On 9 Sep, 19:51, "Capt. Rob" wrote:
On Sep 9, 8:20 am, Donal wrote:

On Mon, 08 Sep 2008 18:59:12 -0700, Capt. Rob wrote:
On Sep 8, 5:50 pm, wrote:

Well, there is a huge difference between the
high pitched whine of a 4 cylinder Evo, and the
low pitched growl of a 12 cylinder of a DB9.

Yup...the 4 is more fun and uses less gas!

The 4 is a cheap engine in a cheap car that
has been designed to exploit the "sub-prime"
market. It cannot use much gas because
a typical Evo driver is probably quite
cost conscious.

Okay, so let's get this straight. The Evo X buyer is getting
essentially a bare bones track car that is not very good for daily
driving. This makes it much more of a toy compared to other cars, such
as a BMW 335xi...as an example.

Agreed.

Even a 135 is a FAR better DD than the
Evo, but the Evo is still one of the hottest sports cars selling. The
Evo buyer can buy the nice BMW, but instead shells out 40K more or
less (before tuning and upgrades). This is a cheap car?

What other car with the same performance costs so little?
That is why I suggest that it is aimed at the sub-prime market.
Sub-prime products are for people who want something and
they are not willing to work for it. You would like to own a
"supercar", but you cannot afford a real one. So, you read
about the blistering performance and the cheap price, and
you think that you can afford to join the elite.

It forces you
to buy at least one other car as a daily driver. My second car cost
32K. My 3rd car costs 22K.

Good grief!! How many washing machines and old matresses are
stacked in your front garden?

Your three cars added together are less than half the cost of a
second-hand DB9. When I referred to you as a sub-prime
customer, I didn't realise just how"sub-prime".

Bear in mind that a DB9 is always a "second" car.
It doesn't have back seats to talk of, the boot (trunk) is tiny.
It is a toy.


My buddy drives a nice Lexus that cost what a loaded Evo costs. He
thinks the Evo is rediculously expensive. He's right. You're paying
for a lot of engine, suspension and transmission,

Nonsense! You are paying for an image. As with everything else,
you get what you pay for.

If you sell your second and third cars, you might be able to afford
a nice 2-3 year old Lexus GS300. This car's performance won't be
affected by the weight of the driver as much as the Evo's, and owners
of real performance cars won't look down their noses at you.


but the car around
it all is a painted cage. That's the philosophy behind the Evo,

You mean it's cheap and fast??

just
like the AM has it's own which is NOT designed to compete with a 911
or Evo X.
Donal, you know NOTHING about cars. It's really quite amazing.

You are right. The AM is definitely not designed to compete with
the 911. In the same way, the 911 is not designed to compete
with the Evo.

To get from a DB9 to an Evo you have to subtract 8 cylinders,
4 litres, a Linn sound system, a beautiful body, hand stitched
leather upholstery(from 5 Austrian cows), satellite tracking
technology ... and so much more.

People run their hands across the bodywork of an AM for the
sensual pleasure. If you did this on an Evo you might cut yourself.




Regards


Donal
--

What other car with the same performance costs so little?
That is why I suggest that it is aimed at the sub-prime market.
Sub-prime products are for people who want something and
they are not willing to work for it. You would like to own a
"supercar", but you cannot afford a real one. So, you read
about the blistering performance and the cheap price, and
you think that you can afford to join the elite.



Donal, I'll take a semi'serious moment to perhaps educate you....

There are a TON of great and fun performance cars for not a ton of
money. And some do things better or differently than the Evo or
Porsche Cayman or even the AM.

Dodge Cobalt SS.....freakisly fast car that is making the rounds on
various racing circuits. A lot of speed and handling for 22K.
Subaru WRX and STI....Both AWD and both fast and fun stock or tuned.
Starting at 25K.
Lotus Elise....A miracle of go-cart handling. This was on my list
along with the even better Exige, but it's just too impractical.
Starting at 47K.
BMW 135i....twin turbo and just a blast. It's practically a mini M3.
If I could live with RWD and the small cabin I'd buy one. Starting at
35K.
BMW 335xi....a nearly perfect blend of speed, handling and comfort and
starting at a low 41K.
Pontiac G8...for those who understand the heritage and Holden
connection, this is a muscle car many will love and 31K to start.

As there are many more from Audi, VW, Mazda, Mitsu and so on. ALL have
their specific strengths and all are reasonable to own. Some, like the
Evo or Elise, are specialty cars. They won't make the average driver
happy unless they understand what the car is for. Others, such as the
335xi, are more rounded and hold more general appeal. The Evo is
expensive. A loaded MR costs a whopping 44K with the custom leather.
And it's still a rather plain shell and interior. You're paying for a
unique technology only available on ONE other car on the market.
Is an Evo right for you, Donal? Probably not if you're taking driving
lessons in a heavy RWD AM. But if you can make an AWD car like the Evo
X drift easily, the car is a true enthusiasts machine. It's not quite
on the level of a GT-R, but for sheer and plain driving on a twisty
mountain road, it tops the AM.
Now, if I have to drive to Ohio, or even PA I'll take that AM in a
heartbeat. It's a far more rounded and comfortable car for long
trips...which is NOT what the Evo was built for.



RB

On 10 Sep, 01:09, "Capt. Rob" wrote:
What other car with the same performance costs so little?
That is why I suggest that it is aimed at the sub-prime market.
Sub-prime products are for people who want something and
they are not willing to work for it. You would like to own a
"supercar", but you cannot afford a real one. So, you read
about the blistering performance and the cheap price, and
you think that you can afford to join the elite.

Donal, I'll take a semi'serious moment to perhaps educate you....

There are a TON of great and fun performance cars for not a ton of
money. And some do things better or differently than the Evo or
Porsche Cayman or even the AM.

Dodge Cobalt SS.....freakisly fast car that is making the rounds on
various racing circuits. A lot of speed and handling for 22K.
Subaru WRX and STI....Both AWD and both fast and fun stock or tuned.
Starting at 25K.
Lotus Elise....A miracle of go-cart handling. This was on my list
along with the even better Exige, but it's just too impractical.
Starting at 47K.
BMW 135i....twin turbo and just a blast. It's practically a mini M3.
If I could live with RWD and the small cabin I'd buy one. Starting at
35K.
BMW 335xi....a nearly perfect blend of speed, handling and comfort and
starting at a low 41K.
Pontiac G8...for those who understand the heritage and Holden
connection, this is a muscle car many will love and 31K to start.

As there are many more from Audi, VW, Mazda, Mitsu and so on. ALL have
their specific strengths and all are reasonable to own. Some, like the
Evo or Elise, are specialty cars. They won't make the average driver
happy unless they understand what the car is for. Others, such as the
335xi, are more rounded and hold more general appeal. The Evo is
expensive. A loaded MR costs a whopping 44K with the custom leather.
And it's still a rather plain shell and interior. You're paying for a
unique technology only available on ONE other car on the market.
Is an Evo right for you, Donal? Probably not if you're taking driving
lessons in a heavy RWD AM. But if you can make an AWD car like the Evo
X drift easily, the car is a true enthusiasts machine. It's not quite
on the level of a GT-R, but for sheer and plain driving on a twisty
mountain road, it tops the AM.
Now, if I have to drive to Ohio, or even PA I'll take that AM in a
heartbeat. It's a far more rounded and comfortable car for long
trips...which is NOT what the Evo was built for.

RB

Bugger me!!

For the first time in 10 years I am feeling sorry for you.

Where's the catch?


I'll be dissappointed if this means that you
dissappear from ASA for another 6 months. We
seem to be just getting going again.


Regards


Donal
--


Regards


Donal
--

Your three cars added together are less than half the cost of a
second-hand DB9. �


Yep, and my classic movie poster collection is insured at 390K as of
2008. I like my posters, especially the original War of the Worlds
poster I just bought. I spend my money my way, but please let us know
what cars you drive and when you're getting a AM! At least I'm getting
an Evo and GT-R. Where are your cars??? HMMMMM?



Bear in mind that a DB9 is always a "second" car.
It doesn't have back seats to talk of, the boot (trunk) is tiny.
It is a toy.


Nonsense. My friend, who's also an oscar winning actress, drives a AM.
Her only other car is a Miata. So she has TWO toys!



Nonsense! �You are paying for an image. � As with everything else,
you get what you pay for.


IMAGE??? Do you even know what a tuners car is? Donal, you're just
beyond help.



If you sell your second and third cars, �you might be able to afford
a nice 2-3 year old Lexus GS300. �This car's performance won't be
affected by the weight of the driver as much as the Evo's, �and owners
of real performance cars won't look down their noses at you.


At least I owned a Lexus twice. Where's your AM or ANY car, Donal?
Hmmmmm?



You mean it's cheap and fast??


If you find the car and mods cheap, then by all means call it cheap. A
typical Evo after tune will cost about 50K when done. Where are your
50K toys? Last I heard you were using a cheap SCT scope and had no
nice car and no sailboat! Hmmmmm?



You are right. �The AM is definitely not designed to compete with
the 911. �In the same way, �the 911 is not designed to compete
with the Evo.


Sigh. Donal, go take some driving lessons. The Evo WAS designed to
compete with the 911 Turbo and does so quite well. The AM is a luxo
coupe, not a hardcore sports car. You just won't ever get it.



To get from a DB9 to an Evo you have to subtract 8 cylinders,
4 litres, a Linn sound system, a beautiful body, hand stitched
leather upholstery(from 5 Austrian cows), satellite tracking
technology ... and so much more.


To get from an Evo X to a DB9 you have to subtract a better Nav
system, better Rockford Fosgate sound system, lose the 1.4 skidpad
rating and superior handling, give up AWD and ability to handle snow
and rain and toss out the AYC system which is winning race after race
and only found on the Bugati! But DO enjoy that leather!



People run their hands across the bodywork of an AM for the
sensual pleasure.


Nah, I prefer to get pleasure from driving. I have a pretty wife for
the other stuff, Donal..and I bet you won't ever have a performance or
specialty car. But I'd be happy to be proven wrong on that last
comment, so go right ahead!


R.

wrote in message
...
People run their hands across the bodywork of an AM for the
sensual pleasure. If you did this on an Evo you might cut yourself.

Now that's funny! (Because it is so true!)

On Sep 9, 9:31 pm, jlrogers±³© wrote:
wrote in message

... People run their hands across the bodywork of an AM for the
sensual pleasure. If you did this on an Evo you might cut yourself.





It's so much fun to be so right about all of this.

Drag coefficient for the DB9 = a fairly awful 0.35

Drag coefficient for the Evo X = 0.31 (same as a M3)

Drag coefficent for the Nissan GT-R = 0.27

Aston Martin makes pretty cars, but Mitsubishi and Nissan have learned
how to make cars that can slip the wind. The DB9 is the same as a 2001
Honda Civic. Yeah...run your hands over THAT!


BWAHAAAHAHAAAHHAHA!!!! Lordy...what a total whooping of all of you and
I didn't even need Ozzy's help.




RB

Quick review for Donal....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bmIbJA3RW_Y


R.

On 10 Sep, 05:09, "Capt. Rob" wrote:
Quick review for Donal....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bmIbJA3RW_Y

R.


Listen to the sound of a real car:-
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WmHqjCa-GAk

Compare and contrast with an Evo!!


Are you really going to buy the Evo?

BTW I had a test drive in a DB9 yesterday. It was
lovely. I stroked the rear, and it felt beautiful.

What number plate do you think that I should
have? BO55 DON seems a bit too expensive.
What do you think about "V12 DON"?

D10NAL is also available, but it doesn't seen quite right.


Regards


Donal
--

On Sep 10, 7:14 pm, wrote:
On 10 Sep, 05:09, "Capt. Rob" wrote:

Quick review for Donal....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bmIbJA3RW_Y

R.

Listen to the sound of a real car:-http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WmHqjCa-GAk

Compare and contrast with an Evo!!

Are you really going to buy the Evo?

BTW I had a test drive in a DB9 yesterday. It was
lovely. I stroked the rear, and it felt beautiful.

What number plate do you think that I should
have? BO55 DON seems a bit too expensive.
What do you think about "V12 DON"?

D10NAL is also available, but it doesn't seen quite right.

Regards

Donal
--




Now you're being silly and I don't think you're dumb enough to buy a
DB9, but I've over-estimated you before.

Yep, I'm buying a Evo X GSR with custom leather, Nav, Rockford Fosgate
and all the toys. ICS is doing my mods after I run 2K on her. Then
she'll be at 372 WHP.
Even in stock trim the Evo out-handles the AM, but you have some
mythical belief in the DB9, which is just what the ad departments
intended. It's actually a wonderful car, but a balls-out driver's car
it is not. Cars that are....the Lotus Exige, Viper, 911 AWD Turbo, BMW
M3, previous generation STI, current Evo X, Nissan GT-R, Audi R8 and
several others....all are there regardless of price. They put driving
dynamics first and leather and comfort last. The AM is big and
powerful, but it lacks many of the wonderful technologies that have
driven the art of automotive engineering to new heights. The AM can't
compete, so it doesn't even try. It exists as a throwback, really not
much different than a Mazda Miata in driving dynamics.

So, driving down my twisty road, into a deep negative bank, the Evo X
will drift a bit, then the active yaw control system will seamlessly
divert power. Coming out of the turn all four wheels will blast the
Evo into an evenly weighted stance. As you learn to trust the AYC and
the amazing grip you can make such maneuvers faster still. In the DB9
you'd have less grip. With only RWD, the rear end would start to
slide. Stay calm and ease off on the power and you MIGHT stay on the
road, but there's only so much give in a simple suspension. Coming out
of the turn you weight for the chassis to recompose before laying down
heavy power. The DB9's torque advantage is high and she takes off. But
the Evo is already five turns ahead. Now it starts to drizzle
slightly. The Evo, with it's S-AWD system is barely effected. The AM
is now crippled. You can't lay down any serious power without swinging
out the rear in any turn.

Buh bye, Aston Martin. Enjoy those engine sounds and your Casino
parking spot.




RB

And just where are you going to drive that pig? A demolition derby? Or
will you roar around your local windy roads, residential neighborhoods, and
school zones, endangering the lives of your neighbors?

What a putz.


"Capt. Rob" wrote in message
...
On Sep 10, 7:14 pm, wrote:
On 10 Sep, 05:09, "Capt. Rob" wrote:

Quick review for Donal....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bmIbJA3RW_Y

R.

Listen to the sound of a real
car:-http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WmHqjCa-GAk

Compare and contrast with an Evo!!

Are you really going to buy the Evo?

BTW I had a test drive in a DB9 yesterday. It was
lovely. I stroked the rear, and it felt beautiful.

What number plate do you think that I should
have? BO55 DON seems a bit too expensive.
What do you think about "V12 DON"?

D10NAL is also available, but it doesn't seen quite right.

Regards

Donal
--




Now you're being silly and I don't think you're dumb enough to buy a
DB9, but I've over-estimated you before.

Yep, I'm buying a Evo X GSR with custom leather, Nav, Rockford Fosgate
and all the toys. ICS is doing my mods after I run 2K on her. Then
she'll be at 372 WHP.
Even in stock trim the Evo out-handles the AM, but you have some
mythical belief in the DB9, which is just what the ad departments
intended. It's actually a wonderful car, but a balls-out driver's car
it is not. Cars that are....the Lotus Exige, Viper, 911 AWD Turbo, BMW
M3, previous generation STI, current Evo X, Nissan GT-R, Audi R8 and
several others....all are there regardless of price. They put driving
dynamics first and leather and comfort last. The AM is big and
powerful, but it lacks many of the wonderful technologies that have
driven the art of automotive engineering to new heights. The AM can't
compete, so it doesn't even try. It exists as a throwback, really not
much different than a Mazda Miata in driving dynamics.

So, driving down my twisty road, into a deep negative bank, the Evo X
will drift a bit, then the active yaw control system will seamlessly
divert power. Coming out of the turn all four wheels will blast the
Evo into an evenly weighted stance. As you learn to trust the AYC and
the amazing grip you can make such maneuvers faster still. In the DB9
you'd have less grip. With only RWD, the rear end would start to
slide. Stay calm and ease off on the power and you MIGHT stay on the
road, but there's only so much give in a simple suspension. Coming out
of the turn you weight for the chassis to recompose before laying down
heavy power. The DB9's torque advantage is high and she takes off. But
the Evo is already five turns ahead. Now it starts to drizzle
slightly. The Evo, with it's S-AWD system is barely effected. The AM
is now crippled. You can't lay down any serious power without swinging
out the rear in any turn.

Buh bye, Aston Martin. Enjoy those engine sounds and your Casino
parking spot.




RB