"swatcop" wrote in message
...


I don't think that a fistfull of citations is the answer.....

Your supervisors might think citations are the answer, however. Of course,
there are never "quotas", per se. A friend with Nassau County Highway Patrol
(Long Island) use to respond to the quota question with "Hell no....there's
no quota. We can write as many as we want". (Huh???)

Clams Canino wrote:

Hi!

This might parrot what others said, but in my opinon the more you can hound
wreckless jet-ski's the better.

Why? Unless they are breaking a definite law, they have the same right
to be on the water as anyone else, regardless of how they may "annoy"
someone.



hehe And then of course wreckless boaters
in general.

OUI is important too, but use your head. A couple guys out in a rowboat with
a 5hp Jonnyrude, fishing, with a 12 pack in the cooler ain't the real big
problem, it's the speedboats with intoxicated operators that think they're
Mario Andretti. LOL.

If the guy in the rowboat with the 5HP engine puts in in a large bay
like the Chesapeake, which is home to megayachts, commercial ships, and
wind swept chop, then his judgement is impared.

Intoxicated operators is a no-brainer, but why the beef with speedboats?
I, like many performance boaters, like things in the fast lane. There
are many myths proliferated relating to operation at speed. Most are a
bunch of hot air.



Equipment checks are a good way to "bust balls" of someone you stopped for
operation. But to stop people *just* to do equipment checks is annoying as
all hell. There's enough strange operatoin out there to keep you busy.

Busting "balls" is one way to kindle resentment.


And as a personal favor. grin Older couples often don't have an extra
person to "spot" for the skiier.Yes, I know the law (in most states)
requires a spotter, but it's often just me and my wife. So I put a rearview
mirror on the boat and call the German shepard my spotter. A warning will do
just fine - as we're at least *trying* to get it right with the mirror.
Sometimes you just can't find a spotter without kidnapping someone - a worse
crime. Don't make me have to get a blow up doll.grin

My daughter is now becoming old enough to function as a spotter. So this
summer should see a resumption in my skiing and tubing activities. That
is, if the muscles in my back and legs can take it.....

Dave

"Dave Hall" wrote in message

Intoxicated operators is a no-brainer, but why the beef with speedboats?
I, like many performance boaters, like things in the fast lane. There
are many myths proliferated relating to operation at speed. Most are a
bunch of hot air.

I dissagree. Alcohol slows reaction time. The faster the boat, the more that
reaction time comes into play. My boat is plenty fast, and you won't find
me out on a busy lake with any measurable B.A.C.

The guy with the duel 454's and duel martini's scares me a *lot* more than
the dood with a rowboat and duel six-packs. My cousin was *killed* when a
hotboat overtook him from the rear and drove up over his stern. It's a fact
of math that more HP plus more alcohol = more risk.

(Now if I'm up at Charlies for the weekend, we might go out for a late night
"booze cruise" where we TROLL out to the middle of the lake, in sight of
camp, turn up the CD player and do some pretty serious drinking and then
TROLL back to the dock at 3am. Legal - no, but there's no boat traffic (or
Marine patroll) at 3am. The only thing that ever scared us was the sound of
a boat approaching fast at WOT at 2am, I looked at Charlie and said "if he's
as drunk as we are - that ******* could plow right into us" We started
blinking our lights and stuff to make sure we were seen. )

I don't have a beef with speedboats - I *like* hotboats and am a paid member
over at the Scream & Fly boards. I don't like boats going fast with
impaired operators. And I don't feel threatened by a little rowboat with a
trolling motor. I don't feel real threatened by those "party barges" either,
though some of them are starting to get way too much HP on the back.

I don't fish much, but all I'm saying is that (in my opinion) people that
troll, fish, and drink aren't the real problem out there - as compared to
people that drink and go fast - or drink and pull rope-toys.

If I see a guy in a rowboat with a pole and a beer I'd be likely to go by
and say "catch anything much today?" If I see a speedboat with an operator
with a beer I'd be likely to say "so how many beers you had today?" it's
called *discretion*.

-W

Clams Canino wrote:

"Dave Hall" wrote in message

Intoxicated operators is a no-brainer, but why the beef with speedboats?
I, like many performance boaters, like things in the fast lane. There
are many myths proliferated relating to operation at speed. Most are a
bunch of hot air.

I dissagree. Alcohol slows reaction time. The faster the boat, the more that
reaction time comes into play. My boat is plenty fast, and you won't find
me out on a busy lake with any measurable B.A.C.

Like I said, BUI is a no-brainer. But why tie BUI operators with
speedboats? You are coming off like you're stereotyping the typical
performance boater. I find that somewhat offensive. I don't drink
alchohol AT ALL when I boat.


The guy with the duel 454's and duel martini's scares me a *lot* more than
the dood with a rowboat and duel six-packs. My cousin was *killed* when a
hotboat overtook him from the rear and drove up over his stern. It's a fact
of math that more HP plus more alcohol = more risk.

Speed and alchohol don't mix, but neither are they surgically attached
at the hip.

I don't fish much, but all I'm saying is that (in my opinion) people that
troll, fish, and drink aren't the real problem out there - as compared to
people that drink and go fast - or drink and pull rope-toys.

It's all a matter of perspective. I don't excuse someone because their
potential for injury is less, as they recklessly disregard the law. In
reality, you're probably right, but it's no excuse to form a bias
against a particular segment of the boating sport.


If I see a guy in a rowboat with a pole and a beer I'd be likely to go by
and say "catch anything much today?" If I see a speedboat with an operator
with a beer I'd be likely to say "so how many beers you had today?" it's
called *discretion*.

In some circles that might be considered "profiling".

Dave

"Dave Hall" wrote in message
...


Like I said, BUI is a no-brainer. But why tie BUI operators with
speedboats? You are coming off like you're stereotyping the typical
performance boater. I find that somewhat offensive.

I'm surprised. You, Dave "I wish I was a Vulcan" Hall should see the logic
here. If a speedboater's a mile away and not breaking any rules about speed,
wake or channel, nobody cares and nobody notices. If he's drunk and hits a
wave the wrong way, flipping the boat and killing everyone onboard, so what?

But, here's a REAL LIFE SCENARIO that I see just about every time I take my
boat out: There are a few areas where boats commonly anchor, at least a mile
or two from the channel, and usually behind islands. Very fast boats, which
have the whole world to play in, come flying past these groups of boats,
sometimes as close as 100', and the same boats sometimes do it repeatedly,
as if they just want to be seen.

Now, let's pretend that these boats made absolutely no wake, and that there
was no speed limit in the area. So, they're breaking no laws. But: A
mechanical or operator failure at high speeds could cause quite a disaster
if that boat is too close to other boats. Therefore (and here comes the
logic, Dave), it is perfectly reasonable to assume that someone doing this
is exercising very poor judgement, and might very well be drunk. Whether
they're breaking any laws or not, they deserve a visit from the authorities.

In a motor vehicle, vague offenses are routinely put in the "reckless
driving" category. It's not a problem. You know that.

Dave Hall wrote:

Clams Canino wrote:

"Dave Hall" wrote in message

Intoxicated operators is a no-brainer, but why the beef with speedboats?
I, like many performance boaters, like things in the fast lane. There
are many myths proliferated relating to operation at speed. Most are a
bunch of hot air.

I dissagree. Alcohol slows reaction time. The faster the boat, the more that
reaction time comes into play. My boat is plenty fast, and you won't find
me out on a busy lake with any measurable B.A.C.

Like I said, BUI is a no-brainer. But why tie BUI operators with
speedboats? You are coming off like you're stereotyping the typical
performance boater. I find that somewhat offensive. I don't drink
alchohol AT ALL when I boat.


Wish you boated in my waters with your obnoxiously loud boat. I'd have
you cited every time you drove by...



--
Email sent to is never read.

"Dave Hall" wrote in message
...
Clams Canino wrote:

Hi!

This might parrot what others said, but in my opinon the more you can
hound
wreckless jet-ski's the better.

Why? Unless they are breaking a definite law, they have the same right
to be on the water as anyone else, regardless of how they may "annoy"
someone.

Sometimes they have miles of water to play in, but they congregate around
anchored boats whose owners simply want a little peace and quiet. They may
not be breaking a law by doing that, but it's absolutely obnoxious. There's
nothing wrong with a cop teaching them some manners, since their parents
obviously forgot. You know this. Stop baiting the assembled audience.


If the guy in the rowboat with the 5HP engine puts in in a large bay
like the Chesapeake, which is home to megayachts, commercial ships, and
wind swept chop, then his judgement is impared.

If the guy in the small boat plants himself near a channel, he's made a
choice. If he plants himself miles from a channel and some asshole in a 50
ft boat chooses to come within 200 ft and throw an enormous wake, it's
obnoxious. Again, there's nothing wrong with a cop pulling him over for a
little chat. You know this. Stop baiting the assembled audience.


Intoxicated operators is a no-brainer, but why the beef with speedboats?
I, like many performance boaters, like things in the fast lane. There
are many myths proliferated relating to operation at speed. Most are a
bunch of hot air.

Like jetski operators, speedboats sometimes they have miles of water to play
in, but they congregate around anchored boats whose owners simply want a
little peace and quiet. They may not be breaking a law by doing that, but
it's absolutely obnoxious. Some people go boating for the quiet. Some people
go boating for the excitement. They have to allow for each other. You know
this. Stop baiting the assembled audience.

It's interesting, isn't it? This is such a simple thing that I can use most
of the same words to help you in all 3 cases.

Doug Kanter wrote:

"Dave Hall" wrote in message
...
Clams Canino wrote:

Hi!

This might parrot what others said, but in my opinon the more you can
hound
wreckless jet-ski's the better.

Why? Unless they are breaking a definite law, they have the same right
to be on the water as anyone else, regardless of how they may "annoy"
someone.

Sometimes they have miles of water to play in, but they congregate around
anchored boats whose owners simply want a little peace and quiet. They may
not be breaking a law by doing that, but it's absolutely obnoxious.

Agreed. But encouraging a LEO to "hound them" simply becasue you don't
like what they do, is not legal.

There's
nothing wrong with a cop teaching them some manners, since their parents
obviously forgot.

It's not a cop's place to "teach manners". His place is to enforce
existing laws. If there is no law that prohibits a jetski from
frequenting the same are of a the water, the cop has no right to hassle
the PWC operator.


If the guy in the rowboat with the 5HP engine puts in in a large bay
like the Chesapeake, which is home to megayachts, commercial ships, and
wind swept chop, then his judgement is impared.

If the guy in the small boat plants himself near a channel, he's made a
choice.

Right, a bad one.


If he plants himself miles from a channel and some asshole in a 50
ft boat chooses to come within 200 ft and throw an enormous wake, it's
obnoxious. Again, there's nothing wrong with a cop pulling him over for a
little chat. You know this. Stop baiting the assembled audience.

Again, if you can cite the specific law that's been broken, that's one
thing. Otherwise, making judgement calls based on personal opinion, is
not within the purview of the LEO. Perhaps you favor the cops randomly
pulling over certain cars, which display certain behavioral traits which
*might* be offensive. Some people might call that profiling.


Intoxicated operators is a no-brainer, but why the beef with speedboats?
I, like many performance boaters, like things in the fast lane. There
are many myths proliferated relating to operation at speed. Most are a
bunch of hot air.

Like jetski operators, speedboats sometimes they have miles of water to play
in, but they congregate around anchored boats whose owners simply want a
little peace and quiet.

Really? A guy who spends $100K on a flashy Fountain, is going to spend
his time running circles around a bunch of anchored boats? You must boat
in a really strange place. Usually, the only time larger boats run like
this is when they are pulling water toys. It just so happens that some
of the best coves for anchoring, are also the calmest coves for skiing.

Maybe you should reconsider your choice of place to enjoy "peace and
quiet". Anchoring adjacent to a transient channel, and attempting to
complain when people pass by, is a bit ridiculous.


They may not be breaking a law by doing that, but
it's absolutely obnoxious. Some people go boating for the quiet. Some people
go boating for the excitement. They have to allow for each other. You know
this.

Being "obnoxious" is not illegal. Bad taste maybe. Poor manners, likely.
Bad judgement, probably. Oblivious of their affects, most likely. But
illegal, no.

Stop baiting the assembled audience.

I'm not "baiting" anyone. I'm just illustrating the line which exists
between the law, and people's personal opinions. There is no law
protecting anyone from being "annoyed" by the actions of another. This
is a free country (more or less) and people have the right to pursue
their leisure activities, provided that those actions do not pose a
danger to the health and safety of the general population, or are not
expressly prohibited by specific laws.


Dave

More often than you may realize, cops have to deal with situations which
involve no violation of the law. But, smart cops show up anyway because they
know that if they don't, they'll have a REAL problem on their hands
otherwise.

You may want to ask a cop about this next thing, but I know you're not too
keen on getting involved with your local public servants.

Forget hostage situations. Forget armed robbers. Forget bomb scares. What is
the most dangerous and unpredictable situation for which cops are called
regularly? Hint: 99% of the time, it initially involves no laws being
broken.

"Dave Hall" wrote in message
...

Doug Kanter wrote:
Sometimes they have miles of water to play in, but they congregate
around
anchored boats whose owners simply want a little peace and quiet. They
may
not be breaking a law by doing that, but it's absolutely obnoxious.

Agreed. But encouraging a LEO to "hound them" simply becasue you don't
like what they do, is not legal.

Ya know, it's like pulling teeth with you. For anyone else, an implied
meaning is sufficient. For you, things need to be spelled out. Here we go -
add these pieces together and see what you come up with, Socrates:

1) Much of the time, a cop will pull someone over because they're driving
strangely. Sometimes, the driver is drunk, so the external observation was
correct.

2) If someone goes down a narrow residential street doing 75mph, he is
clearly a fool. Forget the speed limit. It's safe to say his judgement is
impaired in some way.

3) If someone repeatedly buzzes at high speed within 200 feet of a bunch of
boats which are anchored, when there's no other reason for him to be in that
place, external observation is all you need in order to decide that his
judgement is impaired.

4) Relative to #3, above, there is no harbor, no channel, no nothing. No
reason for the idiot to be doing what he's doing except that he's either
oblivious to he anchored boats or he's intentionally doing it to annoy
people with noise and wake. A cop has every reason in the world to stop that
boat and ask some questions.


There's
nothing wrong with a cop teaching them some manners, since their parents
obviously forgot.

It's not a cop's place to "teach manners". His place is to enforce
existing laws. If there is no law that prohibits a jetski from
frequenting the same are of a the water, the cop has no right to hassle
the PWC operator.

Sometimes, cops don't need laws. But in ALL cases, they have mandates. In
other words, there are things that citizens might WANT the cops to do, which
are not spelled out by laws. This happens all the time, Dave. Got a rash of
burglaries on your street? Got 50 houses on your street? Get a petition from
half the owners which says you want the cops to stop cars which seem to be
meandering aimlessly, just looking around. It's called a mandate. There's no
law against going to slow in a 30mph zone, but the cops will still show up
and make themselves a pain in the ass if you ask them to.


If the guy in the rowboat with the 5HP engine puts in in a large bay
like the Chesapeake, which is home to megayachts, commercial ships,
and
wind swept chop, then his judgement is impared.

If the guy in the small boat plants himself near a channel, he's made a
choice.

Right, a bad one.

Spelled out for you: He has no business complaining about wakes and noise if
he anchors in or near a busy channel.



If he plants himself miles from a channel and some asshole in a 50
ft boat chooses to come within 200 ft and throw an enormous wake, it's
obnoxious. Again, there's nothing wrong with a cop pulling him over for
a
little chat. You know this. Stop baiting the assembled audience.

Again, if you can cite the specific law that's been broken, that's one
thing. Otherwise, making judgement calls based on personal opinion, is
not within the purview of the LEO. Perhaps you favor the cops randomly
pulling over certain cars, which display certain behavioral traits which
*might* be offensive. Some people might call that profiling.

When citizens want that to happen, it's called a mandate. A few years back,
it was alleged that NYC police were taking known gang members into alleys
and giving them a little tune-up. Investigators couldn't find any good
citizens from the neighborhood to discuss it. It was a mandate they'd
requested.


Intoxicated operators is a no-brainer, but why the beef with
speedboats?
I, like many performance boaters, like things in the fast lane. There
are many myths proliferated relating to operation at speed. Most are a
bunch of hot air.

Like jetski operators, speedboats sometimes they have miles of water to
play
in, but they congregate around anchored boats whose owners simply want a
little peace and quiet.

Really? A guy who spends $100K on a flashy Fountain, is going to spend
his time running circles around a bunch of anchored boats? You must boat
in a really strange place. Usually, the only time larger boats run like
this is when they are pulling water toys. It just so happens that some
of the best coves for anchoring, are also the calmest coves for skiing.

On a good trout stream, some of the best places to fish are sometimes taken
by a couple of other guys. I move to another place. Sometimes the best place
to take my son tubing is occupied by someone pulling a skiier. I find
another place, rather than worry about a collision.


Maybe you should reconsider your choice of place to enjoy "peace and
quiet". Anchoring adjacent to a transient channel, and attempting to
complain when people pass by, is a bit ridiculous.

Who said anything about a transient channel?