran.
He was one of four people on a Venisia 43 (I believe) off
of Belize when they got caught. He was below when the
cat flipped. Somehow he had the presence of mind to lash
himself to something and survived. The other three were
washed away (harnesses and jacklines all) "above." I don't
think he ever fully recovered from the experience. Apparently,
the force of the water rushing through the hull was enough to
strip him of his clothes and give him road rash over most of
his body.

"Simple Simon" wrote in message
...


That air inside there gets depleted of oxygen pretty fast
and is a death trap.


"Jonathan Ganz" wrote in message


...


Try living on the inside, not the outside. There have been
several documented cases of people doing that. Most monos
when holed, sink... unless it's a fine vessel like yours, which
has so much foam in it that you can't sit below.

"Simple Simon" wrote in message
...


Any decent monomaran will not sink because it gets rolled
360 degrees. The structure is strong enough to withstand
this treatment without taking on significant quantities of water.

The myth about it is better to be upside down and afloat
than right side up on the bottom is just that - myth. Try living
on the outside of the hulls on an upside down multihull some
time. You will not think it is such a great thing to be sure.


"Jonathan Ganz" wrote in message


...


Wrong again Neal. A mono will right it self to be sure.
Occasionally, on the bottom. The catamaran won't
right it self, but it'll still be floating. Also, you don't have
to washing machine effect in a cat. If you flip, you stay
flipped. If you prepare for that possibility, survivability
goes way up, because you can stay with the boat. You
don't need to purchase an expensive liferaft. The boat
becomes the liferaft, as it should.

"Simple Simon" wrote in message
.. .


IN EVERY WAY THAT MATTERS, I should have said.
The items you listed like limited cabin space, small cockpits
etc. don't matter to real sailors. As a matter of fact limited
cabin space is better and a small cockpit is better as far
as real sailors are concerned. We don't want a floating
condo or a condo ashore for that matter like you lubbers
do. We want something safe and secure in which to sail.

Any multi-hull is markedly inferior as far as seaworthiness
is concerned compared to a proper monomaran. The reason
for this is well known and is because as proper monomaran
will recover from a capsize while a multimaran will remain
upside down. Try sailing an upside-down boat sometime,
that is, if you live through the violent turning and jarring that
occurs from the cornerish nature of a multimaran.

Your example of tens of thousands of cruising cats
is 'ludicrisp' (Mike Tysonspeak). It proves your lubberly
proclivities. Why else would the mention of 'folding' even
be imagined. One need only fold when one places a
cat near shore or ashore.

Priorities, lubberboy, priorities!

"Jeff Morris" jeffmo@NoSpam-sv-lokiDOTcom wrote in message


...


Superior in every way? Are you daft?

Tris have a few advantages over cats: they tack better, they're


usually


faster in light


air, there are some very neat folding designs. But overall,


they


don't


make it as a


cruising boat. Perhaps you've noticed that tens of thousands of


cruising cats have been


built, but there are virtually no cruising tris.

A few reasons: they bounce back and forth on the amas, they have


limited


visibility,


they're hard to get into, they have limited cabin space, the


cockpit


is


usually very


small. When they are overloaded they become dangerous. These


are


not


drawbacks for a


racing boat, but they certainly don't help a cruiser.

On top of this, tris are much easier to capsize than cats; in


fact


the


vast majority of


multihull capsizes are tris.

Once again you've demonstrated a complete lack of understanding


on


the


topic. At least


you're consistent.

-jeff


"Simple Simon" wrote in message
.. .


Tris are superior to cats in every way.

"Oz1" wrote in message


news:jd5pgvc5edr9arhr85tje6hgoutco9utdl@4ax .com...


But a tri is OK!

"Oz1" wrote in message ...

It's rare for a cruising multi to break up and sink.

It's even more rare for a cruising multi to cruise.

It is also rare for a cruising mono to break up and sink. In fact, they
often are found with no-one aboard. I've never heard of that being the
case for a multi. Once a cat gets flipped the loads on the bridge
structure get really enormous due to water in the hulls and 'suction' on
them. This will lead to structural failure PDQ in a storm and that is
why they'll sink. Give a good monohull anytime for survivability.

Cheers MC



Oz1 wrote:

On Fri, 11 Jul 2003 10:32:55 +1200, The_navigator_©
wrote:



Explain why so many cats break up and sink after capsize?

Cheers MC



Nah, you've got it all wrong.
They break up, capsize, break up some more and then scatter or sink.

Thing is the ones you hear of are usually racing bred and going twice
as fast as an equivalent mono.

It's rare for a cruising multi to break up and sink.


Oz1...of the 3 twins.
I welcome you to crackerbox palace,We've been expecting you.

Unfortunately, you're not far from the truth. Many people
overload them to the point of being dangerous. Monos
are less likely to be overloaded.

"Simple Simon" wrote in message
...

"Oz1" wrote in message
...

It's rare for a cruising multi to break up and sink.

It's even more rare for a cruising multi to cruise.

It happened in the 1979 Fastnet race. At least one multi was
found with no one onboard.
"The_navigator_©" wrote in message ...
It is also rare for a cruising mono to break up and sink. In fact, they often are found with no-one aboard. I've never heard of that being the case for a multi. Once a cat gets flipped the loads on the bridge structure get really enormous due to water in the hulls and 'suction' on them. This will lead to structural failure PDQ in a storm and that is why they'll sink. Give a good monohull anytime for survivability.

Cheers MC



Oz1 wrote:

On Fri, 11 Jul 2003 10:32:55 +1200, The_navigator_©
wrote:

Explain why so many cats break up and sink after capsize?

Cheers MC

Nah, you've got it all wrong.
They break up, capsize, break up some more and then scatter or sink.

Thing is the ones you hear of are usually racing bred and going twice
as fast as an equivalent mono.

It's rare for a cruising multi to break up and sink.


Oz1...of the 3 twins.
I welcome you to crackerbox palace,We've been expecting you.

Really? Can you name the boat?

Cheers MC

Jonathan Ganz wrote:

It happened in the 1979 Fastnet race. At least one multi was
found with no one onboard.

"The_navigator_©"
wrote in message
...
It is also rare for a cruising mono to break up and sink. In fact,
they often are found with no-one aboard. I've never heard of that
being the case for a multi. Once a cat gets flipped the loads on
the bridge structure get really enormous due to water in the hulls
and 'suction' on them. This will lead to structural failure PDQ in
a storm and that is why they'll sink. Give a good monohull anytime
for survivability.

Cheers MC



Oz1 wrote:

On Fri, 11 Jul 2003 10:32:55 +1200, The_navigator_©
wrote:



Explain why so many cats break up and sink after capsize?

Cheers MC



Nah, you've got it all wrong.
They break up, capsize, break up some more and then scatter or sink.

Thing is the ones you hear of are usually racing bred and going twice
as fast as an equivalent mono.

It's rare for a cruising multi to break up and sink.


Oz1...of the 3 twins.
I welcome you to crackerbox palace,We've been expecting you.