On Mon, 6 Jun 2005 07:50:31 -0400, "*JimH*" wrote:

Wow, birds picked up on radar....and radar that shows water depths.
Amazing. What brand of radar is this Harry?

Maybe he's got a multifunction display like I have?

On the Ranger:

http://tinyurl.com/czb2d

On the Contender:

http://tinyurl.com/42u25

Later,

Tom

"Shortwave Sportfishing" wrote in message
...
On Mon, 6 Jun 2005 07:50:31 -0400, "*JimH*" wrote:

Wow, birds picked up on radar....and radar that shows water depths.
Amazing. What brand of radar is this Harry?

Maybe he's got a multifunction display like I have?

On the Ranger:

http://tinyurl.com/czb2d

On the Contender:

http://tinyurl.com/42u25

Later,

Tom

I had multifunction also. But only the chartplotter showed water depths, or
a side window on the radar when it was displayed. As you know, the radar,
however, does not read water depths. And recreational marine radar cannot
pickup birds.

On Mon, 6 Jun 2005 12:27:17 -0400, "*JimH*" wrote:


"Shortwave Sportfishing" wrote in message
.. .
On Mon, 6 Jun 2005 07:50:31 -0400, "*JimH*" wrote:

Wow, birds picked up on radar....and radar that shows water depths.
Amazing. What brand of radar is this Harry?

Maybe he's got a multifunction display like I have?

On the Ranger:

http://tinyurl.com/czb2d

On the Contender:

http://tinyurl.com/42u25

I had multifunction also. But only the chartplotter showed water depths, or
a side window on the radar when it was displayed. As you know, the radar,
however, does not read water depths. And recreational marine radar cannot
pickup birds.

Really?

Damn...

Later,

Tom

"Shortwave Sportfishing" wrote in message
...
On Mon, 6 Jun 2005 12:27:17 -0400, "*JimH*" wrote:


"Shortwave Sportfishing" wrote in message
. ..
On Mon, 6 Jun 2005 07:50:31 -0400, "*JimH*" wrote:

Wow, birds picked up on radar....and radar that shows water depths.
Amazing. What brand of radar is this Harry?

Maybe he's got a multifunction display like I have?

On the Ranger:

http://tinyurl.com/czb2d

On the Contender:

http://tinyurl.com/42u25

I had multifunction also. But only the chartplotter showed water depths,
or
as a side window on the radar when it was displayed. As you know, the
radar,
however, does not read water depths. And recreational marine radar
cannot
pickup birds.

Really?

Damn...

Later,

Tom

I knew you knew it Tom.....I posted it for Krause so he understands how
radar works. :-)

On Mon, 6 Jun 2005 14:05:43 -0400, "*JimH*" wrote:


"Shortwave Sportfishing" wrote in message
.. .
On Mon, 6 Jun 2005 12:27:17 -0400, "*JimH*" wrote:


"Shortwave Sportfishing" wrote in message
...
On Mon, 6 Jun 2005 07:50:31 -0400, "*JimH*" wrote:

Wow, birds picked up on radar....and radar that shows water depths.
Amazing. What brand of radar is this Harry?

Maybe he's got a multifunction display like I have?

On the Ranger:

http://tinyurl.com/czb2d

On the Contender:

http://tinyurl.com/42u25

I had multifunction also. But only the chartplotter showed water depths,
or
as a side window on the radar when it was displayed. As you know, the
radar,
however, does not read water depths. And recreational marine radar
cannot
pickup birds.

Really?

Damn...

I knew you knew it Tom.....I posted it for Krause so he understands how
radar works. :-)

Well, not exactly. And I wasn't trying to sand bag you there either -
I wouldn't do that. I was being a smart ass and I apologize for that.

The trick to using recreational radars, even the 2 Kw class radome
antennas, is to set it for extreme range and reduce the discrimination
a bit. Now I'll admit that a good set of binoculars on a small boat
like the Ranger is a hell of a lot more useful than a 2 Kw radar
system set for marginal operating conditions, but it can be done with
practice and operating experience.

On the Contender, it's a different ball game. I have an open array 4
Kw and at mid to extreme ranges, it will pick up large flocks of birds
working surface bait. Now the relative advantage to this escapes me
because if you see a flock of birds working you only have two choices
- either head for the flock or move in front of the flock and set up
for whatever you might think is causing the bait ball to surface. And
the chances are the flock will move away at a tangent relative to you,
so you end up chasing anyway. :)

Now before you start going but, but, but - yes, 10 Kw and up radars
with some height work much better for birds than small boat radars.
The Audubon Society uses radar all the time to track migratory birds -
they even wrote a book about it but I can't find the book at the
moment. If you Google it, like birds on radar, I'm sure you can find
it.

For the big game guys, it is a good tool. For the recreational
schmuck like me it's relative.

The point is that you can't make a blanket statement that you can't
pick up birds on recreational radar because, with training, some
experience and the right setup, you can do it.

Later,

Tom

"Shortwave Sportfishing" wrote in message
...
On Mon, 6 Jun 2005 14:05:43 -0400, "*JimH*" wrote:


"Shortwave Sportfishing" wrote in message
. ..
On Mon, 6 Jun 2005 12:27:17 -0400, "*JimH*" wrote:


"Shortwave Sportfishing" wrote in message
m...
On Mon, 6 Jun 2005 07:50:31 -0400, "*JimH*" wrote:

Wow, birds picked up on radar....and radar that shows water depths.
Amazing. What brand of radar is this Harry?

Maybe he's got a multifunction display like I have?

On the Ranger:

http://tinyurl.com/czb2d

On the Contender:

http://tinyurl.com/42u25

I had multifunction also. But only the chartplotter showed water
depths,
or
as a side window on the radar when it was displayed. As you know, the
radar,
however, does not read water depths. And recreational marine radar
cannot
pickup birds.

Really?

Damn...

I knew you knew it Tom.....I posted it for Krause so he understands how
radar works. :-)

Well, not exactly. And I wasn't trying to sand bag you there either -
I wouldn't do that. I was being a smart ass and I apologize for that.

The trick to using recreational radars, even the 2 Kw class radome
antennas, is to set it for extreme range and reduce the discrimination
a bit. Now I'll admit that a good set of binoculars on a small boat
like the Ranger is a hell of a lot more useful than a 2 Kw radar
system set for marginal operating conditions, but it can be done with
practice and operating experience.

On the Contender, it's a different ball game. I have an open array 4
Kw and at mid to extreme ranges, it will pick up large flocks of birds
working surface bait. Now the relative advantage to this escapes me
because if you see a flock of birds working you only have two choices
- either head for the flock or move in front of the flock and set up
for whatever you might think is causing the bait ball to surface. And
the chances are the flock will move away at a tangent relative to you,
so you end up chasing anyway. :)

Now before you start going but, but, but - yes, 10 Kw and up radars
with some height work much better for birds than small boat radars.
The Audubon Society uses radar all the time to track migratory birds -
they even wrote a book about it but I can't find the book at the
moment. If you Google it, like birds on radar, I'm sure you can find
it.

For the big game guys, it is a good tool. For the recreational
schmuck like me it's relative.

The point is that you can't make a blanket statement that you can't
pick up birds on recreational radar because, with training, some
experience and the right setup, you can do it.

Later,

Tom

Why would any boater bother to set their radar up to track birds?

We had a Raytheon RL9 LCD radar (dome 2 kw radar) and a Raychart 601XX
chartplotter/GPS with a C-Map of the west and east Lake Erie regions on our
32 footer. I installed a Raymarine ST40 depth sounder and interlocked it
with the LCD display. My only use for radar was for storm watching, night
running and for the unlikely event I got caught up in heavy fog. I used the
chartplotter almost exclusively during daytime operation.. Very nice tool
when cruising as it not only showed speed, current position and current
depth but also marked depths (from the c-map) of the Lake areas I was
traveling..

BTW: No apology needed Tom. You have always been a straight shooter and a
stand up guy.

On Mon, 6 Jun 2005 17:43:03 -0400, "*JimH*" wrote:

The point is that you can't make a blanket statement that you can't
pick up birds on recreational radar because, with training, some
experience and the right setup, you can do it.

Why would any boater bother to set their radar up to track birds?

Well, in some cases, it does work rather well. Up here in New
England, there is a lot of clutter and with radomes and small open
array antennas, it is very marginal unless the bird is rising high
enough to catch. I first became interested in bird tracking with
radar when I worked for Texaco Oil in Louisiana. I became friendly
with a head boat charter operator out of Venus, LA (I fixed his radar
for him on the cuff) and he taught me a lot about how to discriminate
surface/rain/fog clutter and birds working a bait ball. I never
forgot the lessons.

We had a Raytheon RL9 LCD radar (dome 2 kw radar) and a Raychart 601XX
chartplotter/GPS with a C-Map of the west and east Lake Erie regions on our
32 footer. I installed a Raymarine ST40 depth sounder and interlocked it
with the LCD display. My only use for radar was for storm watching, night
running and for the unlikely event I got caught up in heavy fog. I used the
chartplotter almost exclusively during daytime operation.. Very nice tool
when cruising as it not only showed speed, current position and current
depth but also marked depths (from the c-map) of the Lake areas I was
traveling..

I'll tell you the truth - I use radar to keep from hitting idiots who
refuse to slow down in the fog or tug operators with long tows. Other
than that, it's running and I keep an eye on it, but I normally I use
my two eyes and the chart plotter. The fishing is usually places I
know will produce in most conditions.

BTW: No apology needed Tom. You have always been a straight shooter and a
stand up guy.

Well I thank you, but I felt bad about that.

Hey, water over the bridge.

Later,

Tom