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US Sailing is NOT the governing body of the sport.
"Mys Terry" wrote in message ... On Sun, 19 Mar 2006 13:06:05 -0500, Jean Pudl wrote: Bart Senior wrote: Welcome to the group Jean. I'll forgive you for making an ass of yourself in your first post. There's little hope I can match your 100% record! It is easy to make hasty remarks that cannot be retracted. Did I say something incorrect? Why don't you introduce yourself. You must work for US Sailing in some capacity. Please elaborate. No connection at all, other than having been a member for several periods. I have, however, been a beneficiary of their work on numerous occasions, in particular, whenever I've raced. I've also sailed a number of times at ASA affiliates and my wife has taken one of their courses, as have a number of friends. I have no complaints with either. My statement about the ASA and US Sailing being nearly identical is with regards to their keelboat training programs. Keelboat training is a tiny part of USSailing's operation. Perhaps you should have qualified your comments. ASA is not involved with racing as you know. While US Sailing on the other hand, has it's roots in racing--it is too bad they did not stay with their expertise. Why? Are you claiming they should stay out of keel-boat training because another group sees them as competition? You've even said that for the students it doesn't matter much. It would seem that ultimately its the quality of the school that counts, not their affiliation. So you think the clients of ASA are yuppies? That is funny! That's the demographic (more or less) of those who are seeking the keelboat certification offered by both USSailing and ASA. The difference is that this is the only business of ASA, because that's where the money is. USSailing, on the other hand, serves the entire boating community. If you knew anything about sail training you would know that the "people" who take such courses span all age groups. If any group dominated, it would be middle aged people--not yuppies. I've taught over 700 people to sail from children to one man nearly 100 years old. Empty-nester are the most common students. OK. Yuppies that grew up. Anyway you look it, this is an aspect of the sport for those on the affluent side of the curve. The single mother with three kids and two jobs is not likely to need a bare boat chartering certificate. She may however, be interested in sending her kids to a community sailing program, or a YMCA camp. I've also taught hundreds of students. The difference is that I did it at non-profit organizations and no one ever paid more then a few hundred dollars for a summer of sailing. Most fees were under $50. I'm not claiming that for-profit training is bad, but I never saw much help from ASA in the non-profit world. And from my point of view, claiming the two organizations are "identical" is ludicrous. Furthermore, the demographics of ASA sailing school students are identical to the clients of sailing schools following US Sailing certifications. So what is the point of your bizarre statement? That may be true in the area that ASA focuses on. But isn't that a tautology? Where they cater to the same customers they have the same demographics? What is bizarre is your claim that because they overlap in this area they are "identical." You seem to imply sailing students are a bunch of dolts. I only implied something about you. And you're certainly living up to that implication now! Perhaps you grew up with sailing and this is the reason for your arrogant attitude. Many of my students have become fine sailors through their love of the sport. and your point is ... ? You have fine students so you're allowed to be a dolt? OK, if you insist. I'd be willing to bet they have better skills than yours in some areas. I congratulate them while my opinion of you has dropped yet another notch. Oh. I point out that you said something blatantly wrong and therefore I'm a bad sailer. You must be a Republican. US Sailing has been knocking ASA for eleven years. US Sailing claims it has a higher standard and tells everyone that the ASA standard is lower. Oh, now we see. You have a big chip there. To be honest, I don't know much about the merits of either side of this feud. I don't care much, and I doubt anyone not in the business cares much. The rest of your material is interesting, but misses the point. US Sailing IS the "National Governing Body" of the sport according to an act of Congress. That is a matter of fact. They are the folks that run the national team, send sailers to the Olympics, trains the race committees, etc. Although this is primarily oriented towards racing, its a historical fact that until about 25 years ago most recreational sailing training was run by yacht clubs and other non-profits that were the same groups that ran racing. Its no surprise that their national group would get involved in training. Further, while ASA is focused on keelboat training, these non-profits often deal with small boat training, especially for kids. If you have any doubt, here's their respective affiliates for your home state: https://www.american-sailing.com/lea...nnecticut.html http://www.ussailing.org/csa/memberOrgs.asp?state=CT So let me repeat. You made three factual errors in your short post; the truth is: USSailing IS the "National Governing Body" by act of Congress. The comment by ARG that started this thread (that ASA was the governing body) was incorrect, the article he referenced never claimed it, and the ASA site never claims it. USSailing IS a non-profit. The fact that some for-profit companies use their materials is irrelevant. USSailing and ASA are not "identical," they are very different organizations. They just happen to overlap in one area. You seem obsessed with this point, defining USSailing by one small piece of the work. I never once mentioned that USSailing is better or worse than ASA, I only said your claims were factually wrong. The bizarre thing is that you've even admitted that you were wrong in two of these points, but you've tried to hide that by claiming that I have some sort of evil agenda. snip interesting but off topic discussion of the history and relative merits to the two training programs I eagerly await your response Jean. Try to come up with some credible arguments next time. I don't think I could possibly do a better job of landing a giant Bart-fish than this! JP "Jean Pudl" wrote Bart Senior wrote: Both groups are virtually identical yet they don't accept each others standards! Absurd! Each of these groups is FOR PROFIT, not for sailing. Right. One group is For Profit, focuses almost entirely on charging yuppies to train them for sailing their first boat or bare boat charter and was created about 20 years ago. The other is a Non-Profit organization that deals with all aspects of the sport, is the National Governing Body for much of the racing in the US, develops and manages the handicap systems (IMS, PHRF, Americap, etc) and is over 100 years old. I can see why you think they're virtually identical. Bravo! Well done. Quite a smackdown! Amen! |
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