Well, we're inching toward our purchase, and the 1980 boat it seems likely
we'll buy has an engine of questionable condition. We'll have an engine
survey on it and the generator if we succeed, but the broker asserts that
diesel prices have come *way* down in recent years.

So, the question arises - if I had to repower, in a 60-80HP class, without
the installation costs, what are the typical available engines and their
costs? I didn't discover any way (without getting into a discussion with a
salesperson) to find that info on the web, at least about Yanmar...

And, if you've done such a repower, what was your experience? Does more
power fit in a smaller space (without resorting to turbos, which I'd prefer
to avoid if I can)? Is it cheaper than, say, 5 or 10 years ago?

Much of the discussions I've seen about repower seem to automatically
include a transmission. Is that because it's easy and cheap while you're in
there already, or because there's incompatibility issues?


Thanks.

L8R

Skip

--
"And then again, when you sit at the helm of your little ship on a clear
night, and gaze at the countless stars overhead, and realize that you are
quite alone on a great, wide sea, it is apt to occur to you that in the
general scheme of things you are merely an insignificant speck on the
surface of the ocean; and are not nearly so important or as self-sufficient
as you thought you were. Which is an exceedingly wholesome thought, and one
that may effect a permanent change in your deportment that will be greatly
appreciated by your friends."- James S. Pitkin

A friend recently replaced his old Perkins 4.108 with a new CAT (somewhere
around 50-70hp) in his Mason 43. He says he's got about $15k into it and
has done nearly all labor himself., but did a very thorough and nice job of
it (new muffler, all hoses, engine controls, panel, etc.)

I've got estimates on both rebuilding, or replacing my Perkins 4.154 with a
re-manufactured engine (w/ exchange for the old one). Both around
$4500-5000 not including removal/installation costs or freight (significant
if not local). The re-man. engines don't come with the marinizing stuff
(you have to use you old or supply new alternator, raw water pump, heat
exchanger, engine mounts, etc.), and the same is essentially true for
rebuilt. The rebuild cost assumed that the injection pump and major
components (i.e. crankshaft) were in good shape.

-Pete

"Skip Gundlach" wrote in
message nk.net...
Well, we're inching toward our purchase, and the 1980 boat it seems likely
we'll buy has an engine of questionable condition. We'll have an engine
survey on it and the generator if we succeed, but the broker asserts that
diesel prices have come *way* down in recent years.

So, the question arises - if I had to repower, in a 60-80HP class, without
the installation costs, what are the typical available engines and their
costs? I didn't discover any way (without getting into a discussion with
a
salesperson) to find that info on the web, at least about Yanmar...

And, if you've done such a repower, what was your experience? Does more
power fit in a smaller space (without resorting to turbos, which I'd
prefer
to avoid if I can)? Is it cheaper than, say, 5 or 10 years ago?

Much of the discussions I've seen about repower seem to automatically
include a transmission. Is that because it's easy and cheap while you're
in
there already, or because there's incompatibility issues?


Thanks.

L8R

Skip

--
"And then again, when you sit at the helm of your little ship on a clear
night, and gaze at the countless stars overhead, and realize that you are
quite alone on a great, wide sea, it is apt to occur to you that in the
general scheme of things you are merely an insignificant speck on the
surface of the ocean; and are not nearly so important or as
self-sufficient
as you thought you were. Which is an exceedingly wholesome thought, and
one
that may effect a permanent change in your deportment that will be greatly
appreciated by your friends."- James S. Pitkin

A friend recently replaced his old Perkins 4.108 with a new CAT (somewhere
around 50-70hp) in his Mason 43. He says he's got about $15k into it and
has done nearly all labor himself., but did a very thorough and nice job of
it (new muffler, all hoses, engine controls, panel, etc.)

I've got estimates on both rebuilding, or replacing my Perkins 4.154 with a
re-manufactured engine (w/ exchange for the old one). Both around
$4500-5000 not including removal/installation costs or freight (significant
if not local). The re-man. engines don't come with the marinizing stuff
(you have to use you old or supply new alternator, raw water pump, heat
exchanger, engine mounts, etc.), and the same is essentially true for
rebuilt. The rebuild cost assumed that the injection pump and major
components (i.e. crankshaft) were in good shape.

-Pete

"Skip Gundlach" wrote in
message nk.net...
Well, we're inching toward our purchase, and the 1980 boat it seems likely
we'll buy has an engine of questionable condition. We'll have an engine
survey on it and the generator if we succeed, but the broker asserts that
diesel prices have come *way* down in recent years.

So, the question arises - if I had to repower, in a 60-80HP class, without
the installation costs, what are the typical available engines and their
costs? I didn't discover any way (without getting into a discussion with
a
salesperson) to find that info on the web, at least about Yanmar...

And, if you've done such a repower, what was your experience? Does more
power fit in a smaller space (without resorting to turbos, which I'd
prefer
to avoid if I can)? Is it cheaper than, say, 5 or 10 years ago?

Much of the discussions I've seen about repower seem to automatically
include a transmission. Is that because it's easy and cheap while you're
in
there already, or because there's incompatibility issues?


Thanks.

L8R

Skip

--
"And then again, when you sit at the helm of your little ship on a clear
night, and gaze at the countless stars overhead, and realize that you are
quite alone on a great, wide sea, it is apt to occur to you that in the
general scheme of things you are merely an insignificant speck on the
surface of the ocean; and are not nearly so important or as
self-sufficient
as you thought you were. Which is an exceedingly wholesome thought, and
one
that may effect a permanent change in your deportment that will be greatly
appreciated by your friends."- James S. Pitkin

Hi, Pete, and thanks for the input....

A friend recently replaced his old Perkins 4.108 with a new CAT (somewhere
around 50-70hp) in his Mason 43. He says he's got about $15k into it and
has done nearly all labor himself., but did a very thorough and nice job
of
it (new muffler, all hoses, engine controls, panel, etc.)

I'm not sure I'd want to repower with a Cat - I have some concern about
parts and service in the third world. Of course, once it's new, the
likelihood of needing such stuff goes down significantly :{))


I've got estimates on both rebuilding, or replacing my Perkins 4.154 with
a
re-manufactured engine (w/ exchange for the old one). Both around
$4500-5000 not including removal/installation costs or freight
(significant
if not local). The re-man. engines don't come with the marinizing stuff
(you have to use you old or supply new alternator, raw water pump, heat
exchanger, engine mounts, etc.), and the same is essentially true for
rebuilt. The rebuild cost assumed that the injection pump and major
components (i.e. crankshaft) were in good shape.

Why would you rebuild yours, vs using a reman, if you have to do all the
disassembly of the other components, too, when, by inference, the rebuild
came with all renewed parts (injector pump, any moving parts new or
rebuilt)?

However, the rebuilt engine costs are encouraging, as I don't expect new
crate engines would have any of that hang-on stuff, either, so it seems
likely that new vs rebuilt might be double the cost, at the same labor costs
for the add-ons, and the R&R costs?

Thanks again for the input.

L8R

Skip and Lydia


--
"And then again, when you sit at the helm of your little ship on a clear
night, and gaze at the countless stars overhead, and realize that you are
quite alone on a great, wide sea, it is apt to occur to you that in the
general scheme of things you are merely an insignificant speck on the
surface of the ocean; and are not nearly so important or as self-sufficient
as you thought you were. Which is an exceedingly wholesome thought, and one
that may effect a permanent change in your deportment that will be greatly
appreciated by your friends."- James S. Pitkin
"Pete" wrote in message
...

Hi, Pete, and thanks for the input....

A friend recently replaced his old Perkins 4.108 with a new CAT (somewhere
around 50-70hp) in his Mason 43. He says he's got about $15k into it and
has done nearly all labor himself., but did a very thorough and nice job
of
it (new muffler, all hoses, engine controls, panel, etc.)

I'm not sure I'd want to repower with a Cat - I have some concern about
parts and service in the third world. Of course, once it's new, the
likelihood of needing such stuff goes down significantly :{))


I've got estimates on both rebuilding, or replacing my Perkins 4.154 with
a
re-manufactured engine (w/ exchange for the old one). Both around
$4500-5000 not including removal/installation costs or freight
(significant
if not local). The re-man. engines don't come with the marinizing stuff
(you have to use you old or supply new alternator, raw water pump, heat
exchanger, engine mounts, etc.), and the same is essentially true for
rebuilt. The rebuild cost assumed that the injection pump and major
components (i.e. crankshaft) were in good shape.

Why would you rebuild yours, vs using a reman, if you have to do all the
disassembly of the other components, too, when, by inference, the rebuild
came with all renewed parts (injector pump, any moving parts new or
rebuilt)?

However, the rebuilt engine costs are encouraging, as I don't expect new
crate engines would have any of that hang-on stuff, either, so it seems
likely that new vs rebuilt might be double the cost, at the same labor costs
for the add-ons, and the R&R costs?

Thanks again for the input.

L8R

Skip and Lydia


--
"And then again, when you sit at the helm of your little ship on a clear
night, and gaze at the countless stars overhead, and realize that you are
quite alone on a great, wide sea, it is apt to occur to you that in the
general scheme of things you are merely an insignificant speck on the
surface of the ocean; and are not nearly so important or as self-sufficient
as you thought you were. Which is an exceedingly wholesome thought, and one
that may effect a permanent change in your deportment that will be greatly
appreciated by your friends."- James S. Pitkin
"Pete" wrote in message
...

On Thu, 15 Jan 2004 15:23:53 GMT, "Skip Gundlach"
wrote:

So, the question arises - if I had to repower, in a 60-80HP class, without
the installation costs, what are the typical available engines and their
costs? I didn't discover any way (without getting into a discussion with a
salesperson) to find that info on the web, at least about Yanmar...

A friend of mine who powers a 40' heavy displacement steel ketch with
a 35 HP 1980-vintage Volvo (his AutoProp compensates quite well for
the somewhat low power) was pleasantly suprised to find yesterday at
the Toronto Boat Show a new 55 HP Volvo (model D2-55? maybe...I have
an Atomic 4 and wasn't paying close attention) for $15K Canadian,
which is about $12K U.S. (0.78 U.S.=$1 Cdn.). This struck even me as
reasonable, as I had thought to get an A4 replacement in diesel (25
HP-30 HP) from Yanmar or Beta Marine (Kubota marinized) would cost
$12K Cdn. new.

The amazing thing, according to my friend, was that the 55 HP Volvo
looked very close in size to his old 35 HP, so he could visualize
repowering if necessary without major mods. I replied that I liked
Volvos very much until something wore out and then one had to pay for
Swedish unionism.

That being said, buy an old Perkins G

R.

On Thu, 15 Jan 2004 15:23:53 GMT, "Skip Gundlach"
wrote:

So, the question arises - if I had to repower, in a 60-80HP class, without
the installation costs, what are the typical available engines and their
costs? I didn't discover any way (without getting into a discussion with a
salesperson) to find that info on the web, at least about Yanmar...

A friend of mine who powers a 40' heavy displacement steel ketch with
a 35 HP 1980-vintage Volvo (his AutoProp compensates quite well for
the somewhat low power) was pleasantly suprised to find yesterday at
the Toronto Boat Show a new 55 HP Volvo (model D2-55? maybe...I have
an Atomic 4 and wasn't paying close attention) for $15K Canadian,
which is about $12K U.S. (0.78 U.S.=$1 Cdn.). This struck even me as
reasonable, as I had thought to get an A4 replacement in diesel (25
HP-30 HP) from Yanmar or Beta Marine (Kubota marinized) would cost
$12K Cdn. new.

The amazing thing, according to my friend, was that the 55 HP Volvo
looked very close in size to his old 35 HP, so he could visualize
repowering if necessary without major mods. I replied that I liked
Volvos very much until something wore out and then one had to pay for
Swedish unionism.

That being said, buy an old Perkins G

R.

Think outside the box, Skip. What if you repowered with a Solomon
Technology Electric Wheel. This is about the same size as your current
transmission. Replace the roughly 200 gal water with 50 gal water and
an RO watermaker and reduce the diesel to 50 gal too. Use the recovered
space for the 144 VDC battery stack. Put a decent sized generator where
the engine is. Now you've got almost infinite electric power to do
other things with.

See: http://www.solomontechnologies.com/

Joe Wood


Skip Gundlach wrote:
Well, we're inching toward our purchase, and the 1980 boat it seems likely
we'll buy has an engine of questionable condition. We'll have an engine
survey on it and the generator if we succeed, but the broker asserts that
diesel prices have come *way* down in recent years.

So, the question arises - if I had to repower, in a 60-80HP class, without
the installation costs, what are the typical available engines and their
costs? I didn't discover any way (without getting into a discussion with a
salesperson) to find that info on the web, at least about Yanmar...

And, if you've done such a repower, what was your experience? Does more
power fit in a smaller space (without resorting to turbos, which I'd prefer
to avoid if I can)? Is it cheaper than, say, 5 or 10 years ago?

Much of the discussions I've seen about repower seem to automatically
include a transmission. Is that because it's easy and cheap while you're in
there already, or because there's incompatibility issues?


Thanks.

L8R

Skip

Think outside the box, Skip. What if you repowered with a Solomon
Technology Electric Wheel. This is about the same size as your current
transmission. Replace the roughly 200 gal water with 50 gal water and
an RO watermaker and reduce the diesel to 50 gal too. Use the recovered
space for the 144 VDC battery stack. Put a decent sized generator where
the engine is. Now you've got almost infinite electric power to do
other things with.

See: http://www.solomontechnologies.com/

Joe Wood


Skip Gundlach wrote:
Well, we're inching toward our purchase, and the 1980 boat it seems likely
we'll buy has an engine of questionable condition. We'll have an engine
survey on it and the generator if we succeed, but the broker asserts that
diesel prices have come *way* down in recent years.

So, the question arises - if I had to repower, in a 60-80HP class, without
the installation costs, what are the typical available engines and their
costs? I didn't discover any way (without getting into a discussion with a
salesperson) to find that info on the web, at least about Yanmar...

And, if you've done such a repower, what was your experience? Does more
power fit in a smaller space (without resorting to turbos, which I'd prefer
to avoid if I can)? Is it cheaper than, say, 5 or 10 years ago?

Much of the discussions I've seen about repower seem to automatically
include a transmission. Is that because it's easy and cheap while you're in
there already, or because there's incompatibility issues?


Thanks.

L8R

Skip

"Skip Gundlach" wrote in
message nk.net...

So, the question arises - if I had to repower, in a 60-80HP class, without
the installation costs, what are the typical available engines and their
costs? I didn't discover any way (without getting into a discussion with
a
salesperson) to find that info on the web, at least about Yanmar...

I've just been pricing smaller Yanmars (the new 3YM30 = 29 HP). They are
locally sold for $9900 CDN. Figure $15,000 US for a Yanmar 75 HP or so.

I wouldn't consider a Volvo, for high parts costs, though first costs are
slightly lower.

Perkins are still around too.

I'd pick Yanmar for general good reputation and best parts availability in
out the way locales. I've been in small marine stores in Mexico with a
Yanmar head gasket on the wall for instance...

And, if you've done such a repower, what was your experience? Does more
power fit in a smaller space (without resorting to turbos, which I'd
prefer
to avoid if I can)? Is it cheaper than, say, 5 or 10 years ago?

Yes, modern diesels are smaller than an old beastie like you've got. The
Yanmar 4JH3E is only about 54 HP. If you want more power, you get the turbo
model., the 4JH3E-TE which gets you to 75 HP. There is only about $1000
more for the turbo model. I'd get it if I were considering them. Probably
no cheaper than 5-10 years ago though.

Much of the discussions I've seen about repower seem to automatically
include a transmission. Is that because it's easy and cheap while you're
in
there already, or because there's incompatibility issues?

There are several different standard SAE bellhousings on the flywheel end of
the engine that transmissions bolt to. A newer engine may have a different
housing that the old transmission won't attach to. Also, if you're
replacing a 2200 RPM with a 3600 RPM engine, the gear ratios will be wrong
for the prop.

Hope this helps,
--
Evan Gatehouse

you'll have to rewrite my email address to get to me
ceilydh AT 3web dot net
(fools the spammers)