Gun control deal done
 

In article , says...

"J Herring" wrote in message
...

On Thu, 11 Apr 2013 08:19:36 -0400, "Eisboch" wrote:

-------------------------------------------------

Are you saying that right also extends to convicted felons, people
with serious mental health issues, alcoholics and drug addicts?


The Constitution does not exclude them.

But then again, a convicted felon forfeited some of his rights. Those
with serious mental health
issues could easily be considered a danger to themselves and/or
society. Alcoholics and drug
addicts? How would that he controlled. I doubt if AA or NA are going
to provide lists of members.
And besides, members don't 'sign up' or register to be a member.

--------------------------------------

I don't know about other states but the gun permit application in MA
has specific questions regarding drug addiction and/or a history of
"habitual drunkenness" or treatment for alcohol abuse. There's a
reason for that. I believe answering in the affirmative will
disqualify the applicant for a permit. They may qualify following a
treatment program and a doctor's statement that the person has
successfully been drug or alcohol free for a period of 5 years. Both
addictions are considered to be mental health issues.

Your problem is that you are wanting someon to:

Step 1: We admitted we were powerless over alcohol/drugs - that our lives had become
unmanageable.

If you are an alocoholic and drug abuser and you haven't accepted the above you are
truthfully answering the questions on the form.

Having had some up close and personal experience in the past year with
an alcoholic who we were finally able to get into a program for
recovery, I can completely support that restriction. Drug and
alcohol addiction can totally change a person into someone you would
never recognize.

You are lucky you got that person in to a program. The problem you now have is relapses. Part
of the mantra of AA and its direclty affiliated programs Al-anon and Al-ateen is that what is
said here stays here. Bringing the law into these types of groups will destroy them and the
benefit to society will be lost. Would you rather have people driving drunk or carring arms?

Gun control deal done
 

In article , says...

"J Herring" wrote in message
...

On Thu, 11 Apr 2013 09:16:03 -0400, "Eisboch" wrote:



"J Herring" wrote in message
.. .

On Thu, 11 Apr 2013 08:19:36 -0400, "Eisboch" wrote:

-------------------------------------------------

Are you saying that right also extends to convicted felons, people
with serious mental health issues, alcoholics and drug addicts?


The Constitution does not exclude them.

But then again, a convicted felon forfeited some of his rights. Those
with serious mental health
issues could easily be considered a danger to themselves and/or
society. Alcoholics and drug
addicts? How would that he controlled. I doubt if AA or NA are going
to provide lists of members.
And besides, members don't 'sign up' or register to be a member.

--------------------------------------

I don't know about other states but the gun permit application in MA
has specific questions regarding drug addiction and/or a history of
"habitual drunkenness" or treatment for alcohol abuse. There's a
reason for that. I believe answering in the affirmative will
disqualify the applicant for a permit. They may qualify following a
treatment program and a doctor's statement that the person has
successfully been drug or alcohol free for a period of 5 years.
Both
addictions are considered to be mental health issues.

Having had some up close and personal experience in the past year
with
an alcoholic who we were finally able to get into a program for
recovery, I can completely support that restriction. Drug and
alcohol addiction can totally change a person into someone you would
never recognize.


Seems silly. A recovering alcoholic, one who's not had a drink for
over five years, let's say, would
need a doctor to attest to that? How the hell would a doctor know? The
Form 4473 has a similar
question about addiction to marijuana, narcotics, etc. It would be
very easy for a slightly less
than honest person to simply say 'no'. Unless there were some record
or conviction, he 'd get away
with it.

I've gone through the same experience you have with an alcoholic. The
individual, a brother, has
been sober for several years now. I wouldn't hesitate to let him buy a
firearm. He's also a retired
cop.

--------------------------------------------------------

Silly?

When you think your brother was mentally responsible enough to own
firearms? A month or two into his recovery? A year?

Who are you to judge others?

I guess it depends on the circumstances, but it's the reason the
question is asked on the questionnaires. Sure, if you lie you might
get away with it until it catches up with you. That's a crime also.

The question is a purgury trap.

The experience we had was one of the most difficult times I've had in
my life. The person was hell bent on self-destruction due to many
issues and pressures and his personality completely changed, often
ugly. It finally started to take a turn for the better when I
happened to visit to check up on him and found him in an alcohol
induced coma. He was going into respiratory failure and I had to
shake and slap him around until the paramedics arrived to keep him
breathing. His blood alcohol level was measured at the hospital at
450 (.45 in more common terminology). .08 is the level normally
considered to be "drunk". Anything over .35 (or 350) is considered
a lethal dose.

Try living with one or more people who are in an alcohol induced coma each and every night of
your childhood? You have heard of building up a tolerance level to alcohol? Some people need
to drink a six pack before they get to work in order to function.

Thrity-five years of drinking a case of beer a day will make .35 look normal.

Gun control deal done
 

On Thu, 11 Apr 2013 20:32:41 -0400, "F.O.A.D." wrote:

On 4/11/13 8:15 PM, J Herring wrote:
On Thu, 11 Apr 2013 19:48:39 -0400, "F.O.A.D." wrote:


In your shoes, I'd start with the personal attacks also. It must be horribly embarrassing to be in
your position - bull****ting and caught.


Salmonbait

--
'Name-calling' - the liberals' last stand.



So the biggest event of your military career was a failure. Must suck, eh?


Got 'Special Circumstances', FOAD??


Salmonbait

--
'Name-calling' - the liberals' last stand.

Gun control deal done
 

On Thu, 11 Apr 2013 20:32:02 -0400, "F.O.A.D." wrote:

On 4/11/13 8:13 PM, J Herring wrote:
On Thu, 11 Apr 2013 19:46:36 -0400, "F.O.A.D." wrote:

On 4/11/13 7:34 PM, J Herring wrote:
On Thu, 11 Apr 2013 16:55:24 -0400, "F.O.A.D." wrote:

On 4/11/13 4:51 PM, J Herring wrote:
On Thu, 11 Apr 2013 15:22:06 -0400, "F.O.A.D." wrote:

Everyone should send PsyChoSnotty a pack of cigarettes.

Does your name-calling tag team with Donnie help your ego? Are you proud that you can do so?


Salmonbait

--
'Name-calling' - the liberals' last stand.



PsychoSnotty gets really upset when you refer to him by his real name
and blows up, and, besides, PsychoSnotty seems the perfect nick for him:
he's psychotic and also a little snot.

That wasn't the question. The question was: Does your name-calling tag team with Donnie help your
ego? Are you proud that you can do so?


Salmonbait

--
'Name-calling' - the liberals' last stand.



Don and I don't work at collaborating. We and several others think
PsychoSnotty is bat**** crazy and say so. It has nothing to do with our
egos. Even you right-wingers must realize that the boy has serious
emotional problems, but instead of encouraging him to control himself
and seek help, you encourage his anti-social behavior.

Some years ago, when he called me, I offered to get him help for some of
his family's medical issues. A number of my old buddies are in the
medical professions up there, and several are affiliated with Yale Med.
Could have lined him up with free meds, too. He turned it down because
he thought a family member of mine would somehow make a buck off the
referrrals. I knew right then and there he was just plain nuts. Nothing
he has done since has convinced me otherwise.

Bull****.

Not at all. He even discussed it here, and said he turned it down
because of the reason I stated.




But go ahead, encourage the idiot.

Never have. Have even attempted to discourage it. But you still evade the question:

The question was: Does your name-calling tag team with Donnie help your
ego? Are you proud that you can do so?


I don't mind ****ting on the heads of right-wing lunatics. IT has
nothing to do with ego,

Good. 'Cause it doesn't make anyone thing more highly of you, except maybe for Donnie.


Salmonbait

--
'Name-calling' - the liberals' last stand.

Gun control deal done
 

On Thu, 11 Apr 2013 21:21:12 -0400, J Herring wrote:

On Thu, 11 Apr 2013 20:32:02 -0400, "F.O.A.D." wrote:

On 4/11/13 8:13 PM, J Herring wrote:
On Thu, 11 Apr 2013 19:46:36 -0400, "F.O.A.D." wrote:

On 4/11/13 7:34 PM, J Herring wrote:
On Thu, 11 Apr 2013 16:55:24 -0400, "F.O.A.D." wrote:

On 4/11/13 4:51 PM, J Herring wrote:
On Thu, 11 Apr 2013 15:22:06 -0400, "F.O.A.D." wrote:

Everyone should send PsyChoSnotty a pack of cigarettes.

Does your name-calling tag team with Donnie help your ego? Are you proud that you can do so?


Salmonbait

--
'Name-calling' - the liberals' last stand.



PsychoSnotty gets really upset when you refer to him by his real name
and blows up, and, besides, PsychoSnotty seems the perfect nick for him:
he's psychotic and also a little snot.

That wasn't the question. The question was: Does your name-calling tag team with Donnie help your
ego? Are you proud that you can do so?


Salmonbait

--
'Name-calling' - the liberals' last stand.



Don and I don't work at collaborating. We and several others think
PsychoSnotty is bat**** crazy and say so. It has nothing to do with our
egos. Even you right-wingers must realize that the boy has serious
emotional problems, but instead of encouraging him to control himself
and seek help, you encourage his anti-social behavior.

Some years ago, when he called me, I offered to get him help for some of
his family's medical issues. A number of my old buddies are in the
medical professions up there, and several are affiliated with Yale Med.
Could have lined him up with free meds, too. He turned it down because
he thought a family member of mine would somehow make a buck off the
referrrals. I knew right then and there he was just plain nuts. Nothing
he has done since has convinced me otherwise.

Bull****.

Not at all. He even discussed it here, and said he turned it down
because of the reason I stated.




But go ahead, encourage the idiot.

Never have. Have even attempted to discourage it. But you still evade the question:

The question was: Does your name-calling tag team with Donnie help your
ego? Are you proud that you can do so?


I don't mind ****ting on the heads of right-wing lunatics. IT has
nothing to do with ego,

Good. 'Cause it doesn't make anyone **think**more highly of you, except maybe for Donnie.


Salmonbait



Salmonbait

--
'Name-calling' - the liberals' last stand.

Gun control deal done
 

On 4/11/2013 7:48 PM, F.O.A.D. wrote:
On 4/11/13 7:36 PM, J Herring wrote:
On Thu, 11 Apr 2013 16:59:08 -0400, "F.O.A.D." wrote:

On 4/11/13 4:57 PM, J Herring wrote:
On Thu, 11 Apr 2013 16:09:18 -0400, "F.O.A.D." wrote:

On 4/11/13 4:02 PM, JustWaitAFrekinMinute wrote:
On 4/11/2013 2:27 PM, F.O.A.D. wrote:
J Herring wrote:
On 11 Apr 2013 17:07:35 GMT, F.O.A.D. wrote:

J Herring wrote:
On Thu, 11 Apr 2013 11:53:07 -0400, "F.O.A.D."
wrote:

On 4/11/13 11:39 AM, Eisboch wrote:


"F.O.A.D." wrote in message
m...

On 4/11/13 8:30 AM, J Herring wrote:
On Thu, 11 Apr 2013 08:19:36 -0400, "Eisboch"
wrote:




The Constitution does not exclude them.

But then again, a convicted felon forfeited some of his
rights.
Those
with serious mental health
issues could easily be considered a danger to themselves
and/or
society. Alcoholics and drug
addicts? How would that he controlled. I doubt if AA or NA are
going
to provide lists of members.
And besides, members don't 'sign up' or register to be a
member.



I don't know what the regs are in a loose state like Virginia,
but in
Maryland if you are buying a firearm, you have to fill out a
questionnaire for the state police on which you state under
criminal
penalties whether you are of legal age, whether you are
engaging
in a
straw purchase, whether you've been convicted of a crime of
violence,
whether you've been convicted of a misdemeanor act of domestic
violence,
whether you are the respondent in a protective order,
whether you've
been committed to a mental institution, whether you are a
habitual
drunkard, et cetera. Say yes to any of 'em and your app is
denied
and
you might get arrested.

Anyone here a heavy drinker?

---------------------------------------------------------

Same here in MA. As I mentioned to John in another post
habitual use
of drugs and/or alcohol can be cause for denial of a permit,
but
also
every time you buy a firearm from a dealer, a form similar
to the
one
you described .... probably the same one .... must be filled
out. It
specifically asks about drug and alcohol abuse.





I have a difficult time understanding why so many on the
right so
violently oppose just about anything that relates to throttling
down gun
violence. I don't accept the fact that "Americans are just plain
violent
and gun laws will never do anything to stop it."


Actually, the reasons are the same as the ones used by those
on the
left
who oppose just about
....etc. If you call something a fact, what is there to not
accept
about
it? It is a fact that there
are some crazy-assed folks out there who will kill people - with
guns or
not with guns. A majority
of those on the right, including a majority of NRA members,
agree with
the background checks. Many
of the other laws, such as the majority of the rules passed by
Maryland,
are simply stupid. They'd
have done nothing to prevent the last child massacre.

However, a janitor with a concealed carry permit could have
prevented it.


Salmonbait

--
'Name-calling' - the liberals' last stand.

Mythical. The secret service and armed police could not prevent
the
near-assassination of Reagan. What would you expect from a janitor
whose
other job was to safeguard a large school full of kids.

No one mentioned anything about the janitor having 'another
job', only a
permit to carry a concealed
weapon. And, not necessarily a janitor. An armed guidance counselor
could
have done as well.

Shoot the gunner before he shot up twenty kids. Using your
analogy, why
have *any* security at the
schools or any type of gun control if in one instance it can be
overcome?


Salmonbait

--
'Name-calling' - the liberals' last stand.

You make a lot of assumptions but ignore the issues.


The average number of people killed in mass shootings when stopped by
police is 14.29

The average number of people killed in a mass shooting when
stopped by a
civilian is 2.33

From the article he
http://dailyanarchist.com/2012/07/31...ge-statistics/



Have a happy day harry, please keep playing with your guns...


Daily Anarchist? Oh, well...in that case.

What, in the article, do you disagree with?


Salmonbait

--
'Name-calling' - the liberals' last stand.



I don't read articles in publications with names like "The Daily
Anarchist."

By the way, do you suppose there are so few murders in this country
where the weapon is a hand grenade has anything to do with the fact that
hand grenades are not easy to obtain?

So you agree with the article. Good.

Does your name-calling tag team with Donnie help your ego? Are you
proud that you can do so?

What were the special circumstances?

Why do you put on the thumb safety on the range after you've chambered
a round?


Salmonbait

--
'Name-calling' - the liberals' last stand.


Your thinking processes exemplify why the U.S. Army got handed its ass
in Vietnam.

Nope. It's because we were one man short of having enough manpower to
get the job done.

Gun control deal done
 

On Thu, 11 Apr 2013 21:00:52 -0400, "F.O.A.D." wrote:

On 4/11/13 8:51 PM, Wayne B wrote:
On Thu, 11 Apr 2013 20:09:48 -0400, "F.O.A.D." wrote:

On 4/11/13 8:02 PM, Wayne B wrote:
On Thu, 11 Apr 2013 19:34:09 -0400, J Herring
wrote:

That wasn't the question. The question was: Does your name-calling tag team with Donnie help your
ego? Are you proud that you can do so?

====

If you have followed Harry's modus operandi over the years, then you
will have noticed that he seeks out those who seem to have a soft spot
somewhere in their psychological make up or back ground. He will
then chip away at that spot trying to force some sort of emotional
blow up. This is a form of bullying of course which Harry seems to
find amusing for some reason. It would be all too easy to compile a
list of some of his past victims that he has driven from this group.
Mr Hypocrite himself, drooling over with false concern for the down
trodden of the world, getting his jollies by trying to push people
over the edge. It's pretty sick behavior and typical for a sociopath.
When no one seems to be rising to the bait, Harry will invent a new
sock puppet or invite a few "friends" over from some other group. The
antidote for all this is to just cut him off and ignore the sock
puppets when they becme known.


Absolute total bull****, w'hine.

====

Not at all. The facts are out there as you well know. Imagine
yourself at a trial trying to defend that position as the witnesses
file in and take the stand.


Sure, w'hine. Go do something useful...take some out of focus photos of
tits on the shoreline.

=====

Typical behavior for a sociopath internet bully when backed ino a
corner. I rest my case.

Gun control deal done
 

On 4/11/2013 8:09 PM, F.O.A.D. wrote:
On 4/11/13 8:02 PM, Wayne B wrote:
On Thu, 11 Apr 2013 19:34:09 -0400, J Herring
wrote:

That wasn't the question. The question was: Does your name-calling
tag team with Donnie help your
ego? Are you proud that you can do so?

====

If you have followed Harry's modus operandi over the years, then you
will have noticed that he seeks out those who seem to have a soft spot
somewhere in their psychological make up or back ground. He will
then chip away at that spot trying to force some sort of emotional
blow up. This is a form of bullying of course which Harry seems to
find amusing for some reason. It would be all too easy to compile a
list of some of his past victims that he has driven from this group.
Mr Hypocrite himself, drooling over with false concern for the down
trodden of the world, getting his jollies by trying to push people
over the edge. It's pretty sick behavior and typical for a sociopath.
When no one seems to be rising to the bait, Harry will invent a new
sock puppet or invite a few "friends" over from some other group. The
antidote for all this is to just cut him off and ignore the sock
puppets when they becme known.


Absolute total bull****, w'hine.

The biography Wayne painted was pretty grim. And you can't refute any
part of it. How does that make you feel?

Gun control deal done
 

On 4/11/2013 2:42 PM, J Herring wrote:
On 11 Apr 2013 18:29:24 GMT, F.O.A.D. wrote:

J Herring wrote:
On 11 Apr 2013 17:10:13 GMT, F.O.A.D. wrote:

wrote:
On Thu, 11 Apr 2013 12:15:10 -0400, "F.O.A.D." wrote:


No, John, they don't. Perhaps you are not aware of this, but...the MS-13
gangsters are not of any particular race.

That is not really true. They are mostly Latino originating in
Salvador but I understand they have recruited some black members

I also know they are very active in Eastern Montgomery and Northern PG
county (areas adjacent to the DC line) but this is spreading all the
way down into Charles County according to my Niece in Bryans Road.


I am very happy that I have put 1300 miles between me and that area.

Latino is not a race.

But Harry, one of the prime examples you and Donnie use for calling me a
racist is the comment I
made about the parents of poorly performing Mexican students not caring much about it.

Tsk, tsk.


Salmonbait

--
'Name-calling' - the liberals' last stand.

Mexican and Latino are racial to racists like you.

Whoops. Caught again, ESAD. That last was some heavy wiggling.


Salmonbait

--
'Name-calling' - the liberals' last stand.


Wonder how his "well dressed, clean black friends" are doing?

Gun control deal done
 

On 4/11/2013 3:08 PM, True North wrote:
The Latino neighbours you were degrading right here in this newsgroup.
Remember the families with one too many cars for your liking?


He commented that the house down the street had too many cars for the
local zoning.