Cannibal
 

"Jessica B" wrote in message
...
On Thu, 27 Jan 2011 23:43:31 -0600, CaveLamb
wrote:
Emptied the bilges

Why does a couple of feet of oar sticking out of the boat matter?

Well, someone could get snagged on it or it could get snagged on
something. Do you really need that extra couple of feet to power up?


People who have to ask such a question (Cavelamb) are no sailors.


Wilbur Hubbard

Cannibal
 

"Jessica B" wrote in message
...


Well, I think you're right, and I think I'm right too... I just posted
a link from the first Google hit.



Thanks, I saw that one. Just another nail in Bruce's coffin. LOL!


Wilbur Hubbard

Cannibal
 

"Bruce" wrote in message
...


I think you are repeating yourself as I just answered your first
message on that subject.


Considering how thick your skull is at times, saying something twice might
be the preferred way to get it through.


Wilbur Hubbard

Cannibal
 

"Bruce" wrote in message
...
pumped out the bilge


Nope. Referring your Internet posted, detailed, instructions about
stealing a bottle of booze from Walmart....

You have a very selective memory.


Wrong! I never posted about stealing booze. You must have me mixed up with
somebody else. Hell, Wal-Mart doesn't even sell booze. And, besides, there
isn't even a Wal-Mart around here. Only a Kmart.


Wilbur Hubbard

Cannibal
 

"Jessica B" wrote in message
...
On Fri, 28 Jan 2011 13:17:17 -0500, "Wilbur Hubbard"
wrote:

"Bruce" wrote in message
. ..
snip

And you certainly should know - Willie-the great Walmart Thief.


Urban legend. Returning defective storage batteries for warranty exchange
is
not theft.


Wilbur Hubbard


What's wrong with a warranty exchange?? I don't get it. Wal-Mart is
pretty good about taking stuff back.. Home Depot took back cabinet I
bought that basically fell apart. All I needed was the receipt.




Poor Bruce! He is really grabbing at straws now. He's failed to support his
side about overly long oars so now he's trying to bring up a bunch of
unrelated bilge in a failed attempt to do a little sidestepping acting.

Wilbur Hubbard

Cannibal
 

"Bruce" wrote in message
...
snip

What I'm doing is trying to get Willie to admit the truth. The license
is one he originally posted to the Internet as belonging to Capt.
Neal, if I remember correctly, and was a 6 pack license, i.e. he could
carry up to 6 passengers for hire. to get one you take a simple
written test and simply say that you have the required days of sea
time.

A very different story from what most people envision when someone
says, "I've got a Marine Master's license."

Jesus, my wife has a better license then Willie, she can captain a
boat up to something like 50 tons. But unlike Willie she doesn't go
around posting a picture on the Internet and bragging about it.


Your memory sure isn't much to set any store by . . .

Wilbur Hubbard

Cannibal
 

On Sat, 29 Jan 2011 14:30:04 -0800, Jessica B
wrote:

Why do they charge $100 for that
card ..TIWC? Seems like it's kind of over the top. What does it get
you?

It gets you a fancy ID card that has all of your biometric data,
including fingerprints, encoded on to an internal chip. All people
involved in public transportation are now required to have one.

Cannibal
 

On Sun, 30 Jan 2011 05:37:41 +0700, Bruce
wrote:

On Sat, 29 Jan 2011 12:16:05 -0800, Jessica B
wrote:

On Sat, 29 Jan 2011 19:09:24 +0700, Bruce
wrote:

On Fri, 28 Jan 2011 17:01:49 -0800, Jessica B
wrote:

On Fri, 28 Jan 2011 18:38:40 +0700, Bruce
wrote:

On Thu, 27 Jan 2011 18:37:26 -0800, Jessica B
wrote:

On Fri, 28 Jan 2011 08:47:36 +0700, Bruce
wrote:

On Thu, 27 Jan 2011 11:39:35 -0500, "Wilbur Hubbard"
wrote:

"Bruce" wrote in message
news:nbm2k6pn6j6ktvnj0fbr0rcld6g9sclibf@4a x.com...
snippage

Given that I have lived for more than half of my life in Asia I wonder
where you came up with your misconception that I ever intended to go
further.

You expect me to believe your goal was a Bangkok backwater? Yah, right!

But of course you don't have misconceptions you simply make it up,
unfortunately your blathering is simply "ignorance in action'.

Wilbur: The proper length for your dinghy oars is short enough to fit
inside the boat.

ONE of the attributes of a proper-length dinghy oar is that it fits into the
length of the dinghy. Get a clue and stop twisting my words.


I hadn't believed that you were actually as stupid as you just proved
yourself. I guess that proves that you should never underrate your
opponents abilities.

The "attribute" of an oar is that it reaches the water..... (Oars
originated for, and are still used today, as a devise to propel a boat
(through the water). Certainly it may have other attributes such as
weight, shape of blade, material of which it is made, etc, but fitting
inside the boat is not one of them.

Your argument is about as logical as saying that the mast should not
be longer then the length of the cockpit....because that
is where you want to keep it when you aren't using the sails.

Cheers,

Bruce

Ok... dumb question time... if the oar doesn't fit in the boat, what
the heck do you do with it when you're done using it? If you just
leave it hanging out, it seems to me it would get torn off or damaged.

Go down to the harbor and have a look at any row boats that may be
around... or visit a collage and have a look in their boat houses...
Or google "correct oar length". Do you see any of them recommend that
ability to store inside the boat as an important factor in sizing
them.

Kind of like special ordering an outboard engine with a 12 inch
shaft... cause that is the size of the locker you plan to store it in.

Cheers,

Bruce

This was the first link for dinghy oar length with a google search...

http://www.answers.com/topic/dinghy-oars

"the typical yacht tender of 7 to 9 feet (2.1 to 2.7 m), they should
be about 6 feet (1.8 m) long"


Yes, you can go to the web and get fallacious answer or you could do a
bit more study and come up with something like
http://www.woodenboat.net.nz/Boats/Oarchoice.html
to see what people who actually row boats think about generalizations
regarding oar length. I might add that people who are serious about
paddling canoes take as much care in choosing their paddles as an
oarsman takes in choosing his oars.

The difference is between the week-end dilettante and the individual
that actually rows a boat.

Cheers,

Bruce

Well, it seems like the guy who wrote this is talking about a
different sort of rowing. There are sculling rowers out there who have
oars that are very, very long. So what? Are you planning on towing one
of those?

I don't know who you're calling a dilettante, but if you're talking
about Wil, I think he's being pretty logical about it. If you're
talking about me, I've never made any claim to know much about boats
(or rowing for that matter). I do know about logical thought, and he
seems to be thinking it.

Firstly, the article I provided the link for was by a bloke in N.Z.
who is building a rowing boat, not a racing shell... Quite a
difference. The point was to demonstrate that oars are a bit more
complex then just a "they gotta fit in the boat" specification.

I don't think Capt. Wil said that was the only criteria for an oar.

I wasn't specifically referring to anyone when I used the words
"weekend dilettante". I was simply referring to those who spend their
time (on Sunday) sailing in the bay, and have all the toys.

Cheers,

Bruce

Cannibal
 

On Sun, 30 Jan 2011 06:06:36 +0700, Bruce
wrote:

On Sat, 29 Jan 2011 12:25:33 -0800, Jessica B
wrote:

On Sat, 29 Jan 2011 19:50:52 +0700, Bruce
wrote:


Actually in my case it was the trough that was the most noticeable. I
was sitting on the cockpit combing and watching a catamaran and a mono
hull, both headed toward Phi Phi and discussing, with my wife, which
one would get there first when suddenly the horizon was only a very
short distance away, perhaps 50 - 100 meters. By the time I could say,
"What the...." the horizon was back to normal and we saw the wave hit
an island some 3 miles east of us.

So, nothing much happened on your boat. You noticed it, but that was
about it.

Jesus, what did you expect? Had the wave arrived an hour earlier it
would have crushed the boat against an island and neither I or my wife
would be here to talk about it.

The discussion started with your talk about being "prepared" for
calamities at sea. I was simply trying to demonstrate that not
everything can be prepared for.

Bruce, I don't think I said that. I specifically talked about getting
run over by a tanker. Everyone deserves to be lucky from time to time!
I'm glad you and your wife are ok!


I recall hearing? reading? about people in
their sailboat in the harbor who rode it out by getting going, then
rescued a bunch of people. Seems to me you're safer moving and away
from the marina, which was my point.

Yes, we had some friends anchored in a bay on the S.W. side of Phuket
and when the water suddenly went away, as they described it, they, a
bloke and his wife, started the engine and knocked the lock off the
anchor winch and ran the chain overboard and headed for the ocean.
They said that they got far enough off shore by the time the crest got
there that they just bounced up and down a bit.

Sounds like they were prepared and did the right thing...?

Nope. In the first place they didn't know what was happening when it
occurred. All they knew was that "the water went away", as they said.
Their reaction was simply to get into more water so if it continued to
"go away" they would still be floating. Starting the engine... well
you turn the key, so perhaps leaving the key in the switch (as nearly
all Yachties do) is being prepared. Running the anchor chain out to
get free of the anchor is actually being un-prepared as most people
advocate tying a rope to the last link in the anchor chain so if you
do run the chain all the way out you don't lose it.

So, they were unprepared but did the right thing? Sounds like they
were prepared to do the right thing! lol

In the situation I described it will knock your boat down - lay it
over on its side - which by itself is not particularly hazardous in a
well found sloop (single masted boat), but will certainly make you sit
up and take notice.

Well, hang on a sec... I don't know what reef pulled in means, but
when the wind blows against the sail, the boat leans over... knocks
down? Ok. Then what? It comes back up or does it keep going? What
happens if you release all the sails? If it happens at night, then ok,
you got hit the first time, but then.... ?

A knock down occurs when the wind against the sail comes from, broadly
speaking, either side of the boat. If the wind suddenly blows hard
enough to overcome the weight of the boat, the boat tips over.
However, as the boat tips over (heels) the grip of the rudder on the
water diminishes and there is less force holding the boat on its
heading.

What happens is that the wind forces the boat over on its side, but
then the ruder is not holding the boat on its course so it turns into
the wind, which decreases the wind pressure on the sails and allows
the boat to right itself.

Ok, so it rights itself, and hopefully everyone is still on the boat,
along with the stuff...


We released all the ropes when we brought them down at the end of the
day... the sails and ropes just flapped around a lot and the boat
stopped moving.

Yes, because you released the "sheets" the ropes that hold the sail
against the wind pressure and allot it to just flap - like a flag.

Ok... well, if I got heeled, then I would release those sheets!

In the book the Perfect Storm, the sailboat seems to take it long
enough for the people to be rescued, and it seems like the winds in
that storm are much higher than in a squall.

I think that you are a bit confused as "The Perfect Storm" is a book
about the swordfishing boa, the Andrea Gail, out of Gloucester,
Massachusetts, that sank in 1991, in a large storm in the N. Atlantic.
Cheers,

Bruce

There was definitely a sailboat.. Satoria I think.

Cannibal
 

On Sat, 29 Jan 2011 19:05:11 -0500, Wayne.B
wrote:

On Sat, 29 Jan 2011 14:30:04 -0800, Jessica B
wrote:

Why do they charge $100 for that
card ..TIWC? Seems like it's kind of over the top. What does it get
you?

It gets you a fancy ID card that has all of your biometric data,
including fingerprints, encoded on to an internal chip. All people
involved in public transportation are now required to have one.

Sounds like it gets the government a whole lot more than they need for
people who take a few people sailing. I guess I could see it for a
tanker or a ferry or something. I really wouldn't want all that info
on a chip.

Cannibal
 

In article , Bruce wrote:
On Fri, 28 Jan 2011 10:52:09 -0500, "Wilbur Hubbard"
wrote:

"CaveLamb" wrote in message
...
snip



Why does a couple of feet of oar sticking out of the boat matter?



Spoken like a clueless dolt! An oar or oars sticking out of a dinghy can
catch under the dinghy dock on a rising tide and capsize the boat. Duh! Just
one of the many hazards that are eliminated with oars that fit inside the
length of the dinghy.

Perhaps some of you pretend sailors need to sail once in a while to learn
how things really go down?


Wilbur Hubbard


Dinghy Dock? And you've spent all this time nattering on about Marinas
and now you admit to anchoring off to avoid paying dockage and then
sneaking into the dinghy dock??

I, not being as well travelled as most here, have seen two types of
dinghy dock. One is floating, and therefore rises with the tide, along
with the dinghy, negating Wilbur's objection. The other is a
concrete/stone harbour arm, there's definitely no 'under' one of those!
Of what type is Wilbur referring?

Justin.

--
Justin C, by the sea.

Cannibal
 

In article , Bruce wrote:
On Fri, 28 Jan 2011 10:55:55 -0500, "Wilbur Hubbard"
wrote:

[snip]

Certainly, you would have to admit that Sir Eric knew a thing or two

[snip]

Sir Eric may well have said/written that, however, given that Hiscock

[snip]

Just a small point. Eric Hiscock was never knighted and therefore is not
entitled to the title Sir. He (and his wife) were awarded the MBE, but
that does not bestow a title.

Justin.

--
Justin C, by the sea.

Cannibal
 

In article , Jessica B wrote:

Ok, but wouldn't it be more convenient to just keep them out of harms
way in the dinghy if you can?

A dinghy can flip, and an inflatable, in a strong breeze can become a
kite, then you lose everything that's in it, thwart and all.

Don't people put their whole dinghy on
their boats?

Yeah, but they're heavy (or can be) and damn difficult to handle -
there's not a lot of room on most boats what with masts, shrouds, and
spinnaker poles. If you're only going a few miles, and the conditions
are OK then it's just easier to tow. I would never tow one far, there's
drag, wear and tear on both your boat and dink... I've heard of some
people towing to arrive at their destination and look to the dink and
find it not there!


Justin.

--
Justin C, by the sea.

Cannibal
 

In article , Jessica B wrote:

This was the first link for dinghy oar length with a google search...

http://www.answers.com/topic/dinghy-oars

Whenever answers.com shows up in Google search results I always skip it
in search of something authoritative. answers.com is an advertising
company, it's revenue is generated by displaying adverts to *you*. They
have answers for just about anything, they don't care whether the
answers are any good, they just want you to visit and see the ads.

Be more critical when judging sources of information, they're not all as
they may seem.

Justin.

--
Justin C, by the sea.

Cannibal
 

Justin C wrote:
In article , Jessica B wrote:
This was the first link for dinghy oar length with a google search...

http://www.answers.com/topic/dinghy-oars

Whenever answers.com shows up in Google search results I always skip it
in search of something authoritative. answers.com is an advertising
company, it's revenue is generated by displaying adverts to *you*. They
have answers for just about anything, they don't care whether the
answers are any good, they just want you to visit and see the ads.

Be more critical when judging sources of information, they're not all as
they may seem.

Justin.



I want my oars long enough to row the boat well.
That's priority one.

And, for what it's worth, the blades snap off leaving the maple rod
of the oar - short enough to stow inside the boat.
But I'd rather bag them assembled.


--

Richard Lamb
email me:
web site: http://www.home.earthlink.net/~cavelamb

Cannibal
 

On Sat, 29 Jan 2011 16:23:02 -0800, Jessica B
wrote:

On Sat, 29 Jan 2011 19:05:11 -0500, Wayne.B
wrote:

On Sat, 29 Jan 2011 14:30:04 -0800, Jessica B
wrote:

Why do they charge $100 for that
card ..TIWC? Seems like it's kind of over the top. What does it get
you?

It gets you a fancy ID card that has all of your biometric data,
including fingerprints, encoded on to an internal chip. All people
involved in public transportation are now required to have one.

Sounds like it gets the government a whole lot more than they need for
people who take a few people sailing. I guess I could see it for a
tanker or a ferry or something. I really wouldn't want all that info
on a chip.

Typical government stuff, one size fits all. We had a joke in the
army that you could have any color shirt you wanted as long as it was
green. That joke obviously predates today's fancy desert camouflage
outfits. The idea with the TWIC card is to ensure that all people
with access to port infrastructure areas, docks, builldings, etc.,
have proper security credentials.

It's entirely possible that our friend in question has some sort of,
uhhh, "issue" in his past that would preclude security authorization.

Cannibal
 

Hi Bob... well, I don't know...


Halvorson design: Freya 39

Cannibal
 

*The idea with the TWIC card is to ensure that all people
with access to port infrastructure areas, docks, builldings, etc.,
have proper security credentials. *

It's entirely possible that our friend in question has some sort of,
uhhh, "issue" in his past that would preclude security authorization.


I have to agree Bruce.
Bob

Cannibal
 

rOn Sat, 29 Jan 2011 16:20:32 -0800, Jessica B
wrote:

On Sun, 30 Jan 2011 06:06:36 +0700, Bruce
wrote:

On Sat, 29 Jan 2011 12:25:33 -0800, Jessica B
wrote:

On Sat, 29 Jan 2011 19:50:52 +0700, Bruce
wrote:


Actually in my case it was the trough that was the most noticeable. I
was sitting on the cockpit combing and watching a catamaran and a mono
hull, both headed toward Phi Phi and discussing, with my wife, which
one would get there first when suddenly the horizon was only a very
short distance away, perhaps 50 - 100 meters. By the time I could say,
"What the...." the horizon was back to normal and we saw the wave hit
an island some 3 miles east of us.

So, nothing much happened on your boat. You noticed it, but that was
about it.

Jesus, what did you expect? Had the wave arrived an hour earlier it
would have crushed the boat against an island and neither I or my wife
would be here to talk about it.

The discussion started with your talk about being "prepared" for
calamities at sea. I was simply trying to demonstrate that not
everything can be prepared for.

Bruce, I don't think I said that. I specifically talked about getting
run over by a tanker. Everyone deserves to be lucky from time to time!
I'm glad you and your wife are ok!


I recall hearing? reading? about people in
their sailboat in the harbor who rode it out by getting going, then
rescued a bunch of people. Seems to me you're safer moving and away
from the marina, which was my point.

Yes, we had some friends anchored in a bay on the S.W. side of Phuket
and when the water suddenly went away, as they described it, they, a
bloke and his wife, started the engine and knocked the lock off the
anchor winch and ran the chain overboard and headed for the ocean.
They said that they got far enough off shore by the time the crest got
there that they just bounced up and down a bit.

Sounds like they were prepared and did the right thing...?

Nope. In the first place they didn't know what was happening when it
occurred. All they knew was that "the water went away", as they said.
Their reaction was simply to get into more water so if it continued to
"go away" they would still be floating. Starting the engine... well
you turn the key, so perhaps leaving the key in the switch (as nearly
all Yachties do) is being prepared. Running the anchor chain out to
get free of the anchor is actually being un-prepared as most people
advocate tying a rope to the last link in the anchor chain so if you
do run the chain all the way out you don't lose it.

So, they were unprepared but did the right thing? Sounds like they
were prepared to do the right thing! lol

In the situation I described it will knock your boat down - lay it
over on its side - which by itself is not particularly hazardous in a
well found sloop (single masted boat), but will certainly make you sit
up and take notice.

Well, hang on a sec... I don't know what reef pulled in means, but
when the wind blows against the sail, the boat leans over... knocks
down? Ok. Then what? It comes back up or does it keep going? What
happens if you release all the sails? If it happens at night, then ok,
you got hit the first time, but then.... ?

A knock down occurs when the wind against the sail comes from, broadly
speaking, either side of the boat. If the wind suddenly blows hard
enough to overcome the weight of the boat, the boat tips over.
However, as the boat tips over (heels) the grip of the rudder on the
water diminishes and there is less force holding the boat on its
heading.

What happens is that the wind forces the boat over on its side, but
then the ruder is not holding the boat on its course so it turns into
the wind, which decreases the wind pressure on the sails and allows
the boat to right itself.

Ok, so it rights itself, and hopefully everyone is still on the boat,
along with the stuff...


We released all the ropes when we brought them down at the end of the
day... the sails and ropes just flapped around a lot and the boat
stopped moving.

Yes, because you released the "sheets" the ropes that hold the sail
against the wind pressure and allot it to just flap - like a flag.

Ok... well, if I got heeled, then I would release those sheets!

In the book the Perfect Storm, the sailboat seems to take it long
enough for the people to be rescued, and it seems like the winds in
that storm are much higher than in a squall.

I think that you are a bit confused as "The Perfect Storm" is a book
about the swordfishing boa, the Andrea Gail, out of Gloucester,
Massachusetts, that sank in 1991, in a large storm in the N. Atlantic.
Cheers,

Bruce

There was definitely a sailboat.. Satoria I think.

You are correct. The Satoria was in the book. The boat where the
Captain said there was no emergency but the crew called in an
authorized Mayday whereby the Coast Guard came out and rescued them
forcing the Captain to abandon the boat (according to statement by his
son). The owner/Captain searched for and found the boat essentially
undamaged since abandoned and sailed it on to Florida (I believe).

Cheers,

Bruce

Cannibal
 

On Sun, 30 Jan 2011 00:43:08 +0000, Justin C
wrote:

In article , Bruce wrote:
On Fri, 28 Jan 2011 10:55:55 -0500, "Wilbur Hubbard"
wrote:

[snip]

Certainly, you would have to admit that Sir Eric knew a thing or two

[snip]

Sir Eric may well have said/written that, however, given that Hiscock

[snip]

Just a small point. Eric Hiscock was never knighted and therefore is not
entitled to the title Sir. He (and his wife) were awarded the MBE, but
that does not bestow a title.

Justin.

It is difficult for outsiders, remember that wogs start at Calais, to
understand the British honors system.

(Particularly one that was said to have originated with someone
recovering a garter (:-)
Cheers,

Bruce

Cannibal
 

On Sat, 29 Jan 2011 20:15:29 -0600, CaveLamb
wrote:

Justin C wrote:
In article , Jessica B wrote:
This was the first link for dinghy oar length with a google search...

http://www.answers.com/topic/dinghy-oars

Whenever answers.com shows up in Google search results I always skip it
in search of something authoritative. answers.com is an advertising
company, it's revenue is generated by displaying adverts to *you*. They
have answers for just about anything, they don't care whether the
answers are any good, they just want you to visit and see the ads.

Be more critical when judging sources of information, they're not all as
they may seem.

Justin.



I want my oars long enough to row the boat well.
That's priority one.

And, for what it's worth, the blades snap off leaving the maple rod
of the oar - short enough to stow inside the boat.
But I'd rather bag them assembled.


It is possible to make oars that can be disassembled but the
commercial versions are pretty shoddy.

I've had several "rubber ducks" and whether my karma is bad, or
something else is wrong but they all developed leaks with astounding
frequency, so I have built various hard dinghies which all seemed to
work (for me) much better (at least they don't leak :-), but they do
tend to be heavy to handle. My last one (went with the sail boat) I
built out of 3 mm ply and covered it inside and out with 200 and 400
gm glass cloth. I could pick it up (on the jetty) by myself and it
easily carried Me, the wife and 80 Liters of water with no problems.

And it had room for proper oars :-)

Cheers,

Bruce

Cannibal
 

"Jessica B" wrote in message
...
On Fri, 28 Jan 2011 11:28:18 -0500, "Wilbur Hubbard"
wrote:

"Jessica B" wrote in message
. ..

snip


Whoa... you're a captain? That's so cool! That says a lot about you...
you have to pass all sorts of background checks if it's anything like
getting even a local government job like mine.


Thanks, I have an excellent security background having had a Top Secret
clearance for security work as a military policeman in the U.S. Army This
is why I am highly insulted being subjected to a government bureaucrat,
dog
and pony, jump-through-the-hoops show. This is why I just said, NO! I've
never been arrested for anything. Never even had a speeding ticket. I can
even produce a valid birth certificate. Few, if any of the people who
would
have me jump through hoops can claim the same. And, this in the name of
anti-terrorism, which is as much as accusing ME of being a terrorist
threat,
while the government ignores actual terrorists and cries and agitates for
releasing them from Guantanamo Bay. Ludicrous!

Yes, and don't listen to Bruce, stuck at the Bangkok dock. He's just
envious
of my greater qualifications. I qualified for and was duly issued a USCG,
Master of Steam or Motor Vessels of not more than 25 gross tons upon near
coastal waters; also operator of uninspected passenger vessels as defined
in
46 U.S.C. 2101 (42) upon near coastal waters not to exceed 100 miles
offshore, which is way more than Brucie-Poo ever accomplished. Don't be
fooled by those envious people like Joe who claim that near coastal is
less
than open ocean for everybody knows near coastal is where the hazardous
sailing takes place. Open ocean is a joke and the realm of autopilots.

That's where the rocks are... So, if you stay away from the rocks,
then you have one less thing to worry about I guess. Every story my
friend tells of mishap is in and around the marina or surrounding
area.

Yes, they say it's usually not the water that puts a boat in jeopardy but
rather the hard stuff around the edges. LOL! Any old fool can pilot a boat
in the open ocean. Heck, there's nothing out there to hit. Many big ships
put the damned things of autopilot and nobody is even keeping a lookout when
on the open ocean and this is the so-called shipping lanes where there IS
some little traffic, at least. Goes to show you have to try pretty hard to
have a collision out there. So, when some pretend sailor makes light of a
near coastal license it just demonstrates a lack of understanding of where
the real challenges are and where it takes real knowledge to cope.




I don't get what's going on with the government... all this money
coming in, and the whole infrastructure seems to be falling apart. I
don't mind a few rules, but come on. Especially when it comes to
paperwork. You've already been through the checks, you've already
passed your exam (or whatever), so give the individual a break
already.


Job security for govt. pencil pushers! (no offense, not meaning you
because
you actually get out of the office and do productive work).

Thanks! I have to write up stuff, but it's from actionable items...
red-flags, resolutions, follow-up recommendations. I'm sick of all the
money that seems to be frittered away on endlessly studying the mating
habits of magpies or whatever.


Has anybody ever offered you a bribe to look the other way on something?



Wilbur Hubbard

Cannibal
 

"CaveLamb" wrote in message
m...
Bruce wrote:
On Fri, 28 Jan 2011 13:57:52 -0600, CaveLamb
wrote:

Bruce,

I think you are right about him/her.

His/her mental masturbations are sort of interesting -
for a while.

But it quickly becomes tiresome.

From one of Rolf Harris' songs:

He's mighty like a rose
He wears his sister's clothes
We don't know (what) to call him
But we think he's one of those

Political correctness in action. I believe that y'all have that back
there.


Yup.

Not yup! He left out 'what' in the third line. Duh! More senile dementia
setting in?

Wilbur Hubbard

Cannibal
 

"Bob" wrote in message
...
The idea with the TWIC card is to ensure that all people
with access to port infrastructure areas, docks, builldings, etc.,
have proper security credentials.

It's entirely possible that our friend in question has some sort of,
uhhh, "issue" in his past that would preclude security authorization.


I have to agree Bruce.
Bob




Then that makes both of you Rubes incorrect.


Wilbur Hubbard

Cannibal
 

"Wayne.B" wrote in message
...
On Sat, 29 Jan 2011 14:30:04 -0800, Jessica B
wrote:

Why do they charge $100 for that
card ..TIWC? Seems like it's kind of over the top. What does it get
you?

It gets you a fancy ID card that has all of your biometric data,
including fingerprints, encoded on to an internal chip. All people
involved in public transportation are now required to have one.




And the Coast Guard officers couldn't care less about even looking at the
damned thing. They know it's a farce. They respect the Master License they
issue but they reject the redundant TWIC card. Why? Because the stupid
bureaucrats don't give them scanners for the biometric chip. So what good is
it?

LOL!


Wilbur Hubbard

Cannibal
 

"Bob" wrote in message
...

What wilbur is saying is that he has a 25 GRT Master most likely
INLAND. This means that ALL of his credible Sea Service was on vessels
15 GRT. One day over 15 GRT would get Willbur a 50 GRT Master.


Do you have reading comprehension problems. Just what don't you understand
about "NEAR COASTAL"? Near coastal is not for the INLAND WATERWAYS. Ever
heard of a line of demarcation? Western Rivers. The Huey P. Long Bridge.
Sheesh, Bob!

Its a rather easy test.

Wrong! More people fail than pass at least the first time around.

The problme that WIlbur is ranting about to
provide a smoke screen for his lack of credible tonnage is now the
USCG and TSA (TWIC) require a significant background check. If you
have a DUI or "other" events that may place you in a security risk
catigory and scuttle your Captiains license. Heck, there are even new
and increased HEALTH requirments that list drugs such as high blood
preasure and others which will deny a renewal. Oh, there are also body
mass index (BMI) requirmenst. In other words., those fat ass coonasses
down south may get denied a renewal cause their so fat.

No DUIs, no parking tickets, no speeding tickets, no moving violations no
traffic violations of ANY sort. Got a ticket on my bicycle a few years ago
but beat it in court - the judge dismissed it.

BP is in the normal range, no other maladies, eyesight 20-40. No color
blindness. I'm 5'10" and weigh 165 so there goes your fattie fantasy. I
could kick your sorry butt anytime in a foot race, bike race or swim race.

Those fat coonasses don't include Joe as I've seen a photo or two of him and
he's ugly but not fat. LOL! Makes me wonder, though, how Ms. Terry managed
to get a Master's license - surely she must be half blind to abide Joe's
puss!


snipp

And I support increased requirments completely. It time to keep the
drug users and fat asses off the water.

Agreed! But that is already covered in the USCG Masters Licence. No
redundant TWIC card is necessary for those things.


Its real simple. I get my 200 GRT Master NC/1600 Mate Near Coast and
all is well. a few years later im so obease I cant get up a ladder, my
blood preasure is so high Id blow, im an alcoholic etc... in other
words Im not fit for duty.


Duh, that's why you must retake the physical and drug tests at every
re-issue. You sound like you don't have a clue about it. Maybe Joe is right
when he says you're a fake??

I say make the rules MORE strict!

Freaking Commie!

so why are you republicans,SLAP

Freaking LIBERAL COMMIE! Take a hike!


Wilbur Hubbard

Cannibal
 

"Jessica B" wrote in message
...
On Sat, 29 Jan 2011 13:55:46 -0800 (PST), Bob
snip

And I support increased requirments completely. It time to keep the
drug users and fat asses off the water.

Somehow I don't get the impression that Capt. Wil is either a drug
user or a fat ass.


Thank you, Jessica, and well-said. As usual, you are more perceptive than
the so-called sailors. Beauty AND brains - so wonderful.


Wilbur Hubbard (wishing I were about forty years younger)

Cannibal
 

In article , Bruce wrote:
On Sun, 30 Jan 2011 00:43:08 +0000, Justin C
wrote:

Just a small point. Eric Hiscock was never knighted and therefore is not
entitled to the title Sir. He (and his wife) were awarded the MBE, but
that does not bestow a title.

Justin.

It is difficult for outsiders, remember that wogs start at Calais, to
understand the British honors system.

No, that's 'frogs'.


(Particularly one that was said to have originated with someone
recovering a garter (:-)
Cheers,

T'weren't easy for me to work out either, I just started by looking up
EH on Wikipedia, then I had to start with the whole honours thing. Fkin
can of worms that was. Elton John a 'Sir'?! Yet someone like EH, who
actually *did* something.... oh, let's just not go there.

Justin.

--
Justin C, by the sea.

Cannibal
 

On Sat, 29 Jan 2011 17:54:30 -0500, "Wilbur Hubbard"
wrote:

"Bruce" wrote in message
.. .


Dinghy Dock? And you've spent all this time nattering on about Marinas
and now you admit to anchoring off to avoid paying dockage and then
sneaking into the dinghy dock??


More proof that you never go anywhere. If you were a real cruiser you would
use dinghy docks regularly when anchored in distant harbors. What do YOU do?
Haul your dinghy ashore on private property? Probably. Some dinghy docks
charge a small fee and some are free - either way trying to change the
subject about the stupidity of having long oars protruding over the ends or
sides of a dinghy just won't cut the mustard.

Wilbur Hubbard

Err... What "distant harbours are you referring to? The places I
anchor don't have "dinghy docks", they only have a beach. Private
property? Whatever are you talking about, there is no one there but
me.

Ah Willie... the penny drops - you are talking about the coast of
Florida. Not the far flung harbors and bays of the world. But I do
suppose that reading books give one a bit of a restricted viewpoint.

By the way, Willie-boy, the secret of not having your oars stick out
of your dinghy isn't to cut the oars off, a much better solution is to
build a longer dinghy.

Oh, but I forgot, you lack the skills to built a dinghy so you buy a
"rubber duck".

Cheers,

Bruce

Cannibal
 

On Sat, 29 Jan 2011 17:51:35 -0500, "Wilbur Hubbard"
wrote:

"Bruce" wrote in message
.. .
emptied ballast

Sir Eric may well have said/written that, however, given that Hiscock
was writing in an earlier time ("Wandering Under Sail" -1939) and who
died in 1986 I suggest that he was not writing about a rubber dinghy
which is a far different design from the small rowing boat that was
likely what Hiscock had experience with.

Poppycock! Sir Eric knew more about sailing than you can ever hope to. He
was talking about rowing dinghies and not so abortion of an inflatable which
he could not and would not abide for all the obvious reasons. You must think
I have a rubber duck. I do not. My dinghy is constructed of GRP and is six
feel long. Six-foot oars is the max length for my dinghy as they will lay
inside just like Sir Eric recommends. You are the clown the attempted to say
it was nonsense to suggest oars should fit in the length of the dinghy. So,
stop trying to obfuscate, man up, admit your mistake and apologize for your
ignorant abusive tone.

Are you sure that you know what you are talking about?
For a very quick example, you refer to "Sir Eric Hiscock". He was
never knighted and never used that title.

did you really read the book? Of just see it in the window when
passing the store?

It is nonsense to suggest that oars short enough to fit inside the
boat is a major criterion for oar design. and arguing is simply
attempting to justify yet another stupid statements.

Now go and ask anyone who rows a boat on a daily basis. They will
simply laugh at you and row away as you have just exposed yourself as
yet another Sunday Sailor who (in spite of having read Hiscock) still
knows nothing of boats.

Should I care about the opinion of some wannabe over that of a notable
expert like Sir Eric?

Wilbur Hubbard


Cheers,

Bruce

Cannibal
 

On Sun, 30 Jan 2011 22:43:58 +0000, Justin C
wrote:

In article , Bruce wrote:
On Sun, 30 Jan 2011 00:43:08 +0000, Justin C
wrote:

Just a small point. Eric Hiscock was never knighted and therefore is not
entitled to the title Sir. He (and his wife) were awarded the MBE, but
that does not bestow a title.

Justin.

It is difficult for outsiders, remember that wogs start at Calais, to
understand the British honors system.

No, that's 'frogs'.

I blush to argue but the saying "The wogs begin at Calais" was
originated by George Wigg, Labour MP for Dudley, in 1949. In a
parliamentary debate concerning the Burmese, Wigg shouted at the Tory
benches, "The Honourable Gentleman and his friends think they are all
'wogs'. Indeed, the Right Honourable Member for Woodford [i.e. Winston
Churchill] thinks that the 'wogs' begin at Calais.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wog


(Particularly one that was said to have originated with someone
recovering a garter (:-)
Cheers,

T'weren't easy for me to work out either, I just started by looking up
EH on Wikipedia, then I had to start with the whole honours thing. Fkin
can of worms that was. Elton John a 'Sir'?! Yet someone like EH, who
actually *did* something.... oh, let's just not go there.

Justin.
Cheers,

Bruce

Cannibal
 

On Sat, 29 Jan 2011 17:35:26 -0500, "Wilbur Hubbard"
wrote:

"Bruce" wrote in message
.. .
On Fri, 28 Jan 2011 13:12:37 -0500, "Wilbur Hubbard"
wrote:

A kitty cat is a proper addition to a sailing yacht as they will eliminate
any mouse or rat that might come aboard from who knows where.

there is room for you, and a rat, on the yellow dinghy?

Many ocean-going sailors will confirm the fact that a 27-30 foot sailboat is
the ideal size because of the wavelength and frequency of prevailing winds
generated wave trains. Something about twice that size ends up being a
rougher ride by far and can be overwhelmed and pooped in a following sea
whereas the modest-size vessel just rides up and over like a duck. So, get a
clue. Loose that stupid bigger is better attitude. It only paints you as
ignorant of real world sailing.

Ah Willie, I see you've been reading the Pardey's. If you read Lynn's
earliest stories you world have discovered that the major reason for
building Seraffyn (24'7") was lack of money to build bigger and the
Pardey's first published exercise was a letter to the editor of a
sailing magazine, in response to a published article, in which they
argue that a little boat can be as seaworthy as a big boat.

But your argue that a 27-30 ft. boat is ideal is just a pipe dream. A
VLCC or Box Carrier will be doing 30 K in weather that will keep you
in the harbor. Obviously you (once again) don't know what you are
talking about.

As for being pooped, boat length has nothing to do with it. If the
wave travels faster then the boat you get pooped, if the boat is at
wave speed, or faster, then you don't. But then, you don't have to
read a book to discover that little gem... just go sailing.


snip


Errr, Willie, I'm here in Thailand, and you are still anchored in
Florida? And somehow this indicates that you are the sailorman and I'm
not.....

Admission of failure noted. While I have cruised thousands of miles, I have
never been stranded in some backwater for 30 years like you have. I have met
all my goals and have not been forced into expatriation by virtue of a
dearth of perserverance and/or skills.

How so Backwater? Are you comparing your S. Florida cove with Bali,
Jakarta, Singapore, Port Klang, Pinang, Or any of the Thai ports, and
that just covers a fraction of the places I've anchored in the past
few years.


Something wrong with your logic I'm afraid.

You're afraid, alright. Afraid of going the rest of the way around. LOL!
Keep telling yourself that half of your goal is success. One day in the
distant future you might even come to really believe it.

I'm beginning to wonder about your continued rabbeting on about goals.
What ever are you going on about? My "goals" have been varied over the
years but have never been to sail a boat somewhere. It isn't a "goal"
to somehow be accomplished any more then driving to the convenience
store to get a can of beer. You just get in and go.

You see Willie-boy, you are romanticizing a subject that is just an
everyday occurrence. One of the shortcomings of reading rather then
doing.



Liberal drones? what ever gave you that idea? I certainly would like
to see your evidence to support that statement..


Your brainwashed state and Joe's brainwashed state respecting equating
trying with succeeding is at the very core of liberal drone thinking. It's
the very same thought process that has children playing soccer, softball,
etc. and not keeping score because there can be no losers. Get a clue. In
life there ARE winners and losers and just because one tries, it doesn't
keep one from being a failure and a loser when one does not succeed. You and
Joe are quite pitiful really. Joe brags that he's the better man because he,
at least, tried. Never mind that he tried AND failed miserably. So, by his
reasoning, a miserable failure is better than somebody with goals he tries
and succeeds at attaining even though the goals don't seem quite so lofty?
So you have a failure presuming to be the arbiter of loft? That doesn't
strike you as ludicrous and inane? You can't see that grinding to a halt
half-way around is no success no matter how hard you try to rationalize it,
after the fact?

The more you talk the more it appears that you really know nothing
about sailing. Your talk about winners and losers, failure and
winning, and all the other bumph that you spout is just that and
exposes your utter lack of knowledge about boats.

Boats are not some sort of Everest that has to be conquer. It is just
a form of transportation. Like your bicycle, a motor-car, even shoes.
Go you rabbit on about riding your bike to the 7-11 to get a tube of
toothpaste? Or extol your shoes and how you walk from house to house
reading the water-meters?

Willie-boy you go on about the romance and mystique of boating just
exactly like all the other wannabes. Try talking to someone who has
actually sailed to somewhere and you will be surprised at the lack of
romance there is. Just load the boat, check the mail, and go.


Wilbur Hubbard

Cheers,

Bruce

Cannibal
 

Why do they charge $100 for that
card ..TIWC? Seems like it's kind of over the top. What does it get
you?


For those who work in the maritime industry/docks etc it is a
requirment to gain access to vessels and other secure areas.. as in
get passed the gate to the dock.


It gets you a fancy ID card that has all of your biometric data,
including fingerprints, encoded on to an internal chip. *All people
involved in public transportation are now required to have one.

as in Transportation Worker Identification Card (TWIC).


And the Coast Guard officers couldn't care less about even looking at the
damned thing.

Not true........ Ive had USCG boardig team request my "mariners
papers" which included my TWIC

They know it's a farce.

That is a huge assumptoin on your part. The USCG people Ive met were
exemplary professionals. Their personal opinions were not evident.
They were there reperseinting the laws of the land.

They respect the Master License they
issue but they reject the redundant TWIC card.


Respect has nothing to do with it. Pure and simple its a job. They ask
for certain documnets and I as a workig mariner present thoes
documents.

Why? Because the stupid
bureaucrats don't give them scanners for the biometric chip. So what good is
it?


That my friend yould have to ask Geo Bush and the republicans. They
were the ones who created Das Homland Security and the TSA. If you
want to blame somebody blame the republicans for stealing more of our
personal feedoms.


LOL!

Wilbur Hubbard

Cannibal
 

On Jan 30, 9:17*am, "Wilbur Hubbard"
wrote:
"Bob" wrote in message

...

What wilbur is saying is that he has a 25 GRT Master most likely
INLAND. This means that ALL of his credible Sea Service was on vessels
15 GRT. One day over 15 GRT would get Willbur a 50 GRT Master.

Do you have reading comprehension problems. Just what don't you understand
about "NEAR COASTAL"? Near coastal is not for the INLAND WATERWAYS. Ever
heard of a line of demarcation? Western Rivers. The Huey P. Long Bridge.
Sheesh, Bob!

Yes Wilbur In fact Ive walked across the HP Long Bridge.
And yes, I understand the how INLAND-NEAR COAST-OCEANS indorcement are
defined.
My comment was a simple sarcastic criticizim of your license. I
assumed ur 25 ton was INLAND




Its a rather easy test.

Wrong! More people fail than pass at least the first time around.

That is incorrect. The USCG audit and monitor the private
license prep "schools." I belive in 2008 the lower level (200GRT)
master license pass rate was 97%. Those are USCG numbers.

Now how you characterize that number is up to you.............


No DUIs, no parking tickets, no speeding tickets, no moving violations no
traffic violations of ANY sort. Got a ticket on my bicycle a few years ago
but beat it in court - the judge dismissed it.

Ya aint that a bitch. I got a ticket on my bicycle fro bloowing
through a stop sign.


BP is in the normal range, no other maladies, eyesight 20-40. No color
blindness. I'm 5'10" and weigh 165 so there goes your fattie fantasy. I
could kick your sorry butt anytime in a foot race, bike race or swim race..

That is good that you keep healty. That way my taxes will be lower
because you live a heathy life style. Democrats are very fiscally
conservative in that way. Why should my taxes increase to pay for your
medical bills and yuor health **** ups?

And I support increased requirments completely. It time to keep the
drug users and fat asses off the water.

Agreed! But that is already covered in the USCG Masters Licence. No
redundant TWIC card is necessary for those things.


take that up with the republican make work TSA. Yup the TSA was the
biggest make-work program since the CCC.


You sound like you don't have a clue about it. Maybe Joe is right
when he says you're a fake??

Think what you want. For a 1 1/2 years I worked as an AB.


I say make the rules MORE strict!

Freaking Commie!

No we have way too many rules as it is and most are nutured making
necessary rules to govern safety a joke.


so why are you republicans,SLAP

Freaking LIBERAL COMMIE! Take a hike!

Wilbur Hubbard

Cannibal
 

As for being pooped, boat length has nothing to do with it. If the
wave travels faster then the boat you get pooped, if the boat is at
wave speed, or faster, then you don't. But then, you don't have to
read a book to discover that little gem... just go sailing.

My dear Bruce. I belive the defintion of getting pooped is when water
is shiped on deck. TO have a wave pass the boat is simply that: a wave
going by.

Please forgive me if I misunderstood your post.

Bob

Cannibal
 

Wilbur Hubbard (wishing I were about forty years younger)


I dont want to waste my time finding your original post. However, the
one I recall that cought my eye was your statment that anchor rode
should be 3 strand nylon.

Here I completly disagree in one aspect. Yes, 3 strand is okay for day
anchors in winds below 20 k how ever in conditions where "extream"
loads are experinced nylon double braid is best. Why? It wont hockle
and part do to the hockle. Yes double braid has less stretch but if
you ballance the correct working load, length, and chain/line ratio it
will counter the reduced stratch. Your ground tackle In a survival
situation should be double braid not 3 strand. And i dont give a ****
what Ocean Navigator or Cruising WOrld mag you quote. Recreational
sailing advice/best practices is driven by marketing stratiges to get
you to buy a product or erronious tradition.

Do a review of the approperate case studies and youll find that rodes
part in three typical places:
1) Chafe point where line gets fair lead through a closed chock on
deck. ( this can be cured)
2) standing part of line due to hockle (this can be cured with double
braid)
3) eye splice/shackle connection to chain. (this can be cured)

This aint briain surgury its jsut plain riggin.

BOb

Cannibal
 

Bob wrote:
Wilbur Hubbard (wishing I were about forty years younger)


I dont want to waste my time finding your original post. However, the
one I recall that cought my eye was your statment that anchor rode
should be 3 strand nylon.

Here I completly disagree in one aspect. Yes, 3 strand is okay for day
anchors in winds below 20 k how ever in conditions where "extream"
loads are experinced nylon double braid is best. Why? It wont hockle
and part do to the hockle. Yes double braid has less stretch but if
you ballance the correct working load, length, and chain/line ratio it
will counter the reduced stratch. Your ground tackle In a survival
situation should be double braid not 3 strand. And i dont give a ****
what Ocean Navigator or Cruising WOrld mag you quote. Recreational
sailing advice/best practices is driven by marketing stratiges to get
you to buy a product or erronious tradition.

Do a review of the approperate case studies and youll find that rodes
part in three typical places:
1) Chafe point where line gets fair lead through a closed chock on
deck. ( this can be cured)
2) standing part of line due to hockle (this can be cured with double
braid)
3) eye splice/shackle connection to chain. (this can be cured)

This aint briain surgury its jsut plain riggin.

BOb


That's not what the magazine article that he read said though!

--

Richard Lamb
email me:
web site: http://www.home.earthlink.net/~cavelamb

Cannibal
 

Bob wrote:
Wilbur Hubbard (wishing I were about forty years younger)


I dont want to waste my time finding your original post. However, the
one I recall that cought my eye was your statment that anchor rode
should be 3 strand nylon.

Here I completly disagree in one aspect. Yes, 3 strand is okay for day
anchors in winds below 20 k how ever in conditions where "extream"
loads are experinced nylon double braid is best. Why? It wont hockle
and part do to the hockle. Yes double braid has less stretch but if
you ballance the correct working load, length, and chain/line ratio it
will counter the reduced stratch. Your ground tackle In a survival
situation should be double braid not 3 strand. And i dont give a ****
what Ocean Navigator or Cruising WOrld mag you quote. Recreational
sailing advice/best practices is driven by marketing stratiges to get
you to buy a product or erronious tradition.

Do a review of the approperate case studies and youll find that rodes
part in three typical places:
1) Chafe point where line gets fair lead through a closed chock on
deck. ( this can be cured)
2) standing part of line due to hockle (this can be cured with double
braid)
3) eye splice/shackle connection to chain. (this can be cured)

This aint briain surgury its jsut plain riggin.

BOb

BOb,

Would a swivel shackle help prevent 3 braid hockle?

--

Richard Lamb
email me:
web site: http://www.home.earthlink.net/~cavelamb

Cannibal
 

On Sun, 30 Jan 2011 21:55:22 -0600, CaveLamb
wrote:

Would a swivel shackle help prevent 3 braid hockle?

I assume you mean a swivel at the anchor? If yes, perhaps.

There are a lot of different "hockle" issues. Like most cruisers with
boats over 40 ft or so, we anchor with a chain rode and then use a
hook line to provide some shock absorption, and also to take the load
off of the windlass and anchor pulpit. For years we used a hook line
made from three strand nylon. Unfortunately three strand nylon tries
to unlay its own twist when you put a strain on it, and that in turn
twists the chain. Some of that twist goes away when you remove the
strain but not all of it, probably due to frictional forces. Over
time you end up with a hockled chain, even with a swivel at the
anchor. We've recently switched over to an 8-plait nylon braid for
the hook line. It's difficult to splice but does seem to help with
eliminating twisted chain. The 8-plait braid would also make a
superb all nylon rode if properly chafe protected because it does not
hockle up when stowed.

Cannibal
 

On Jan 30, 8:33*pm, Wayne.B wrote:
On Sun, 30 Jan 2011 21:55:22 -0600, CaveLamb
wrote:

Would a swivel shackle help prevent 3 braid hockle?

I assume you mean a swivel at the anchor? *If yes, perhaps.

There are a lot of different "hockle" issues. *Like most cruisers with
boats over 40 ft or so, we anchor with a chain rode and then use a
hook line to provide some shock absorption, and also to take the load
off of the windlass and anchor pulpit. *For years we used a hook line
made from three strand nylon. *Unfortunately three strand nylon tries
to unlay its own twist when you put a strain on it, and that in turn
twists the chain. *Some of that twist goes away when you remove the
strain but not all of it, probably due to frictional forces. *Over
time you end up with a hockled chain, even with a swivel at the
anchor. * We've recently switched over to an 8-plait nylon braid for
the hook line. * It's difficult to splice but does seem to help with
eliminating twisted chain. * The 8-plait braid would also make a
superb all nylon rode if properly chafe protected because it does not
hockle up when stowed.



A well thought out relpy Wayne. My experince with my 17 grt Freya is
similar. I tried the bridal and the "shock obsorber? gizmo. Both with
the same result. Do you remember those 10 cent balsa rubber band
airplanes? (circa 1950s-early 60s)

That is what happens with three strand line when put under a load. Ive
watched 100 feet of four inch three strand nylon undrer FULL load
last winter...... (hang off line) it was attacched to the stern of the
boat I was on(180', 930 GRT) and a structure. It parted 10 feet
forward of the 6 foot eye splice. It looked just like that rubber band
on that 10 cent airplane. WIth each surg it twisted complet rotations
seveal times. Bammm! Im sure Joe will chime in here with his crew boat
storyies with their 1 1/2 lines.

Ive also seen 100+ ton codends being drug up the stern ramp of factory
trawlers in the Bering Sea. They used double braid in the 80s but ALL
use AMSTEAL now. Its a plait line. That stuff has completely replaced
wire roap in the commercial trawl fisheries. Why? Amsteal is rock
****ing rugged, dont rust, no fish-hooks, light and faster to splice.
Its a god send to riggers.

Now for the swivel controversy...... if you use double braid you now
eliminate one more link (the swivel) in your ground tackle which
follows my rigging guidlines..... less is better. Also, take a dock
walk and look at those boat owners using those swivels. My experince
is 30%+ are installed incorrectly. There is a right end and wrong end
to attach to the road....

Best wishes.......
Bob.