This doesn't even deserve a reply.

......BUT....

Look man, I *DON'T* just go out and aimlessly blast any wild animal that I
see.
If I want to augment my family's suppliment of food, and it happens to be
turkey season, I will go out and get a turkey for us to eat. You eat turkey
at
Thansgiving, don't you?

I don't know of any hunter friends of mine that go out and blast animals for
the sport of it. There are rules and regulations, and a hunter can get
heavily
fined and maybe jailed for poaching.

Butch Ammon



If you look at what I wrote I was talking about those who kill animals for the
fun of it, not for the purposes of food. If you like to kill your own food to
save money or because you enjoy it I have no problem with that. I was talking
about those who kill a deer or any animal and just leave it for dead, and
plenty of people do that. Read more carefully next time.

Chris

On 06 Sep 2003 01:37:09 GMT, (Gould 0738) wrote:

I think Harry will really be saddened to hear that I went to the seminar at
Fort A.P.Hill here in Virginia and got my deer permit for the base this
coming
season. Venison steaks will be for dinner!

Butch Ammon


Deer hunting? Maybe your deer are bigger, meaner, and warier back east but
shooting a deer out west here anymore is like gunning down the neighbor's pet
goat.
Darn things are all semi-tame. They are so acclimated to people that about half
of them come up and beg for snacks when they see human beings. There was
probably something to the "sport" at one time, but most of the deer around here
are not much bigger than (and no more clever than) a typical petting-zoo goat.

Every delicious whitetail I have ever shot was dispatched in
self-defense.

To keep this On-Topic, I sometimes use my boat while hunting.

noah

On Sat, 06 Sep 2003 02:38:37 GMT, "Don White"
wrote:

I don't see where it's a sport anymore.
If your family needs the food...that's one thing, but to sit on the edge of
a field and blast away at a flock of geese walking around resting or trying
to find feed......seems a bit like shooting fish in a barrell.
Same with deer hunting. With a high powered rifle and scope...not to mention
ATV's & Ski Doos what chance does the deer have.
What's next?...laser rifles that are silent? The 'great white hunter' could
blast holes in dozens of the beasts before they are scared off. The
Beatles said it all....'hey Bunglow Bill what did you kill'

Don, FWIW, laser sights and silencers are strictly illegal for any
kind of hunting, and any responsible hunter would not think of using
them even if they were legal. Also FWIW, if I am bird hunting
(including waterfowl), I do not shoot them if they are "down". All
shots are taken "in flight". I don't know if this makes any
difference to you, but please get the facts straight about laser
sights and silencers.

Thanks,
noah


Gould 0738 wrote in message
...
I think Harry will really be saddened to hear that I went to the seminar
at
Fort A.P.Hill here in Virginia and got my deer permit for the base this
coming
season. Venison steaks will be for dinner!

Butch Ammon


Deer hunting? Maybe your deer are bigger, meaner, and warier back east but
shooting a deer out west here anymore is like gunning down the neighbor's
pet
goat.
Darn things are all semi-tame. They are so acclimated to people that about
half
of them come up and beg for snacks when they see human beings. There was
probably something to the "sport" at one time, but most of the deer around
here
are not much bigger than (and no more clever than) a typical petting-zoo
goat.

On Sat, 06 Sep 2003 13:35:32 GMT, "Mark Browne"
wrote:


"Harry Krause" wrote in message
...
Don White wrote:

I don't see where it's a sport anymore.
If your family needs the food...that's one thing, but to sit on the edge
of
a field and blast away at a flock of geese walking around resting or
trying
to find feed......seems a bit like shooting fish in a barrell.
Same with deer hunting. With a high powered rifle and scope...not to
mention
ATV's & Ski Doos what chance does the deer have.
What's next?...laser rifles that are silent? The 'great white hunter'
could
blast holes in dozens of the beasts before they are scared off. The
Beatles said it all....'hey Bunglow Bill what did you kill'

Gould 0738 wrote in message
...
I think Harry will really be saddened to hear that I went to the
seminar
at
Fort A.P.Hill here in Virginia and got my deer permit for the base
this
coming
season. Venison steaks will be for dinner!

Butch Ammon


Deer hunting? Maybe your deer are bigger, meaner, and warier back east
but
shooting a deer out west here anymore is like gunning down the
neighbor's
pet
goat.
Darn things are all semi-tame. They are so acclimated to people that
about
half
of them come up and beg for snacks when they see human beings. There
was
probably something to the "sport" at one time, but most of the deer
around
here
are not much bigger than (and no more clever than) a typical
petting-zoo
goat.




Isn't it wonderful? We overdevelop the earth and take away the habitat
of all sorts of wild critters, some of whom, like geese, then have to
forage wherever they can, and then we get aggravated when they swoop
down on a farmer's field to steal a little grain. So the farmer calls
some brave men with shotguns in, and they blast the geese to smithereens.

It takes one brave man to shoot a goose, a duck or a deer. At least in
fishing, one can catch and release. Not so easy to shoot and release, eh?

Once in a while, I'll catch a glimpse of some "hunting show" in which a
great white hunter will sit up in a tree with a gun or a bow and wait
for a harmless critter to walk into range. Then the guy will blast it
and practically get orgasmic when the animal falls over dead. What a
thrill, eh? Bubba shot himself one of them there dangerous elk! What a
man.

You eat meat or you don't. It's just that simple. Paying a butcher to kill a
critter for you works out the same way; you just loose the connection
between something dying and you eating. It does not change the fact that you
are eating animal flesh! Where do you suppose that pink chunk in the
butchers showcase came from?

Most of nature does not seem to have any problem with this - humans have
enough food and spare time to get worked up about it. If it bothers you,
don't kill and eat critters. And don't pay others to kill them in your name.

Some people have come to terms with these facts and are happy carnivores -
deal with it.

Mark Browne
PS Do you know how many animal parts are found in a box of cereal? Almost
everything you eat is pretty gross while it is being made - if you could see
how most of your food is made, you would not eat it!


Mark,

The sad fact is that, for whatever reason, some non-hunters assume a
mantle of moral superiority over hunters. Because they don't kill
their own food, the death of the animal becomes abstract to them.
Psychologically, they absolve themselves of any connection to the fact
that their food was once a living creature. "It's not cow flesh, it's
a Delmonico steak, damnit! It says so on the package!"

I am a hunter. Sometimes I kill my food. I repect wildlife, and take
responsibility for the death of the animal. I hunt strictly within
the laws, and apologise to no one. I don't care if someone thinks it
is "sport" or not. It generally takes skill, patience, and much more
effort than sitting at a keyboard moralizing and acting
holier-than-thou.

Not everyone rationalises their carnivorous eating habits this way,
but some do.

Others are simply contentious because "Off topic" posting in the group
is under question, they are among the biggest off-topic posters, and
they need to stir the pot.

P.E.T.A.
"People Eating Tasty Animals"
noah

On 06 Sep 2003 17:42:01 GMT, ospam (Chris) wrote:


This doesn't even deserve a reply.

......BUT....

Look man, I *DON'T* just go out and aimlessly blast any wild animal that I
see.
If I want to augment my family's suppliment of food, and it happens to be
turkey season, I will go out and get a turkey for us to eat. You eat turkey
at
Thansgiving, don't you?

I don't know of any hunter friends of mine that go out and blast animals for
the sport of it. There are rules and regulations, and a hunter can get
heavily
fined and maybe jailed for poaching.

Butch Ammon



If you look at what I wrote I was talking about those who kill animals for the
fun of it, not for the purposes of food. If you like to kill your own food to
save money or because you enjoy it I have no problem with that. I was talking
about those who kill a deer or any animal and just leave it for dead, and
plenty of people do that. Read more carefully next time.

Chris


Chris, I have hunted the better part of 40 years, and I know of no
fellow hunter or "sportsman" who would kill an animal and "just leave
it for dead". If you know of anyone like that, please report them to
your State's wildlife office. If they are breaking the law,
responsible hunters would be happy to see them jailed.

In any leisure activity: boating, fishing, hunting, or even
jet-skiing, it is the irresponsible dolt who casts a bad light on
everyone else.

noah

I have never heard of anyone killing a deer and leaving them there. They
may poach an animal off season, but they always bring it home for the meat.
Chris, sounds like he is allow his emotions to overwhelm his brain. Reminds
me of most of Harry's posts.


"noah" wrote in message
...
On 06 Sep 2003 17:42:01 GMT, ospam (Chris) wrote:


This doesn't even deserve a reply.

......BUT....

Look man, I *DON'T* just go out and aimlessly blast any wild animal that
I
see.
If I want to augment my family's suppliment of food, and it happens to
be
turkey season, I will go out and get a turkey for us to eat. You eat
turkey
at
Thansgiving, don't you?

I don't know of any hunter friends of mine that go out and blast animals
for
the sport of it. There are rules and regulations, and a hunter can get
heavily
fined and maybe jailed for poaching.

Butch Ammon



If you look at what I wrote I was talking about those who kill animals
for the
fun of it, not for the purposes of food. If you like to kill your own
food to
save money or because you enjoy it I have no problem with that. I was
talking
about those who kill a deer or any animal and just leave it for dead, and
plenty of people do that. Read more carefully next time.

Chris


Chris, I have hunted the better part of 40 years, and I know of no
fellow hunter or "sportsman" who would kill an animal and "just leave
it for dead". If you know of anyone like that, please report them to
your State's wildlife office. If they are breaking the law,
responsible hunters would be happy to see them jailed.

In any leisure activity: boating, fishing, hunting, or even
jet-skiing, it is the irresponsible dolt who casts a bad light on
everyone else.

noah

I have never heard of anyone killing a deer and leaving them there. They
may poach an animal off season, but they always bring it home for the meat.
Chris, sounds like he is allow his emotions to overwhelm his brain. Reminds
me of most of Harry's posts

So because YOU have not heard of hunters killing an animal and leaving it there
then it doesn't happen? I know several people personally who have done such
things many times. But I guess the fact that YOU don't know anyone who has
means that I must be imagining things, these people I know simply do not really
exist. These are the type of people I was referring to in my post, and as
stated by others here, I think most responsible hunters would agree with my
distaste for these people.

Chris

On Sat, 06 Sep 2003 07:35:36 -0400, Harry Krause
wrote:

Gould 0738 wrote:

I don't exactly "shoot" deer, as in using a rifle - I don't own a rifle. But
I
have a big compound bow with 65 lbs of pull to it, and merely launch an arrow
at a deer. It's more sporty that way - you have to get REAL CLOSE to a deer

too.

Yes, that does sound a little more sporting
than blasting a 75-pound Bambi from 200 yards away using a high-powered rifle
and scope. :-)


Where's the "sport" part? Does Bambi shoot back?

C'mon Harry. "Bambi" is a cartoon characterization of a deer fawn.
That is where the similarities end. Your response is emotionally, not
reality based. Ever eat "veal"?

According to my handy-dandy Websters:

"sport n. :1a a source of diversion. b. sexual play. c(1) physical
activity engaged in for pleasure (2) a particular activity (as hunting
or an athletic game) so engaged in."

If you have an emotional aversion to hunting, so be it. Don't make it
sound like moral superiority, OK? A big part of the folly in this
country comes from moral high-handedness. Don't join it, please.

further:

"sport fish n. a fish important for the sport it affords anglers."

Let's not rehash what the meaning of the word "is" is.

Regards,
noah

jps wrote:
"noah" wrote in message
...

Don, FWIW, laser sights and silencers are strictly illegal for any
kind of hunting, and any responsible hunter would not think of using
them even if they were legal. Also FWIW, if I am bird hunting
(including waterfowl), I do not shoot them if they are "down". All
shots are taken "in flight".

Don't geese mate for life?



Not when our hunterboys shoot down one of the pair.


--
* * *
email sent to will *never* get to me.

On 06 Sep 2003 23:35:13 GMT, ospam (Chris) wrote:

I have never heard of anyone killing a deer and leaving them there. They
may poach an animal off season, but they always bring it home for the meat.
Chris, sounds like he is allow his emotions to overwhelm his brain. Reminds
me of most of Harry's posts

So because YOU have not heard of hunters killing an animal and leaving it there
then it doesn't happen? I know several people personally who have done such
things many times. But I guess the fact that YOU don't know anyone who has
means that I must be imagining things, these people I know simply do not really
exist. These are the type of people I was referring to in my post, and as
stated by others here, I think most responsible hunters would agree with my
distaste for these people.

Chris

What, Chris, have you done about it? The actions you speak of would be
considered disgusting by any hunter I've ever heard of. It sounds like you're
associating with some sick individuals. By doing nothing, you're simply enabling
them. If you find their actions offensive, as would any real hunter, then call
the law!

John
On the 'Poco Loco' out of Deale, MD