wrote:

I have been drawn to the idea of buying a boat, because of the
independant lifestyle it brings. Here are some rather ignorant
questions, and I would be very grateful to anyone who takes a few
minutes to answer one or all of them:

a) How big a boat is required to go from New York to England (about
3750nm)?

As big as you can afford and small enough that you can single hand it.
The kind of boat (how well built and how well equipped) is more
important than the size, and the person sailing it is the most
important thing in the equation

b) If I wanted to learn more about boating, is there a book available
by someone who captures what it is like to be at sea, and describes
the pros and cons of boat life?

I think the best book I've read on this is "Voyaging On A Small
Income" by Annie Hill. It is in paperback. The danger with this
book is that you will immediately want a junk rigged boat.

Lin Pardey has written a lot of books on the pros and cons of boat
life, but the disadvantage of those books is that they advocate a
wooden boat with no engine, and that isn't really what most people can
deal with.

You could also read these logs
http://www.thetwocaptains.com/logbook.htm These logs give a really
good idea of how it is to sail to tropical places. However, I should
add that both of these people have their captains licenses (that's why
it is called "The Two Captains", so they are more than ordinarily
competent sailors. Don was a pilot (airplane), and Gwen chartered her
own boat in the USVI for a number of years and also is a SCUBA
instructor. She's also writing a column for several magazines ATM
which are also on her website.

c) Do any of you live on your boats?

Yes

d) Why does the value of boats fall off so fast? Some new boats seem
to loose half their value in five years.

Because people are stupid enough to buy a new boat which costs a lot
of money. Same as with cars.

d) Why does the value of boats fall off so fast? Some new boats seem
to loose half their value in five years.

Because people are stupid enough to buy a new boat which costs a lot
of money. Same as with cars.

Not all boats lose that much. In 1989, an Island Packet 31 listed at
under $78,000. Today there is a 1989 on Yacht World for $74,000 and this
is typical for IPs. Of course if you count inflation--
Still not bad for an 18 year old boat.
Gordon

"Gordon" wrote in message
...

d) Why does the value of boats fall off so fast? Some new boats
seem
to loose half their value in five years.

Because people are stupid enough to buy a new boat which costs a lot
of money. Same as with cars.

Not all boats lose that much. In 1989, an Island Packet 31 listed
at under $78,000. Today there is a 1989 on Yacht World for $74,000 and
this is typical for IPs. Of course if you count inflation--
Still not bad for an 18 year old boat.
Gordon

Island Packet = the most overpriced boat in the industry. It's a good
thing they have high resale value because you don't get your money's
worth as far as quality of construction goes.

Wilbur Hubbard

On Wed, 21 Mar 2007 12:14:13 -0400, "Wilbur Hubbard"
wrote:

Island Packet = the most overpriced boat in the industry. It's a good
thing they have high resale value because you don't get your money's
worth as far as quality of construction goes.

Usually, in fact always, high resale value equates to high demand?

Why is that? There must be something about them that people like.

"Wayne.B" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 21 Mar 2007 12:14:13 -0400, "Wilbur Hubbard"
wrote:

Island Packet = the most overpriced boat in the industry. It's a good
thing they have high resale value because you don't get your money's
worth as far as quality of construction goes.

Usually, in fact always, high resale value equates to high demand?

Why is that? There must be something about them that people like.

It's the same thing that drives the sale of MacGregor 26s. Ignorance!
People buy into the hype. People who buy them aren't really sailors.
They are campers. They enjoy going to rallys where they make giant
raft-ups. (Who does than with a real boat, anyway? That's the very last
thing I'd ever do with my boat. It's just plain stupid, dangerous and
dumb!) They motor up and down the Intracoastal Waterway. The polish and
shine and add every gadget in the catalog. Those Island Packets are poor
performers empty. Load them down and they can't get out of their own
way. There are better boats out there at less than half the cost.

Wilbur Hubbard

Gordon wrote:


d) Why does the value of boats fall off so fast? Some new boats seem
to loose half their value in five years.

Because people are stupid enough to buy a new boat which costs a lot
of money. Same as with cars.

Not all boats lose that much. In 1989, an Island Packet 31 listed at
under $78,000. Today there is a 1989 on Yacht World for $74,000 and this
is typical for IPs. Of course if you count inflation--
Still not bad for an 18 year old boat.
Gordon

That has a lot to do with inflation. How much would 1989$$s be worth
in current buying power? In the ten years between 1989 and 1999, the
buying power of the dollar went down. What you could buy for $78K in
1989 would take about $104 in 1999. That's not just a $4K loss - it
is a $30K loss

A more cogent analysis would be - how much was that boat selling for
in 1994? How much would you have had to pay for that $78K boat when
it was five years old?

Some of the older boats hold their value (discounting the cost of
inflation) pretty well, but that's an argument FOR buying an old boat.

Another argument FOR buying and old boat is that the new boats don't
come equipped - you have spend mucho additional money to fit her out
with things like lines, fenders and the like.

AGAINST an old boat is that the equipment may be worn and outdated.

"Rosalie B." wrote in message
news
Gordon wrote:


d) Why does the value of boats fall off so fast? Some new boats
seem
to loose half their value in five years.

Because people are stupid enough to buy a new boat which costs a lot
of money. Same as with cars.

Not all boats lose that much. In 1989, an Island Packet 31 listed
at
under $78,000. Today there is a 1989 on Yacht World for $74,000 and
this
is typical for IPs. Of course if you count inflation--
Still not bad for an 18 year old boat.
Gordon

That has a lot to do with inflation. How much would 1989$$s be worth
in current buying power? In the ten years between 1989 and 1999, the
buying power of the dollar went down. What you could buy for $78K in
1989 would take about $104 in 1999. That's not just a $4K loss - it
is a $30K loss

A more cogent analysis would be - how much was that boat selling for
in 1994? How much would you have had to pay for that $78K boat when
it was five years old?

Some of the older boats hold their value (discounting the cost of
inflation) pretty well, but that's an argument FOR buying an old boat.

Another argument FOR buying and old boat is that the new boats don't
come equipped - you have spend mucho additional money to fit her out
with things like lines, fenders and the like.

AGAINST an old boat is that the equipment may be worn and outdated.


When it comes to things holding their value or increasing in value
people see what they want to see. Boats usually visibly go down in
value quite rapidly in the first couple of years. Same with cars. But
houses people claim make them money. But, people are wrong. They buy a
house for 100K and five years later they have it appraised and the value
is now 150K so they say, "Wow I've made 50% on my investment. WRONG! Add
in the 1) taxes 2) insurance 3) upkeep 4) utilities 5) inflation 6)
furnishings 7) mortgage interest, etc. and you've LOST money on it.
Simplistic bought for and sold for dollar values are totally misleading.

Wilbur Hubbard

"Wilbur Hubbard" wrote:


"Rosalie B." wrote in message
news
Gordon wrote:


d) Why does the value of boats fall off so fast? Some new boats
seem
to loose half their value in five years.

Because people are stupid enough to buy a new boat which costs a lot
of money. Same as with cars.

Not all boats lose that much. In 1989, an Island Packet 31 listed
at
under $78,000. Today there is a 1989 on Yacht World for $74,000 and
this
is typical for IPs. Of course if you count inflation--
Still not bad for an 18 year old boat.
Gordon

That has a lot to do with inflation. How much would 1989$$s be worth
in current buying power? In the ten years between 1989 and 1999, the
buying power of the dollar went down. What you could buy for $78K in
1989 would take about $104 in 1999. That's not just a $4K loss - it
is a $30K loss

A more cogent analysis would be - how much was that boat selling for
in 1994? How much would you have had to pay for that $78K boat when
it was five years old?

Some of the older boats hold their value (discounting the cost of
inflation) pretty well, but that's an argument FOR buying an old boat.

Another argument FOR buying and old boat is that the new boats don't
come equipped - you have spend mucho additional money to fit her out
with things like lines, fenders and the like.

AGAINST an old boat is that the equipment may be worn and outdated.


When it comes to things holding their value or increasing in value
people see what they want to see. Boats usually visibly go down in
value quite rapidly in the first couple of years. Same with cars. But
houses people claim make them money. But, people are wrong. They buy a
house for 100K and five years later they have it appraised and the value
is now 150K so they say, "Wow I've made 50% on my investment. WRONG! Add
in the 1) taxes 2) insurance 3) upkeep 4) utilities 5) inflation 6)
furnishings 7) mortgage interest, etc. and you've LOST money on it.
Simplistic bought for and sold for dollar values are totally misleading.

Yes it is wrong to say that you've made 50%, but not necessarily for
all the reasons you say. Inflation actually helps you. You get to
invest your money and then inflation makes your investment worth more
- that is where the making 50% comes in.

You have to live somewhere, and you will have a cost for it regardless
of where it is. On land, furnishings and utilities are going to be a
cost regardless of whether you rent or buy a house. So you can't
count that AGAINST house ownership.

In the US, the taxes and mortgage interest can be used to reduce your
income tax, so that's kind of a wash. You have to pay one way or the
other - either more income tax or interest/real estate tax.

So generally speaking houses DO make money for people, which cars and
boats do not.