"Dave" wrote in message
...
On Fri, 24 Jun 2005 13:09:20 -0700, "Bob La Londe"
said:

In theory a warrant or sufficient PC is required to search a car or other
motor vehicle in the US. A basic moving violation is not considered PC
for
a search. Practice and legality don't always go hand in hand.

Grossly oversimplified. That's why I said the rules for vehicles are
"different." I don't intend to give you a dissertation on the differences,
but you can get a pretty good idea at
http://www.jus.state.nc.us/NCJA/jurissep.htm.

Sea Lawyers. Sheesh!

LOL
--
Bob La Londe
www.YumaBassMan.cm

"Dave" wrote in message
...
On Fri, 24 Jun 2005 21:38:34 GMT, "MMC" said:

Actually those High
School grads have Federal powers of arrest, same as a FBI Agent.

And of course in a good and just system, only Ph Ds would have arrest
power,
right?

Gimme a break.

But of course, and if we paid better we might be able to get them. LOL.

--
Bob La Londe
www.YumaBassMan.cm

Bob La Londe wrote:
"Dave" wrote in message
http://www.jcrobbins.com/documents/boarding.htm
Interesting read. Also, interesting that one paragraph seems to
indicate
that their are limits while others say their aren't. Also, interesting that
all limits are ambiguous.

One day back in the early 80's a couple of gun-toting sociopaths decided
to rob a store or a bank in Ottawa and ended up killing an officer. That
same day, my crew and I cleared customs in the St. Lawrence on a rented
alco-barge (houseboat) heading for Alexandria Bay, NY. We must have
looked like what the border people were looking for. Say what you want
about "limits". When the USCG cutter hailed us, with what I recall were
4 guys on the foredeck with what appeared to be M16's (I don't know for
sure, I don't know guns), flak-jackets and helmets, I wasn't going to
argue about limits. I told everyone onboard to get out on the deck
facing the cutter with their hands in plain sight as I came along side.

"Bob La Londe" wrote in
:

Does the US Coast Guard have the authority to stop, search or do a
"routine" safety check on a vessel of US registry or US state
registration fully within US waters and obviously not suited for long
offshore travel without cause?


Absolutely....ad nauseum! On my little jetboat, it wasn't unusual to have
my fire extinguisher "inspected" 3, 4 or 5 times on a Saturday...even with
the USCG Auxiliary's seal-of-approval prominently displayed on the side!
It meant nothing to the CG crews, Dept of Natural Resources swat teams in
the camo boats in their flak jackets and Army greens, City cops guarding
the no wake zones, County cops guarding nothing in particular.

I used to tell people I drove and "inspected vessel" because my boat was
inspected far more often than that silly little cruise ship at Union
Pier...(c;

They can't haul your ass over in your car on I-26 without justifiable cause
or there's big trouble. But, they can haul your ass over and tear apart
your boat any ol' time they get a hankerin' to! Nothing on the water is
"illegal search and seizure" any more...even before 9/11/01.

--
Larry

You know you've had a rough night when you wake up and you're outlined in
chalk.

"same as a FBI Agent". The FBI Agent would have time to mature a little and
get A LOT of training before given these responsibilities.
When I joined the Navy at 18 years old, you and your neighbors wouldn't have
wanted me to have that kind of authority

"Dave" wrote in message
...
On Fri, 24 Jun 2005 21:38:34 GMT, "MMC" said:

Actually those High
School grads have Federal powers of arrest, same as a FBI Agent.

And of course in a good and just system, only Ph Ds would have arrest
power,
right?

Gimme a break.

"MMC" wrote in
:

When I joined the Navy at 18 years old, you and your neighbors
wouldn't have wanted me to have that kind of authority



I guess that's why Navy didn't want me to have a gun and bullets at the
same time....(c; I've stood watch with a .45 automatic with no shells many
times. Once this happened in Malta when one of the divers grabbed the
watch's .45 and put a hole in a gondola taxi because the driver was ****ing
on the side of his dive boat. The international incident cooled when they
took away our ammo and assured the Maltese it couldn't happen again, but
noone ****ed on our small boats after that, either. Gondola drivers never
went near them!

--
Larry

You know you've had a rough night when you wake up and you're outlined in
chalk.

Just took a little convincing?
MMC

"Larry W4CSC" wrote in message
...
"MMC" wrote in
:

When I joined the Navy at 18 years old, you and your neighbors
wouldn't have wanted me to have that kind of authority



I guess that's why Navy didn't want me to have a gun and bullets at the
same time....(c; I've stood watch with a .45 automatic with no shells
many
times. Once this happened in Malta when one of the divers grabbed the
watch's .45 and put a hole in a gondola taxi because the driver was
****ing
on the side of his dive boat. The international incident cooled when they
took away our ammo and assured the Maltese it couldn't happen again, but
noone ****ed on our small boats after that, either. Gondola drivers never
went near them!

--
Larry

You know you've had a rough night when you wake up and you're outlined in
chalk.

Since they are a part of "Homeland Security" I wouldn't doubt you can
disappear into a Gitmo type facility for no reasonable reason. Even
before 9-11 the "War" on drugs let them do what they wanted. I remember
a story of the CG's drug dog barking at a docked boat, the boat
subsequently ransacked in a search, 15-20 inspection holes drilled into
inaccessable areas, nothing found (WMD's?), the owner told he was free
to go. No apologies from the CG, no recourse for the owner. Sam

In article ,
Larry W4CSC wrote:

"Bob La Londe" wrote in
:

Does the US Coast Guard have the authority to stop, search or do a
"routine" safety check on a vessel of US registry or US state
registration fully within US waters and obviously not suited for long
offshore travel without cause?


Absolutely....ad nauseum! On my little jetboat, it wasn't unusual to have
my fire extinguisher "inspected" 3, 4 or 5 times on a Saturday...even with
the USCG Auxiliary's seal-of-approval prominently displayed on the side!
It meant nothing to the CG crews, Dept of Natural Resources swat teams in
the camo boats in their flak jackets and Army greens, City cops guarding
the no wake zones, County cops guarding nothing in particular.

I used to tell people I drove and "inspected vessel" because my boat was
inspected far more often than that silly little cruise ship at Union
Pier...(c;

They can't haul your ass over in your car on I-26 without justifiable cause
or there's big trouble. But, they can haul your ass over and tear apart
your boat any ol' time they get a hankerin' to! Nothing on the water is
"illegal search and seizure" any more...even before 9/11/01.

You can sue them for damages, and it actually has been done. Usually if
they were very destructive, and nothing was found, they settle "Out of
Court" because the US Attorney doesn't want his forth coming "Political
Career" tarnished by some "Way Overboard Coastie" screwing the pouch.
Also the District Admiral doesn't want to smear his "Command" with
incidents of BAD PR, from such public outcries, of some "Overzellious
Junior Officer". Every group has it's Rambo's...but in the Military
they get stomped on fast if the don't make the case..... Just remeber
that this all takes place After the Fact... and after a whole lot of BAD
Press....

Me

On Fri, 24 Jun 2005 22:11:58 -0400, Larry W4CSC
wrote:



They can't haul your ass over in your car on I-26 without justifiable cause
or there's big trouble. But, they can haul your ass over and tear apart
your boat any ol' time they get a hankerin' to! Nothing on the water is
"illegal search and seizure" any more...even before 9/11/01.

Hi,
A question.

I am sailing to the east coast of the US early next year after I cross
the Atlantic. I have a valid 10 year visa (we had to apply for one at
the Madrid US embassy even though if we fly in we get an automatic 3
month visa), and don't carry or use dope of any kind.

What concerns me about all of this is not the boarding by the US
Coastguard, but the stories of searches being done and damage caused
by the searchers. I have heard one where the tops of the water tanks
were cut open - and that in international waters. I can understand and
appreciate the need and benefit to stop foreign flagged yachts in
international waters due to the drug trade and don't mind at all being
searched. What I don't want is having to repair damage at my time and
expence.

Question: has anyone had any bad experience of this kind?

FWIW
When we arrived at the Customs wharf in Australia (well before 9/11),
there was a yacht moored to the wharf that had been stripped down
inside in an attempt to find illegal weapons and drugs. The yacht had
been intercepted after a tip that the owner was running guns. He
claims that he is a collector and that the box of hand grenades were
part of his collection. The case went to court. If he wins then
Customs has to make good the damage. If he loses, they don't. Is it
the same with the US Coastguard or any officials if they find that no
offence has been committed?

Another point, as a New Zealand registered yacht we cannot be boarded
by any other officials than Customs or Quarantine ones in Australian
ports (excepting police if we are commiting a crime) as we come under
Customs control. I believe that this is part of international law but
I may stand to be corrected.

Everywhere we have been stopped by coastguards or other officials in
the world so far they have always asked first (politely) if they can
come aboard.