"Jim Cate" wrote in message
...

In any event, the appearance of the Mac 26M is sufficiently attractive
that MacGregor can't come close to meeting the demand for the boat.

The fact that you were able to buy one and have it delivered in 2 months is
absolute proof that they are not backordered as you claim. When a boat is "hard
to get" it means its backordered 6 months or a year. Ordering in March for a
Spring delivery is essentially buying the dealer's stock.

You just believe everything the salesman tells you. Didn't your daddy teach you
anything about salesmen?


(And don't try to tell me that the comments of contributors to this ng
"prove" your point. - 95% of the participants on this ng are obviously
biased regarding MacGregor and would put down whatever design they came
up with.)

Actually, I thought that picture was rather flattering. From most angles
they're butt-ugly.

I think most mac owners with bad experiences don't want to talk about them,
especially since they're still trying to unload the boat.

We have to rely on witnesses, like this one:

http://www.ybw.com/cgi-bin/forums/sh...b=5&o=93&part=

Macgregor 26 may be ok for an experienced and careful owner. Hear a lot of bad
reports re stability etc. We recorded bad accident on Loch Lomond with one : I
was doing my RNLI water safety bit at the slipway and a guy pulled up with one
on a trailer. He had just hauled it from Southampton too. Anyway, he had had a
good sleep and was fresh to go. He spent three hours with his son, getting her
rigged and I checked his boat for safety and stuff and he launched ok. Next day,
he set off from one of the islands and as he cleared the lee, caught a sudden
blow and because he had his keels either 'up' or empty of water buoyancy, the
whole thing just rolled over and submerged. His kids were down below asleep and
he had left some of his lifejackets at his campsite on the island!! Fortunately,
he was in shallow water and was saved by the inshore fast rescue boat.
Unfortunately, the Mac was wrecked during a later attempted recovery. A long
tale of woe for sure, but boating as we know can be tricky at times. The skipper
did have some experience but he made a mistake which on the Mac 26 proved
terminal. Best advice, buy any boat you like and can afford, but first of all,
get trained by a real expert. There are some on this forum who are professional
instructors and they will probably advise what's best. Happy boating. Safe
people have more fun anyway!! Roy

"Jim Cate" wrote in message
...
Dear Capt Moron,

The cost of a Mac 26M with 50 hp motor is substantially less than 32K
for a fully equipped boat. Nevertheless, however, 32K is a BARGAIN for
a boat of this quality, versatility, capability.

Incidentally, if, as you say, the Mac 26 is only a "cheap plastic piece
of ****" that is "dangerously under rigged," then there must be hundreds
of them that are falling apart every year, right? Since MacGregor has
sold over 30,000 boats, there must be at least 5,000 of them in which
the rigging has come apart in a moderate wind, or in which the boat has
simply self-destructed and sunk. - Right? If it's dangerously under
rigged, the rigging must be coming apart every time they go out in
moderate winds. (Incidentally, Capt, while you are at it, can you
explain to me why the MacGregor boats, with 300 sq ft of sail, need the
same type of standing rigging as boats with 1,500 ft of sail, and a
4,000 - 6,000 lead keel.)

Of the some MacGregor 30,000 boats, how many do you know of that have
failed, or sunk, or fallen apart because of build quality or "cheap
plastic", excluding user error? - 2,000, perhaps? Maybe 1,000?? Surely
you must know of 500, Moron. Ok, if not 500, how about 100? I'm talking
about yearly averages, not anecdotes, by the way.

In other words, can you back up your (libelous) remarks?

Jim



Capt. Mooron wrote:

CRIPES!!!!!!!

I tagged the basics and ended up with a cost of over 32 grand for what
amounts to a dangerously under rigged, cheap plastic piece of **** with the
PHRF rating of a margarine container.

You won't get pussy on that boat unless you have a "As when And Where"
contract with a brothel.

I can't see any major difference between the "X" & "M"......

CM




"Scott Vernon" wrote in message
...
| Just look at the POS!
| http://www.havencraft.com/Index.asp
|
| A pic is worth a thousand words, in this case all negative.
|
| Scotty
|

Now Jim, I'm going to tell you a true story, and if you've been lurking here
for as long as you say you have, you know I don't make things up. When we
had our O'Day 27 up for sale, which by the way was a 1976 model...the old
variety, the good variety of O'day, a young couple came to look at the boat.
They sat with us down in the cabin, with very forlorn faces. You see, they
had purchased a brand new Mac26X the previous summer, hated it and couldn't
sell it. They wanted to know if we would trade....needless to say, the
answer was "no". We did not bash their boat, but commiserated with them.
He stated that yes, it was great to motor around in, and that it would get
up and boogie under engine power, but that it stank as a sailboat. There
are several that "sail" on Muskegon Lake...they are not fast...they are not
even mediocre...when they can't get the thing to sail on the wind, they rev
up the engine's to reposition themselves. And that's the truth, whether you
want to admit it or not. Remember, an awful lot of people bought things
like Gremlins, Yugo's and Pacers...and they to went the way of most things
useless.

--
katysails
s/v Chanteuse
Kirie Elite 32
http://katysails.tripod.com

"Women and cats will do as they please, and men and dogs should relax
and get used to the idea." - Robert A. Heinlein

Capt. Mooron wrote:

CRIPES!!!!!!!

I tagged the basics and ended up with a cost of over 32 grand for what
amounts to a dangerously under rigged, cheap plastic piece of **** with the
PHRF rating of a margarine container.

It was 'designed' to look like Chiquita by Bill Tripp too?

Cheers MC

Jim asked:
What education or degrees do you have that relate to aesthetics?

Give me a break. Now you are being absolutely ludicrous. Aesthetics is in
the eye of the beholder...and that includes art. There is no degree that
teaches you that. Aesthetics come from experience, from knowing what works,
what is practical, what is beautifful. Do you see any of the top boat
designers designing sailboats that look like Macs? NO! I'd venture Bob
Perry would gag. I'd say Buddy Melges would have a stroke. The French
designers would spit on you. Maybe you'd find someone in your court from
the old Coronado/Irwin camps....but probably not. You are buying a
butt-ugly, unaesthetic boat that is neither fish nor foul but a
hermaphrodite. And like most hermaphrodites, it is impotent.
--
katysails
s/v Chanteuse
Kirie Elite 32
http://katysails.tripod.com

"Women and cats will do as they please, and men and dogs should relax
and get used to the idea." - Robert A. Heinlein

You are quite correct, beauty is in the eye of the beholder, but please,
don't post a picture of your wife or children.

Cheers MC

Jim Cate wrote:



Jonathan Ganz wrote:

It's blue and butt-ugly.


Johnathan, appearance is in the eye of the beholder (I personally prefer
the white hull), but what qualifies you to make judgments like that? Do
you have training in art, yacht design, color selection and matching?
What education or degrees do you have that relate to aesthetics?

In any event, the appearance of the Mac 26M is sufficiently attractive
that MacGregor can't come close to meeting the demand for the boat. (And
don't try to tell me that the comments of contributors to this ng
"prove" your point. - 95% of the participants on this ng are obviously
biased regarding MacGregor and would put down whatever design they came
up with.)

Jim

It's still a piece of junk.

--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com

"Jim Cate" wrote in message
...
There are major differences between the two boats, including an entirely
new hull design, new keel, new sail configuration, different ballast,
etc., etc., etc. These differences have been discussed in detail in the
past few weeks.

Of course, if you are more interested in posting Mac-Bashing notes on
the ng and getting "atta-boys" from your buddies, you probably don't
have much interest in the facts, do you CM?

Jim

That's why MacBoy is stupid, stupid, stupid.

--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com

"Jeff Morris" wrote in message
...
I think most mac owners with bad experiences don't want to talk about
them,
especially since they're still trying to unload the boat.

We have to rely on witnesses, like this one:


http://www.ybw.com/cgi-bin/forums/sh...b=5&o=93&part=

Macgregor 26 may be ok for an experienced and careful owner. Hear a lot of
bad
reports re stability etc. We recorded bad accident on Loch Lomond with one
: I
was doing my RNLI water safety bit at the slipway and a guy pulled up with
one
on a trailer. He had just hauled it from Southampton too. Anyway, he had
had a
good sleep and was fresh to go. He spent three hours with his son, getting
her
rigged and I checked his boat for safety and stuff and he launched ok.
Next day,
he set off from one of the islands and as he cleared the lee, caught a
sudden
blow and because he had his keels either 'up' or empty of water buoyancy,
the
whole thing just rolled over and submerged. His kids were down below
asleep and
he had left some of his lifejackets at his campsite on the island!!
Fortunately,
he was in shallow water and was saved by the inshore fast rescue boat.
Unfortunately, the Mac was wrecked during a later attempted recovery. A
long
tale of woe for sure, but boating as we know can be tricky at times. The
skipper
did have some experience but he made a mistake which on the Mac 26 proved
terminal. Best advice, buy any boat you like and can afford, but first of
all,
get trained by a real expert. There are some on this forum who are
professional
instructors and they will probably advise what's best. Happy boating. Safe
people have more fun anyway!! Roy

"Jim Cate" wrote in message
...
Dear Capt Moron,

The cost of a Mac 26M with 50 hp motor is substantially less than 32K
for a fully equipped boat. Nevertheless, however, 32K is a BARGAIN for
a boat of this quality, versatility, capability.

Incidentally, if, as you say, the Mac 26 is only a "cheap plastic piece
of ****" that is "dangerously under rigged," then there must be hundreds
of them that are falling apart every year, right? Since MacGregor has
sold over 30,000 boats, there must be at least 5,000 of them in which
the rigging has come apart in a moderate wind, or in which the boat has
simply self-destructed and sunk. - Right? If it's dangerously under
rigged, the rigging must be coming apart every time they go out in
moderate winds. (Incidentally, Capt, while you are at it, can you
explain to me why the MacGregor boats, with 300 sq ft of sail, need the
same type of standing rigging as boats with 1,500 ft of sail, and a
4,000 - 6,000 lead keel.)

Of the some MacGregor 30,000 boats, how many do you know of that have
failed, or sunk, or fallen apart because of build quality or "cheap
plastic", excluding user error? - 2,000, perhaps? Maybe 1,000?? Surely
you must know of 500, Moron. Ok, if not 500, how about 100? I'm talking
about yearly averages, not anecdotes, by the way.

In other words, can you back up your (libelous) remarks?

Jim



Capt. Mooron wrote:

CRIPES!!!!!!!

I tagged the basics and ended up with a cost of over 32 grand for what
amounts to a dangerously under rigged, cheap plastic piece of ****
with the
PHRF rating of a margarine container.

You won't get pussy on that boat unless you have a "As when And Where"
contract with a brothel.

I can't see any major difference between the "X" & "M"......

CM




"Scott Vernon" wrote in message
...
| Just look at the POS!
| http://www.havencraft.com/Index.asp
|
| A pic is worth a thousand words, in this case all negative.
|
| Scotty
|

Macboy, it's butt-ugly in the same way that you're stupid.

--
"j" ganz @@
www.sailnow.com

"Jim Cate" wrote in message
...


Jonathan Ganz wrote:

It's blue and butt-ugly.

Johnathan, appearance is in the eye of the beholder (I personally prefer
the white hull), but what qualifies you to make judgments like that? Do
you have training in art, yacht design, color selection and matching?
What education or degrees do you have that relate to aesthetics?

In any event, the appearance of the Mac 26M is sufficiently attractive
that MacGregor can't come close to meeting the demand for the boat.
(And don't try to tell me that the comments of contributors to this ng
"prove" your point. - 95% of the participants on this ng are obviously
biased regarding MacGregor and would put down whatever design they came
up with.)

Jim

"Scott Vernon" wrote in message
...
Just look at the POS!
http://www.havencraft.com/Index.asp

A pic is worth a thousand words, in this case all negative.

Scotty

The real madness is thinking these things hold their value.
http://www.havencraft.com/BoatDetail...d=39&imageID=1
Scrolling through the ads, noticed most of the older models weren't
advertising their price.
http://www.havencraft.com/BoatDetail...d=36&imageID=1
Have to feel sorry for this guy, someone at the brokerage must have told him
he could get this much money.
John Cairns