SamJenson wrote:
"basskisser" wrote in message
oups.com...

SamJenson wrote:
"JohnH" wrote in message
...


If the loser loses, and has to donate the money, I'll (that's a
contraction
for 'I will', i.e., future tense) match it!

Hell, maybe the Racing for Renee Team can become the number one
fundraising
team!

That would be great John but this is where basskisser tries to wiggle
out,
or ignores the thread completely.

What in the hell are you talking about dummy?


Petty and childish name calling does nothing for your credibility

Remember what one of the experts that you were trying to dig up told
you? Here it is:

This is a rule of thumb with Cherokees, there are exceptions with some
vehicles.

"basskisser" wrote in message
oups.com...

Remember what one of the experts that you were trying to dig up told
you? Here it is:

This is a rule of thumb with Cherokees, there are exceptions with some
vehicles.

And you call me a dummy? Why didn't you post the "experts" complete post?
Here's the full text-

"I did brakes and such for a long time professionally. I looked it up in my
Wagner book to confirm, just incase I'm getting foggy.1995 Jeep Cherokee
rear brake shoes, short shoe to the front, long shoe in the rear.This is a
rule of thumb with Cherokees, there are exceptions with some vehicles.Your
best bet is to do your vehicle correctly, and let the idiot foul his up.Keep
your rear brakes properly adjusted."

Lets look at some of the other responses from the experts-

"You are correct. The longer secondary shoe holds the parking brake
hardware."

"There is a clear diagram in the Haynes Manual that labels the shoes and
shows the shorter lining on the front or primary shoe.
I could take a digital photo of the page and email it to you if you would
like."

"The Haynes manual is a half decent book to have around, if only for things
like that and the torque specs. It is in the twenty dollar
range. Most auto parts stores sell them. If you had the book which shows
photos of the shoes as well as the diagram, that would fix his wagon.
Meanwhile I was bored so I got a couple blurry shots from the book and
posted them on alt.binaries.pictures.autos.4x4. They are soo blurry there is
no way you could be accused of photoshopping them. LOL!"

"Short shoe to the front."

"If you think about this for a long time, you might convince yourself that
there is a reason for it. I tried, but I just didn't get it. I did notice
that when people put them on backwards, the short shoe wears out way too
fast."

Have any proof that you're right and *everyone* else is wrong?

SamJenson wrote:
"basskisser" wrote in message
oups.com...

Remember what one of the experts that you were trying to dig up told
you? Here it is:

This is a rule of thumb with Cherokees, there are exceptions with some
vehicles.

And you call me a dummy? Why didn't you post the "experts" complete post?
Here's the full text-

"I did brakes and such for a long time professionally. I looked it up in my
Wagner book to confirm, just incase I'm getting foggy.1995 Jeep Cherokee
rear brake shoes, short shoe to the front, long shoe in the rear.This is a
rule of thumb with Cherokees, there are exceptions with some vehicles.Your
best bet is to do your vehicle correctly, and let the idiot foul his up.Keep
your rear brakes properly adjusted."

Funny, from this so-called expert, when in fact the Jeep was NEW when I
got it. Are you saying that the brakes were put in by the factory
incorrectly? Then how do you account for the fact that the parking
brake hardware is in fact hooked up correctly?

Lets look at some of the other responses from the experts-

"You are correct. The longer secondary shoe holds the parking brake
hardware."

Never said that the longer shoe DIDN'T hold the parking brake hardware.

"There is a clear diagram in the Haynes Manual that labels the shoes and
shows the shorter lining on the front or primary shoe.
I could take a digital photo of the page and email it to you if you would
like."

Okay. And (now THINK for a second) remember "there are exceptions."
These exeptions being different rear ends, etc.
I can also take a digital picture of the damned brakes on mine, which
makes me correct in any and all of my statements.

"The Haynes manual is a half decent book to have around, if only for things
like that and the torque specs. It is in the twenty dollar
range. Most auto parts stores sell them. If you had the book which shows
photos of the shoes as well as the diagram, that would fix his wagon.
Meanwhile I was bored so I got a couple blurry shots from the book and
posted them on alt.binaries.pictures.autos.4x4. They are soo blurry there is
no way you could be accused of photoshopping them. LOL!"

"Short shoe to the front."

Not on mine, again since brand new!

"If you think about this for a long time, you might convince yourself that
there is a reason for it. I tried, but I just didn't get it. I did notice
that when people put them on backwards, the short shoe wears out way too
fast."

They aren't on "backwards. Came from the factory like that. THIS is
what you are losing sight of.

Have any proof that you're right and *everyone* else is wrong?

sure, again, I can take a picture. Now, do you REALLY want to wager
enough for me to take the hub off and take a picture of them? I'm
willing, but not for peanuts. Let me know.

"I did brakes and such for a long time professionally. I looked it up in
my
Wagner book to confirm, just incase I'm getting foggy.1995 Jeep Cherokee
rear brake shoes, short shoe to the front, long shoe in the rear.This is
a
rule of thumb with Cherokees, there are exceptions with some
vehicles.Your
best bet is to do your vehicle correctly, and let the idiot foul his
up.Keep
your rear brakes properly adjusted."

Funny, from this so-called expert, when in fact the Jeep was NEW when I
got it. Are you saying that the brakes were put in by the factory
incorrectly?


I'm saying you're wrong- and they didn't come that way. I suppose all the
service manuals, experts, and the manufacturer are all wrong and you're
right?

Then how do you account for the fact that the parking
brake hardware is in fact hooked up correctly?

Because they're designed that way. The same backing plates are used for each
side. The mounting patterns, holes, etc are identical on the primary and
secondary shoes so that they will fit on each side of the vehicle. The size
and composition of the friction surface is the only difference.


Lets look at some of the other responses from the experts-

"You are correct. The longer secondary shoe holds the parking brake
hardware."

Never said that the longer shoe DIDN'T hold the parking brake hardware.

See above- the parking brake hardware will fit on either shoe.


"There is a clear diagram in the Haynes Manual that labels the shoes and
shows the shorter lining on the front or primary shoe.
I could take a digital photo of the page and email it to you if you would
like."

Okay. And (now THINK for a second) remember "there are exceptions."
These exeptions being different rear ends, etc.

Not on your vehicle there's not. The only exceptions to the smaller primary
to the front rule I've been able to find are on vehicles that have multiple
wheel cylinders per axel, or some vehicles that have the wheel cylinder on
the bottom, neither of which was ever available on the Cherokee.


I can also take a digital picture of the damned brakes on mine, which
makes me correct in any and all of my statements.

A picture proves nothing. As stated- the shoes can be installed backwards as
easily as they can be installed correctly.
Can you provide *any* other source to back up your statements?
Why not move this thread over to the jeep forum? You can tell everyone how
they're all wrong.

Are you ready to put your money where your mouth is?

SamJenson wrote:
"I did brakes and such for a long time professionally. I looked it up in
my
Wagner book to confirm, just incase I'm getting foggy.1995 Jeep Cherokee
rear brake shoes, short shoe to the front, long shoe in the rear.This is
a
rule of thumb with Cherokees, there are exceptions with some
vehicles.Your
best bet is to do your vehicle correctly, and let the idiot foul his
up.Keep
your rear brakes properly adjusted."

Funny, from this so-called expert, when in fact the Jeep was NEW when I
got it. Are you saying that the brakes were put in by the factory
incorrectly?


I'm saying you're wrong- and they didn't come that way. I suppose all the
service manuals, experts, and the manufacturer are all wrong and you're
right?

Then how do you account for the fact that the parking
brake hardware is in fact hooked up correctly?

Because they're designed that way. The same backing plates are used for each
side. The mounting patterns, holes, etc are identical on the primary and
secondary shoes so that they will fit on each side of the vehicle. The size
and composition of the friction surface is the only difference.


Lets look at some of the other responses from the experts-

"You are correct. The longer secondary shoe holds the parking brake
hardware."

Never said that the longer shoe DIDN'T hold the parking brake hardware.

See above- the parking brake hardware will fit on either shoe.


"There is a clear diagram in the Haynes Manual that labels the shoes and
shows the shorter lining on the front or primary shoe.
I could take a digital photo of the page and email it to you if you would
like."

Okay. And (now THINK for a second) remember "there are exceptions."
These exeptions being different rear ends, etc.

Not on your vehicle there's not. The only exceptions to the smaller primary
to the front rule I've been able to find are on vehicles that have multiple
wheel cylinders per axel, or some vehicles that have the wheel cylinder on
the bottom, neither of which was ever available on the Cherokee.


I can also take a digital picture of the damned brakes on mine, which
makes me correct in any and all of my statements.

A picture proves nothing. As stated- the shoes can be installed backwards as
easily as they can be installed correctly.
Can you provide *any* other source to back up your statements?
Why not move this thread over to the jeep forum? You can tell everyone how
they're all wrong.

Are you ready to put your money where your mouth is?

Again, now learn to read. I bought the Jeep BRAND NEW.......
I CHANGED THE SHOES THE FIRST TIME
THEY CAN'T BE BACKWARDS BECAUSE OF THE WAY THE PARKING BRAKE CABLE
ENTERS FROM THE BACKING PLATE.(unless someone at the factory or the
dealership thought it would be cool to switch backing plates and went
to that trouble!)

Now again please learn to read. Where have I said that "everyone" is
wrong?
I said and I STILL say, my jeep's brakes are just as I've described and
ALWAYS HAVE BEEN. Again, the ONLY WAY they can be wrong is if someone
switched backing plates on the axle. Think that happened? So, sure,
I'll put my money where my mouth is. I know how they've ALWAYS been.
And again, I can take a picture showing you how they can't possibly be
installed wrong unless the axle is backwards (which of course isn't the
case) or the backing plates were changed (which of course isn't the
case). Go for it.