"BAR" wrote in message
...
H the K wrote:
JustWait wrote:
In article ,
says...
On Wed, 12 Aug 2009 07:12:51 -0700 (PDT), wf3h
wrote:

On Aug 12, 8:39 am, BAR wrote:
wf3h wrote:
much of our healthcare dollars (something like 20-30%) are spent on
people in the last few weeks of life. we need to understand when it
does and doesn't pay to perform medical procedures on people when
they
are beyond help. anyone who's worked in a hospital has seen people
being treated when they are beyond help
If I am spending my money then it is none of your business how much I
spend in the last few weeks of my life. If my insurance company is
paying for it then it due to the contract that my insurance company
and
I entered into and they are fulfilling their part of the contract.
well... no. because you're not spending YOUR money. you're spending
mine

where did you right wingers get this mythology? 'grims' fairy tales?

you use HEALTH INSURANCE to pay for illnesses. and we ALL pay premiums
for that. you do not pay for your own care ONLY from YOUR premiums. i
pay too.

you obviously have never taken an economics course, and seem to know
only what fox news tells you to think.

there's simply no point in paying that much money for a dying person
when someone who COULD use health care effectively to prevent a
serious illness isn't getting it.

you're too stupid to wonder why our healthcare costs are so high.
you've got your little right wing mantra and you think that'll keep
you safe from the big bad boogeyman.

welcome to reality, right winger.

OTOH we DO ration care today in the most inefficient manner
possible.
people who COULD benefit from care are denied it because they can't
pay. that's rationing, folks. regardless of what the right wing
thinks
about it, that is RATIONING
We ration cars, clothes, food, housing and all manner of goods and
services too. If you want it pay for it.
well it's about time you realized that. we do. thank you for proving
my point. we DO ration health care. so right wingers have to give up
THIS point.

so regardless of what the right thinks, we DO ration care in this
country. as always we take care of the rich first. the middle class
and poor ensure that the rich get the best medical care in the
world.
We ration cars, clothes, food, housing and all manner of goods and
services too. If you want it pay for it.
i do. the difference is we're talking collective costs, not individual
ones. if you want to pay for your healthcare out of your own pocket,
be my guest. but when you start using health insurance, OR when
healthcare coverage is rationed by employers THEN it becomes MY issue.

you right wingers do love your fables, don't you?

Act NOW and there is MORE. Not only will you get crappy health
care
and the govt taking money directly out of your bank account, they
will
bill your estate after your death for the cost of procedures.
WAIT, THERE'S MORE.
the right bitches about 'socialized' medicine
Even the left understands that socialized medicine leads to
rationing.
and the right wing doesnt realize healthcare is already rationed. you
yourself admitted it above, NOW you deny it.

you guys are hysterical to watch as you do your little 'i love the
free market' dance...

what we have right now is medical care run by bear, stearns; goldman
sachs, bank of america and all the other institutions that have
shown
how much they value the american consumer by laying off so many of
us.
Pay as you go. There is nothing stopping you from paying cash when
you
go see your doctor.
agreed. but let me know when you pay for your healthcare out of your
own pocket, m'kay? because if you're using health insurance THEN it's
a matter of public policy.

yes, i want socialized medicine. because private enterprise DOES NOT
WORK in medical care.
Private enterprise built America. Private enterprise is what attracts
so
many people to America, the dream that if they work hard they can
become
rich.

and unregulated private enterprise has killed our economy, our jobs,
and has given us the most inefficient healthcare system in the
industrialized world.

you have your 'dreams'. i have reality. go back and tell your mom
that you still believe in the tooth fairy. it's suckers like you that
the rich rely on to keep them rich.

Have you, in your visions of reality, ever noticed how most liberals
must resort to name calling and personal insults in their pursuit of
winning an argument.

Do the name-calling and personal insults enhance your argument, or
make you appear just as another Harry Krause?

He is another Harry, KF him and get it over with...




Awww...the righties are upset because they can't sell their bull****.

Still depending on the state for your health care, bozo?


The Obama death squad, I mean end of life consideration team will be
stopping by to have a consultation with you soon. I hope you don't get
sick.

In June, 2002, I couldn't make it from the car to the front door of the
store without stopping twice. I could not climb stairs. If this had been
in place then, I would have been allowed to die, and probably would have
done so within six months.

Then I had a nine hour 5 way bypass and aortic valve replaced. About $200k
all together. I'm still alive and kicking. Paying taxes.

What gets me is people who don't see. There have been many cases where
people were considered dead or that would die soon, but made full recoveries
and went on to live for a long time. Those people would have been murdered
(yes, that is the operative word) by someone trying to save money for their
own salary and retirement. Since when did anyone appoint or vote these
fools in as gods, emperors, or kings, to decide who lives and dies? Obama
is so ****ing stupid he said prostate cancer can be detected during a
colonoscopy. Remember his comment on giving the kid with asthma a
breathalyzer? This guy and people like him are going to be making the calls
on when people die?

I just have one question. Are they subject to the same panel, or because
they are another caste/class of people than we, the unwashed rabble, is
their insurance panel going to be different like their health care is now?

Or do they get the thumbs up/thumbs down, too?

Steve

On Wed, 12 Aug 2009 21:44:05 -0600, "SteveB"
wrote:


"BAR" wrote in message
m...
H the K wrote:
JustWait wrote:
In article ,
says...
On Wed, 12 Aug 2009 07:12:51 -0700 (PDT), wf3h
wrote:

On Aug 12, 8:39 am, BAR wrote:
wf3h wrote:
much of our healthcare dollars (something like 20-30%) are spent on
people in the last few weeks of life. we need to understand when it
does and doesn't pay to perform medical procedures on people when
they
are beyond help. anyone who's worked in a hospital has seen people
being treated when they are beyond help
If I am spending my money then it is none of your business how much I
spend in the last few weeks of my life. If my insurance company is
paying for it then it due to the contract that my insurance company
and
I entered into and they are fulfilling their part of the contract.
well... no. because you're not spending YOUR money. you're spending
mine

where did you right wingers get this mythology? 'grims' fairy tales?

you use HEALTH INSURANCE to pay for illnesses. and we ALL pay premiums
for that. you do not pay for your own care ONLY from YOUR premiums. i
pay too.

you obviously have never taken an economics course, and seem to know
only what fox news tells you to think.

there's simply no point in paying that much money for a dying person
when someone who COULD use health care effectively to prevent a
serious illness isn't getting it.

you're too stupid to wonder why our healthcare costs are so high.
you've got your little right wing mantra and you think that'll keep
you safe from the big bad boogeyman.

welcome to reality, right winger.

OTOH we DO ration care today in the most inefficient manner
possible.
people who COULD benefit from care are denied it because they can't
pay. that's rationing, folks. regardless of what the right wing
thinks
about it, that is RATIONING
We ration cars, clothes, food, housing and all manner of goods and
services too. If you want it pay for it.
well it's about time you realized that. we do. thank you for proving
my point. we DO ration health care. so right wingers have to give up
THIS point.

so regardless of what the right thinks, we DO ration care in this
country. as always we take care of the rich first. the middle class
and poor ensure that the rich get the best medical care in the
world.
We ration cars, clothes, food, housing and all manner of goods and
services too. If you want it pay for it.
i do. the difference is we're talking collective costs, not individual
ones. if you want to pay for your healthcare out of your own pocket,
be my guest. but when you start using health insurance, OR when
healthcare coverage is rationed by employers THEN it becomes MY issue.

you right wingers do love your fables, don't you?

Act NOW and there is MORE. Not only will you get crappy health
care
and the govt taking money directly out of your bank account, they
will
bill your estate after your death for the cost of procedures.
WAIT, THERE'S MORE.
the right bitches about 'socialized' medicine
Even the left understands that socialized medicine leads to
rationing.
and the right wing doesnt realize healthcare is already rationed. you
yourself admitted it above, NOW you deny it.

you guys are hysterical to watch as you do your little 'i love the
free market' dance...

what we have right now is medical care run by bear, stearns; goldman
sachs, bank of america and all the other institutions that have
shown
how much they value the american consumer by laying off so many of
us.
Pay as you go. There is nothing stopping you from paying cash when
you
go see your doctor.
agreed. but let me know when you pay for your healthcare out of your
own pocket, m'kay? because if you're using health insurance THEN it's
a matter of public policy.

yes, i want socialized medicine. because private enterprise DOES NOT
WORK in medical care.
Private enterprise built America. Private enterprise is what attracts
so
many people to America, the dream that if they work hard they can
become
rich.

and unregulated private enterprise has killed our economy, our jobs,
and has given us the most inefficient healthcare system in the
industrialized world.

you have your 'dreams'. i have reality. go back and tell your mom
that you still believe in the tooth fairy. it's suckers like you that
the rich rely on to keep them rich.

Have you, in your visions of reality, ever noticed how most liberals
must resort to name calling and personal insults in their pursuit of
winning an argument.

Do the name-calling and personal insults enhance your argument, or
make you appear just as another Harry Krause?

He is another Harry, KF him and get it over with...




Awww...the righties are upset because they can't sell their bull****.

Still depending on the state for your health care, bozo?


The Obama death squad, I mean end of life consideration team will be
stopping by to have a consultation with you soon. I hope you don't get
sick.

In June, 2002, I couldn't make it from the car to the front door of the
store without stopping twice. I could not climb stairs. If this had been
in place then, I would have been allowed to die, and probably would have
done so within six months.

Then I had a nine hour 5 way bypass and aortic valve replaced. About $200k
all together. I'm still alive and kicking. Paying taxes.

What gets me is people who don't see. There have been many cases where
people were considered dead or that would die soon, but made full recoveries
and went on to live for a long time. Those people would have been murdered
(yes, that is the operative word) by someone trying to save money for their
own salary and retirement. Since when did anyone appoint or vote these
fools in as gods, emperors, or kings, to decide who lives and dies? Obama
is so ****ing stupid he said prostate cancer can be detected during a
colonoscopy. Remember his comment on giving the kid with asthma a
breathalyzer? This guy and people like him are going to be making the calls
on when people die?

I just have one question. Are they subject to the same panel, or because
they are another caste/class of people than we, the unwashed rabble, is
their insurance panel going to be different like their health care is now?

Or do they get the thumbs up/thumbs down, too?

Steve


Well, for what it's worth, I'm glad you're still around.
--
John H

All decisions, even those made by liberals, are the result of binary thinking.

JLH wrote:
On Wed, 12 Aug 2009 21:44:05 -0600, "SteveB"
wrote:

"BAR" wrote in message
...
H the K wrote:
JustWait wrote:
In article ,
says...
On Wed, 12 Aug 2009 07:12:51 -0700 (PDT), wf3h
wrote:

On Aug 12, 8:39 am, BAR wrote:
wf3h wrote:
much of our healthcare dollars (something like 20-30%) are spent on
people in the last few weeks of life. we need to understand when it
does and doesn't pay to perform medical procedures on people when
they
are beyond help. anyone who's worked in a hospital has seen people
being treated when they are beyond help
If I am spending my money then it is none of your business how much I
spend in the last few weeks of my life. If my insurance company is
paying for it then it due to the contract that my insurance company
and
I entered into and they are fulfilling their part of the contract.
well... no. because you're not spending YOUR money. you're spending
mine

where did you right wingers get this mythology? 'grims' fairy tales?

you use HEALTH INSURANCE to pay for illnesses. and we ALL pay premiums
for that. you do not pay for your own care ONLY from YOUR premiums. i
pay too.

you obviously have never taken an economics course, and seem to know
only what fox news tells you to think.

there's simply no point in paying that much money for a dying person
when someone who COULD use health care effectively to prevent a
serious illness isn't getting it.

you're too stupid to wonder why our healthcare costs are so high.
you've got your little right wing mantra and you think that'll keep
you safe from the big bad boogeyman.

welcome to reality, right winger.

OTOH we DO ration care today in the most inefficient manner
possible.
people who COULD benefit from care are denied it because they can't
pay. that's rationing, folks. regardless of what the right wing
thinks
about it, that is RATIONING
We ration cars, clothes, food, housing and all manner of goods and
services too. If you want it pay for it.
well it's about time you realized that. we do. thank you for proving
my point. we DO ration health care. so right wingers have to give up
THIS point.

so regardless of what the right thinks, we DO ration care in this
country. as always we take care of the rich first. the middle class
and poor ensure that the rich get the best medical care in the
world.
We ration cars, clothes, food, housing and all manner of goods and
services too. If you want it pay for it.
i do. the difference is we're talking collective costs, not individual
ones. if you want to pay for your healthcare out of your own pocket,
be my guest. but when you start using health insurance, OR when
healthcare coverage is rationed by employers THEN it becomes MY issue.

you right wingers do love your fables, don't you?

Act NOW and there is MORE. Not only will you get crappy health
care
and the govt taking money directly out of your bank account, they
will
bill your estate after your death for the cost of procedures.
WAIT, THERE'S MORE.
the right bitches about 'socialized' medicine
Even the left understands that socialized medicine leads to
rationing.
and the right wing doesnt realize healthcare is already rationed. you
yourself admitted it above, NOW you deny it.

you guys are hysterical to watch as you do your little 'i love the
free market' dance...

what we have right now is medical care run by bear, stearns; goldman
sachs, bank of america and all the other institutions that have
shown
how much they value the american consumer by laying off so many of
us.
Pay as you go. There is nothing stopping you from paying cash when
you
go see your doctor.
agreed. but let me know when you pay for your healthcare out of your
own pocket, m'kay? because if you're using health insurance THEN it's
a matter of public policy.

yes, i want socialized medicine. because private enterprise DOES NOT
WORK in medical care.
Private enterprise built America. Private enterprise is what attracts
so
many people to America, the dream that if they work hard they can
become
rich.
and unregulated private enterprise has killed our economy, our jobs,
and has given us the most inefficient healthcare system in the
industrialized world.

you have your 'dreams'. i have reality. go back and tell your mom
that you still believe in the tooth fairy. it's suckers like you that
the rich rely on to keep them rich.

Have you, in your visions of reality, ever noticed how most liberals
must resort to name calling and personal insults in their pursuit of
winning an argument.

Do the name-calling and personal insults enhance your argument, or
make you appear just as another Harry Krause?
He is another Harry, KF him and get it over with...



Awww...the righties are upset because they can't sell their bull****.

Still depending on the state for your health care, bozo?

The Obama death squad, I mean end of life consideration team will be
stopping by to have a consultation with you soon. I hope you don't get
sick.
In June, 2002, I couldn't make it from the car to the front door of the
store without stopping twice. I could not climb stairs. If this had been
in place then, I would have been allowed to die, and probably would have
done so within six months.

Then I had a nine hour 5 way bypass and aortic valve replaced. About $200k
all together. I'm still alive and kicking. Paying taxes.

What gets me is people who don't see. There have been many cases where
people were considered dead or that would die soon, but made full recoveries
and went on to live for a long time. Those people would have been murdered
(yes, that is the operative word) by someone trying to save money for their
own salary and retirement. Since when did anyone appoint or vote these
fools in as gods, emperors, or kings, to decide who lives and dies? Obama
is so ****ing stupid he said prostate cancer can be detected during a
colonoscopy. Remember his comment on giving the kid with asthma a
breathalyzer? This guy and people like him are going to be making the calls
on when people die?

I just have one question. Are they subject to the same panel, or because
they are another caste/class of people than we, the unwashed rabble, is
their insurance panel going to be different like their health care is now?

Or do they get the thumbs up/thumbs down, too?

Steve


Well, for what it's worth, I'm glad you're still around.
--
John H

All decisions, even those made by liberals, are the result of binary thinking.

That "death panel" bull**** you all are harping is so dishonest it's
shameful.

"NotNow" wrote in message
...
JLH wrote:
On Wed, 12 Aug 2009 21:44:05 -0600, "SteveB"
wrote:

"BAR" wrote in message
...
H the K wrote:
JustWait wrote:
In article ,
says...
On Wed, 12 Aug 2009 07:12:51 -0700 (PDT), wf3h

wrote:

On Aug 12, 8:39 am, BAR wrote:
wf3h wrote:
much of our healthcare dollars (something like 20-30%) are spent
on
people in the last few weeks of life. we need to understand when
it
does and doesn't pay to perform medical procedures on people when
they
are beyond help. anyone who's worked in a hospital has seen
people
being treated when they are beyond help
If I am spending my money then it is none of your business how
much I
spend in the last few weeks of my life. If my insurance company is
paying for it then it due to the contract that my insurance
company and
I entered into and they are fulfilling their part of the contract.
well... no. because you're not spending YOUR money. you're spending
mine

where did you right wingers get this mythology? 'grims' fairy
tales?

you use HEALTH INSURANCE to pay for illnesses. and we ALL pay
premiums
for that. you do not pay for your own care ONLY from YOUR premiums.
i
pay too.

you obviously have never taken an economics course, and seem to
know
only what fox news tells you to think.

there's simply no point in paying that much money for a dying
person
when someone who COULD use health care effectively to prevent a
serious illness isn't getting it.

you're too stupid to wonder why our healthcare costs are so high.
you've got your little right wing mantra and you think that'll keep
you safe from the big bad boogeyman.

welcome to reality, right winger.

OTOH we DO ration care today in the most inefficient manner
possible.
people who COULD benefit from care are denied it because they
can't
pay. that's rationing, folks. regardless of what the right wing
thinks
about it, that is RATIONING
We ration cars, clothes, food, housing and all manner of goods and
services too. If you want it pay for it.
well it's about time you realized that. we do. thank you for
proving
my point. we DO ration health care. so right wingers have to give
up
THIS point.

so regardless of what the right thinks, we DO ration care in this
country. as always we take care of the rich first. the middle
class
and poor ensure that the rich get the best medical care in the
world.
We ration cars, clothes, food, housing and all manner of goods and
services too. If you want it pay for it.
i do. the difference is we're talking collective costs, not
individual
ones. if you want to pay for your healthcare out of your own
pocket,
be my guest. but when you start using health insurance, OR when
healthcare coverage is rationed by employers THEN it becomes MY
issue.

you right wingers do love your fables, don't you?

Act NOW and there is MORE. Not only will you get crappy health
care
and the govt taking money directly out of your bank account,
they will
bill your estate after your death for the cost of procedures.
WAIT, THERE'S MORE.
the right bitches about 'socialized' medicine
Even the left understands that socialized medicine leads to
rationing.
and the right wing doesnt realize healthcare is already rationed.
you
yourself admitted it above, NOW you deny it.

you guys are hysterical to watch as you do your little 'i love the
free market' dance...

what we have right now is medical care run by bear, stearns;
goldman
sachs, bank of america and all the other institutions that have
shown
how much they value the american consumer by laying off so many
of us.
Pay as you go. There is nothing stopping you from paying cash when
you
go see your doctor.
agreed. but let me know when you pay for your healthcare out of
your
own pocket, m'kay? because if you're using health insurance THEN
it's
a matter of public policy.

yes, i want socialized medicine. because private enterprise DOES
NOT
WORK in medical care.
Private enterprise built America. Private enterprise is what
attracts so
many people to America, the dream that if they work hard they can
become
rich.
and unregulated private enterprise has killed our economy, our
jobs,
and has given us the most inefficient healthcare system in the
industrialized world.

you have your 'dreams'. i have reality. go back and tell your mom
that you still believe in the tooth fairy. it's suckers like you
that
the rich rely on to keep them rich.

Have you, in your visions of reality, ever noticed how most liberals
must resort to name calling and personal insults in their pursuit of
winning an argument.

Do the name-calling and personal insults enhance your argument, or
make you appear just as another Harry Krause?
He is another Harry, KF him and get it over with...



Awww...the righties are upset because they can't sell their bull****.

Still depending on the state for your health care, bozo?

The Obama death squad, I mean end of life consideration team will be
stopping by to have a consultation with you soon. I hope you don't get
sick.
In June, 2002, I couldn't make it from the car to the front door of the
store without stopping twice. I could not climb stairs. If this had
been in place then, I would have been allowed to die, and probably would
have done so within six months.

Then I had a nine hour 5 way bypass and aortic valve replaced. About
$200k all together. I'm still alive and kicking. Paying taxes.

What gets me is people who don't see. There have been many cases where
people were considered dead or that would die soon, but made full
recoveries and went on to live for a long time. Those people would have
been murdered (yes, that is the operative word) by someone trying to
save money for their own salary and retirement. Since when did anyone
appoint or vote these fools in as gods, emperors, or kings, to decide
who lives and dies? Obama is so ****ing stupid he said prostate cancer
can be detected during a colonoscopy. Remember his comment on giving
the kid with asthma a breathalyzer? This guy and people like him are
going to be making the calls on when people die?

I just have one question. Are they subject to the same panel, or
because they are another caste/class of people than we, the unwashed
rabble, is their insurance panel going to be different like their health
care is now?

Or do they get the thumbs up/thumbs down, too?

Steve

Well, for what it's worth, I'm glad you're still around.
--
John H

All decisions, even those made by liberals, are the result of binary
thinking.

That "death panel" bull**** you all are harping is so dishonest it's
shameful.

I absolutely agree. But there shall be some laws and practices in place
that will get the same results, even though there won't be three fat ladies
sitting there gorging on pizza and Diet Pepsi while dispensing life and
death. But you can bet there will be some review committee, and I predict
the old Roman thumbs up thumbs down thing will be revived.

Death panel? Sheesh, we're not that stupid.

Steve

SteveB wrote:
"NotNow" wrote in message
...
JLH wrote:
On Wed, 12 Aug 2009 21:44:05 -0600, "SteveB"
wrote:

"BAR" wrote in message
...
H the K wrote:
JustWait wrote:
In article ,
says...
On Wed, 12 Aug 2009 07:12:51 -0700 (PDT), wf3h

wrote:



John H

All decisions, even those made by liberals, are the result of binary
thinking.
That "death panel" bull**** you all are harping is so dishonest it's
shameful.

I absolutely agree. But there shall be some laws and practices in place
that will get the same results, even though there won't be three fat ladies
sitting there gorging on pizza and Diet Pepsi while dispensing life and
death. But you can bet there will be some review committee, and I predict
the old Roman thumbs up thumbs down thing will be revived.

Death panel? Sheesh, we're not that stupid.

Steve


http://www.classicalideals.com/HR3200.htm

In article , says...

SteveB wrote:
"NotNow" wrote in message
...
JLH wrote:
On Wed, 12 Aug 2009 21:44:05 -0600, "SteveB"
wrote:

"BAR" wrote in message
...
H the K wrote:
JustWait wrote:
In article ,
says...
On Wed, 12 Aug 2009 07:12:51 -0700 (PDT), wf3h

wrote:



John H

All decisions, even those made by liberals, are the result of binary
thinking.
That "death panel" bull**** you all are harping is so dishonest it's
shameful.

I absolutely agree. But there shall be some laws and practices in place
that will get the same results, even though there won't be three fat ladies
sitting there gorging on pizza and Diet Pepsi while dispensing life and
death. But you can bet there will be some review committee, and I predict
the old Roman thumbs up thumbs down thing will be revived.

Death panel? Sheesh, we're not that stupid.

Steve


http://www.classicalideals.com/HR3200.htm

Wow...

--
Wafa free since 2009

JustWait wrote:
In article , says...
SteveB wrote:
"NotNow" wrote in message
...
JLH wrote:
On Wed, 12 Aug 2009 21:44:05 -0600, "SteveB"
wrote:

"BAR" wrote in message
...
H the K wrote:
JustWait wrote:
In article ,
says...
On Wed, 12 Aug 2009 07:12:51 -0700 (PDT), wf3h

wrote:


John H

All decisions, even those made by liberals, are the result of binary
thinking.
That "death panel" bull**** you all are harping is so dishonest it's
shameful.
I absolutely agree. But there shall be some laws and practices in place
that will get the same results, even though there won't be three fat ladies
sitting there gorging on pizza and Diet Pepsi while dispensing life and
death. But you can bet there will be some review committee, and I predict
the old Roman thumbs up thumbs down thing will be revived.

Death panel? Sheesh, we're not that stupid.

Steve


http://www.classicalideals.com/HR3200.htm

Wow...

Great. Now y'all are using one person's opinion of the actual HR to come
to your conclusions. I suppose that person doesn't have an agenda, huh?