Doug Kanter wrote:

"Harry Krause" wrote in message
...



I've not deleted anything, crap-for-brains. In fact, I don't even know
how one would do that, since doing so is of no interest to me.

Harry, you need a translator on retainer. When someone like Jim says you
deleted your old posts, it means he's unable to figure out how to find them
with a google search.



Ahhh..thanks. Sometimes I find it difficult to understand the dribbles
of the terminally stupid, like "Jim," aka Dennis.

"Harry Krause" wrote in message
...
Doug Kanter wrote:

"Harry Krause" wrote in message
...



I've not deleted anything, crap-for-brains. In fact, I don't even know
how one would do that, since doing so is of no interest to me.

Harry, you need a translator on retainer. When someone like Jim says you
deleted your old posts, it means he's unable to figure out how to find
them
with a google search.



Ahhh..thanks. Sometimes I find it difficult to understand the dribbles
of the terminally stupid, like "Jim," aka Dennis.

Thanks for making my point (the fact that you always reply to those
disagreeing with you with a childish insult) once again.

Jim-- wrote:
"Harry Krause" wrote in message
...
Doug Kanter wrote:

"Harry Krause" wrote in message
...



I've not deleted anything, crap-for-brains. In fact, I don't even know
how one would do that, since doing so is of no interest to me.

Harry, you need a translator on retainer. When someone like Jim says you
deleted your old posts, it means he's unable to figure out how to find
them
with a google search.



Ahhh..thanks. Sometimes I find it difficult to understand the dribbles
of the terminally stupid, like "Jim," aka Dennis.

Thanks for making my point (the fact that you always reply to those
disagreeing with you with a childish insult) once again.



Well, Dennis, *you* make one unfounded, d.f. accusation after
another...if you can't take it, don't try to dish it out, eh?

On Thu, 04 Mar 2004 19:47:21 -0500, John H wrote:



Of course, you may be one of those who proclaim he knew about the attack
in advance and was probably involved in the planning. Then I could
understand your position.


I don't believe GWB, or anyone in his administration, knew about the
attack in advance. That being said, I am troubled by the administrations
apparent lack of cooperation with the 9/11 inquiry. What are your
thoughts?

"ecr" wrote in message
om...
"Doug Kanter" wrote in message
news:raL1c.4540

Surely you don't believe that Bush's presence was any benefit to the
country
in the minutes, days and months after 9/11, do you? If he'd perished in
flames, better men would've stepped up. Matter of fact, Rudy's
popularity
rating were far higher than Bush's.


Wow! How can a, a, ... citizen make such a response?

Do you think POTUS presence (regardless of politics)is not required
during an attack on the US mainland?

Can you imagine the state of the country at this point if POTUS had
been killed?
(POTUS didn't go to DC because it(he) was deemed a probable target).

Do you think the "bad guys" would not have kept up the attack?

I fear for my country.

1) In terms of morale, Bush was only important to people who had respect for
him. I wouldn't hold the door for him if he were on crutches, so for me, his
existence was meaningless.

2) In terms of solid, material results in the time immediately following the
attack, he was of no consequence. He doesn't possess the intelligence to
understand the spectrum of responses to an attack like that. Any and all
responses were dictated at the time by real people, not Bush.

3) Whether the bad guys continued the attack or not was in no way related to
anything the president could've done. If they had 5 more planes targeted and
in the air, there still would've been some sort of trouble on those planes,
successful or not.

4) If Bush had been 4 blocks away from the WTC, with a perfect view and
access to all emergency communications occurring at the time, he still could
not have expressed anything coherent about the events, unless it was
previously scripted for him. Better men took care of keeping the public
informed. There were fire and police officials who better able to put ideas
together during impromptu interviews.

5) A real man would've told the public that the best information was coming
from the mayor of NYC.

Sorry, but I don't believe in deities, and I especially don't attribute
god-like qualities to humans. You're welcome to do that, though.

"WaIIy" wrote in message
...

NOT THIS VETERAN!!!!!!!! I am absolutely 100%,dyed-in-the-wool,
Pro-Bush, all
the way!!!!!

You want to talk to two of my brothers-in-law? They were over in Vietnam
and
fought, survived, and came home. There were countless stories going
around
among all the services. I can tell you this... Kerry is *DESPISED* by
Vietnam
vets!!

Yes, I believe he is despised. Most traitors are.

Polls indicate that Vietnam vets are widely mixed as far as where they fall
on the political spectrum. This is nothing new. It's been that way since
they began returning from Vietnam. Better not make any assumptions.

On Thu, 04 Mar 2004 21:33:11 -0500, Jim wrote:

And in all cases radio contact with the planes was turned off.
Passengers with cell phones were talking from the PA plane and
describing what was happening. The FAA ordered ALL planes grounded --
these 4 did not respond. IT doesn't take a genius.

John H wrote:
On Thu, 04 Mar 2004 12:50:31 -0500, Jim wrote:



John H wrote:


Bush did a superb job of providing leadership to the country during a
time when panic could have reigned supreme.



Ummm -- seems to me that The president and VP ran and hid while this was
going on. There was something like 20 min between tower 1 and tower 2
being hit. It was over an hour before the Pentagon was hit, yet no air
defense was prepared. The plane that went down in PA was tracked for
some time, yet not taken out

All in all I'd say the presidents' actions on 9/11 are nothing to brag about


Jim, we had not normally been keeping an air defense battery around
the twin towers or the Pentagon. The closest air defense we had was at
Fort Belvoir, VA. That's about an hour from the Pentagon on a good
day, assuming the troops were loaded and ready to go.

We had not been keeping F-16's on the ready rack at Andrews AFB
either.

Have you ever landed at National Airport in Washington, D,C.? When
landing from the north, planes fly directly above the Potomac River
until they hit the runway. This means they pass within a few blocks of
the Pentagon. The warning time would have been about 4 seconds from
the time a plane left the normal flight path.

It's okay to hate Bush, but try to exercise some reason!

John H

On the 'Poco Loco' out of Deale, MD
on the beautiful Chesapeake Bay!

Are you implying that the FAA ordered all planes grounded before the
incidents occurred?

John H

On the 'Poco Loco' out of Deale, MD
on the beautiful Chesapeake Bay!

On Fri, 05 Mar 2004 04:10:28 GMT, "Doug Kanter"
wrote:

"John H" wrote in message
.. .

Jim, we had not normally been keeping an air defense battery around
the twin towers or the Pentagon. The closest air defense we had was at
Fort Belvoir, VA. That's about an hour from the Pentagon on a good
day, assuming the troops were loaded and ready to go.

We had not been keeping F-16's on the ready rack at Andrews AFB
either.

Have you ever landed at National Airport in Washington, D,C.? When
landing from the north, planes fly directly above the Potomac River
until they hit the runway. This means they pass within a few blocks of
the Pentagon. The warning time would have been about 4 seconds from
the time a plane left the normal flight path.

It's okay to hate Bush, but try to exercise some reason!

John H

On the 'Poco Loco' out of Deale, MD
on the beautiful Chesapeake Bay!

I may be wrong, but I believe we still have an ANG base on Long Island. A
path straight north would intercept a plane about halfway between Boston and
Manhattan.

That could have been possible, but no one had knowledge of anything
going on until after the first tower was hit. Even then the incident
was being described as an accident. Only after the second tower was
hit was a "purposeful" connection made.

Air National Guard folks tended to drill primarily on weekends. They
didn't normally have armed fighters on ready alert, i.e. sitting at
the end of the runway with a pilot ready to take off. We had no reason
for this prior to 9/11.

John H

On the 'Poco Loco' out of Deale, MD
on the beautiful Chesapeake Bay!

As I recall the grounding order came after the 2nd tower was hit. The
fact remains that the US was attack. The military did nothing (at least
nothing effective) to stop it. The "Commander in Chief" (again to the
best of my knowledge) issued NO orders to defend the country. He now
refuses to testify to the commission investigating the incident, and in
fact seems to be doing everything he can to impede the investigation.

There are a lot of websites supporting theories that he knew in advance.
I don't subscribe to this, but there ARE a lot of conflicting reports
as to his actions, and many unanswered questions.

Whatever happened to "The buck stops here"?

Very simple logic
1) Country was attack
2) Defense caught unprepared
3) Commander in Chief takes the blame

John H wrote:
On Thu, 04 Mar 2004 21:33:11 -0500, Jim wrote:


And in all cases radio contact with the planes was turned off.
Passengers with cell phones were talking from the PA plane and
describing what was happening. The FAA ordered ALL planes grounded --
these 4 did not respond. IT doesn't take a genius.

John H wrote:

On Thu, 04 Mar 2004 12:50:31 -0500, Jim wrote:



John H wrote:


Bush did a superb job of providing leadership to the country during a
time when panic could have reigned supreme.



Ummm -- seems to me that The president and VP ran and hid while this was
going on. There was something like 20 min between tower 1 and tower 2
being hit. It was over an hour before the Pentagon was hit, yet no air
defense was prepared. The plane that went down in PA was tracked for
some time, yet not taken out

All in all I'd say the presidents' actions on 9/11 are nothing to brag about


Jim, we had not normally been keeping an air defense battery around
the twin towers or the Pentagon. The closest air defense we had was at
Fort Belvoir, VA. That's about an hour from the Pentagon on a good
day, assuming the troops were loaded and ready to go.

We had not been keeping F-16's on the ready rack at Andrews AFB
either.

Have you ever landed at National Airport in Washington, D,C.? When
landing from the north, planes fly directly above the Potomac River
until they hit the runway. This means they pass within a few blocks of
the Pentagon. The warning time would have been about 4 seconds from
the time a plane left the normal flight path.

It's okay to hate Bush, but try to exercise some reason!

John H

On the 'Poco Loco' out of Deale, MD
on the beautiful Chesapeake Bay!


Are you implying that the FAA ordered all planes grounded before the
incidents occurred?

John H

On the 'Poco Loco' out of Deale, MD
on the beautiful Chesapeake Bay!

"John H" wrote in message
...


That could have been possible, but no one had knowledge of anything
going on until after the first tower was hit. Even then the incident
was being described as an accident. Only after the second tower was
hit was a "purposeful" connection made.

Even after just ONE hit, it should've looked fishy. Anything's possible, but
the whole neighborhood's surrounded by open water. Any normal pilot would've
tried very hard to hit water in such a situation. Oh well. Hindsight blah
blah blah.....