I have a Nanni 4.330 TDI 115hp diesel engine on my Resort 35
displacement cruiser. The boat is built to charter specifications in
Australia and is set up for charter in the Sydney area. The number 3
piston has lost compression due to a valve seat falling out and
destroying the piston head. It is too early as yet to get the full
picture of all the damage, as the mechanic has only just pulled it out
of the boat, but I was wondering if anyone else has experienced this
problem and what was the cause of the seat falling out. My mechanic
wanted me to look at the engine, because he had never seen another
similar problem. He later explained to me that the only two causes of
this failure were severe overheating of the engine, as a consequence of
which the seat falls out from the expanded head, or because the head or
the seat have been incorrectly milled and the tolerance was
insufficient to hold them together under normal engine operating
temperatures. My problem appears to be the latter because there is
absolutely no evidence of any overheating of the engine, which is why
my mechanic wanted me to see the condition of the engine, water pumps
head gaskets other pistons and so on, just to understand why he thought
it unusual that the seat fell out.

Does anyone have a similar experience or perhaps can give me another
reason to look in to, as to why the seat fell out. The boat is only 5
years old and the engine has only done about 670 hours of operation. I
have limited mechanical experience and understanding, but several
mechanics, including my father in law all agree that this should not
have happened if there were no overheating of the head and block. Would
you let me know if there are any other reasons I should be aware of
before they repair the engine, only to let it happen again sometime in
the future, because we missed something. Any advice is helpful.

I agree with your mechanic. Looks like a manufacturing defect AKA poor
quality control. However, as it held up for 670 operating hours I doubt
you'll get Nanni to participate in the repair cost. Was the cylinder head
damaged badly? If not, count yourself lucky. A replacement seat, properly
installed, should outlast the boat.

Butch
wrote in message
oups.com...
I have a Nanni 4.330 TDI 115hp diesel engine on my Resort 35
displacement cruiser. The boat is built to charter specifications in
Australia and is set up for charter in the Sydney area. The number 3
piston has lost compression due to a valve seat falling out and
destroying the piston head. It is too early as yet to get the full
picture of all the damage, as the mechanic has only just pulled it out
of the boat, but I was wondering if anyone else has experienced this
problem and what was the cause of the seat falling out. My mechanic
wanted me to look at the engine, because he had never seen another
similar problem. He later explained to me that the only two causes of
this failure were severe overheating of the engine, as a consequence of
which the seat falls out from the expanded head, or because the head or
the seat have been incorrectly milled and the tolerance was
insufficient to hold them together under normal engine operating
temperatures. My problem appears to be the latter because there is
absolutely no evidence of any overheating of the engine, which is why
my mechanic wanted me to see the condition of the engine, water pumps
head gaskets other pistons and so on, just to understand why he thought
it unusual that the seat fell out.

Does anyone have a similar experience or perhaps can give me another
reason to look in to, as to why the seat fell out. The boat is only 5
years old and the engine has only done about 670 hours of operation. I
have limited mechanical experience and understanding, but several
mechanics, including my father in law all agree that this should not
have happened if there were no overheating of the head and block. Would
you let me know if there are any other reasons I should be aware of
before they repair the engine, only to let it happen again sometime in
the future, because we missed something. Any advice is helpful.

Just found out today that the bore was scored and could not be
adequately rubbed back and because the block does not have a wet
sleeve, that the engine is pretty much useless. The cost to re bore the
piston and rebuild the head would probably cost more than a new engine.
The mechanic is getting quotes for me now on both a long and short
block, depending on whether we use some of the old parts like turbo,
etc from the current engine. He also said that because the engine is
pretty new that there would be no market for the engine to be sold to a
re conditioner of engines as there would be little demand for such an
engine for quite some time. The head around the valve seat was chewed a
little, but even if it can be repaired, (and the mechanic is not sure
it can be) it seems that the cost of checking out the other valves, the
injectors, the bore and so on would almost warrant a new engine. I hope
you are wrong about Nanni, or their Australian distributors, because I
have the most expensive row boat in Australia at the moment. Thanks for
your comments.

Peter

In the US a short block means without head(s). And neither includes
anything other than the basic engine. We would call an engine with turbo
and accessories a complete engine, not a short or long block. At your hours
a long block should be satisfactory, your accessories should be ok. I am a
bit surprised that a single bore, replacement piston, and a valve seat
replacement will cost close to the price os a diesel long block but then I'm
not where you are either. Is he pricing just a single bore? Or a boring
and replacing all the cylinders? Some people don't like doing a single bore
but frankly I don't think it is a problem to punch just one out 1 size up.

wrote in message
oups.com...
Just found out today that the bore was scored and could not be
adequately rubbed back and because the block does not have a wet
sleeve, that the engine is pretty much useless. The cost to re bore the
piston and rebuild the head would probably cost more than a new engine.
The mechanic is getting quotes for me now on both a long and short
block, depending on whether we use some of the old parts like turbo,
etc from the current engine. He also said that because the engine is
pretty new that there would be no market for the engine to be sold to a
re conditioner of engines as there would be little demand for such an
engine for quite some time. The head around the valve seat was chewed a
little, but even if it can be repaired, (and the mechanic is not sure
it can be) it seems that the cost of checking out the other valves, the
injectors, the bore and so on would almost warrant a new engine. I hope
you are wrong about Nanni, or their Australian distributors, because I
have the most expensive row boat in Australia at the moment. Thanks for
your comments.

Peter

I am not sure of the terms, but the mechanic said that his labour to
pull the engine out of the boat and then to strip the engine of all
parts to just the block, in order to send it away and be bored out, is
expensive enough. Then, add the cost of someone upsizing the piston
etc, as well as rebuilding the damage to the valve cylinder and then
inserting a new seat. For eample, because everybody here is a
specialist nowadays, the fuel injector will cost $110.00 per injector,
to rebuild.

He said before he gave me a quote to do this repair, he wanted to see
what a new engine would cost, complete with all marinised parts,
including gearbox etc, and then just the Kubota engine cost. which we
could marinise with the existing parts from my engine. This way I can
choose which option is price effective, while carrying the least amount
of risk from existing ware and tear. He is certain that the cost of
subcontracting the specialised repairs of various critical parts and
adding his labour for striping and rebuilding the engine and putting it
back on the boat, will be very close to a new engine. My friend who is
a qualified mechanic along with his brother, another mechanic, spent
over $4,500 here to repair his volvo engine, and he did most of the
labour. As soon as I have these prices and the options I will post it
on the net if you are interested.

I know very little about engines and repairing them, but the longer I
own a boat the faster I am learning. If I said tractor, any mechanic
would not dare to say anything that started with one thousand, but tell
them boat and they tell you not to get your hopes up for anything less
than ten thousand. There's a great way to make money........JUST ADD
WATER ! It makes every grow ten time bigger, including your bills.


James wrote:
In the US a short block means without head(s). And neither includes
anything other than the basic engine. We would call an engine with turbo
and accessories a complete engine, not a short or long block. At your hours
a long block should be satisfactory, your accessories should be ok. I am a
bit surprised that a single bore, replacement piston, and a valve seat
replacement will cost close to the price os a diesel long block but then I'm
not where you are either. Is he pricing just a single bore? Or a boring
and replacing all the cylinders? Some people don't like doing a single bore
but frankly I don't think it is a problem to punch just one out 1 size up.

wrote in message
oups.com...
Just found out today that the bore was scored and could not be
adequately rubbed back and because the block does not have a wet
sleeve, that the engine is pretty much useless. The cost to re bore the
piston and rebuild the head would probably cost more than a new engine.
The mechanic is getting quotes for me now on both a long and short
block, depending on whether we use some of the old parts like turbo,
etc from the current engine. He also said that because the engine is
pretty new that there would be no market for the engine to be sold to a
re conditioner of engines as there would be little demand for such an
engine for quite some time. The head around the valve seat was chewed a
little, but even if it can be repaired, (and the mechanic is not sure
it can be) it seems that the cost of checking out the other valves, the
injectors, the bore and so on would almost warrant a new engine. I hope
you are wrong about Nanni, or their Australian distributors, because I
have the most expensive row boat in Australia at the moment. Thanks for
your comments.

Peter

Probably hard to find for a boat but some people have big truck diesels
bored in place. Otherwise the engine removal is a given cost either way. I
see you have cost issues that maybe we don't have. Around here swapping the
parts to a long block would be cheaper than buying a complete, ready to
install engine. Some machine shops will bore with the crank and the other 3
pistons still in. Boring is done from the top.

wrote in message
oups.com...
I am not sure of the terms, but the mechanic said that his labour to
pull the engine out of the boat and then to strip the engine of all
parts to just the block, in order to send it away and be bored out, is
expensive enough. Then, add the cost of someone upsizing the piston
etc, as well as rebuilding the damage to the valve cylinder and then
inserting a new seat. For eample, because everybody here is a
specialist nowadays, the fuel injector will cost $110.00 per injector,
to rebuild.

He said before he gave me a quote to do this repair, he wanted to see
what a new engine would cost, complete with all marinised parts,
including gearbox etc, and then just the Kubota engine cost. which we
could marinise with the existing parts from my engine. This way I can
choose which option is price effective, while carrying the least amount
of risk from existing ware and tear. He is certain that the cost of
subcontracting the specialised repairs of various critical parts and
adding his labour for striping and rebuilding the engine and putting it
back on the boat, will be very close to a new engine. My friend who is
a qualified mechanic along with his brother, another mechanic, spent
over $4,500 here to repair his volvo engine, and he did most of the
labour. As soon as I have these prices and the options I will post it
on the net if you are interested.

I know very little about engines and repairing them, but the longer I
own a boat the faster I am learning. If I said tractor, any mechanic
would not dare to say anything that started with one thousand, but tell
them boat and they tell you not to get your hopes up for anything less
than ten thousand. There's a great way to make money........JUST ADD
WATER ! It makes every grow ten time bigger, including your bills.


James wrote:
In the US a short block means without head(s). And neither includes
anything other than the basic engine. We would call an engine with turbo
and accessories a complete engine, not a short or long block. At your
hours
a long block should be satisfactory, your accessories should be ok. I am
a
bit surprised that a single bore, replacement piston, and a valve seat
replacement will cost close to the price os a diesel long block but then
I'm
not where you are either. Is he pricing just a single bore? Or a boring
and replacing all the cylinders? Some people don't like doing a single
bore
but frankly I don't think it is a problem to punch just one out 1 size
up.

wrote in message
oups.com...
Just found out today that the bore was scored and could not be
adequately rubbed back and because the block does not have a wet
sleeve, that the engine is pretty much useless. The cost to re bore the
piston and rebuild the head would probably cost more than a new engine.
The mechanic is getting quotes for me now on both a long and short
block, depending on whether we use some of the old parts like turbo,
etc from the current engine. He also said that because the engine is
pretty new that there would be no market for the engine to be sold to a
re conditioner of engines as there would be little demand for such an
engine for quite some time. The head around the valve seat was chewed a
little, but even if it can be repaired, (and the mechanic is not sure
it can be) it seems that the cost of checking out the other valves, the
injectors, the bore and so on would almost warrant a new engine. I hope
you are wrong about Nanni, or their Australian distributors, because I
have the most expensive row boat in Australia at the moment. Thanks for
your comments.

Peter