"Vic Smith" wrote in message
...
I can't recall what options you had to get your injectors, but
excepting dealing with an asshole and mistakenly sacrificing your
banjo bolts, seems you got the job done.

My options, once I capitulated to sending off my old ones, as I was
going to
be in the states for only a few more weeks, were extremely limited.

However, I'd started with Southeastservice.net. They have a
rebuilding and
stocking location in NC, not a driveable distance from where I was in
GA,
and their location was a couple of hours south of me. That's where I
got the
BBs and washers, they promising to stay a few minutes longer if
needed
because I was coming just before they closed on Saturday, the day
before I
was to leave. They had 4 in stock, praise the Lord, which solved my
immediate problem. I really just wanted to see what Foley would do;
they
proved their reputation among cruisers many times over, in the end.
When I
called to see what might be done to get the missing parts,
introducing
myself nicely (no more than identifying myself, really), he
interrupted me
before I could even say hello, and hung up on me. His hanging up on
people,
as you may have seen, is SOP with him.

In my initial searching, I struck out on finding anyone with stock, or
who
could provide any real assurance that they'd have me back in business
by the
time I had to leave. In desperation (preferring to get them serviced,
if
they didn't need rebuilding), I called all the tractor places, truck
places,
and any other service places which showed Perkins in their ads. All
said
they shipped them off to the Southeast plant in NC, which is why I
STARTED
with them before, hoping to find one who could sell me two more in
stock (to
go with the two new spares I had).

I'd called TAD, who I've had a good experience with in the past, but
they
were closed. Asshole was the next on the list. Wish he'd been closed,
too,
cuz I'd have called TAD back in the morning! :{/)

Did you ever find a source other than Foley that you could have used
or will use next time you're fixing your Perkins in an exotic
location?

If I were willing to deal with international shipments, and have a
spare
set, as I now do, there are legions of Perkins distributors who would
be
glad to help me if I took the old ones out and sent them off, using
my
spares until their return (to go into spares). One such was the guy
in
California who told me of the GA distributors (after closing on the
same
Friday, but CA being 3 hours earlier, I was able to get one), and gave
me
not only the right part numbers, but told me not to pay any more than
the
RRP of $3.16 (which was what I was charged in Southeast.

And, going back to my original target (servicing), had I abandoned
that and
just resigned myself to rebuilts, I have no doubt that Southeast would
have
done a stellar job. I'm going there in Lydia's July run for her
grandson to
get the other 4 BBs and washers, and pick their brain about what
other
spares they might have which would be prudent for me to have...

You should publicize it.

Heh. If you read my stuff regularly, you know I do go out of my way,
in
many of my log posts, to praise (and link, with emails, too) helpful
vendors. This is just the flip side of the coin :{))

OTOH, in general, as Dr. Diesel was proud to point out in his BBB
response,
the 4-154 is an obsolete engine, and parts other than the BBs which
are
generic to the many engines which use the same injectors are
sometimes
unobtainium. In another venue, someone took me to task for what (he
thought) should have been a very simple job. He then went looking to
see
how easy it was, and admitted that it was far from simple. Despite all
the
farm tractors which also use the same engine, getting parts - such as
a
fresh water pump - is sometimes literally impossible NIB, and
difficult in
rebuilt and/or used. It's why, on lists which are specific to boats
using
the engine, any part-outs are usually snapped up immediately.

In any case, I really expect (other than discussions such as this)
this to
be the end of it. They're not going to even think (posturing to the
BBB
aside) about legal action, and I've had more than $100 of fun with
the
experience :{))

L8R

Skip
--
Morgan 461 #2
SV Flying Pig KI4MPC
See our galleries at www.justpickone.org/skip/gallery !
Follow us at http://groups.yahoo.com/group/TheFlyingPigLog
and/or http://groups.google.com/group/flyingpiglog

"You are never given a wish without also being given the power to
make it come true. You may have to work for it however."
(and)
"There is no such thing as a problem without a gift for you in
its hand. You seek problems because you need their gifts."

(Richard Bach, in Illusions - The Reluctant Messiah)

Skip,
I can see why you are irritated about this affair, but some of this is clearly your doing. Your first error is not having
verified, functional injectors on the boat. Not having them forced you to do remote business. That placed you in a very vulnerable
position and that usually translates to exceptional cost. The next mistake is to send the injectors back BEFORE the new ones
arrived. The normal method used when core charges are necessary is that the customer (you) pays the full price and then after the
core is received by the vender, the vender generates a credit to the customer. I also think your comment about the firm catching
your error is out of order. I think it is pretty safe to assume that the people receiving parts, stacking shelves and packing
parts will not be the sharpest knives in the drawer when it comes to knowing how to use the bits they handle, because if they did
know, they wouldn't be stacking shelves and packing boxes. Now that said, I think Phil George's action is stupid at best. His
action over this incident has done nothing to help his company's business reputation. It fact, I am certain it has caused
irreparable harm. I can think of several ways he could have remedied the situation and not cost the company anything and generated
good will in the process. As far as pending legal action....forget it..... he has no case. Stupidity has its just rewards. Let
this be a lesson to all.
Steve


"Flying Pig" wrote in message ...
Foley Engines responds to the BBB - a followup to a post of about a month
ago titled "Dr. Diesel, Foley Engines, and me..." and subsequent thread
expansion which included reference to the Better Business Bureau...

As I was under sail and out of internet communication, I didn't see this
until just recently...

For those interested in seeing any other stuff which may appear, you can go
to the link in the BBB - click on the "more" for expansion of any section:
http://central-westernma.app.bbb.org...24611/c/c98bbd...

This response from Foley was sent to the BBB on 4-1 (appropriately, April
Fool's Day).

Contact Name and Title: Philip George, Service Mg
Contact Phone: 508-753-2979
Contact Email:
Dear Sir/Ms.,

We sold Mr. Gundlach a set of fuel injectors for his Perkins Marine engine.
The transaction was quite simple. Mr. Gundlach called to place an order with
us. We took his order in good faith. The parts he purchased were
remanufactured and sold exchange (the old parts have to be sent back to us).
The old injectors came back and we shipped a set of Factory Remanufactured
injectors out to Mr. Gundlach. In the interim, Mr. Gundlach says he left a
very small fitting on his old injectors. By the time this was brought to our
attention Mr. Gundlach's old injectors had been processed along with the
hundreds of other injectors we process every week. We could not entertain
Mr. Gundlach's request for our people to "dig" through approximately 3000
injectors cores to look for these fittings. At that time we advised him to
simply go to his local Perkins dealer and obtain the replacement fittings
that he had said he had sent to us. The total cost for these parts should
not have exceeded $15. We can not take responsibility for Mr. Gundlach's
decision to remove or nor remove these fittings from his old injectors. For
all of the above reasons we unable to offer Mr. Gundlach any money for his
mistake.

Furthermore, Mr. Gundlach has a track record of writing long winded
complaints about issues with little or no merit. We are getting phone calls
from past customers in the caribbean telling us that Mr. Gundlach is posting
negative comments about our 96 year old company on various sail boat
internet discussion sites including Sailnet and the Morgan 41 owners site.
(Apparently Mr.Gundlach's boat, The Flying Pig is a Morgan). Our customers
also tell us to disregard his rants because he has a pattern of posting
daily on many different sites and he doesn't have the highest credibility.

We urge the BBB to overturn this complaint. We have referred this matter to
our attorneys and they tell us that they will be pursuing this matter in the
courts of the Commonwealth of Massachusetts for damages resulting from
"interference with a beneficial business relationship" and slander.

Please feel free to contact me with any questions.


Best Regards,

Philip George
Service Manager
508-753-2979




I'd be interested to see on what basis I can be found responsible for (Open
Quote) "interference with a beneficial business relationship" and slander
(close Quote) given that most of my post on which the complaint would be
based consisted of verbatim transcripts of our email communications, of
which half were theirs (and, of course, theirs, proving my point).

Not to mention that slander is verbal defamation (from the Legal Dictionary:
"1 : defamation of a person by unprivileged oral communication made to a
third party"); I believe Mr. George intends Libel, the publishing of
untruths (from http://www.cyberlibel.com/libel.html#Number%201 : "The
classic definition is: "a publication without justification or lawful excuse
which is calculated to injure the reputation of another by exposing him to
hatred, contempt or ridicule." (Parke, B. in Parmiter v. Coupland (1840)
GM&W 105 at 108)" - and many other interesting points found at the same
site, all of which point to a fruitless enterprise on the attorney's part, -
but if his attorneys say it's slander, who am I, not a lawyer, to disagree?
And, do my numerous confirmatory respondents in public fora also run the
risk of such approbium???

And then there's his audacious and scurrilous mendacity with his customers, some (others) found at Sailnet, of all places, given
his citation using Sailnet as part of his rant. I'm hardly alone - see
http://www.sailnet.com/forums/gear-m...y-engines.html as
just a single point of reference for some perspective :{)) I'd have done
myself a world of good to have seen this link before my encounter (but I
didn't). To the above paragraph, did his attorneys go after all those posters, as well?? Note his "our customers tell" them to
disregard me. Interesting that I've not heard from any of them in his defense, nor get the criticism (I get plenty of
criticism - read: polarity of views - about some of my posts on various levels, but not usually about stuff I have first-hand
experience with) cited. Am I now to take _him_ to libel action? :{))

Note, of course, the total lack of response to the bait-and-switch part of
the complaint, let alone the customer service attitude and followup
(including offering to sell me the missing parts and then demanding an
additional $50 purchase when I tried to do that, as seen in my original -
another bait-and-switch, in my view). However, back to his response
specifics:

Foley Engine, the self-proclaimed diesel engine experts, should not have had
to be notified of a part sent into them (the banjo bolts) which should have
been retained. I've never before worked on them (if I had, I might have
known not to include them when I sent off the cores, despite my - new -
spares having them on them). However, even given my lack of practical
experience, if I'd seen 3000 injector cores come in (implied in the last 2
weeks between receipt and my notification) without them, I believe I would
recognize that this was out of order.

These so-called experts should have had that stick out like a sore thumb,
and have mentioned it in the requirement that I pay them $200 more than I
was quoted at the beginning. Without their having seen them, as seen in the
original, nothing would have happened (meaning, they had my injectors in
hand - had they not been acceptable cores, the order would have been
rejected, which suggests that they were inspected before I was called - and
were proceeding with the order, however it may have concluded). The
suggestion that I go to the local Perkins dealer, given that I was in the
Bahamas, was disingenous at best. Even when I was in the states, it
involved a drive of a couple of hours, as seen in my original post.

Failing that, as pointed out, in my last letter to them, and his response to
the BBB, it's less than $15 for the required parts. Don't you suppose that
it would have been REALLY good business (particularly, since I agreed, under
stress, to pay $100 more than I'd originally agreed), prompting a very
different sort of reaction from me, to have sent me those parts, new, with
the new injectors, saying something to the effect of "You'll need these;
they're not normally included, but since your engine won't run without them,
we've included them here. Remember us when you need more parts!"?

Those of you who follow my "rambling and nonsensical posts" (an assertion
from a followup poster to the BBB site, but softened to include that Foley
had a rough reputation in dispute resolution) know that I make repetitious
very positive noises about vendors I find going out of their way either in
good customer service or in delivering more than they promise, including
links to how to find them, in case one of my thousands of readers might like
to take advantage of such superior vendors. Imagine the difference
(counterweight to all the negative stuff which appears other than in a
thread originated by me, if one searches, as I SHOULD have done, before my
order) if I'd been singing their praises not only on this but on future
encounters with them!?!

You (regular readers) also know that I'm not shy about admitting dumb
mistakes. Likely, my retelling of this (different!) tale would have
included laughing at myself, and congratulating Foley on catching my error
(admitted, based on the new spares I had already in stock) and rectifying
it - whether by customer service of free parts, or, even, just a simple
sale of the parts to me (which should, of course, have occurred by their
immediate offer, instead of only after my many attempts to reach them, and,
especially, without requiring an additional $50 purchase).

Their loss, I've already eaten mine. If, in the EXTREMELY unlikely event
I'm so much as contacted by an attorney, let alone served, I'll follow up,
but, aside from this thread continuing, I expect this is the end of it.

L8R

Skip, lying George Town Exuma Bahamas

Morgan 461 #2
SV Flying Pig KI4MPC
See our galleries at www.justpickone.org/skip/gallery !
Follow us at http://groups.yahoo.com/group/TheFlyingPigLog
and/or http://groups.google.com/group/flyingpiglog

"You are never given a wish without also being given the power to
make it come true. You may have to work for it however."
(and)
"There is no such thing as a problem without a gift for you in
its hand
(Richard Bach)

"Flying Pig" wrote in message
...
Foley Engines responds to the BBB - a followup to a post of about a month
ago titled "Dr. Diesel, Foley Engines, and me..." and subsequent thread
expansion which included reference to the Better Business Bureau...

big snip


Skippy, if you had a real sailboat, not some dumb motorsailer, you'd be
spending more time sailing and less time engaging in lubberly pursuits like
dealing with diesel injector rebuilds from rude and obnoxious companies with
their "**** the customer" attitudes.


Wilbur Hubbard

"Wilbur Hubbard" wrote in message
anews.com...

Skippy, if you had a real sailboat, not some dumb motorsailer, you'd be
spending more time sailing and less time engaging in lubberly pursuits
like dealing with diesel injector rebuilds from rude and obnoxious
companies with their "**** the customer" attitudes.


Wilbur Hubbard

You obviously haven't been paying attention (again) :{))

That occasion was under duress; I'd have far rather have been on the
boat,
but as long as I was ashore, I took advantage of the opportunity to
get some
boat parts and see if servicing my injectors would improve matters.

And to your last, I commend your inspection of our logs since that
time.

L8R

Love from Skip and crew, still in Georgetown, but about to move on in
the
next weather window - but enjoying the KISS amps keeping our batteries
up,
now

--
Morgan 461 #2
SV Flying Pig KI4MPC
See our galleries at www.justpickone.org/skip/gallery !
Follow us at http://groups.yahoo.com/group/TheFlyingPigLog
and/or http://groups.google.com/group/flyingpiglog

"You are never given a wish without also being given the power to
make it come true. You may have to work for it however."
(and)
"There is no such thing as a problem without a gift for you in
its hand. You seek problems because you need their gifts."

(Richard Bach, in Illusions - The Reluctant Messiah)

Skippy, if you had a real sailboat, not some dumb motorsailer, you'd be
spending more time sailing and less time engaging in lubberly pursuits like
dealing with diesel injector rebuilds from rude and obnoxious companies with
their "**** the customer" attitudes.

Wilbur Hubbard


Dear Willbur:

Did you read, "...Our customers also tell us to disregard his rants
because he has a pattern of posting
daily on many different sites and he doesn't have the highest
credibility...."

Our work here is confrmed! Yes, calling Bull **** on Skip is working.
some people do take notice. please keep up the good work. Hopfully
with persaverance Zoe the coffee clown will also be found a fraud.
People are reading willburr keep writing!~

bob

"Bob" wrote in message
...

Skippy, if you had a real sailboat, not some dumb motorsailer, you'd be
spending more time sailing and less time engaging in lubberly pursuits
like
dealing with diesel injector rebuilds from rude and obnoxious companies
with
their "**** the customer" attitudes.

Wilbur Hubbard


Dear Willbur:

Did you read, "...Our customers also tell us to disregard his rants
because he has a pattern of posting
daily on many different sites and he doesn't have the highest
credibility...."

Our work here is confrmed! Yes, calling Bull **** on Skip is working.
some people do take notice. please keep up the good work. Hopfully
with persaverance Zoe the coffee clown will also be found a fraud.
People are reading willburr keep writing!~

bob





Joe is still a fraud and a hopeless case - all talk and no action - but,
other than being very long-winded, Skippy has earned some respect from me.
He's done a lot of cruising and hasn't come to serious grief in the past two
years so he's learning. Now, if he would loan me Lydia for a couple months
so I could put her to work doing a good spring cleaning aboard my yacht
where her domestic talents would be appreciated, he would be able to pilot
his yacht himself and stay within the marked channels. lol

And, besides, if Lydia really thinks Skippy is some sort of 'hunk' she
wouldn't be able to keep her hands off a real stud like me. But, I'd keep
her at bay because, as a Christian man, I wouldn't feel right having
intimate relations with a married woman and if she got what I have to give
she'd never be satisfied with the likes of Skippy any more. I can't have ANY
woman living her life pining after me the rest of her days.


Wilbur Hubbard

"Wilbur Hubbard" wrote in message
news:4be07ac9$0$65850 ...
other than being very long-winded, Skippy has earned some respect from me.
He's done a lot of cruising and hasn't come to serious grief in the past
two years so he's learning. Now, if he would loan me Lydia for a couple
months so I could put her to work doing a good spring cleaning aboard my
yacht where her domestic talents would be appreciated, he would be able to
pilot his yacht himself and stay within the marked channels. lol


All cattle and no hat.

You've been invited more times than I can bother to look, and Lydia is
obsessed with cleaning and polishing.

You're welcome to her, if you'll just show up...

And, besides, if Lydia really thinks Skippy is some sort of 'hunk' she
wouldn't be able to keep her hands off a real stud like me. But, I'd keep
her at bay because, as a Christian man, I wouldn't feel right having
intimate relations with a married woman and if she got what I have to give
she'd never be satisfied with the likes of Skippy any more. I can't have
ANY woman living her life pining after me the rest of her days.


Wilbur Hubbard

I can assure you she'd manage to quell her fiery impulses - no worries on
your part or mine.

So, for yet another time, when are you coming out to the Bahamas to show us
what a real boat is like?

L8R

Skip, still in Georgetown

--
Morgan 461 #2
SV Flying Pig KI4MPC
See our galleries at www.justpickone.org/skip/gallery !
Follow us at http://groups.yahoo.com/group/TheFlyingPigLog
and/or http://groups.google.com/group/flyingpiglog

"You are never given a wish without also being given the power to
make it come true. You may have to work for it however."
(and)
"There is no such thing as a problem without a gift for you in
its hand. You seek problems because you need their gifts."

(Richard Bach, in Illusions - The Reluctant Messiah)

"Flying Pig" wrote in message
...

All cattle and no hat.

Translate: Mostly bull****, and the emperor has no clothes :{))

L8R, I'm going to bed...
--
Morgan 461 #2
SV Flying Pig KI4MPC
See our galleries at www.justpickone.org/skip/gallery !
Follow us at http://groups.yahoo.com/group/TheFlyingPigLog
and/or http://groups.google.com/group/flyingpiglog

"You are never given a wish without also being given the power to
make it come true. You may have to work for it however."
(and)
"There is no such thing as a problem without a gift for you in
its hand. You seek problems because you need their gifts."

(Richard Bach, in Illusions - The Reluctant Messiah)

On Tue, 4 May 2010 15:51:33 -0400, "Wilbur Hubbard"
wrote:

I can't have ANY
woman living her life pining after me the rest of her days.

I really don't think you have anything to worry about.

Casady

On May 1, 11:31*am, "Flying Pig" wrote:


Let me get this right skep. all these 10,000s of words youve written
is becuause you

1) made a mistake and sent in a needed part with your cores?


Ya i apologize aboutthe jew remark it is racist and not normally part
of how I think.
i believe it was a result of living with all the fat **** toothless
ignorant racist from the south who work the offshore oil industry. you
know......... guys like Coffee Joe

I stand admonished. I apologize.

Now for you Skip.............. why are you making your injector
mistake a vindeta. Im mean god man get a life. I have a excuse for
typing here im board siting in a motel waiting to get on a boat and go
to work. You on the other hand are living the tropical deram of
harmony and bliss in paradice....seem like you wouldnt want to sully
yourself with such trivia.

Oh and why did you go to that guy. i found his webpage several years
ago and decied he catered to the recreational boater too much and thre
for not a suitable source for information or parts. go to a real disel
shop not a place who makes 75% of their busines from novice/
recreational whinny people like yourself.

best wishes
Bob

Bob