Dave wrote in
:

One has to follow the money here. Can more grant money be shaken loose
for academia by arguing there's an imminent crises, or by arguing
there's the possibility of a distant crisis?


Or....no crisis at all, just normal operation of EARTH and SUN.

Larry
--
Alltel Axcess TV - 10 minutes of TV
then it dumps you until you click to
get 10 minutes more. It SUCKS!

ON the other hand ...........
Lets assume for the sake of argument that real non-politicallly
influenced and objective science can be the answer of whats going on;
and .........
1. The sun is producing more energy at this particular cycle (of the
Holocene interglacial epoch).
2. The eminating particles from the sun are increasingly striking the
earth and are creating more nuclei for cloud formation than during
other solar cycles.
3. The earth is warming due to increase solar output, and the heat is
being trapped by the increase of cloud cover.
4. Due to the increase insolation (sun and re-reflection) by clouds the
oceans are now warmer.
5. Carbon dioxide has LESS solubility in seawater when the water is
warmer: hence, higher atmospheric CO2. (All the current data shows
that the oceanic water temperature rise PRECEDES CO2 increase ....
simple chemistry of gas solubility in a liquid at work!! Atmospheric
CO2 FOLLOWS oceanic temperature rise.
Al Gore is (was) a politician and has absolutely NO scientific
credentials, yet an 'agenda'. .
Most of the 2500 scientists (UN / IPCC) reporting global warming due to
human caused CO2 .... their jobs depend on Global Warming, etc.
Objectivitiy???? This is simply all "great Satan Envy".

No thanks, I think Ill wait it out and without advocating squandering a
major portion of national treasure on something that is most plausibly
'entirely out of the control of arrogant mankind'.
Whats being proposed will have NO effect on global warming, other
'cycles' in the past have been warmer than now (and with higher
atmospheric CO2) .... This is the complimentary "nonsense" of the
1960s/70s when Global cooling and a new ICE AGE was immediately
inevitable. This nonsense will only stop when the 'feel-gooders' stop
or cease all advances of civilization, force the return to primitive
subsistance living (except for China and India) .... and all the poor
in the third world countries suffer even more because of our arrogant
insanity. This is simply anti-capitalism at its finest .... its so
'political' , so politically correct, etc. that noone wants to be
called the emperor with no clothes. Wait another 50 years, then you
can tell me I was right. :-)


In article , KLC Lewis
wrote:

Let's assume, for the sake of argument, that Al Gore's worst predictions are
snip
in order to reduce them, utterly redundant an unnecessary.

"Rich Hampel" wrote in message
...
ON the other hand ...........
Lets assume for the sake of argument that real non-politicallly
influenced and objective science can be the answer of whats going on;
and .........
1. The sun is producing more energy at this particular cycle (of the

big snip to make things easier to read

This is simply anti-capitalism at its finest .... its so
'political' , so politically correct, etc. that noone wants to be
called the emperor with no clothes.

So, warming is occurring, but there's discussion about the cause.

Post cause, there's an effect. There's (so far in this discussion) been an
assumption by many that the effect is 'disaster', therefore action is needed
to cool things down.

There will be change. The degree of change will be incertain. It will almost
certainly mean an increase in navigable waters (good news for sailors - lets
get back OT) and less space for landlubbers (tough if you haven't got a
boat; and tough for those who own sea level property, who will have to
depreciate their assets as the threat becomes more obvious). Hilltops may
become prime land for building. Farmers will not be 'wiped out', though
that's what will happen to those who don't adapt to growing different
crops - just part of normal economic change through bankruptcy. And so on.
Fur coats may even go out of fashion, replaced by more rainwear. Nudity may
spread (like obesity? Hmm. Hope not).

Darwinism works wonders . . . those who adapt to change will survive . . . .
people or businesses or governments.

That'll prepare us for the day when the galaxy starts to cool . . . . or a
volcanic island takes off into the stratosphere . . . . or that asteroid
smashes into the earth.

Don't resist change, go with the flow.

JimB
www.jimbaerselman.f2s.com/
Comparing (the nicer) European Cruise areas

"Larry" wrote in message
...
"KLC Lewis" wrote in
:

Is
there any reason to believe that CO2 will actually increase at his
projected rates?


None. Download the movie from ITN in UK called "The Great Global
Warming
Swindle" and see the overwhelming truth, from the scientists not the
people living off global warming terror.

The CO2 in the atmosphere has risen from 0.52% to 0.54% since the
industrial revolution.

Ha ahahhahahahahhahahahahah! Just where did you come up with those bogus
figures? The present percentage of CO2 in the atmosphere is .035%. Your
figures are off by a factor of about 18 times. Until such time as people
can at least get the facts straight how do expect anybody nuts to have
their way?

Read and learn:
http://www.globalchange.umich.edu/gl...olution%5Fatm/

Wilbur Hubbard

On Wed, 28 Mar 2007 01:41:22 +0000, Larry wrote:

"KLC Lewis" wrote in
:

Is
there any reason to believe that CO2 will actually increase at his
projected rates?


None. Download the movie from ITN in UK called "The Great Global Warming
Swindle" and see the overwhelming truth, from the scientists not the
people living off global warming terror.


Total crap.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisf...032575,00.html
http://www.jri.org.uk/index.php?opti...37&Item id=83
http://community.channel4.com/groupe...m/f/9250037634


The CO2 in the atmosphere has risen from 0.52% to 0.54% since the
industrial revolution.

********!
http://www.metoffice.gov.uk/corporat...ths/index.html

The most interesting graphics on the movie is when one of the professors,
I forget which one, overlays the CO2 in the air with the temperature over
the last X thousand years. When the temperature rises, CO2 in the air
rises AFTERWARDS, not before. When the temperature falls, CO2 in the air
falls AFTERWARDS, not before. This is caused by the oceans. As the top
levels of the oceans warm with the air, the ocean animals rapidly
multiply, filling the ocean with CO2, which the oceans' massive surfaces
transfer into the air. When the oceans cool, as the planet cools, the
opposite happens. This has been going on for millions of years.....not
since man invented the 427 Chevy with dual exhausts and 6 carbs.

Global warming, as you'll see from the Earth's many records in the
movie...is caused by the SUN,

In the past, yes. The release of CO2 privides positive feedback.

that big thermonuclear bomb that's quite
close, by astronomical standards, to the Earth. CO2 FOLLOWS its warming
and cooling...not causes it!

Of course, without "global warming" there is no "global warming
government spending/grants" and all the trappings of $$$$ that goes with
it. Once The Beast is convinced of something, The Beast throws billions
at it, creating its own vacuum to consume everything The Beast throws at
it.

Oh, and HIV doesn't cause AIDS, either. HIV is an ancient virus humans
have been passing on to each other for thousands of years. ALL AIDS
patients don't have HIV, just some of them. ALL HIV carriers don't get
AIDS, either, only a small percentage of them. So, HIV can't cause AIDS.
But, just like Global Warming, we have this HIV/AIDS industry that
DEPENDS on The Beast pouring money into it, so it doesn't matter whether
HIV causes AIDS or not...as long as The Beast thinks it does...the money
will flow, ad nauseum, for decades.

Can we afford to find a cure for Cancer? Heart Diseases? Common Cold?
or any of the other massive moneymakers that buy fancy cars, yachts,
jets, beachfront mansions for doctors? What? Are you CRAZY?!! Anyone
who finds a cure is DEAD MEAT!


Larry

Oh ...and you are an ass.

My, my. A little hot under the collar are we?

nope thats why i re read my post and asked you to insert "being"
before an.

GW discussions dont make me hot under the coller; i reserve that for
old southern californians moving to oregon and trying to change the
laws.

GW is just a thing that needs to be delt with. I have no illusions
that most of the population is going to ignore the problem untill it
affects them.

I just figure sailors who live by the sea would be a bit more ready to
read the current research because it has a real effect on our
decisions (when and where we sail) and our insurances. (dont know
about sport sailors but ships are getting hit a little harder these
days)
this subject intrests me because i think sailors will look at current
research and give it a closer look than our Respective parties and
politics. However this depends on actually reading the work and not
getting the snooze from CNN.

in my career, i have seen a change in the waters i would be sailing at
different times of the year.
breakup in Dead Horse is now the middle of june and not mid july.
Africa is spitting tropical storms into the carib a little more often
than ten years ago. it affects how i plan a trip and how i navigate.
Even ships have limits and in some storms.
The tuna are getting closer and closer to shore here in oregon every
year and, early. the tuna fleet is already on its way up from the
south seas and its only march.

Folks do point out darwinianin selection but seem to forget that the
only reason GW is of concern is humans. the flora and fauna will live
on.

"Two meter troll" wrote in message
oups.com...

in my career, i have seen a change in the waters i would be sailing at
different times of the year.
breakup in Dead Horse is now the middle of june and not mid july.
Africa is spitting tropical storms into the carib a little more often
than ten years ago. it affects how i plan a trip and how i navigate.
Even ships have limits and in some storms.
The tuna are getting closer and closer to shore here in oregon every
year and, early. the tuna fleet is already on its way up from the
south seas and its only march.

Folks do point out darwinianin selection but seem to forget that the
only reason GW is of concern is humans. the flora and fauna will live
on.


You are aware that hurricanes tend to run in ten-year cycles, and that we
are currently in the last few of years of a "high" period? And that,
technically speaking, humans are also "fauna"?

You are aware that hurricanes tend to run in ten-year cycles, and that we
are currently in the last few of years of a "high" period? And that,
technically speaking, humans are also "fauna"?



yep; on the hurricane cycle, also global wobbel, shrinking ice caps on
mars and most of the other stuff folks like to defend one point or
another with.


The exclusion of humans from fauna was deliberate so I would not have
folks arguing evolution at me.

This is why provided search links to ALL of the data.

Dave... yes I suppose i am a "greenie" at that. I just researched the
research instead of listening to Chomski or Rush.

Faith in politics much like faith in nav aids is a good way to die.

In article ,
Dave wrote:
On 28 Mar 2007 13:09:05 -0700, "Two meter troll" said:

I suppose i am a "greenie" at that

Says it all. Attacking a religious faith would be pointless and probably
counterproductive.

But Dave, you're so good at it!


--
Capt. JG @@
www.sailnow.com

But Dave, you're so good at it!

--
Capt. JG



LOL