"Vic Smith" wrote in message
...
Skip, you're apparently having fun and learning while you get your
boat shipshape. But it seems to me there is something fundamentally
wrong about your approach to your boat's mech/electrical systems.
Whether the installations were wrong from the get-go, or the product
of piecemealing mismatched components, or of using low quality
components, or you mucking up with your own hands things you don't
have the knowledge to deal with, I don't know.
If it were me I would get better advice on what works best and use it.
There are always cost compromises for most of us, but boating -
especially cruising - should *not* be "fixing things in exotic places"
or whatever cuteism you care to use.
Scheduled maintenance, proper diagnostic gear to use for
troubleshooting, and occasional replacement of broken down parts
should be the goal for cruisers.
Sometimes reading cruiser logs remind me of tales - usually from the
very young - who pick up an '89 Chevy Cavalier in NY for $300 and
set off for California.
They might make the journey, but it is doubtful it will be much fun,
and it will probably end up costing more in repairs than if they had
just bit the bullet and splurged $500 on a '92 Chevy Corsica.
Of course being at sea has dangers beyond being stalled on a road.
I hope I'm not off base here, but I've never read so many accounts of
various breakdowns as I have from you, and I'm a bit concerned, since
I do wish you the best.

--Vic

Other than the grounding, it seems to me that the only "boat stopper"
they've experienced so far is the steering failure -- and even that was
fixable at sea from Skip's report, with emergency steering solutions
available (unknown whether they had the knowledge to employ any of them,
however).

The Flying Pig is clearly a boat with more equipment than I would choose to
go to sea with. I prefer simple systems that are easily repaired in the
event of failure. Tiller steering. No refer. Low power demands. Very limited
through-hulls. Porta-potti with "bucket and chuck-it" option at sea. But
horses for courses, as they say. Some claim that women demand high-comfort
heads with lots of beauty-parlor options. Guess I'm not that much of a
girly-girl.

Nevertheless, underway repairs and maintenance are pretty much expected. The
higher-tech the systems, the more repairs to be expected. And they *are* in
"shake-down" mode at this time.

Karin

"KLC Lewis" wrote in message
...
Other than the grounding, it seems to me that the only "boat stopper"
they've experienced so far is the steering failure -- and even that was
fixable at sea from Skip's report, with emergency steering solutions
available (unknown whether they had the knowledge to employ any of them,
however).

The Flying Pig is clearly a boat with more equipment than I would choose
to go to sea with. I prefer simple systems that are easily repaired in
the event of failure. Tiller steering. No refer. Low power demands. Very
limited through-hulls. Porta-potti with "bucket and chuck-it" option at
sea. But horses for courses, as they say. Some claim that women demand
high-comfort heads with lots of beauty-parlor options. Guess I'm not that
much of a girly-girl.

Nevertheless, underway repairs and maintenance are pretty much expected.
The higher-tech the systems, the more repairs to be expected. And they
*are* in "shake-down" mode at this time.

Karin


One additional comment:

Skip reported that TFP had experienced steering problems on a first attempt
to leave the dock. They returned to the dock, couldn't find or duplicate the
problem, so they left anyway. That, IMHO, was a mistake. If I experience a
critical system problem at the dock which I cannot troubleshoot on my own, I
don't leave until someone else with appropriate experience has located and
fixed the problem or shown me how to do it. I've missed out on some planned
sails because of this mindset, but it also means that I don't tend to have
many "adventures at sea." ;-)

Skip Gundlach wrote in
oups.com:

On Aug 5, 11:18 am, Geoff Schultz wrote:

I was referring to Skip's quote that "cruising is repairing boats in
exotic locations." By that definition and his being in the ICW, it's
not cruising.

-- Geoffwww.GeoffSchultz.org

HEY!! :{))

Aren't you the guy who took me to task for not going up the river from
Charleston???

L8R

Skip :{))

I believe that I suggested heading up the ICW to make miles when the
weather outside didn't cooperate. I don't think that I ever suggested
seeing it on the wrong end of a tow line! :-)

-- Geoff
www.GeoffSchultz.org

"KLC Lewis" wrote:


"KLC Lewis" wrote in message
...
Other than the grounding, it seems to me that the only "boat stopper"
they've experienced so far is the steering failure -- and even that was
fixable at sea from Skip's report, with emergency steering solutions
available (unknown whether they had the knowledge to employ any of them,
however).

The Flying Pig is clearly a boat with more equipment than I would choose
to go to sea with. I prefer simple systems that are easily repaired in
the event of failure. Tiller steering. No refer. Low power demands. Very
limited through-hulls. Porta-potti with "bucket and chuck-it" option at
sea. But horses for courses, as they say. Some claim that women demand
high-comfort heads with lots of beauty-parlor options. Guess I'm not that
much of a girly-girl.

I'm not either -- but I hate tiller steering. I can just about manage
a wheel.

I think on a passage (more than 36 hours offshore), I would want a
windvane rather than an autopilot, but we aren't going to do a passage
(at least there's no chance of that anymore), so we have and use the
autopilot which is more useful in near shore.

Our boat when we bought it had a refer, and it's nice to have. We
installed a radar, and Bob decided to have Lectrasans (it certainly
wasn't my idea, but I don't think I'd want a portapot either).

Nevertheless, underway repairs and maintenance are pretty much expected.
The higher-tech the systems, the more repairs to be expected. And they
*are* in "shake-down" mode at this time.

Karin

One additional comment:

Skip reported that TFP had experienced steering problems on a first attempt
to leave the dock. They returned to the dock, couldn't find or duplicate the
problem, so they left anyway. That, IMHO, was a mistake. If I experience a
critical system problem at the dock which I cannot troubleshoot on my own, I
don't leave until someone else with appropriate experience has located and
fixed the problem or shown me how to do it. I've missed out on some planned
sails because of this mindset, but it also means that I don't tend to have
many "adventures at sea." ;-)

I think this is - in general- a man's mindset. At least with us, the
only times we've really been in trouble is when Bob has wanted to
leave and I have not, and he's convinced me when I should have stood
my ground. I am, of course, not really a sailor - more of a
companion.

It is Bob's boat to fix. One of the reasons I was OK with his getting
a boat is that I knew that he loves to fix things.

One of the reasons that we aren't really cruising much anymore is
because we went aground the last time we came up the ICW in the middle
of the channel south of Wrightsville Beach (opposite Masonboro Inlet),
and Bob said it was too stressful to do the trip anymore.

Also of course we are getting older.

"Rosalie B." wrote in message
...
One of the reasons that we aren't really cruising much anymore is
because we went aground the last time we came up the ICW in the middle
of the channel south of Wrightsville Beach (opposite Masonboro Inlet),
and Bob said it was too stressful to do the trip anymore.

Also of course we are getting older.


You know what they say, Rosalie, "if you haven't gone aground it's because
you haven't sailed enough." I haven't gone aground yet (knock on wood) but
I've brushed the mud a time or two. Mostly this is because I'm exceptionally
paranoid about depth. If the chart (and my depth sounder) shows less than 20
feet I don't want to be there unless I'm anchoring.

"KLC Lewis" wrote:

"Rosalie B." wrote in message
.. .
One of the reasons that we aren't really cruising much anymore is
because we went aground the last time we came up the ICW in the middle
of the channel south of Wrightsville Beach (opposite Masonboro Inlet),
and Bob said it was too stressful to do the trip anymore.

Also of course we are getting older.


You know what they say, Rosalie, "if you haven't gone aground it's because
you haven't sailed enough." I haven't gone aground yet (knock on wood) but
I've brushed the mud a time or two. Mostly this is because I'm exceptionally
paranoid about depth. If the chart (and my depth sounder) shows less than 20
feet I don't want to be there unless I'm anchoring.

What got Bob's goat was that it was in the middle of the channel where
there should have been plenty of water and the depth sounder didn't
give us any warning. No one is more paranoid about depth than he is.

We have gone aground several times, and it was never a very happy
experience although not dire in the way Skip's was.

We tried to get into Queenstown once, and got blown out of the channel
by the wind and couldn't raise anyone on the radio or phone.
Eventually we kedged off - we almost lost the dinghy in doing that
because when we got up to the anchor, Bob went to get the dinghy from
where he'd tied it and it had untied itself and was being blown away.
Bob jumped for it, and made it with just one foot getting wet.

I had my daughter and SIL out in the Patuxent, and managed to run
aground under sail while tacking. It apparently gave my SIL great
satisfaction to say that his MIL had run aground.

The first time down the ICW, we tried to go out Brunswick inlet and
when I called to Bob that we were too close to the breakers he mistook
the side that he was too close to and steered us right into the surf
line. Took all the paint off the leading edge of the keel up about a
foot.

But we've actually had more problem with wind and current than with
meeting the bottom.

"Rosalie B." wrote in message
news
"KLC Lewis" wrote:

"Rosalie B." wrote in message
. ..
One of the reasons that we aren't really cruising much anymore is
because we went aground the last time we came up the ICW in the middle
of the channel south of Wrightsville Beach (opposite Masonboro Inlet),
and Bob said it was too stressful to do the trip anymore.

Also of course we are getting older.


You know what they say, Rosalie, "if you haven't gone aground it's because
you haven't sailed enough." I haven't gone aground yet (knock on wood) but
I've brushed the mud a time or two. Mostly this is because I'm
exceptionally
paranoid about depth. If the chart (and my depth sounder) shows less than
20
feet I don't want to be there unless I'm anchoring.

What got Bob's goat was that it was in the middle of the channel where
there should have been plenty of water and the depth sounder didn't
give us any warning. No one is more paranoid about depth than he is.

We have gone aground several times, and it was never a very happy
experience although not dire in the way Skip's was.

We tried to get into Queenstown once, and got blown out of the channel
by the wind and couldn't raise anyone on the radio or phone.
Eventually we kedged off - we almost lost the dinghy in doing that
because when we got up to the anchor, Bob went to get the dinghy from
where he'd tied it and it had untied itself and was being blown away.
Bob jumped for it, and made it with just one foot getting wet.

I had my daughter and SIL out in the Patuxent, and managed to run
aground under sail while tacking. It apparently gave my SIL great
satisfaction to say that his MIL had run aground.

The first time down the ICW, we tried to go out Brunswick inlet and
when I called to Bob that we were too close to the breakers he mistook
the side that he was too close to and steered us right into the surf
line. Took all the paint off the leading edge of the keel up about a
foot.

But we've actually had more problem with wind and current than with
meeting the bottom.


I haven't been in the ICW since 1979-80, but from what I've seen on the
charts things have only gotten worse. Channels narrowing and shoaling has to
make it quite an ordeal. I'm not sure that it's worth the hassle,
personally. If I were heading south, I would seriously consider doing it
offshore -- though as I remember the Gulf Stream, that raises a whole
'nother can o worms. Is harbor hopping down the coast possible, avoiding the
ICW? Weather and GS position permitting, of course.

"KLC Lewis" wrote in
et:


"Rosalie B." wrote in message
news
"KLC Lewis" wrote:

"Rosalie B." wrote in message
...
One of the reasons that we aren't really cruising much anymore is
because we went aground the last time we came up the ICW in the
middle of the channel south of Wrightsville Beach (opposite
Masonboro Inlet), and Bob said it was too stressful to do the trip
anymore.

Also of course we are getting older.


You know what they say, Rosalie, "if you haven't gone aground it's
because you haven't sailed enough." I haven't gone aground yet (knock
on wood) but I've brushed the mud a time or two. Mostly this is
because I'm exceptionally
paranoid about depth. If the chart (and my depth sounder) shows less
than 20
feet I don't want to be there unless I'm anchoring.

What got Bob's goat was that it was in the middle of the channel
where there should have been plenty of water and the depth sounder
didn't give us any warning. No one is more paranoid about depth than
he is.

We have gone aground several times, and it was never a very happy
experience although not dire in the way Skip's was.

We tried to get into Queenstown once, and got blown out of the
channel by the wind and couldn't raise anyone on the radio or phone.
Eventually we kedged off - we almost lost the dinghy in doing that
because when we got up to the anchor, Bob went to get the dinghy from
where he'd tied it and it had untied itself and was being blown away.
Bob jumped for it, and made it with just one foot getting wet.

I had my daughter and SIL out in the Patuxent, and managed to run
aground under sail while tacking. It apparently gave my SIL great
satisfaction to say that his MIL had run aground.

The first time down the ICW, we tried to go out Brunswick inlet and
when I called to Bob that we were too close to the breakers he
mistook the side that he was too close to and steered us right into
the surf line. Took all the paint off the leading edge of the keel
up about a foot.

But we've actually had more problem with wind and current than with
meeting the bottom.


I haven't been in the ICW since 1979-80, but from what I've seen on
the charts things have only gotten worse. Channels narrowing and
shoaling has to make it quite an ordeal. I'm not sure that it's worth
the hassle, personally. If I were heading south, I would seriously
consider doing it offshore -- though as I remember the Gulf Stream,
that raises a whole 'nother can o worms. Is harbor hopping down the
coast possible, avoiding the ICW? Weather and GS position permitting,
of course.

Simply get a book like Skipper Bob's Anchorages and read where the
shoaling is. You can get updates on-line. I annotate the book with the
updates and create warning symbols on the GPS course which warn me when
I'm heading into a area known to have problems. Following this
procedure I didn't have any issues this year, but I knew many people who
did and they were just following the R/Gs and didn't realize where the
shoaling was.

-- Geoff
www.GeoffSchultz.org

On 2007-08-05 19:25:52 -0400, "KLC Lewis" said:

You know what they say, Rosalie, "if you haven't gone aground it's because
you haven't sailed enough." I haven't gone aground yet (knock on wood) but
I've brushed the mud a time or two. Mostly this is because I'm exceptionally
paranoid about depth. If the chart (and my depth sounder) shows less than 20
feet I don't want to be there unless I'm anchoring.

Don't try to sail in the Chesapeake, then! I'm thrilled when I have
over 15 feet of depth!

Ruby

Geoff Schultz wrote:

Didn't Skipper Bob die? Most of the information I see now comes from
Claiborne Young

Simply get a book like Skipper Bob's Anchorages and read where the
shoaling is. You can get updates on-line. I annotate the book with the
updates and create warning symbols on the GPS course which warn me when
I'm heading into a area known to have problems. Following this
procedure I didn't have any issues this year, but I knew many people who
did and they were just following the R/Gs and didn't realize where the
shoaling was.

-- Geoff
www.GeoffSchultz.org

I have all the charts with notations (like the new buoys north of the
Alligator River bridge and the channel that is closed in Beaufort NC.)

But in this case, we'd been in Marathon all winter and hadn't seen
anything about this particular problem although the TBUS guy said that
a lot of people had run aground there.