"Charles Momsen" wrote in message
...

"Wilbur Hubbard" wrote in message
anews.com...

"Charles Momsen" wrote in message
...

"Joe" wrote in message
...
On Nov 22, 10:16 am, "Charles Momsen" wrote:
Story he

http://www.king5.com/localnews/stori...nomy_abandoned...

Hey Gilligan hope all is well in Colorado,

Here there are over 300 boats abandoned on the lake .

http://www.galvnews.com/story.lasso?...13B4Upx1BE88DD

The EL Lago Marina was one of the worst wiped out, sadly Silvers wife
could not handle the pressure.

http://abclocal.go.com/ktrk/story?se...cal&id=6517696

Joe

Hi Joe,

Things are pretty good here for the most part. No real big unemployment
problems since most of those who lost their jobs went back to Mexico. A
good number of foreclosures on houses but the small investor is locked
out because lenders have a limit on the number of houses you can have
mortgaged. Gas is under $2.00, food and ammunition prices are dropping
so it's not all gloom and doom. I plan on getting down your way in a few
weeks to see my old yacht, its new owner and sniff around for another
fine addition to the fleet.

I hope you are getting a new RedCloud II going, it's people like you
that make America great - independent, self reliant people that never
give up on their vision.

Partially true but a vision will not be realized without hard work and
competent action. Although Joe has demonstrated he does not fear hard
work it is the competence angle upon which he has yet to get a firm grip.

Wilbur Hubbard


Right you are Wilbur and there's also luck, both good and bad. I believe
Joe has all it takes and more to be successful.

Perhaps, but only time will tell.

What concerns me is he's too full of pride. I have yet to read where he
admits he screwed up royally in losing Red Cloud unnecessarily. I fear that
until and unless he steps back and takes a realistic appraisal of the whys
and wherefores he's doomed to continue his "bad luck." Part of being a man
is to admit one's mistakes and not continue to always blame them on fate or
bad luck. Until one can admit a mistake one will never be able to correct a
mistake or forestall the same thing happening in the future.


Wilbur Hubbard

"Wilbur Hubbard" wrote in message
anews.com...

"Charles Momsen" wrote in message
...

"Wilbur Hubbard" wrote in message
anews.com...

"Charles Momsen" wrote in message
...

"Joe" wrote in message
...
On Nov 22, 10:16 am, "Charles Momsen" wrote:
Story he

http://www.king5.com/localnews/stori...nomy_abandoned...

Hey Gilligan hope all is well in Colorado,

Here there are over 300 boats abandoned on the lake .

http://www.galvnews.com/story.lasso?...13B4Upx1BE88DD

The EL Lago Marina was one of the worst wiped out, sadly Silvers wife
could not handle the pressure.

http://abclocal.go.com/ktrk/story?se...cal&id=6517696

Joe

Hi Joe,

Things are pretty good here for the most part. No real big unemployment
problems since most of those who lost their jobs went back to Mexico. A
good number of foreclosures on houses but the small investor is locked
out because lenders have a limit on the number of houses you can have
mortgaged. Gas is under $2.00, food and ammunition prices are dropping
so it's not all gloom and doom. I plan on getting down your way in a
few weeks to see my old yacht, its new owner and sniff around for
another fine addition to the fleet.

I hope you are getting a new RedCloud II going, it's people like you
that make America great - independent, self reliant people that never
give up on their vision.

Partially true but a vision will not be realized without hard work and
competent action. Although Joe has demonstrated he does not fear hard
work it is the competence angle upon which he has yet to get a firm
grip.

Wilbur Hubbard


Right you are Wilbur and there's also luck, both good and bad. I believe
Joe has all it takes and more to be successful.

Perhaps, but only time will tell.

What concerns me is he's too full of pride. I have yet to read where he
admits he screwed up royally in losing Red Cloud unnecessarily. I fear
that until and unless he steps back and takes a realistic appraisal of the
whys and wherefores he's doomed to continue his "bad luck." Part of being
a man is to admit one's mistakes and not continue to always blame them on
fate or bad luck. Until one can admit a mistake one will never be able to
correct a mistake or forestall the same thing happening in the future.


That's a true concern and wise advice. I think Joe has what it takes.

On Nov 23, 4:34*pm, "Wilbur Hubbard"
wrote:
"Charles Momsen" wrote in message

...







"Wilbur Hubbard" wrote in message
tanews.com...

"Charles Momsen" wrote in message
...

"Joe" wrote in message
....
On Nov 22, 10:16 am, "Charles Momsen" wrote:
Story he

http://www.king5.com/localnews/stori...nomy_abandoned....

Hey Gilligan hope all is well in Colorado,

Here there are over 300 boats abandoned on the lake .

http://www.galvnews.com/story.lasso?...84&-session=Th...

The EL Lago Marina was one of the worst wiped out, sadly Silvers wife
could not handle the pressure.

http://abclocal.go.com/ktrk/story?se...cal&id=6517696

Joe

Hi Joe,

Things are pretty good here for the most part. No real big unemployment
problems since most of those who lost their jobs went back to Mexico. A
good number of foreclosures on houses but the small investor is locked
out because lenders have a limit on the number of houses you can have
mortgaged. Gas is under $2.00, food and ammunition prices are dropping
so it's not all gloom and doom. I plan on getting down your way in a few
weeks to see my old yacht, its new owner and sniff around for another
fine addition to the fleet.

I hope you are getting a new RedCloud II going, it's people like you
that make America great - independent, self reliant people that never
give up on their vision.

Partially true but a vision will not be realized without hard work and
competent action. Although Joe has demonstrated he does not fear hard
work it is the competence angle upon which he has yet to get a firm grip.

Wilbur Hubbard

Right you are Wilbur and there's also luck, both good and bad. I believe
Joe has all it takes and more to be successful.

Perhaps, but only time will tell.

What concerns me is he's too full of pride. I have yet to read where he
admits he screwed up royally in losing Red Cloud unnecessarily. I fear that
until and unless he steps back and takes a realistic appraisal of the whys
and wherefores he's doomed to continue his "bad luck." Part of being a man
is to admit one's mistakes and not continue to always blame them on fate or
bad luck. *Until one can admit a mistake one will never be able to correct a
mistake or forestall the same thing happening in the future.

Wilbur Hubbard- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

What concerns me is how you ended chained to chicken bone reef ?
Until you untie that mooring line and cast off Neal, your advice you
so freely spew, will not merit nor warrent attention.
You a good about talking (typing) about sailing, but thats not what
it's about.

Joe

On Nov 23, 4:34*pm, "Wilbur Hubbard"
wrote:
"Charles Momsen" wrote in message

...







"Wilbur Hubbard" wrote in message
tanews.com...

"Charles Momsen" wrote in message
...

"Joe" wrote in message
....
On Nov 22, 10:16 am, "Charles Momsen" wrote:
Story he

http://www.king5.com/localnews/stori...nomy_abandoned....

Hey Gilligan hope all is well in Colorado,

Here there are over 300 boats abandoned on the lake .

http://www.galvnews.com/story.lasso?...84&-session=Th...

The EL Lago Marina was one of the worst wiped out, sadly Silvers wife
could not handle the pressure.

http://abclocal.go.com/ktrk/story?se...cal&id=6517696

Joe

Hi Joe,

Things are pretty good here for the most part. No real big unemployment
problems since most of those who lost their jobs went back to Mexico. A
good number of foreclosures on houses but the small investor is locked
out because lenders have a limit on the number of houses you can have
mortgaged. Gas is under $2.00, food and ammunition prices are dropping
so it's not all gloom and doom. I plan on getting down your way in a few
weeks to see my old yacht, its new owner and sniff around for another
fine addition to the fleet.

I hope you are getting a new RedCloud II going, it's people like you
that make America great - independent, self reliant people that never
give up on their vision.

Partially true but a vision will not be realized without hard work and
competent action. Although Joe has demonstrated he does not fear hard
work it is the competence angle upon which he has yet to get a firm grip.

Wilbur Hubbard

Right you are Wilbur and there's also luck, both good and bad. I believe
Joe has all it takes and more to be successful.

Perhaps, but only time will tell.

What concerns me is he's too full of pride. I have yet to read where he
admits he screwed up royally in losing Red Cloud unnecessarily. I fear that
until and unless he steps back and takes a realistic appraisal of the whys
and wherefores he's doomed to continue his "bad luck." Part of being a man
is to admit one's mistakes and not continue to always blame them on fate or
bad luck. *Until one can admit a mistake one will never be able to correct a
mistake or forestall the same thing happening in the future.

Wilbur Hubbard- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Again, Why are you still chained to Chicken bone reef?

Joe

"Joe" wrote in message
...
On Nov 23, 4:34 pm, "Wilbur Hubbard"
wrote:
big snip

| Again, Why are you still chained to Chicken bone reef?
|
| Joe


You just demonstrated my point, Joe. Instead of being rational you resorted
to your usual, ad hominem attack to avoid the issue. Not the most adult of
things to do.

The fact that the topic's such a sore spot with you certainly should clue
you in that there's at least a kernel of truth in what I say. Moreover, no
matter what careless, self-serving assumptions you care to make about me,
they have little bearing on the fact that you really DO need to re-evaluate
yourself and your choices honestly if you wish to increase your chances of
success next time around.

Wilbur Hubbard

On Nov 24, 8:32*am, "Wilbur Hubbard"
wrote:
"Joe" wrote in message

...
On Nov 23, 4:34 pm, "Wilbur Hubbard"
wrote:
big snip

| Again, Why are you still chained to Chicken bone reef?
|
| Joe

You just demonstrated my point, Joe. Instead of being rational you resorted
to your usual, ad hominem attack to avoid the issue. *Not the most adult of
things to do.

The fact that the topic's such a sore spot with you certainly should clue
you in that there's at least a kernel of truth in what I say. Moreover, no
matter what careless, self-serving assumptions you care to make about me,
they have little bearing on the fact that you really DO need to re-evaluate
yourself and your choices honestly if you wish to increase your chances of
success next time around.

Wilbur Hubbard

It's not a sore spot Neal. Just a subject and process that is none of
your concern. If I were seeking an opinion on how to move forward to
success, I would consult someone that is moving forward and has
experienced success.

You sir are the ad hominem attack expert. I wonder why? Why do my
question bother you so? All I asked was why you are still chained to
chicken bone reef?

Also the expert at dodging the truth about your sailing ability and
boat. And at that I quote pud"d'nhead "Don't part with your illusions.
When they are gone you may still exist, but you have ceased to live."

Please re-evaluate your choice of a hobby Neal.

Sailing is more than making an A on a 25gt masters ticket test, and
flogging the crew.
If you ever worked your ticket you would know that is it a licence to
learn, not proof you know anything pratical.

Joe

wrote in message
...
On Mon, 24 Nov 2008 09:32:24 -0500, "Wilbur Hubbard"
wrote:


"Joe" wrote in message
...
On Nov 23, 4:34 pm, "Wilbur Hubbard"
wrote:
big snip

| Again, Why are you still chained to Chicken bone reef?
|
| Joe


You just demonstrated my point, Joe. Instead of being rational you
resorted
to your usual, ad hominem attack to avoid the issue. Not the most adult
of
things to do.

The fact that the topic's such a sore spot with you certainly should clue
you in that there's at least a kernel of truth in what I say. Moreover, no
matter what careless, self-serving assumptions you care to make about me,
they have little bearing on the fact that you really DO need to
re-evaluate
yourself and your choices honestly if you wish to increase your chances of
success next time around.

Wilbur Hubbard


I remember during the planning of his business, posters asked him if
he had taken care of certain things they thought would be easy to
overlook. Joe smugly replied each time that he had crossed all the T's
and dotted all the i's. He clearly hadn't. Imagine his surprise when
he got to his destination and found out that he would not be allowed
to load the 10,000 pounds he had counted on transporting. There was a
4,000 pound limit, which even if he had made it back in one piece,
would have severely impacted the whole venture.


I hadn't heard that bit of news but it doesn't really surprise me. I've
always liked Joe but I'm disappointed in him because he refuses to listen to
reason. People try to help him and he takes it as an affront to his manhood
or something. People who have this type of personality rarely are able to
learn anything from their mistakes. They seem doomed to repeat the same
mistakes over and over again.

His smug rejection of sound advice, of course, may engender "I told you
so's" as a matter of course. Yet, he seems to think these "I told you so's"
are coming out of the blue with no rhyme or reason to them when it's his
attitude that gives rise to them. In some ways his personality seems to have
certain child-like qualities unbecoming of male adulthood. I wonder if he is
a product of a broken home and was raised without any strong father figure
in his life?

Wilbur Hubbard

On Nov 24, 9:18*am, wrote:
On Mon, 24 Nov 2008 09:32:24 -0500, "Wilbur Hubbard"





wrote:

"Joe" wrote in message
....
On Nov 23, 4:34 pm, "Wilbur Hubbard"
wrote:
big snip

| Again, Why are you still chained to Chicken bone reef?
|
| Joe

You just demonstrated my point, Joe. Instead of being rational you resorted
to your usual, ad hominem attack to avoid the issue. *Not the most adult of
things to do.

The fact that the topic's such a sore spot with you certainly should clue
you in that there's at least a kernel of truth in what I say. Moreover, no
matter what careless, self-serving assumptions you care to make about me,
they have little bearing on the fact that you really DO need to re-evaluate
yourself and your choices honestly if you wish to increase your chances of
success next time around.

Wilbur Hubbard

I remember during the planning of his business, posters asked him if
he had taken care of certain things they thought would be easy to
overlook. Joe smugly replied each time that he had crossed all the T's
and dotted all the i's. *He clearly hadn't. *Imagine his surprise when
he got to his destination and found out that he would not be allowed
to load the 10,000 pounds he had counted on transporting. There was a
4,000 pound limit, which even if he had made it back in one piece,
would have severely impacted the whole venture.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Where did you garnish this "4000 lb limit" information Mike?
No such restriction that I know of, can you please point to where you
heard this?
It would not suprise me that you heard it, because Ive read a dozen
versions of what really happened too.

Want the facts? http://www.customs.gov.bz

Joe

On Nov 24, 11:15*am, wrote:
On Mon, 24 Nov 2008 08:53:53 -0800 (PST), Joe





wrote:
On Nov 24, 9:18*am, wrote:
On Mon, 24 Nov 2008 09:32:24 -0500, "Wilbur Hubbard"

wrote:

"Joe" wrote in message
...
On Nov 23, 4:34 pm, "Wilbur Hubbard"
wrote:
big snip

| Again, Why are you still chained to Chicken bone reef?
|
| Joe

You just demonstrated my point, Joe. Instead of being rational you resorted
to your usual, ad hominem attack to avoid the issue. *Not the most adult of
things to do.

The fact that the topic's such a sore spot with you certainly should clue
you in that there's at least a kernel of truth in what I say. Moreover, no
matter what careless, self-serving assumptions you care to make about me,
they have little bearing on the fact that you really DO need to re-evaluate
yourself and your choices honestly if you wish to increase your chances of
success next time around.

Wilbur Hubbard

I remember during the planning of his business, posters asked him if
he had taken care of certain things they thought would be easy to
overlook. Joe smugly replied each time that he had crossed all the T's
and dotted all the i's. *He clearly hadn't. *Imagine his surprise when
he got to his destination and found out that he would not be allowed
to load the 10,000 pounds he had counted on transporting. There was a
4,000 pound limit, which even if he had made it back in one piece,
would have severely impacted the whole venture.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Where did you garnish this "4000 lb limit" information Mike?
No such restriction that I know of, can you please point to where you
heard this?
It would not suprise me that you heard it, because Ive read a dozen
versions of what really happened too.

Want the facts?http://www.customs.gov.bz

Joe

It was widely reported. Can you point to anything to verify that you
had 10,000 pounds of coffee aboard Red Cloud? ALL accounts that
mention the amount of coffee aboard say you had 4.000 pounds of
coffee, and that you didn't know you could only take 4,000 pounds
until your arrival down there.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Don't believe everything you read in the press Mike. Like you, the
press was not privy to the facts.
There is no such limit as to the amount you can export, thats just
plain silly.

You can export any amount as long as the tariffs and taxes are paid.

Joe

On Nov 24, 11:43*am, wrote:
On Mon, 24 Nov 2008 09:39:19 -0800 (PST),
wrote:





On Nov 24, 11:15*am, wrote:
On Mon, 24 Nov 2008 08:53:53 -0800 (PST), Joe

wrote:
On Nov 24, 9:18*am, wrote:
On Mon, 24 Nov 2008 09:32:24 -0500, "Wilbur Hubbard"

wrote:

"Joe" wrote in message
...
On Nov 23, 4:34 pm, "Wilbur Hubbard"
wrote:
big snip

| Again, Why are you still chained to Chicken bone reef?
|
| Joe

You just demonstrated my point, Joe. Instead of being rational you resorted
to your usual, ad hominem attack to avoid the issue. *Not the most adult of
things to do.

The fact that the topic's such a sore spot with you certainly should clue
you in that there's at least a kernel of truth in what I say. Moreover, no
matter what careless, self-serving assumptions you care to make about me,
they have little bearing on the fact that you really DO need to re-evaluate
yourself and your choices honestly if you wish to increase your chances of
success next time around.

Wilbur Hubbard

I remember during the planning of his business, posters asked him if
he had taken care of certain things they thought would be easy to
overlook. Joe smugly replied each time that he had crossed all the T's
and dotted all the i's. *He clearly hadn't. *Imagine his surprise when
he got to his destination and found out that he would not be allowed
to load the 10,000 pounds he had counted on transporting. There was a
4,000 pound limit, which even if he had made it back in one piece,
would have severely impacted the whole venture.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Where did you garnish this "4000 lb limit" information Mike?
No such restriction that I know of, can you please point to where you
heard this?
It would not suprise me that you heard it, because Ive read a dozen
versions of what really happened too.

Want the facts?http://www.customs.gov.bz

Joe

It was widely reported. Can you point to anything to verify that you
had 10,000 pounds of coffee aboard Red Cloud? ALL accounts that
mention the amount of coffee aboard say you had 4.000 pounds of
coffee, and that you didn't know you could only take 4,000 pounds
until your arrival down there.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Don't believe everything you read in the press Mike. Like you, the
press was not privy to the facts.
There is no such limit as to the amount you can export, thats just
plain silly.

You can export any amount as long as the tariffs and taxes are paid.

Joe

In other words, you can't provide a single source that disagrees with
what I said. Okay!- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

A single source I provided... http://www.customs.gov.bz
Joe