Steve wrote:
It looks like I'll be looking for and hopefully attending a reasonably
priced course, rather than trying to blag a 40hp again or putting up
with a 25hp.


Steve. Might I suggest that you consider a Dayskipper Power Shorebased
course, plus the practical. With it you will automatically get an ICC, but
it goes into great depth (pardon the punn) on passage planning, weather
conditions, Safety of Life at Sea, and emergency actions.

If you look around (I've found local colleges a good cheap source) you can
get a Dayskipper Classroom for around £100, The practical is generally
morem but gets you 5 days (2 weekends) away on the water, so it's really a
jollyday with a certificate.

This route requires more outlay (both financially and in terms of
commitment) from the student, however I liken it to doing a motorcycle CBT
compared to a Full License. I wouldn't have dreamt of jumping on my
1200cc bike having gained my riding experience on a 125 scooter, by the
same token, I wasn't prepared to take out a 36' Benneteau, with only 12
months inshore Wayfarer sailing. (Though a 'wayfarer' adventure is still an
adventure!!!)

Personally, having done the dayskip, and compared it to the 'silly bus' of
the powerboat ICC (I see it weekly at my local dinghy club), I can honestly
say I would actively support a raising of the required standard to this.
(probably make a lot of enemies in the proccess though!)

I'm not one to patronise, (believe me, I like to cut corners.) but I feel a
lot more equipped to deal with situations that may arrise, and a lot more
cautious and aware of the possible hazards, both in weather and surface
conditions and technically in a boat.

Even if you just want to do the ICC practical, a shorebased dayskipper would
in my opinion, still be highly recommended!

Probably not what you wanted to here, but only an opinion!

--
The keelworm sticketh, the sander scrapeth away!
www.love2sail.co.uk - uk coastal sailing forums
---------------------------------------------------------------------
Q?: Would antifouling solve the problem caused by cats in my back yard?

BrianH wrote:
Then I can only propose you spend some time on the Croatian side of your
bit of water - I've been sailing my yacht there for over 20 years and the
Bora is a wind to respect. It *often* arrives without warning, although
sometimes there are maritime reports that conditions are such that one
could be expected; not always correct. It hits like a sledgehammer and in
ten minutes
can be storm force. I've been at anchor and been suddenly well heeled
over from mast windage alone, until the boat settles downwind to the
anchor. The conditions that produce this NNE wind are probably associated
with the steep coastal mountains. For some details see:
http://www.cig.ensmp.fr/~iahs/sappor.../015776-1.html

SNIP

Brian,

I'm intrigued by your information on the Bora winds. I have just organised
a charter from Hvar, and plan to take in destinations around the central
Dalmatian islands. I had red about the Bora, and it's effects, but all the
text i'd read seemed to be a little 'Tourist Friendlied' compared to your
post.

I lke an exciting sail as much as the next man, but with my limited
experience, (Dayskipper, 500+ miles 30+ night hours, solent greece), I'm
wondering if Croatia was a sensible move. Can you recommend any good
sourceds of information sailing in croatia, and any advice on dealing
with potential freekish weather fronts (if indeed they are likely in
August).

Also, can you suggest any recommended reading/harbour guides for the areas
in question. (I found Rod Heikels typically touristy Greek Islands guide
indespensible).

Regards.

Phil


The keelworm sticketh, the sander scrapeth away!
www.love2sail.co.uk - uk coastal sailing forums
---------------------------------------------------------------------
ALTERNATIVE SAILING TERMS:
Fix:
1. The estimated position of a boat.
2. The true position a boat and its crew in are in most of the time.

BrianH wrote:
Then I can only propose you spend some time on the Croatian side of your
bit of water - I've been sailing my yacht there for over 20 years and the
Bora is a wind to respect. It *often* arrives without warning, although
sometimes there are maritime reports that conditions are such that one
could be expected; not always correct. It hits like a sledgehammer and in
ten minutes
can be storm force. I've been at anchor and been suddenly well heeled
over from mast windage alone, until the boat settles downwind to the
anchor. The conditions that produce this NNE wind are probably associated
with the steep coastal mountains. For some details see:
http://www.cig.ensmp.fr/~iahs/sappor.../015776-1.html

SNIP

Brian,

I'm intrigued by your information on the Bora winds. I have just organised
a charter from Hvar, and plan to take in destinations around the central
Dalmatian islands. I had red about the Bora, and it's effects, but all the
text i'd read seemed to be a little 'Tourist Friendlied' compared to your
post.

I lke an exciting sail as much as the next man, but with my limited
experience, (Dayskipper, 500+ miles 30+ night hours, solent greece), I'm
wondering if Croatia was a sensible move. Can you recommend any good
sourceds of information sailing in croatia, and any advice on dealing
with potential freekish weather fronts (if indeed they are likely in
August).

Also, can you suggest any recommended reading/harbour guides for the areas
in question. (I found Rod Heikels typically touristy Greek Islands guide
indespensible).

Regards.

Phil


The keelworm sticketh, the sander scrapeth away!
www.love2sail.co.uk - uk coastal sailing forums
---------------------------------------------------------------------
ALTERNATIVE SAILING TERMS:
Fix:
1. The estimated position of a boat.
2. The true position a boat and its crew in are in most of the time.

"JimB" writes:

I'm quite prepared to believe that Steve may have experienced a
weather change that frightened him immensely. I suspect the swell
may have been building up beforehand, but perhaps it's
significance hadn't registered. I think also the swell height was
exaggerated - it just doesn't build up from nothing to more than
2 metres within less than half an hour - unless you've popped
around a sheltering headland by mistake.

He said he was heading back into a lee shore in order to return to the
place from which he'd started. I agree that the sea isn't likely to pile
up that quick in open water but close in shore there may have been a
very vicious sea very quickly - which is why he shouldn't have closed
a lee shore in those circumstances.

And also, in a small boat, especially if you don't have much
experience, it's quite hard to judge the height of a sea - it can look
very intimidating.

So, though this discussion is interesting, I think it's a red
herring concerning licencing.

Well, I don't think it is. It's not a license he wants, it's a
'Certificate of _Competence_', and competence is exactly what he
needs. Of course a piece of paper won't give him competence, but a
good course may help in giving him competence.

--
(Simon Brooke) http://www.jasmine.org.uk/~simon/

;; 99% of browsers can't run ActiveX controls. Unfortunately
;; 99% of users are using the 1% of browsers that can...
[seen on /. 08:04:02]

"JimB" writes:

I'm quite prepared to believe that Steve may have experienced a
weather change that frightened him immensely. I suspect the swell
may have been building up beforehand, but perhaps it's
significance hadn't registered. I think also the swell height was
exaggerated - it just doesn't build up from nothing to more than
2 metres within less than half an hour - unless you've popped
around a sheltering headland by mistake.

He said he was heading back into a lee shore in order to return to the
place from which he'd started. I agree that the sea isn't likely to pile
up that quick in open water but close in shore there may have been a
very vicious sea very quickly - which is why he shouldn't have closed
a lee shore in those circumstances.

And also, in a small boat, especially if you don't have much
experience, it's quite hard to judge the height of a sea - it can look
very intimidating.

So, though this discussion is interesting, I think it's a red
herring concerning licencing.

Well, I don't think it is. It's not a license he wants, it's a
'Certificate of _Competence_', and competence is exactly what he
needs. Of course a piece of paper won't give him competence, but a
good course may help in giving him competence.

--
(Simon Brooke) http://www.jasmine.org.uk/~simon/

;; 99% of browsers can't run ActiveX controls. Unfortunately
;; 99% of users are using the 1% of browsers that can...
[seen on /. 08:04:02]

On Thu, 19 Feb 2004 02:30:50 GMT, Brian Whatcott
wrote:

On Wed, 18 Feb 2004 21:48:09 +0000, Steve wrote:
///
I've yet to meet anyone who's been pulled over by cops while on a
boat.


I was stopped, as they wanted to see my permit for VHF radio (which we
of course had

Mika

On Thu, 19 Feb 2004 02:30:50 GMT, Brian Whatcott
wrote:

On Wed, 18 Feb 2004 21:48:09 +0000, Steve wrote:
///
I've yet to meet anyone who's been pulled over by cops while on a
boat.


I was stopped, as they wanted to see my permit for VHF radio (which we
of course had

Mika

"Mika" wrote in message
...
On Thu, 19 Feb 2004 02:30:50 GMT, Brian Whatcott
wrote:

On Wed, 18 Feb 2004 21:48:09 +0000, Steve wrote:
///
I've yet to meet anyone who's been pulled over by cops while on a
boat.


I was stopped, as they wanted to see my permit for VHF radio (which we
of course had

Mika

A quick de-lurk to say that both the Canadian Coastguard and the Surete du
Quebec (the provincial police) patrol rivers and lakes here (once the ice
has gone out). They can and do pull boats over for safety checks (e.g.
enough life jackets for the number of bodies aboard) and to check on alcohol
consumption.

Glad I found this ng. It's full of good stuff. Thanks for sharing your
knowledge.

Cheers, Sage

"Mika" wrote in message
...
On Thu, 19 Feb 2004 02:30:50 GMT, Brian Whatcott
wrote:

On Wed, 18 Feb 2004 21:48:09 +0000, Steve wrote:
///
I've yet to meet anyone who's been pulled over by cops while on a
boat.


I was stopped, as they wanted to see my permit for VHF radio (which we
of course had

Mika

A quick de-lurk to say that both the Canadian Coastguard and the Surete du
Quebec (the provincial police) patrol rivers and lakes here (once the ice
has gone out). They can and do pull boats over for safety checks (e.g.
enough life jackets for the number of bodies aboard) and to check on alcohol
consumption.

Glad I found this ng. It's full of good stuff. Thanks for sharing your
knowledge.

Cheers, Sage

A quick de-lurk to say that both the Canadian Coastguard and the Surete du
Quebec (the provincial police) patrol rivers and lakes here (once the ice
has gone out). They can and do pull boats over for safety checks (e.g.
enough life jackets for the number of bodies aboard) and to check on
alcohol
consumption.

Blimey, a police state - so much for being 'free'!

Here in our harbours I've only ever known the local harbour conservancy to
book people for speeding - I've never known licence or lifejacket checks, or
anyone having problems (with the authorities) due to alcohol consumption.

Think I'll stay here in the UK!

Adam H