To avoid the embarassment of paddling in, or sailing close hauled into
a narrow channel for a landing, we put together a Chrysler 3 HP
outboard from two nearly complete projects.

3 HP seemed like a frequent choice for sailboats at about the size
of boats we have - a SouthCoast 22ft.

But on a day with a stiff breeze (yesterday) I blew onto a lee shore
at launch, and could not hold the heading to windward when returning a
few hours later, on outboard alone.

So here's the dumb question: how many Horses does it take to be
steering a 22 ft sailboat into a brisk wind? 5HP, 7 HP 10 HP, more?

Thanks in advance


Brian Whatcott Altus OK

Brian Whatcott wrote:
To avoid the embarassment of paddling in, or sailing close hauled into
a narrow channel for a landing, we put together a Chrysler 3 HP
outboard from two nearly complete projects.

3 HP seemed like a frequent choice for sailboats at about the size
of boats we have - a SouthCoast 22ft.

But on a day with a stiff breeze (yesterday) I blew onto a lee shore
at launch, and could not hold the heading to windward when returning a
few hours later, on outboard alone.

So here's the dumb question: how many Horses does it take to be
steering a 22 ft sailboat into a brisk wind? 5HP, 7 HP 10 HP, more?

Thanks in advance


Brian Whatcott Altus OK

The motor sold with my sailboat when new was/is a 1986 Evinrude Yachtwin
6 hp Long Shaft. A few people with my size have moved up to 8 hp...
but 6 hp seems to be the norm.
http://sailquest.com/market/models/spipe.htm

Brian Whatcott wrote:
To avoid the embarassment of paddling in, or sailing close hauled into
a narrow channel for a landing, we put together a Chrysler 3 HP
outboard from two nearly complete projects.

3 HP seemed like a frequent choice for sailboats at about the size
of boats we have - a SouthCoast 22ft.

But on a day with a stiff breeze (yesterday) I blew onto a lee shore
at launch, and could not hold the heading to windward when returning a
few hours later, on outboard alone.

So here's the dumb question: how many Horses does it take to be
steering a 22 ft sailboat into a brisk wind? 5HP, 7 HP 10 HP, more?

Thanks in advance


Brian Whatcott Altus OK
What is the displacement of the boat? The rule of thumb I have heard is
between 3 and 5 hp per ton. My Ranger 26 was 3 ton and had a 9.9 hp
Honda, my T33 is 7 ton and has a 22 hp Yanmar. My 102' was 90 ton and
had a 260 hp Detroit.

Seems to work......sorta.

Gary

I had a Cal 20 with a very old 4 hp evinrude 2-stroke. Seemed to do fine in
everything up to about 15kts. The boat was just under 2000 lbs.

--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com

"Brian Whatcott" wrote in message
...

To avoid the embarassment of paddling in, or sailing close hauled into
a narrow channel for a landing, we put together a Chrysler 3 HP
outboard from two nearly complete projects.

3 HP seemed like a frequent choice for sailboats at about the size
of boats we have - a SouthCoast 22ft.

But on a day with a stiff breeze (yesterday) I blew onto a lee shore
at launch, and could not hold the heading to windward when returning a
few hours later, on outboard alone.

So here's the dumb question: how many Horses does it take to be
steering a 22 ft sailboat into a brisk wind? 5HP, 7 HP 10 HP, more?

Thanks in advance


Brian Whatcott Altus OK

Lowering the board will help the SC22 stay head to wind.

Been there, with a Suzuki 3.5. It was plenty.

Terry K

On 31 Jul 2006 12:06:46 -0700, "Terry K" wrote:

Lowering the board will help the SC22 stay head to wind.

Been there, with a Suzuki 3.5. It was plenty.

Terry K


Thanks to Don, Gary, Capt JG and Terry for helpful inputs.

We are now looking for something more than 7HP.
The centerboard and the rudder were both down all the way.

Thinking about the scenario later, I realised that if going forward
into wind was difficult because of cabin windage etc., then I could
still have motored in in reverse. OR I could have hoist a trysail on
the aft stay, but that approach would have added drag as well as
useful weathercocking.

Live n learn

Brian Whatcott Altus OK

In article ,
Brian Whatcott wrote:
On 31 Jul 2006 12:06:46 -0700, "Terry K" wrote:

Lowering the board will help the SC22 stay head to wind.

Been there, with a Suzuki 3.5. It was plenty.

Terry K


Thanks to Don, Gary, Capt JG and Terry for helpful inputs.

We are now looking for something more than 7HP.
The centerboard and the rudder were both down all the way.

Thinking about the scenario later, I realised that if going forward
into wind was difficult because of cabin windage etc., then I could
still have motored in in reverse. OR I could have hoist a trysail on
the aft stay, but that approach would have added drag as well as
useful weathercocking.

Live n learn

Hey Brian... another thought occured to me... is the bottom clean? I
had a somewhat similar problem on my Cal while taking it over to get
hauled for the first time right after I bought her (well, acquired is
more accurate). The forest was about 10 feet long, with small
creatures leaping off when they pulled it out. I *wondered* why I had
full throttle and was only doing 1/2 knot.

--
Capt. JG @@
www.sailnow.com

On 31 Jul 2006 21:15:09 -0700, lid (Jonathan Ganz)
wrote:

In article ,
Brian Whatcott wrote:
On 31 Jul 2006 12:06:46 -0700, "Terry K" wrote:

Lowering the board will help the SC22 stay head to wind.

Been there, with a Suzuki 3.5. It was plenty.

Terry K


Thanks to Don, Gary, Capt JG and Terry for helpful inputs.

We are now looking for something more than 7HP.
The centerboard and the rudder were both down all the way.

Thinking about the scenario later, I realised that if going forward
into wind was difficult because of cabin windage etc., then I could
still have motored in in reverse. OR I could have hoist a trysail on
the aft stay, but that approach would have added drag as well as
useful weathercocking.

Live n learn

Hey Brian... another thought occured to me... is the bottom clean? I
had a somewhat similar problem on my Cal while taking it over to get
hauled for the first time right after I bought her (well, acquired is
more accurate). The forest was about 10 feet long, with small
creatures leaping off when they pulled it out. I *wondered* why I had
full throttle and was only doing 1/2 knot.


It is a nuisance to find two bystanders to hold lines from the stays
to steady the mast while it is winched up. Then rig the stays etc.
(after trailering into the launch point.)

But, a fouled bottom is the one problem that is a non-problem.
This early example of a trailerable boat design of 22 ft length - the
SouthCoast 22 still has that grerat advantage - it's light on its feet
to numerous waters.

Brian Whatcott Altus OK

In article , betwys1
@sbcglobal.net says...
On 31 Jul 2006 21:15:09 -0700, lid (Jonathan Ganz)
wrote:

In article ,
Brian Whatcott wrote:
On 31 Jul 2006 12:06:46 -0700, "Terry K" wrote:

Lowering the board will help the SC22 stay head to wind.

Been there, with a Suzuki 3.5. It was plenty.

Terry K


Thanks to Don, Gary, Capt JG and Terry for helpful inputs.

We are now looking for something more than 7HP.
The centerboard and the rudder were both down all the way.

Thinking about the scenario later, I realised that if going forward
into wind was difficult because of cabin windage etc., then I could
still have motored in in reverse. OR I could have hoist a trysail on
the aft stay, but that approach would have added drag as well as
useful weathercocking.

Live n learn

Hey Brian... another thought occured to me... is the bottom clean? I
had a somewhat similar problem on my Cal while taking it over to get
hauled for the first time right after I bought her (well, acquired is
more accurate). The forest was about 10 feet long, with small
creatures leaping off when they pulled it out. I *wondered* why I had
full throttle and was only doing 1/2 knot.


It is a nuisance to find two bystanders to hold lines from the stays
to steady the mast while it is winched up. Then rig the stays etc.
(after trailering into the launch point.)



On our Windrose 18, one person can raise or lower the mast, but
two makes it easier. The upper and lower shrouds stay connected
all the time and have only about a foot of slack when the mast
is in the step fitting and laid back to the stern crutch.
I use a 2-part tackle on the forestay with a pivoting
gin pole at the foot of the mast to get a lifting angle
on the forestay. (The gin pole is vertical at the start
and the forestay clevis pin and stay fit into a notch at
the top at the start. As I pull on the forestay,
the mast pops up the clevis pin comes down to the bow fitting.

We usually try to raise the mast on the trailer and have the
tongue lower. That way, the mast goes a little past
vertical and pulls on the already-connected backstay. That
makes it easy to fasten the forestay.

The second person helps most by standing in the cockpit and
raising the mast the first 4 or 5 feet---where the tension
on the forestay is highest.


But, a fouled bottom is the one problem that is a non-problem.
This early example of a trailerable boat design of 22 ft length - the
SouthCoast 22 still has that grerat advantage - it's light on its feet
to numerous waters.

To a much greater degree than was the case when we bought our
Windrose 15 years ago, the gas to tow the boat to the water
is a bigger issue!


Back to topic: We use a 4HP Evinrude sailmaster on the Windrose.
It has quite a lot of cabin windage also and the problem going
upwind is even worse if you've merely bungied down the genny
on the bow pulpit. When motoring upwind or crosswind, it really
helps to take the time to remove the sail altogether. That
will limit your options if you lose power and have to sail
your way out of trouble, though.

If your engine has sufficient power to make headway to windward,
you can often get past the initial problems by falling off
and gaining speed---with the main up if necessary. When
you've got enough speed for good control, turn up and
get the main down ASAP. Worst case, I suppose you
could tack to windward under tight-sheeted main
and with motor assist. The sailing purists will hate
that though. It does give you more options should
the engine die or get weeded up.

When you're singlehanding or in narrow waters, having
enough engine really helps!

Mark Borgerson

On Tue, 1 Aug 2006 10:23:31 -0700, Mark Borgerson
mborgerson.at.comcast.net wrote:

On our Windrose 18, one person can raise or lower the mast, but
two makes it easier. The upper and lower shrouds stay connected
all the time and have only about a foot of slack when the mast
is in the step fitting and laid back to the stern crutch.
I use a 2-part tackle on the forestay with a pivoting
gin pole at the foot of the mast to get a lifting angle
on the forestay. (The gin pole is vertical at the start
and the forestay clevis pin and stay fit into a notch at
the top at the start. As I pull on the forestay,
the mast pops up the clevis pin comes down to the bow fitting.

We usually try to raise the mast on the trailer and have the
tongue lower. That way, the mast goes a little past
vertical and pulls on the already-connected backstay. That
makes it easy to fasten the forestay.

The second person helps most by standing in the cockpit and
raising the mast the first 4 or 5 feet---where the tension
on the forestay is highest.


But, a fouled bottom is the one problem that is a non-problem.
This early example of a trailerable boat design of 22 ft length - the
SouthCoast 22 still has that grerat advantage - it's light on its feet
to numerous waters.

To a much greater degree than was the case when we bought our
Windrose 15 years ago, the gas to tow the boat to the water
is a bigger issue!


Back to topic: We use a 4HP Evinrude sailmaster on the Windrose.
It has quite a lot of cabin windage also and the problem going
upwind is even worse if you've merely bungied down the genny
on the bow pulpit. When motoring upwind or crosswind, it really
helps to take the time to remove the sail altogether. That
will limit your options if you lose power and have to sail
your way out of trouble, though.

If your engine has sufficient power to make headway to windward,
you can often get past the initial problems by falling off
and gaining speed---with the main up if necessary. When
you've got enough speed for good control, turn up and
get the main down ASAP. Worst case, I suppose you
could tack to windward under tight-sheeted main
and with motor assist. The sailing purists will hate
that though. It does give you more options should
the engine die or get weeded up.

When you're singlehanding or in narrow waters, having
enough engine really helps!

Mark Borgerson


Mark,
Thanks for the opportunity to compare notes - it's true we had the jib
bungeed in a pile in the pulpit. That would not have helped in the
fresh breeze - perhaps 20 kt.

Brian Whatcott Altus OK