wrote:
Yes, the wind indeed felt like a bullet. It was in the Long Island
Sound - about 1/2 nm from shore. In hindsight, it probably would have
made sense to bear away to a broad reach? I did not for two reasons.
(1) I wasn't sure if that would have made the boat more vulerable to
another knockdown and (2) I was too focused on trying to head into the
wind in order to furl the sails.

I sail with arcane rigs, so some of what I do isn't
translatable. However, on both the light schooner and Lady
Kate the AS29, turning up into a bullet is a recipe for
capsize and swamping in the one, and knockdown in the other.
The light schooner (a boat requiring crew) as an open and low
boat would already be sailing with her lee rail down. A sharp
turn into the wind would knock her down further, assisted by a
powerful spade rudder tending to act as an elevator plane
because of the angle, both reinforcing the knockdown; also
stop her dead allowing the waves to take her over also.
Bearing away, turning downwind, brings the boat up to level
rather than heeled. While the risk now is driving under, it
allows time to think and possibly come back to the wind a bit
at a higher speed through the water, or alternatively time to
set up and get the crew coordinated to bring the boat to the
wind and heave to to allow reefing. Because the schooner's
biggest sail is the last, it's very easy to drop the foresail
and continue on main and jib--the lazy man's reef!

All of the light schooner capsizes reported to me have in the
end been due to a failure or an inability to bear away when
hit. Including my own efforts.

The 2.5 tons extra weight and huge watertight volume of Lady
Kate means that a knockdown is an irritation and an
embarrassment, not a drama. But, she's single-handed, and a
cat-yawl with all of a catboat's wilfulness downwind with too
much sail up. In her case, when hit, I heave to immediately,
get my breath back, then start reefing. In those
circumstances, I'm usually in a washing machine chop, but no
underlying swell.

A number of folks in this thread
mentioned heaving to. It seems to me that would be ok if
the jib is
adequately reefed, but not ok as an emergency measure with a
full jib.
What do you think?


I think you need to learn how to heave to, and do that as the
standard first step, rrather than attempt head to wind or
immediately relying on motor. Heaving to is both a
convenience AND an emergency measure, and indeed in emergency
circumstances you should be heaving to to reef, not
surrendering control of your boat (which you are doing by
trying to stop head to wind. What happens when the head falls
off?? Or--given the dependence many lay on motors to hold one
head to wind--what happens if the squall or chop kills your
motor?? (Keep the motor as the last resort, not the first)
--
Flying Tadpole

-------------------------
http://www.flyingtadpole.com

On 2005-05-31, Flying Tadpole wrote:

I sail with arcane rigs, so some of what I do isn't
translatable. However, on both the light schooner and Lady
Kate the AS29, turning up into a bullet is a recipe for
capsize and swamping in the one, and knockdown in the other.
The light schooner (a boat requiring crew) as an open and low
boat would already be sailing with her lee rail down. A sharp
turn into the wind would knock her down further, assisted by a
powerful spade rudder tending to act as an elevator plane
because of the angle, both reinforcing the knockdown; also
stop her dead allowing the waves to take her over also.
Bearing away, turning downwind, brings the boat up to level
rather than heeled.

I'm trying to picture turning up producing more heeling force and
having difficulty. I've been sailing dinghies recently and if hit
by a gust, feathering up reduces the heeling force whilst bearing
away places more of the sail square on to the wind and increases
the heeling. How is the schooner different?

--
Andy Repton

Andy Repton wrote:
On 2005-05-31, Flying Tadpole wrote:

I sail with arcane rigs, so some of what I do isn't
translatable. However, on both the light schooner and Lady
Kate the AS29, turning up into a bullet is a recipe for
capsize and swamping in the one, and knockdown in the other.
The light schooner (a boat requiring crew) as an open and low
boat would already be sailing with her lee rail down. A sharp
turn into the wind would knock her down further, assisted by a
powerful spade rudder tending to act as an elevator plane
because of the angle, both reinforcing the knockdown; also
stop her dead allowing the waves to take her over also.
Bearing away, turning downwind, brings the boat up to level
rather than heeled.


I'm trying to picture turning up producing more heeling force and
having difficulty. I've been sailing dinghies recently and if hit
by a gust, feathering up reduces the heeling force whilst bearing
away places more of the sail square on to the wind and increases
the heeling. How is the schooner different?


First, we always sailed her as hard as possible, so anywhere
on the wind the lee rail would tend to be a few inches above
the water. Think "not much scope for error"

Second, the rudder is way aft, deep and powerful, pintle hung
and _not_ balanced, carrying over a quarter of the lateral
plane the daggerboard carries half-and-a-bit when heeled, and
the chine (sharpie hull) carries the rest. Think "lots of
water/pressure at the rudder"

Third, the boat, though half a ton with a two-up crew, is as
rapid in response to helm movement as a small dinghy and will
be travelling, in the circumstances described, well over hull
speed. 8-12 knots depending on where the wind is. Think "momentum"

Putting the helm down to round up, sets the rudder, on an
already heeling hull, acting like an elevator plane, heeling
the boat further as she starts spinnong ruound. At this
point, the lee rail cuts under...boat slows, and blows over
(or would, but we've probably let fly the sheets at this
point, of up to four sails.

Incidentally, the hull shape is sufficiently narrow for its
length _not_ to also suddenly transform the boat into a foul
mouthed broaching monster, which is what happens to most of
the trailable yachts in her sailing grounds.

The falling off when hit by a bullet is also a standard
catamaran trick, and we used it to the same advantage.
Bullet? Fall off, come more upright, pick up speed, come back
on course at higher speed. Really too much bullet? Ease the
sheet while doing so. Really, really too much bullet? Still
fall off to recover, then come to the wind while easing sheets
(staying as upright as possible) and heave to to reef.
Incidentally, the boat fore-reaches at about 2knots hove-to,
so in close proximity to obstacles, reefing is done as fast as
possible.

More info on the website, from memory
--
Flying Tadpole

-------------------------
http://www.flyingtadpole.com