MacGregor 26M - Valiant 40
 

Unless it's a mere 'stepping stone'.

SV

"Donal" wrote
Second, it doesn't really matter what boat you buy - at least for a few
years. You will probably get enjoyment from simply being "out there".

MacGregor 26M - Valiant 40
 

In the interest of full disclosure, I recently placed an order for one
of the new 26M boats. Having carefully studied all the helpful advice
and unbiased evaluations posted on this and other newsgroups, it became
obvious to me that the Mac 26M was definitely the best choice in the
under $75,000 price range for my intended applications. So, I'm one of
the lucky few who will be able to take delivery of this wonderful new
model in the next few months, since demand far exeeds the supply, and
deliveries are normally several months behind schedule.

Thanks to all for the helpful and educational comments.

Jim

Jim Cate wrote:


I'm considering the new MacGregor 26M for use in the Galveston-Houston
area and would like to get comments from anyone who has seen or sailed
on the boat. Or, anyone else.

For sailing and motoring in this area, the MacGregor seems to have some
advantages. - I'm aware of the largely negative comments on this ng
regarding the MacGregor line. However, for the intended use, e.g.,
sailing and motoring with small kids (grandchildren), fishing, and doing
some limited coastal cruising, the Mac 26M has the advantage that it
will motor to a desired destination at around 24 mph and can therefore
get to a desired sail or fishing area, and return, much more quickly
than a fixed keel boat. This tends to minimize the "are we home yet"
issue with small kids and non-sail-type guests. Also, in view of the
hundreds of square miles of shallow bay waters in our area, the boat's
ability to anchor in 15 inches of water, or to beach at one of the
islands, would be an obvious advantage. (The 40-foot Valiant, although
a great boat under sail offshore, was limited to around 8-10 knots under
motor or sail. So, it took us five hours to get from the Kemah marina to
the gulf, and we had to be careful to keep a sharp watch on the depth
finder.)

OK, the comparison is admittedly somewhat ludicrous. For the uses
anticipated, however, the Mac may be a practical and fun choice. Also,
the new "M" model seems to include some substantive improvements. - It
now has both lead and the removable water ballast, has a fin keel (which
I'm assuming may help in pointing), and a structural keel housing
extending vertically from the deck to the ballast area. The boat
reportedly includes additional fiberglass layers and other structural
and ergonomic improvements derived from their experience over the years.
As to it's sailing abilities, there is a video on the Mac web site
comparing the 26M and the 26X under sail, and the new model is clearly
much faster. (Assuming they didn't stage the race or doctor the video.)
With a large genoa, it looks like it might be a fast sailing boat; it
can reportedly plane under sail.

A further consideration is that, if I bought the MacGregor, I would
still have the opportunity to charter a wide variety of heavier boats
kept under charter in our area. Conversely, I couldn't purchase a
conventional fixed-keel boat and also charter a boat similar to the Mac.
(I'm not into motor boats, or staying out in the Texas sun for hours on
a powered fishing boat.) A negative factor is that the new Mac is
fairly expensive when fully equiped, comparable in price to many used 30
- 32-foot boats.

Comments from anyone regarding the sailing and motoring characteristics
of the new 26M would be appreciated.

Jim

MacGregor 26M - Valiant 40
 

In our area, some of the many "obvious advantages" include the ability
to get out to good sailing waters, sail for half a day, and return to
port within a few hours. If you can only sail on weekends, that's an
"obvious advantage" over a boat that takes six hours to motor to a good
sailing area, and six hours to motor back.

Jim

JAXAshby wrote:

However, they (mac 26's) entail certain obvious advantages for sailing


not that anyone but you can see.

MacGregor 26M - Valiant 40
 

Donal wrote:

"Jim Cate" wrote in message
...


katysails wrote:

Jim...MacGregor's have a poor reputation. They have made some very bad
boats. Most of us here have experience sailing many different brands of
boats and have been around sailors and sailboats for years and years.

Your

analogy about intellectual honesty is bunkum. Fact of the matter is, if

a

product gets negative brand recognition because of lack of quality, it

will

take 75% more effort to convince the knowledgeable that that company

might

then, out of the blue, produce a good product. If you were in the

market

for a subcompact car, and you read the history of the Yugo, spoke with
people who had purchased Yugo's, and seen the statistics about their

rate of

repair and other problems, would you then include Yugo in the cars you

are

planning to test drive? I think not. Time is money, and wating time is
wasting money. Yes, there are flukes...once in a while a company with a

bad

reputation comes up with a single good item...Hunter comes to mind
here...but for the most part, Hunter's are crap, and that is based on
comparison of facts. macGregor's , for the most part, are crap. Now

quit

wasting everyone's time with your specious arguments and go learn how to
sail.


Katy, first regarding your comment that I need to go learn to sail, as
previously mentioned, I have sailed a 37-ft O'Day, 40-ft Valiant (weeks
charter), Cal 34, Cat 30 Endeavor 32, etc., etc. I'm seeking to extend
my sailing experience.


First, I'd like to point out that most of the replies have been genuine
attempts to be helpful.

Second, it doesn't really matter what boat you buy - at least for a few
years. You will probably get enjoyment from simply being "out there".





Regarding the reputation of the MacGregors, I realize that it isn't the
same type of boat as fixed keel boats such as the Valiant and the O'Day.
However, they entail certain obvious advantages for sailing in bay
areas and with respect to their ability to get to a desired sailing area
quickly, and to return quickly, and to getting through marginal channels


This is the heart of the matter.

You seem to want a sailing vessel. However, you also want to keep your
boat about 25 miles from your sailing area. If you really must keep your
boat so far from a sailing ground, then I think that you should tell us why.
Perhaps that will produce different responses from people.

Regards

Donal
_______________________________

You asked why I wanted to keep the boat 25 miles from the sailing area.
What I meant was that it is 25 miles from the blue water sailing areas
in the Gulf, that I prefer. In our region, 95% of the marinas and slips
are in the Kemah-Seabrook area, located between Houston and Galveston.
I think the reason most people leave their boats here is that it is
some distance inland and considered safer from hurricanes and other
weather issues. There is a large bay near here in which we can sail for
the afternoon. As mentioned below, I recently placed an order for one
of the Mac 26M's. When it's delivered, I'll be able to motor down to
Galveston and to the offshore blue water in about two hours. Or, I can
tow the boat down to various points on the coast and launch it there. -
I'll try several sailing areas and see how they compare and report back
to the group.

Jim

MacGregor 26M - Valiant 40
 

Jim Cate wrote:
In our area, some of the many "obvious advantages" include the ability
to get out to good sailing waters, sail for half a day, and return to
port within a few hours.

Umm, no. The "obvious advantage" here is that you can get shaken and
deafened while putt-putting out into more open water, then bobbing
around with (or without, doesn't make much difference) sail up, then
reversing the process.

A few days ago I went sailing around our marina. Slaloming among the
outer pilings is fun.

"Good sailing waters" is where good sailors sail.


... If you can only sail on weekends, that's an
"obvious advantage" over a boat that takes six hours to motor to a good
sailing area, and six hours to motor back.

You've been sold a bill of goods. You either should 1- keep the boat
closer to where you want to sail or 2- get a boat that can be enjoyably
sailed in waters a practical distance away. There are many solutions to
every problem, and the one you've fixed on is a rather poor one IMHO.

Meanwhile, you get to ride around on your new boat (did you get red or
blue?) while subsidizing your local Macgregor dealers lifestyle. Enjoy.

FB
Doug King

MacGregor 26M - Valiant 40
 

katysails wrote:

Jim stated:
Again, an evaluation of the quality of the boat depends on the criteria
used in the evaluation, and how the boat will be used.

So the MacGregor obviously fits OYUR criteria...go buy one, but don't come
whining back here...but then, maybe you're like Horvath with his blind love
of Hunter's....

1) As you suggested, I did place an order for one of the 26M's.

2) I won't come whining back to the group.

3) I'll be glad to report on my sailing experiences if anyone is
interested.

Jim

MacGregor 26M - Valiant 40
 

Jonathan Ganz wrote:

Ok. Well, I think we're pretty much finished with you. Just about
everyone, including Jax, has tried to be helpful. You're not having
any. And, I guess we'll just have to live with the fact that either you're
not too bright or an asshole who is not too bright.

Well, Johathan, if I'm that dumb, or that much of an asshole, I'm
assuming that you won't be reading any more of my notes or responding to
them. - In that case, all you have to do is to press the "down arrow"
(on the lower right side of your keyboard), and you can quickly
pass by my notes and move on to another topic. Or, even more convenient,
you can easily set up a filter that will filter out all my notes, and
all notes addressed to me, so that you don't even have to hit your
"down" arrow.

So your problems are solved, Johathan. - If you meant what you said,
that is.

Jim

MacGregor 26M - Valiant 40
 

Scott Vernon wrote:

autosteering? Do they make one for the 'x' model. That steering wheel is
like, 14'' dia..

SV


I'm not going to sit in that cockpit all the way from Galveston to the
Keys.

Jim


"JAXAshby" wrote in message
...

okay, a radar as long as it is at least 4kw and has a CRT screen rather

than an

LCD.


C'mon Jax, give the pedant a break. I saw a mac motoring out the race
equipped with radar.Gave me pause. Kind of like a mouse crawling up an
elephants leg with rape on its mind.

On 01 Apr 2004 15:52:48 GMT, (JAXAshby) wrote:


you are

forbidden from buying an EPIRB. That would be unethetical on your

part

and

would doom you to Hell for eternity.


Would I be permitted to buy a chart plotter, depth-knot, autosteering,
or VHF?


nope.



Jim

MacGregor 26M - Valiant 40
 

Scott Vernon wrote:

As the NG moderator, I do.

For my information, what material are you moderating out? What's
permitted, and what isn't? And are the rules different for Mac owners
and fixed hull owners?

Jim



SV

"Jim Cate" wrote in message
...

Scott, you certainly don't have to read or respond to my notes.
It's rather easy to click the down arrow and move on to another topic.

Jim

Scott Vernon wrote:


Jim, this troll is all used up. Move on.


"Jim Cate" wrote in message
...


This note concerns the issue of intellectual honesty.

As a follow-up to and summary of the many responses generated by this
question, several hundreds of usually negative, usually dogmatic
statements were posted regarding the MacGregor 26M, but none were posted
by anyone who had actually sailed the 26M. Also, as far as I can
determine, none were posted by anyone who had even spoken to someone who
had actually sailed the boat. (Correct me if I missed one.)
Additionally, there was a long string of comments by posters who had
obviousaly confused various previous MacGregor boats with the current
26M (which incorporates major, substantive changes from the previous
models). Additionally, most writers were not willing, even when
corrected by knowledgeable members of the group, to admit that they were
talking about another boat and didn't actually know what the 26M

entailed.

In other words, as a summary of this long and convoluted series of
pontifications, few participants had the intellectual honesty to admit
that they really didn't know what the hell they were talking about in
the first place. - Of course, this doesn't meant that the 26M is a great
boat. - But it does say something about the character and (lack of)
intellectual honesty of many who posted under this subject string.

Jim


Jim Cate wrote:



I'm considering the new MacGregor 26M for use in the Galveston-Houston
area and would like to get comments from anyone who has seen or sailed
on the boat. Or, anyone else.

For sailing and motoring in this area, the MacGregor seems to have some
advantages. - I'm aware of the largely negative comments on this ng
regarding the MacGregor line. However, for the intended use, e.g.,
sailing and motoring with small kids (grandchildren), fishing, and

doing

some limited coastal cruising, the Mac 26M has the advantage that it
will motor to a desired destination at around 24 mph and can therefore
get to a desired sail or fishing area, and return, much more quickly
than a fixed keel boat. This tends to minimize the "are we home yet"
issue with small kids and non-sail-type guests. Also, in view of the
hundreds of square miles of shallow bay waters in our area, the boat's
ability to anchor in 15 inches of water, or to beach at one of the
islands, would be an obvious advantage. (The 40-foot Valiant, although
a great boat under sail offshore, was limited to around 8-10 knots

under

motor or sail. So, it took us five hours to get from the Kemah marina

to

the gulf, and we had to be careful to keep a sharp watch on the depth
finder.)

OK, the comparison is admittedly somewhat ludicrous. For the uses
anticipated, however, the Mac may be a practical and fun choice. Also,
the new "M" model seems to include some substantive improvements. - It
now has both lead and the removable water ballast, has a fin keel

(which

I'm assuming may help in pointing), and a structural keel housing
extending vertically from the deck to the ballast area. The boat
reportedly includes additional fiberglass layers and other structural
and ergonomic improvements derived from their experience over the

years.

As to it's sailing abilities, there is a video on the Mac web site
comparing the 26M and the 26X under sail, and the new model is clearly
much faster. (Assuming they didn't stage the race or doctor the video.)
With a large genoa, it looks like it might be a fast sailing boat; it
can reportedly plane under sail.

A further consideration is that, if I bought the MacGregor, I would
still have the opportunity to charter a wide variety of heavier boats
kept under charter in our area. Conversely, I couldn't purchase a
conventional fixed-keel boat and also charter a boat similar to the

Mac.

(I'm not into motor boats, or staying out in the Texas sun for hours on
a powered fishing boat.) A negative factor is that the new Mac is
fairly expensive when fully equiped, comparable in price to many used

30

- 32-foot boats.

Comments from anyone regarding the sailing and motoring characteristics
of the new 26M would be appreciated.

Jim

MacGregor 26M - Valiant 40
 

jim, how many boats do you expect to sell from this little piece of advertising
fluff you did here?

In the interest of full disclosure,

What full disclosure? That you sell these things? That this whole thread was
a piece of advertising fluff?

I recently placed an order for one
of the new 26M boats. Having carefully studied all the helpful advice
and unbiased evaluations posted on this and other newsgroups, it became
obvious to me that the Mac 26M was definitely the best choice in the
under $75,000 price range for my intended applications. So, I'm one of
the lucky few who will be able to take delivery of this wonderful new
model in the next few months, since demand far exeeds the supply, and
deliveries are normally several months behind schedule.

Thanks to all for the helpful and educational comments.

Jim

Jim Cate wrote:


I'm considering the new MacGregor 26M for use in the Galveston-Houston
area and would like to get comments from anyone who has seen or sailed
on the boat. Or, anyone else.

For sailing and motoring in this area, the MacGregor seems to have some
advantages. - I'm aware of the largely negative comments on this ng
regarding the MacGregor line. However, for the intended use, e.g.,
sailing and motoring with small kids (grandchildren), fishing, and doing
some limited coastal cruising, the Mac 26M has the advantage that it
will motor to a desired destination at around 24 mph and can therefore
get to a desired sail or fishing area, and return, much more quickly
than a fixed keel boat. This tends to minimize the "are we home yet"
issue with small kids and non-sail-type guests. Also, in view of the
hundreds of square miles of shallow bay waters in our area, the boat's
ability to anchor in 15 inches of water, or to beach at one of the
islands, would be an obvious advantage. (The 40-foot Valiant, although
a great boat under sail offshore, was limited to around 8-10 knots under
motor or sail. So, it took us five hours to get from the Kemah marina to
the gulf, and we had to be careful to keep a sharp watch on the depth
finder.)

OK, the comparison is admittedly somewhat ludicrous. For the uses
anticipated, however, the Mac may be a practical and fun choice. Also,
the new "M" model seems to include some substantive improvements. - It
now has both lead and the removable water ballast, has a fin keel (which
I'm assuming may help in pointing), and a structural keel housing
extending vertically from the deck to the ballast area. The boat
reportedly includes additional fiberglass layers and other structural
and ergonomic improvements derived from their experience over the years.
As to it's sailing abilities, there is a video on the Mac web site
comparing the 26M and the 26X under sail, and the new model is clearly
much faster. (Assuming they didn't stage the race or doctor the video.)
With a large genoa, it looks like it might be a fast sailing boat; it
can reportedly plane under sail.

A further consideration is that, if I bought the MacGregor, I would
still have the opportunity to charter a wide variety of heavier boats
kept under charter in our area. Conversely, I couldn't purchase a
conventional fixed-keel boat and also charter a boat similar to the Mac.
(I'm not into motor boats, or staying out in the Texas sun for hours on
a powered fishing boat.) A negative factor is that the new Mac is
fairly expensive when fully equiped, comparable in price to many used 30
- 32-foot boats.

Comments from anyone regarding the sailing and motoring characteristics
of the new 26M would be appreciated.

Jim