I see you have decided not to argue against the facts for a change.

There may be hope for you yet.

"Joe" wrote in message ...
I see you have decided not to argue against the facts for a change.

There may be hope for you yet.

Idiot boy, do you not think that a PROPERLY TRIMMED boat, ie: weight
distribution, would out perform the exact same boat that was not
trimmed properly, but instead used trim tabs?
You can do the exact same thing with an aircraft, you can either trim
it out by distributing the weight properly, which then you don't need
to use tabs to trim it, or you can stick trim tabs out in the air.
Now, which would YOU think more fuel efficient??

"Joe" wrote in message news:4hwqb.4312
Here's some reading for you.

http://www.bennetttrimtabs.com/whatdo.htm
http://www.trimmaster.net/id114.htm
http://www.boatus.com/boattech/trimtabs.htm
http://www.powerandmotoryacht.com/fe...abs/index.html
http://www.h-ri.com/Product/Duraplane/Duraplane_01.html


Uh, yeah, sure. All of the above are trying to sell a product, you
idiot. McDonalds claims the Big Mac is the best burger in the world.
Do you swear by that, too, JoeTechnician? Dol-fin claims that there
product will increase fuel mileage, too. You are stupid if you think
that by creating MORE DRAG, that you are increasing fuel economy.

"basskisser" wrote in message
om...
"Joe" wrote in message
...
I see you have decided not to argue against the facts for a change.

There may be hope for you yet.

Idiot boy, do you not think that a PROPERLY TRIMMED boat, ie: weight
distribution, would out perform the exact same boat that was not
trimmed properly, but instead used trim tabs?

No, it would not. Equalization of weight would not outweigh the advantages
of the lift provided by trim tabs.

Let me ask you a question, if a boat with trim tabs is able to plane at 20
knots with the tabs adjust correctly, but must achieve 30 knots to plane
without tabs, will adjusting the weight distribution in the boat allow the
boat to plane at 20 knots as it could with the tabs?

You can do the exact same thing with an aircraft, you can either trim
it out by distributing the weight properly, which then you don't need
to use tabs to trim it, or you can stick trim tabs out in the air.
Now, which would YOU think more fuel efficient??

Do you really think the dynamics of an aircraft flying through air is the
same as a planing hull on water?

"basskisser" wrote in message
om...
"Joe" wrote in message news:4hwqb.4312
Here's some reading for you.

http://www.bennetttrimtabs.com/whatdo.htm
http://www.trimmaster.net/id114.htm
http://www.boatus.com/boattech/trimtabs.htm
http://www.powerandmotoryacht.com/fe...abs/index.html
http://www.h-ri.com/Product/Duraplane/Duraplane_01.html


Uh, yeah, sure. All of the above are trying to sell a product, you
idiot. McDonalds claims the Big Mac is the best burger in the world.
Do you swear by that, too,

So, you're saying that they're all wrong and you're right? Who woulda thunk.

JoeTechnician? Dol-fin claims that there
product will increase fuel mileage, too.

Don't know, never used them, never have heard anything good about them
though.

You are stupid if you think
that by creating MORE DRAG, that you are increasing fuel economy.

Open your eyes kevin, your only looking at one part of the equation.

You forgot to answer my question-

Here's real world scenario for you- On my boat (21.5' CC 200hp), at 3000rpm
the boat will ride with a bow high attitude with stern dive. As I actuate
the trim tabs the stern rises, the bow lowers and the boat planes. Once
planed the rpm's will immediately climb (without touching the throttle) and
my speed increases. I then can reduce throttle back to 3000rpm and continue
along on a plane.

Now, tell me, do you think my boat is more, or less efficient at 3000rpm's
with my tabs down or tabs up?

"Joe" wrote in message .. .
You forgot to answer my question-

Here's real world scenario for you- On my boat (21.5' CC 200hp), at 3000rpm
the boat will ride with a bow high attitude with stern dive. As I actuate
the trim tabs the stern rises, the bow lowers and the boat planes. Once
planed the rpm's will immediately climb (without touching the throttle) and
my speed increases. I then can reduce throttle back to 3000rpm and continue
along on a plane.

Now, tell me, do you think my boat is more, or less efficient at 3000rpm's
with my tabs down or tabs up?

Uh, you are changing the subject here. You previously said more FUEL
efficient, now you are simply saying efficient. As far as fuel
efficiency goes, 3000rpm is 3000rpm, whether the boat is running flat
in the water, or straight up, so no, your fuel effeciency hasn't
increased. Your ride may be better, at the SAME fuel rate, but your
fuel effeciency hasn't changed. Do you not understand that? Do you
also not understand that when you use a tab, you are sticking a metal
plate out to drag in the water? Now, again, answer me....do you think
it is more fuel efficient to create drag by using trim tabs, or to
distribute weight to achieve the same ride characteristics?

"basskisser" wrote in message
m...
"Joe" wrote in message
.. .
You forgot to answer my question-

Here's real world scenario for you- On my boat (21.5' CC 200hp), at
3000rpm
the boat will ride with a bow high attitude with stern dive. As I
actuate
the trim tabs the stern rises, the bow lowers and the boat planes. Once
planed the rpm's will immediately climb (without touching the throttle)
and
my speed increases. I then can reduce throttle back to 3000rpm and
continue
along on a plane.

Now, tell me, do you think my boat is more, or less efficient at
3000rpm's
with my tabs down or tabs up?

Uh, you are changing the subject here. You previously said more FUEL
efficient, now you are simply saying efficient.

They're directly related. So I am saying both

As far as fuel efficiency goes, 3000rpm is 3000rpm, whether the boat is
running flat
in the water, or straight up, so no, your fuel effeciency hasn't
increased. Your ride may be better, at the SAME fuel rate, but your
fuel effeciency hasn't changed.

You're wrong again. Here's a hint- manifold vacuum.
Observe the fuel efficiency of one boat towing another boat running at 3000
rpm's and then compare it to the same boat while not towing another boat
running at 3000 rpm's.
Do you think it's the same? According to your theory it is.

On my boat I have to REDUCE the throttle to maintain 3000 rpm's after
actuating the trim tabs. Tell me how I could possibly.
be running at the same efficiency.

Do you not understand that? Do you
also not understand that when you use a tab, you are sticking a metal
plate out to drag in the water?

With a tab you are actuating a plate angularly to deflect water, when used
correctly the deflection will decrease the wetted area of the hull by
raising the stern, and lowering the bow. Other benefits are reducing the
surface area of the lower unit exposed to water, and more efficient prop
angle.

Now, again, answer me....do you think
it is more fuel efficient to create drag by using trim tabs, or to
distribute weight to achieve the same ride characteristics?

Yes, it is more efficient to properly engage the tabs than to distribute
weight.

"Joe" wrote in message ...
"basskisser" wrote in message
om...
"Joe" wrote in message
...
I see you have decided not to argue against the facts for a change.

There may be hope for you yet.

Idiot boy, do you not think that a PROPERLY TRIMMED boat, ie: weight
distribution, would out perform the exact same boat that was not
trimmed properly, but instead used trim tabs?

No, it would not. Equalization of weight would not outweigh the advantages
of the lift provided by trim tabs.

Let me ask you a question, if a boat with trim tabs is able to plane at 20
knots with the tabs adjust correctly, but must achieve 30 knots to plane
without tabs, will adjusting the weight distribution in the boat allow the
boat to plane at 20 knots as it could with the tabs?

Again,dumb JoeTechnician, you were speaking of EFFICIENCY. I don't
give a damn about the speed at which the boat planes. I'm telling you
that if you stick a couple of plates in the ****ing water, and drag
them THROUGH the water, you are creating drag. You will use more power
to plane at 20 knots because you have to drag those plates through the
water. Does pulling a skier make your boat more efficient, too????

You can do the exact same thing with an aircraft, you can either trim
it out by distributing the weight properly, which then you don't need
to use tabs to trim it, or you can stick trim tabs out in the air.
Now, which would YOU think more fuel efficient??

Do you really think the dynamics of an aircraft flying through air is the
same as a planing hull on water?

Never said they were the same thing, but, there is a direct
correlation between tabs on an aircraft, and tabs on a boat. Thusly:
they both create drag. They both create lift. BUT again, at a cost.
Same thing with an airplane, you generally use some tabs for takeoff,
because the lift is so much better. But, when you get up to altitude,
you certainly don't use the tabs because the efficiency of dragging
them through the air makes fuel consumption rates rise.

"basskisser" wrote in message
om...
"Joe" wrote in message
...
"basskisser" wrote in message
om...
"Joe" wrote in message
...
I see you have decided not to argue against the facts for a change.

There may be hope for you yet.

Idiot boy, do you not think that a PROPERLY TRIMMED boat, ie: weight
distribution, would out perform the exact same boat that was not
trimmed properly, but instead used trim tabs?

No, it would not. Equalization of weight would not outweigh the
advantages
of the lift provided by trim tabs.

Let me ask you a question, if a boat with trim tabs is able to plane at
20
knots with the tabs adjust correctly, but must achieve 30 knots to plane
without tabs, will adjusting the weight distribution in the boat allow
the
boat to plane at 20 knots as it could with the tabs?

Again,dumb JoeTechnician, you were speaking of EFFICIENCY. I don't
give a damn about the speed at which the boat planes. I'm telling you
that if you stick a couple of plates in the ****ing water, and drag
them THROUGH the water, you are creating drag. You will use more power
to plane at 20 knots because you have to drag those plates through the
water. Does pulling a skier make your boat more efficient, too????

You can do the exact same thing with an aircraft, you can either trim
it out by distributing the weight properly, which then you don't need
to use tabs to trim it, or you can stick trim tabs out in the air.
Now, which would YOU think more fuel efficient??

Do you really think the dynamics of an aircraft flying through air is
the
same as a planing hull on water?

Never said they were the same thing, but, there is a direct
correlation between tabs on an aircraft, and tabs on a boat. Thusly:
they both create drag. They both create lift. BUT again, at a cost.
Same thing with an airplane, you generally use some tabs for takeoff,
because the lift is so much better. But, when you get up to altitude,
you certainly don't use the tabs because the efficiency of dragging
them through the air makes fuel consumption rates rise.


You're forgetting something, when tabs are deployed on an aircraft, and
produce lift, efficiency does not increase because the density of the air is
equal on all sides of the aircraft. On a boat it is much different, water is
approximately 800 times more dense than air and any reduction in wetted
surface will always result in increased efficiency. Properly activated tabs
reduce the wetted area by providing lift at the stern, planing the boat, and
lowering the bow reducing the hill of water the boat must overcome. Add to
this the more efficient prop angle which reduces prop slippage and energy
wasted pushing up instead of forward and the overall efficiency of the boat
is greatly increased.

It's obvious that you have never owned a boat with trim tabs. I suggest you
go along for a ride with someone who does have them and observe them in
action.