Butch Davis wrote:
So, K.... what's a poor boater to do? Per yr message all dealers that sell
Evinrudes are crooked and liars and don't deserve our business. How about
the others? Don't they all commit the same sins of overstating the value
and reliability of the stuff they sell?

In my experience dealers try to find out what you want and sometimes even
what you need. Then they try to find out what you are capable of buying.
If possible, they then try to match you to a package that you want, need,
and can buy. Do they hype the products they sell? Of course they do.
They'd like to eat and support a family. Is that bad?

Perhaps most dealers are not as well informed as you and lack your technical
expertise and therefore sell unsatisfactory goods to customers. Or maybe
they're just rats who seek to screw everyone they sell to. After all,
that's a swell way to stay in business over the long haul, no?

So, K.... what outboards do you feel are satisfatory performers with great
reliability. Maybe that new supercharged four stroke is the one.

Respectful regards,

Butch

Hi Butch,

There's not much you can do to avoid them they're a retail price
maintenance scam of the first order.

You cannot buy the engines other than through an "authorised" dealer &
the dealers are closely controlled by the manufacturer/supplier. Most of
the dealers' profit comes from post sale rebates, plans, meetings
display payments, rewards, etc etc all discretionary & all post retail.

This way if any one dealer did really start to sell quantities of
engines either below the dealer invoice (reliant upon still getting
rebates etc later) or say out of area or ................. then the
other dealers would soon complain & that dealer would find his rebates
getting clipped.

The aggregate of returns on big ticket motors is in the realm of 17.5 to
22% unless of course we now know that had been upped to 30% to sell Ficht.

This is for engines they don't even have to pay for!!! the Manufacturer
"organises" the finance as part of the kickbacks (that way the
manufacturer gets instant cash flow by merely delivering the engines out
the door.

You as a punter get no chance to avoid a corrupt market where a two
stroke over grown whipper snipper engine with a right angle drive
attached costs more than a medium sized car!!!

The dealers are the front line of this & need to be named as such. Again
you correctly point out you can't avoid them but equally you shouldn't
just bend over.

You will remember when Ficht finally dragged OMC under all the
previously full of it dealers in this NG just ran away!!!! They really
did!!! Runaway william even tried denying it & I had to post hist
history, truly a dealer to the core say or do anything to make a sale
to the gullible. The only reason runaway is back is he's trying to sell
more of the same & he still doesn't even admit the first run was a total
failure.

I know you object to my position & I even respect that but you need to
offer actual technical comment if you have some & we can debate it.

This time I will not be intimidated by the same BS spreading dealers &
this time anyone who wants to find E-Tec failures will be able to on the
simplest of searches at our public no spam NG.

K

"K. Smith" wrote in message
...

trainfan1 wrote:

K. Smith wrote:


That's the exact issue runaway your marketing is based on your "claims"
& every single time they're independently tested (so far) you are found
out as fudging. When independently tested a Merc made the claimed 250HP
(+),


On premium fuel, required, on a factory hopped-up motor...

The article makes it clear the Bomb people were there prepping their motor
also, so I'd say it's independent testing, the losers will always have the
dealers making excuses. In this case the Bomb engine was 13HP below the
Merc that's a fair bit of HP.


a Yamaha was slightly under it's claimed 250HP & your engine Co's


was way down on HP & to some users more importantly; torque.


BUT the peak torque comes in at a lower & more usable rpm...

I think that's a fair comment & probably it would have been relevant if
the engine made the claimed HP as the others in the class did, but when
it's only a 239HP engine it sounds like the dealers are trying to still
sell no matter what???

Remember these engines are thousands of dollars dearer than the
competition, not hundreds but thousands!!!! Where is that extra money
going?? certainly we can't see it going into the engines which are simple
old style 2 strokes with a ficht injector system??? No multiple variable
timing cam shafts,multi valves per cyl,super chargers,world leading &
proven GM technology base?? none of that with these super priced whipper
snipper motors.

The clear suspicion needs to be that the "extra" money is being thrown at
the dishonest dealers so they'll flog them & say/do whatever it takes to
make their windfall profits. There's no way the dealers or bomb will ever
admit any of this indeed the rebate, subsidy, training BS money return
schemes are so well hidden not even dealer staff are aware. The same
marketing ploy was used to flog the Fichts & the dealers of course even in
this NG denied it all day long, till the bankruptcy court uncovered the
truth when the dealers tried to recover the kickbacks. Which was Her
Honour found the dealers had extracted 30% post retail sale kickbacks &
that they were never entitled to them, indeed we were hoping she'd refer
them for resale price maintenance:-) The dealers were flogging known
defective ficht engines for extra money (one even made it clear they'd
said they'd stop selling ficht unless they got bigger rebates etc).

Now these dealer idiots think they can run the exact same scam & nobody
will say anything??


A name change doesn't clear the slate,


It's more than a name change - & you know it... actually you probably
don't...

It's nothing more than a name change, all the claimed "improvements" are
about trying to get enough engines to hold together long enough that the
dealers will sell sell sell for their super markup??.

How does a treated bore stop detonation??

How do high melting point pistons stop detonation???

How does high temp oil & then even less of it stop detonation??

How does an impact injector/garden hose nozzle combo provide enough
atomisation to stop detonation???

How does running an engine at power on hugely lean mixtures stop
detonation?? it caused the base heat buildup that starts detonation.

How does a beefed up huge extra drag gearcase stop detonation??

The answer is none do: all those things are a lame (is not an MP3
emulator:-)) attempt to make the engines able to withstand the inevitable
detonation consequences when run lean at power on poorly atomised low
pressure injection with very questionable lubrication.

Thanks for the E-Tec spruik Rob but hey I'm sure you got a lucrative deal
to fit them?? much more dollars than the other brands???

K


Rob