Reggie Smithers wrote:

My biggest concern with a long cruising trip in a 22' boat is it is too
damn small. If the Bayliner is in good shape, the Bayliner would
probably meet the criteria ( many more marinas today than 20 yrs ago),
but can you imagine many families or friends staying aboard a 22' boat
for longer than an overnighter?

A couple points here. First, the cabin and bunks on that 2252 are much
larger than found on most 22-footers. There is a huge difference in
interior space between that cuddy and the recently discussed Grady.
Second, the overall profile of the 2252 makes it easier to tow at
interstate speeds. Third, the Cortez is still very primitive in most
areas...but inexpensive air conditioned hotels *can* be found for
overnighting between legs.

Exploring in and on the Cortez is a real adventure in a small boat. One
I'd highly recommend for the less sedate among us. What is living for
anyway? And a final point...if not now, when? Think about it.

If Skipper still enjoys roughing it in a 22' boat for a week or two, I
say more power to him, but it would not be my preferred vacation. In my
younger days, I might have enjoy the adventure, today I would have to
pass. I would prefer to be pampered.

--
Skipper

Harry Krause wrote:

Skipper, your original challenge was based upon nothing more than your
ignorance and prejudice. It wasn't just that my aluminum trailer back in
those days was superior in engineering and construction to that Bayliner
galvanized Escort-brand trailer, it was that just about any trailer was
superior in engineering and construction to that Bayliner trailer.

You took umbrage at that, and started a multi-year rant on what you
believed was the "superiority" of Bayliners, a rant that made you look
like a blooming idiot. And still does.

The original challenge was established to resolve that disagreement. One
of us puked.

--
Skipper

Skipper wrote:
Reggie Smithers wrote:

My biggest concern with a long cruising trip in a 22' boat is it is too
damn small. If the Bayliner is in good shape, the Bayliner would
probably meet the criteria ( many more marinas today than 20 yrs ago),
but can you imagine many families or friends staying aboard a 22' boat
for longer than an overnighter?

A couple points here. First, the cabin and bunks on that 2252 are much
larger than found on most 22-footers. There is a huge difference in
interior space between that cuddy and the recently discussed Grady.
Second, the overall profile of the 2252 makes it easier to tow at
interstate speeds. Third, the Cortez is still very primitive in most
areas...but inexpensive air conditioned hotels *can* be found for
overnighting between legs.

Exploring in and on the Cortez is a real adventure in a small boat. One
I'd highly recommend for the less sedate among us. What is living for
anyway? And a final point...if not now, when? Think about it.

If Skipper still enjoys roughing it in a 22' boat for a week or two, I
say more power to him, but it would not be my preferred vacation. In my
younger days, I might have enjoy the adventure, today I would have to
pass. I would prefer to be pampered.

--
Skipper

Skipper,
I really enjoyed the web site you posted a week ago, and it would
definitely be a great place to cruise, but I would never do it on a 22'
powerboat, I would do it on a 36' -40' sailboat. If a Freedom Yacht was
available for charter ( http://www.freedomyachts.com/index.htm) I would
chose it, if not any sloop would be manageable for a couple or family.

For me, the benefit of a sailboat is the trip is part of the vacation,
in a powerboat the destination is important.

--
Reggie
************************************************** *************
That's my story and I am sticking to it.

************************************************** *************

JohnH wrote:

A well commissioned 2252 would outperform that Parker in this
challenge, IMO.

Another road I'll not go down again. Move on from this foolishness,
Snipper.

Have no intention to navigate this road again, Krause. It's just that
you were never told why I *knew* that Parker would come up short. Now
your know. No skin...right?

I asked you the question, you said it was due to ease of trailering a Grady
vs a Parker. I think they'd both be about the same regarding towing
difficulty, so that part of your challenge makes little sense.

When it comes to crossing the water, do you think the Grady would perform
better? Why? What is it about the Parker that you don't like?

Look, the Parker is a fine half-day fishing platform. However, for the
particular usage contemplated in The Challenge it comes up short. Take a
closer look at its weight, towing profile and *width* compared to the
Grady or 2252. If given the choice, which would you prefer to tow to
remote adventures.

--
Skipper

JohnH wrote:

I doubt if there's much difference between the Parker's cabin height and
the Grady's hardtop height. The beam would be a problem, though. Looks like
permits would be required.

There is a significant difference in the *towing profile* and weight of
the respective boats.

--
Skipper

JohnH wrote:

Based on the beam of the Parker, 9ft 6in, I'll grant that the overall
towing experience would be easier with the Grady. At least I wouldn't have
to get a permit for each state.

Now, lets get on the water. Between the two, which would be preferable for
the trip across the sea? Why?

You just can't underestimate the towability of the candidate boats. It's
the *major* factor in this adventure, not how they ride across the bay.
Both boats will do just fine on those waters. However, the Grady would
be my choice between these two in the hot summer months for obvious
reasons.

Most boaters do not find the Cortez the same ol' same 'ol. A Cortez
adventure is special on many levels. The diving is great, the fishing
even better. The atmosphere is friendly and layed back. A night cruise
over those waters is something to be remembered with the soft glow of
those highly phosphorescent waters, a glow that will burn into your
being. To really experience the Cortez, your own hull is required.

--
Skipper

Since no one has stepped up to accept your challenge, may I be the first to
congratulate you as the winner of the 10th annual Kansas to Cortez
challenge. Congrats Skipper.
Tow...Tow...Tow... your boat gently down the highway.

"Skipper" wrote in message
...
JohnH wrote:

A well commissioned 2252 would outperform that Parker in this
challenge, IMO.

Another road I'll not go down again. Move on from this foolishness,
Snipper.

Have no intention to navigate this road again, Krause. It's just that
you were never told why I *knew* that Parker would come up short. Now
your know. No skin...right?

I asked you the question, you said it was due to ease of trailering a
Grady
vs a Parker. I think they'd both be about the same regarding towing
difficulty, so that part of your challenge makes little sense.

When it comes to crossing the water, do you think the Grady would perform
better? Why? What is it about the Parker that you don't like?

Look, the Parker is a fine half-day fishing platform. However, for the
particular usage contemplated in The Challenge it comes up short. Take a
closer look at its weight, towing profile and *width* compared to the
Grady or 2252. If given the choice, which would you prefer to tow to
remote adventures.

--
Skipper

On Thu, 26 Jan 2006 07:20:51 -0500, Reggie Smithers
wrote:

JohnH wrote:
On Wed, 25 Jan 2006 19:13:43 -0500, " JimH" jimh_osudad@yahooDOT
comREMOVETHIS wrote:

"JohnH" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 25 Jan 2006 19:00:15 -0500, " JimH" jimh_osudad@yahooDOT
comREMOVETHIS wrote:

"JohnH" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 25 Jan 2006 17:30:59 -0600, Skipper wrote:

JohnH wrote:

The Gradys are wonderful boats. But the 228 is no match for my
Parker.
Now you're just making me feel bad. Not sure what you mean by 'no
match'.
Size wise, that's for sure. But, for a 22'er, it's got a *lot* of deck
room. I could force myself to get by!
Should one get the itch for *real* adventure, which would be the better
boat for a Cortez challenge?
I'd take the Parker, simply because it's bigger.
--
John H

******************************************
***** Have a Spectacular Day! *****
******************************************
Why not the 1985 22 foot Bayliner?

I don't have one. Otherwise I might give it a try.
--
John H

Take Skippy's advice and strap one or two 55 gallon drums filled with fuel
to increase your range. ;-)


Well, like I said, I don't have one. It appears that one could do a lot of
sightseeing and fishing with regular tanks. The towns don't appear to be
all that far apart.

http://www.cruisecortez.com/sancarloscruisingarea.htm
--
John H

******************************************
***** Have a Spectacular Day! *****
******************************************

My biggest concern with a long cruising trip in a 22' boat is it is too
damn small. If the Bayliner is in good shape, the Bayliner would
probably meet the criteria ( many more marinas today than 20 yrs ago),
but can you imagine many families or friends staying aboard a 22' boat
for longer than an overnighter?

If Skipper still enjoys roughing it in a 22' boat for a week or two, I
say more power to him, but it would not be my preferred vacation. In my
younger days, I might have enjoy the adventure, today I would have to
pass. I would prefer to be pampered on one of these ships

http://www.windjammer.com/fleet.html

or this one.

http://www.starclippers.com/ships_rc.html

I agree. I wouldn't buy a 22'er with plans for a long cruise. At most I'd
spend a weekend on the thing, but only if a decent motel wasn't available.
--
John H

******************************************
***** Have a Spectacular Day! *****
******************************************

On Thu, 26 Jan 2006 07:17:01 -0600, Skipper wrote:

Take a
closer look at its weight, towing profile and *width* compared to the
Grady or 2252. If given the choice, which would you prefer to tow to
remote adventures.

Frankly neither, that's way too long a tow for a short vacation in my
opinion. I towed a 5,000 lb 24 footer from Connecticut to Florida
when I moved here 3 years ago and I'm in no hurry to tow it that far
again.

Skipper wrote:
JohnH wrote:

A well commissioned 2252 would outperform that Parker in this
challenge, IMO.

Another road I'll not go down again. Move on from this foolishness,
Snipper.

Have no intention to navigate this road again, Krause. It's just that
you were never told why I *knew* that Parker would come up short. Now
your know. No skin...right?

I asked you the question, you said it was due to ease of trailering a Grady
vs a Parker. I think they'd both be about the same regarding towing
difficulty, so that part of your challenge makes little sense.

When it comes to crossing the water, do you think the Grady would perform
better? Why? What is it about the Parker that you don't like?

Look, the Parker is a fine half-day fishing platform. However, for the
particular usage contemplated in The Challenge it comes up short. Take a
closer look at its weight, towing profile and *width* compared to the
Grady or 2252. If given the choice, which would you prefer to tow to
remote adventures.

--
Skipper
Harry uses his Parker as a half-day fishing platform, so for his needs
it is a better boat. The Bayliner is an overnighter, where you can do
fishing off the transom, it definitely is not a fishing boat.

--
Reggie
************************************************** *************
That's my story and I am sticking to it.

************************************************** *************