Another quality boat manufacturer sells out.
 

Short Wave Sportfishing wrote:
On Mon, 05 Nov 2007 17:10:00 -0600, Vic Smith
wrote:

On Mon, 05 Nov 2007 23:01:52 GMT, Short Wave Sportfishing
wrote:

On Mon, 05 Nov 2007 16:35:20 -0500, HK wrote:

I have no objection to modern materials in the hull, but I'd not buy any
boat with foam in between the hull skins.
Why?
I've read that pounding eventually destroys the foam's
structure/strength, leading to excessive hull flex.
Yep. That's what I remember reading.

I've heard that before, but I'm not at all sure that it is true with
closed cell foam.

I saw a 12 year old Ranger 318 VS when it was being cut up and the
foam flotation looked brand new.

Fresh water bass boats don't take much of a pounding. Besides, they have
low sides. Further, we're not talking about flotation.

Another quality boat manufacturer sells out.
 

Vic Smith wrote:
On Mon, 05 Nov 2007 23:01:52 GMT, Short Wave Sportfishing
wrote:

On Mon, 05 Nov 2007 16:35:20 -0500, HK wrote:

I have no objection to modern materials in the hull, but I'd not buy any
boat with foam in between the hull skins.
Why?

I've read that pounding eventually destroys the foam's
structure/strength, leading to excessive hull flex.
Yep. That's what I remember reading.

--Vic

There's that, there's the thinner skins on each side, there's the water
that can get between the foam and the skins when the skins work...

Another quality boat manufacturer sells out.
 

On Mon, 5 Nov 2007 16:42:14 -0500, " JimH" ask penned the
following well considered thoughts to the readers of rec.boats:

|
|"Gene Kearns" wrote in message
.. .
| On Mon, 5 Nov 2007 14:02:00 -0500, " JimH" ask penned the
| following well considered thoughts to the readers of rec.boats:
|
|
|"Reginald P. Smithers III" wrote in message
om...
| HK wrote:
| Capt John wrote:
| On Nov 3, 6:29 pm, HK wrote:
| Just read that Albemarle was bought out by Brunswick. Another famous
| line goes in the crapper. Cabo was sold last year. Sad to see the
| independents disappearing, since they build the best boats.
|
| I can't say I blame them, with the price of fuel, the future is very
| cloudy. Powerboating was very much a middle class activity. Sure, the
| really big boats are owned by the wealthy, but the vast majority of
| boat owners are middle class. Crazy fuel prices are starting to push
| the middle class out of boating.
|
| If I owned a business that was very much dependant on middle class
| incomes. And the business started to change, pushing the operating
| cost of my product beyond that which my customer base can afford,
| driving increasing numbers of those customers away. And someone came
| along and offered me a good price for that business, I'd probably take
| the money and run.
|
| John
|
|
| Oh, I don't *blame* Albemarle for selling out, but the likelihood is
| that
| the product that emerges in the years to come will no longer be an
| "Albemarle." It'll be the product of the MBAs and accountants, and
| therefore the probability is, it will be crap, because that is what
| MBAs
| and accountants produce.
|
| Some decades ago, an ad and pr company I worked for had a client that,
| at
| that time, was the largest and most successful FHA-VA mortgage banker
| in
| the country. We liked the company and its management a lot, so much so
| that the owner of the company and I (I was the chief account exec and
| writer) bought some stock. It was traded O-T-C at the time, for about
| $4.00 a share.
|
| Lo and behold, a giant NY-based financial institution offer the
| founders
| $35 a share for the stock. Too good an offer to turn down. We all
| cashed
| in to the limits of our holdings, of course. I made a few bucks and was
| happy to do so.
|
| Well, the new owners simply didn't understand the market for the
| acquisition and in a few years, it sold the company off to someone
| else,
| after most of its value (which was mainly in good will and very
| competent
| staff in about 20 U.S. markets). The company disappeared, along with
| the
| service it had provided. The big institution's MBAs turned the mortgage
| company into crap.
|
| The family that started the mortgage company, the guys who cashed out,
| stayed active in business. A large regional bank in our market was
| about
| to be shut down by the FDIC, and the guys, over the course of ONE
| weekend, put together enough cash to take over the bank with the FDIC's
| blessing. Bank opened Monday with a new name and new management.
| No MBAs involved.
|
| Hatteras no longer is a premier manufacturer of top-end sportfishing
| boats. Cabo no longer has its edge. Albemarle is going to become just
| another nameplate.
|
| Sad to see, whatever the reasons.
|
|
|
| Who is the premier mfg'er of top-end sportfishing boats who has retained
| it's edge.
|
|
|Tiara
|
|http://www.tiarayachts.com/Brix?pageID=168
|
|
| It is sorta hard to take a "sportfisher" made in Michigan
| seriously.... and from the number I see around here, I must not be the
| only person to have that opinion.
|
|Why? Is there no sport fishing on any other body of water other than the
|Atlantic Ocean?

I've heard rumors of some small amount engaged in on the Pacific, but
have always been leery of same. Sort of like tostitos in Kansas.....

--

Grady-White Gulfstream, out of Oak Island, NC.

Homepage
http://pamandgene.idleplay.net/

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Another quality boat manufacturer sells out.
 

Wayne.B wrote:
On Mon, 05 Nov 2007 14:44:47 -0500, HK wrote:

My first sailboat on the Bay was from the wonderful folks who brought us
Tiara. S2 9.2. Just under 30', and a wide-bodied slowpoke. But it was
easy to sail.

It's hard to imagine you in an old slow boat like that. Our old slow
GB will run circles around a 30 ft sailboat, and do it with a great
deal more comfort.


It was only a year old when I bought it and as I posted, it was easy to
sail, and fun, too.

Sitting in an oversized old tub of a GB is not my kind of boating. It
wasn't then, and it isn't now.

Another quality boat manufacturer sells out.
 

On Mon, 05 Nov 2007 17:07:41 -0500, HK wrote:

Absolutely, although 700 hp is about the norm for an offshore sportfish
boat of that size. The engines will be about $18,000 each through
Parker, I would guess. That would be the fully rigged price. $36,000 for
the pair. I wonder what a pair of new 350 hp diesels, fully rigged,
with transmissions, goes for these days? Let's say...$80,000+, or a
$44,000 difference. It's going to take a hell of a lot of diesel
efficiency to make that up!

Well, lets run the numbers just for the fun of it. Your price
estimate is in the ball park so let's figure out what the payback is
over 5 years or so. Assuming the diesels will return 50% of their
extra cost on resale, the number to meet is $22,000.

With the pair of big OBs the boat will burn about 50 gph, 25 gph with
diesels. Gas at the marina is about $4, diesel about $3, cost per
hour $200 gas, $75 diesel, $125 delta.

$22,000 divided by $125 is 176 hours. That is the break even point.
If you use the boat more than 176 hours you are money ahead on
operating costs alone. Factor in the reliability and longevity of
diesels and you are way ahead if you use the boat regularly.

Another quality boat manufacturer sells out.
 

On Nov 5, 2:14?pm, HK wrote:
Chuck Gould wrote:
On Nov 5, 1:33?pm, HK wrote:
Chuck Gould wrote:
On Nov 5, 11:35?am, HK wrote:
Eisboch wrote:
"Chuck Gould" wrote in message
glegroups.com...
With crude oil well over $90/bbl and forecast to hit $100 by the end
of the year, we could easily see $4- $4-50 a gallon at gas stations
and
maybe $6 at fuel docks during next spring's annual gas gouge. If
boating is to survive as a pastime and if the manufacturers hope to
sell enough boats to survive, the industry has to get some weight out
of the boats without sacrificing strength. The solid, hand rolled
laminate hull is being supplanted with better alternatives, made
possible in part by vacuum infused molding.
Making boats lighter has more implications than saving a few bucks worth of
fuel.
Leave them heavy and drive slower, I say.
Eisboch
I love this line, since it is right out of the PR Department's
bullship-ometer:
"The solid, hand rolled laminate hull is being supplanted with better
alternatives..."
Right, of course.- Hide quoted text -
- Show quoted text -
I'm sure you consider Hinckley a piece of crap. None of their lobster
or picnic style boats would ever compare to yours, I'm certain of
that.
If you might be interested in a general description of how a well
respected E Coast boat is built, follow this link:
http://hinckleyyachts.com/home.html
Select "Under the Skin", and then select item 5 on the illustration.
Omigawd. Kevlar and carbon fiber composites! (Watch the video- see the
bagged hull). Better run over there quick, Harry, and let them know
they don't have the first clue about how to build a boat.
Obviously a solid, hand rolled, FRP hull would be vastly superior to
anything Hinckley is putting out.....right?
I thought we were discussing sal****er fishing boats.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

I thought I was responding to your comment that my remark (about
modern composite construction offering some opportunities to improve
upon traditional hand rolled rove and resin) "pegged the Bullship-o-
meter" and was straight off the PR desk. My response consists of an
observation that Hinckley, normally considered among today's finest
boat builders, uses a "composite", rather than hand rolled hull. No
bullship.

Chuck...I have no problems with "modern" composite hulls, so long as the
composite does not include foamboard or balsa.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Then why does a statement that modern composite construction is
supplanting traditional hand rolled rove and resin "peg the bullship-o-
meter"?

Another quality boat manufacturer sells out.
 

On Mon, 05 Nov 2007 16:55:46 -0500, HK wrote:

There haven't been any real "Bertrams" for years, just boats made by
successive companies that bought the Bertram name before, during and
after manufacturing started and stopped...Whittaker, Bertram Trojan,
Feretti and others have owned the name.

There are lots of used ones from the 80s still going strong. They are
such great boats that it pays to do a refurb on them and bring them
back to like new. You can buy a used 46 for 200K or so, put 2 or 300
into a complete refit and still be way ahead of a new boat of
comparable quality.

Another quality boat manufacturer sells out.
 

On Mon, 05 Nov 2007 19:37:32 -0500, HK wrote:

It's hard to imagine you in an old slow boat like that. Our old slow
GB will run circles around a 30 ft sailboat, and do it with a great
deal more comfort.


It was only a year old when I bought it and as I posted, it was easy to
sail, and fun, too.

Sitting in an oversized old tub of a GB is not my kind of boating. It
wasn't then, and it isn't now.

Sez the guy who's never tried it. :-)

Another quality boat manufacturer sells out.
 

On Mon, 5 Nov 2007 19:32:24 -0500, " JimH" ask wrote:

I've heard rumors of some small amount engaged in on the Pacific, but
have always been leery of same. Sort of like tostitos in Kansas.....



I guess I need to see your definition of 'sport fishing'.

You're not likely to be convinced but on the east coast it is commonly
meant to be "deep sea fishing", or going out off the continental shelf
to the "canyons". It takes a decent boat to go out there and back in
the windy conditions which frequently prevail.

Just my 2 cents worth.

Another quality boat manufacturer sells out.
 

On Mon, 05 Nov 2007 20:02:30 -0500, Wayne.B
wrote:

On Mon, 05 Nov 2007 16:55:46 -0500, HK wrote:

There haven't been any real "Bertrams" for years, just boats made by
successive companies that bought the Bertram name before, during and
after manufacturing started and stopped...Whittaker, Bertram Trojan,
Feretti and others have owned the name.

There are lots of used ones from the 80s still going strong. They are
such great boats that it pays to do a refurb on them and bring them
back to like new. You can buy a used 46 for 200K or so, put 2 or 300
into a complete refit and still be way ahead of a new boat of
comparable quality.

That's the way I've been thinking lately after seeing a '47 Post that
was refurbished.

I've seen a couple of insurance boats that would make good candidates
for this approach.