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Default What's your (entirely subjective) Favorite Offshore Cruising boatfrom 35 to 45'?

On Dec 22, 12:20*am, izibizi wrote:
On Dec 22, 4:10 am, kupono wrote:

I'm looking to compile a list of favorite cruising boats based upon
your completely subjective opinions. Eddy and Duff's criteria might be
a useful guide, but don't feel constrained *by it.


* * 1. She must be easy to handle.
* * 2. She must be comfortable.
* * 3. She must be seaworthy.
* * 4. She must be fast.
* * 5. She must be beautiful.


Please qualify your choices with fully founded, and no doubt, highly
subjective arguments based on well thought out personal opinion (and
hopefully experience).


Let the opionions fly.


1. how much u want to spend, the worlds largest freighter is handled
by 13 men only, most of them for cleaning and cooking, automatisation
is the world, it costs

2. how old are u? a mans age in feet boat length is an old rule of
thumb, still comfort levels are something personal, fakirs have a
different lifestyle compared to a princess on a pea.

3. some swear on iron or lead ducks, a hole and they sink, but if they
return after a capsize, they are mostly upright, I believe in
Catamarans, they might end up upside down, and this is how the are
sometimes found, sunken monohulls are mostly not found any more. Both
varieties have seaworthy and less seaworthy examples

4. well, then look into a modern trimaran and do not expect any
comfort, not even paint on the carbon hull. maybe a bucket as toilet.
I went for a balsa/honeycomb cat, 43' 8800lb plus payload 1000sqft
upwind sail

5. well, if all women like the same guy, what will all others do? for
some a tank is beautiful, some love soft lines, some baroque ones ;-)

my last cat was a shangri-la-nova 47', German designer Nissen with
help of a guy (Pieske) cruising around the world for 15 years,
homebuilt but so beautiful someone forced me to sell, even when it was
ten years old, better he would have stolen it, then the insurance
would have paid more. **** happens.

Now after ten years owning a cat I know what I liked, basically the
same, it was a perfect design, just a little heavy, but rock solid.
This one is smaller, much lighter, just fits like a tight jeans, 43'
Schionning design. for me the Australians have some of the best cat
designers when it comes to pleasing lines (Grainger, Lidgaard,
Spirited Design), there might be other good designers too, but I did
not like how the yachts look like.

You write CRUISING, means you spend most of the time at anchorages,
occasionally a passage, living on board. Nothing beats a well designed
Catamaran for that. no rolling, no gimbaled stove, at anchor peaceful,
yes, uphill sometimes noisy, but that is no long fun on a mono either,
but on a cat you still cook when on a mono you secure everything. And
in a marine you live first floor and not in the basement.

My opinion....


This thread is about you, not me. I want your opinions. Mine suck. I
couldn't afford a boat the length of my age anyway. I do like multi-
hulls though.
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Default What's your (entirely subjective) Favorite Offshore Cruising boatfrom 35 to 45'?

On Dec 21, 12:10 pm, kupono wrote:
I'm looking to compile a list of favorite cruising boats based upon
your completely subjective opinions. Eddy and Duff's criteria might be
a useful guide, but don't feel constrained by it.

1. She must be easy to handle.
2. She must be comfortable.
3. She must be seaworthy.
4. She must be fast.
5. She must be beautiful.

Please qualify your choices with fully founded, and no doubt, highly
subjective arguments based on well thought out personal opinion (and
hopefully experience).

Let the opionions fly.



While I like my Crown 28, and feel it's "offshore-capable", my Dream
Boat is a Sceptre 43. Fast, comfortable, all the amenities (including
a wine-cellar)... Only about $300-$400K depending on options...

druid
http://www.bcboatnet.org
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Default What's your (entirely subjective) Favorite Offshore Cruising boatfrom 35 to 45'?

kupono wrote:
I'm looking to compile a list of favorite cruising boats based upon
your completely subjective opinions. Eddy and Duff's criteria might be
a useful guide, but don't feel constrained by it.

1. She must be easy to handle.
2. She must be comfortable.
3. She must be seaworthy.
4. She must be fast.
5. She must be beautiful.

Please qualify your choices with fully founded, and no doubt, highly
subjective arguments based on well thought out personal opinion (and
hopefully experience).

Let the opionions fly.


Some years ago I posted a copy of Edey & Duff's essay here. Still
worth consideration IMHO... their Stone Horse is a lovely boat but
it's a bit small for most people to consider for more than weekending.

My favorite cruiser is our 36' tugboat, in which my wife & I are
currently cruising the Great Loop... not the same as crossing an ocean
and this would not be the boat for that. However we are very
comfortable, certainly easy to handle (and another consideration along
those lines is "easy to maintain"), not fast but OTOH we get there.
Beautiful? Well, I find the Winnie W's looks pleasant and we
occasionally get compliments...
http://sports.webshots.com/album/550708407IeSjaU

"Seaworthiness" is also rather subjective... our boat is not built for
battling rough weather, and so it's primary "seaworthiness"
characteristic is the skipper's ability to hear weather forecasts. In
eight months (over 5,000 miles) of full time cruising we've had
weather that was difficult only 5 times, and all five of those were
due to being in a hurry and setting off with a marginal (or in one
case, just plain bad) forecasts.... at the time we were willing to
take the hit and we would not set out at all with more than a slight
risk of real danger...

One factor that is very important, but rarely discussed (at least,
that I've seen) is the cruiser's radius of action. How long can you go
out, in either miles or in time, and stay in your desired cruising
area? For a powerboat, that is heavily dependent on fuel capacity &
efficiency. For sailboats & powerboats alike, other considerations are
draft, ground tackle, stores, water capacity, holding tank
capacity.... then lesser items like "can you dry towels aboard without
turning the cabin into a swamp."

A really marvelous way to cruise, and my family did this for years....
get a trailerable racing class boat, go to regattas and either camp or
stay with friends. You get to sail a lot of different places, and
learn a lot of good skills too. Sort of like touring on land in a
sports car & staying in hotels, instead of buying an RV!

Fresh Breezes- Doug King

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Default What's your (entirely subjective) Favorite Offshore Cruising boat from 35 to 45'?

On Thu, 27 Dec 2007 16:30:27 -0800 (PST), wrote:

kupono wrote:
I'm looking to compile a list of favorite cruising boats based upon
your completely subjective opinions. Eddy and Duff's criteria might be
a useful guide, but don't feel constrained by it.

1. She must be easy to handle.
2. She must be comfortable.
3. She must be seaworthy.
4. She must be fast.
5. She must be beautiful.

Please qualify your choices with fully founded, and no doubt, highly
subjective arguments based on well thought out personal opinion (and
hopefully experience).

Let the opionions fly.


Some years ago I posted a copy of Edey & Duff's essay here. Still
worth consideration IMHO... their Stone Horse is a lovely boat but
it's a bit small for most people to consider for more than weekending.

My favorite cruiser is our 36' tugboat, in which my wife & I are
currently cruising the Great Loop...


Good points in favor of considering a fuel efficient powerboat. The
original poster did not specify power or sail but there is a cultural
bias towards sail in this forum. That said, after 11,000 nautical
miles of experience we are very happy with cruising our Grand Banks
trawler, as are many other people. It has at least twice the interior
volume of a comparable sailboat, a great deal of system redundancy not
found in most sail boats, is faster than any sailboat we have ever
owned, invariably gets compliments on appearance, carries enough fuel
and water to be totally self sufficient for several months if
necessary, very comfortable, and easily handled with one or two
people. Something to consider if you are not intent on crossing
oceans, although there are cruising trawlers that will do that also.

Some pictures he

Boat, Dock, Tiki hut, etc. -

http://share.shutterfly.com/action/w...AaOGTlo0Zt2LlI

Abacos Cruise -

http://share.shutterfly.com/action/w...AaOGTlo0Zt2LjQ


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Default What's your (entirely subjective) Favorite Offshore Cruising boat from 35 to 45'?


"druid" wrote in message
...
While I like my Crown 28, and feel it's "offshore-capable", my Dream
Boat is a Sceptre 43. Fast, comfortable, all the amenities (including
a wine-cellar)... Only about $300-$400K depending on options...

druid
http://www.bcboatnet.org


Since you are talking dollars I assume you are in USA. Why would anyone in
USA pay $300/400 for a boat of that size when the used market in USA is
running at a level where the prices for really nice boats are ridiculously
cheap by European standards? Ok, if money is no object but that does not
apply to most people.




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Default What's your (entirely subjective) Favorite Offshore Cruising boatfrom 35 to 45'?

Consider just about any design by Robert H. Perry, or other reknown
offshore designer: Tayana, Valiant, Baba, Tashiba, Panda, etc.

* * 1. She must be easy to handle.

Most Perry boats are full 'buttocked' so that the stern dosnt squat
and have a lot or reserve buoyancy, etc., have reasonable stability,
are 'seakindly' - slow rolling, less pitching, etc. etc. Easy to
handle depends 95% on how the individual owner sets up all the sailing
hardware, etc. You must be aware that long distance cruising boats
and racing boats are purposely designed for their venues --- the
differences would be equal to the comparison of a stable 747 versus a
totally unstable fighter jet.
Easy to handle means many different things. Most blue water design
boats are known for 'tracking ability', not for turning on a dime
inside a marina fairway, etc. I'd favor a split underbody with the
rudder at the very far end of the stern over a modified-full keel.
* * 2. She must be comfortable.

Seakindliness or dockside entertaining .... look at the stabilitiy
ratios, roll periods, etc. etc.
* * 3. She must be seaworthy.

Simply look for a mechanical/structural 'factor of safety' of about
4:1 for any offshore boat. Once you get down to the final-cut of
selection, join the various email, etc. 'owners groups' and ask about
their dirty underwear.
Most of the above listed are proven blue water boats. Seaworthy
depends a LOT on the skill/knowledge of the skipper.
* * 4. She must be fast.

Most of those above within your length criteria will vary from 135 to
170 PHRF .... of course these are mostly cutter rigged (true cutters
and sloops with added staysails) so you have to *really* already know
how to shape and trim for fast sailing as cutters are not easily
sailed with just a 'sloop' mentality. Fast also depends on water line
length and bow shape (how it performs in waves, etc. based on the
bow's 'half angle', etc.)
* * 5. She must be beautiful.

Perry is probably most reknown for his 'beautiful' shear lines,
etc.

If you're serious about such a boat, suggest you make your preliminary
selection 'cuts' then contract one of the major designers for
'consulting services' to aid in the end-game of your selection,
especially when you close down on the final few; and, especially when
you are thinking about contracting with a surveyor - thats when such
consulting services will pay off in spades - as the designer will have
all the history of what worked and what didnt, whats lasted the test
of time and what needs to be replaced or upgraded, etc. based on the
age or when the boat was built during the production series. They are
usually 'most critical' with their own designs. Such can save you a
lot of $, heartache and selecting the wrong boat for your exact
needs. You might want to review first several books of "boat design
criteria" as would be published by the various 'designers', etc. to
help in "what" type of boat you want. Amazon, and many of the various
marine-booksellers, etc. has them.
'
hope this helps
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Default What's your (entirely subjective) Favorite Offshore Cruising boatfrom 35 to 45'?

http://sports.webshots.com/album/550708407IeSjaU

WaIIy wrote:
You have a fine boat.

Your thruster project was quite ambitious and there aren't many that
would attempt to make a hole like that in their boat.

Excellent job on that.


Thank you (blush).

One reason why I was willing to saw a big hole in the boat is that
over the past 4 decades, I spent more time & money fixing up old
beater racing-class sailboats to be competitive... including a lot of
fiberglass work making them lighter & stiffer... so I was fairly
confident that at the very worst, I could just fiberglass the hole
shut again.




Wayne.B wrote:
Good points in favor of considering a fuel efficient powerboat. The
original poster did not specify power or sail but there is a cultural
bias towards sail in this forum.


Oh yes!
However some of the other biases have loosened up over the years... I
don't have the time to be as active as I was a few years ago, but it
looks to me like the Crab-Crusher Mafia has lost a lot of their
traction.

One of the "issues" regarding powerboat cruising is that relatively
few people look carefully at the trade-off between speed & fuel
efficiency. Speed is great, we often wish we could make shorter time
of some of the less-pleasant transits; however a lot of fellow Great
Loopers are burning more than 3X the fuel we are, and have to stop
every couple of days to tank up. We go several weeks between fill-
ups!

That said, after 11,000 nautical
miles of experience we are very happy with cruising our Grand Banks
trawler, as are many other people. It has at least twice the interior
volume of a comparable sailboat, a great deal of system redundancy not
found in most sail boats, is faster than any sailboat we have ever
owned, invariably gets compliments on appearance, carries enough fuel
and water to be totally self sufficient for several months if
necessary, very comfortable, and easily handled with one or two
people. Something to consider if you are not intent on crossing
oceans, although there are cruising trawlers that will do that also.


Yep, and even with fuel prices rising, more people are going on power
cruising rallies & flotillas so that many of the challenges are easier
(less intimidating).

Some pictures he

Boat, Dock, Tiki hut, etc. -

http://share.shutterfly.com/action/w...AaOGTlo0Zt2LlI

Abacos Cruise -

http://share.shutterfly.com/action/w...AaOGTlo0Zt2LjQ


We checked out the dolphin video... awesome!

BTW I would also like to give Wayne B. and his good wife a public
"thank you" for ensuring we had a great time when we cruised thru
their home town.

DSK

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Default What's your (entirely subjective) Favorite Offshore Cruising boat from 35 to 45'?

On Sat, 29 Dec 2007 16:06:58 -0800 (PST), wrote:

BTW I would also like to give Wayne B. and his good wife a public
"thank you" for ensuring we had a great time when we cruised thru
their home town.


You are quite welcome of course. We consider SWFL a wonderful
cruising area this time of year and are always happy to show it off.

Are you back to NC yet?

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Default What's your (entirely subjective) Favorite Offshore Cruising boatfrom 35 to 45'?

On Dec 28, 6:40 am, "Edgar" wrote:
"druid" wrote in message

...
While I like my Crown 28, and feel it's "offshore-capable", my Dream


Boat is a Sceptre 43. Fast, comfortable, all the amenities (including
a wine-cellar)... Only about $300-$400K depending on options...


druid
http://www.bcboatnet.org


Since you are talking dollars I assume you are in USA. Why would anyone in
USA pay $300/400 for a boat of that size when the used market in USA is
running at a level where the prices for really nice boats are ridiculously
cheap by European standards? Ok, if money is no object but that does not
apply to most people.


Nope - Canada. There are more countries in the world than the US that
use "dollars" for currency (Can and Aus, for two...).
The Sceptre is built in Richmond, BC, so there aren't many in the
eastern US, where the "bargains" are. Ya gets what ya pays for...

I looked at buying an Islander 28 in Calif and shipping it up - I
ended up buying a Crown 28, which I think is a better boat anyway (and
again: built in North Van, so there aren't many in the US). So buying
a boat in the US isn't what it's cracked up to be...

druid
http://www.bcboatnet.org
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