On Wed, 20 Dec 2017 11:56:46 -0800 (PST), Its Me
wrote:

On Wednesday, December 20, 2017 at 2:50:38 PM UTC-5, wrote:
On Wed, 20 Dec 2017 13:38:07 -0500, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

On 12/20/2017 1:14 PM, wrote:

He does use some misleading DNC talking points like "13 million lose
health care" instead of the truth that 13 million can choose not to
buy it but he does make some valid points and he is a very good
spokesman for the DNC party line. It makes you wonder why they tried
so hard to stop him in 2016.


What amazes me is how the Republicans and their pundits are proclaiming
that 80 percent or more of the population will benefit from a tax cut
due to the Tax Cut and Jobs Act while at the same time the Democrats and
their pundits are proclaiming that 80 percent of the population will
receive a tax hike.



The reality is the number who will pay no income taxes at all will go
up, maybe to over 50%. It is hard to reconcile how this raises taxes
for the 80%the democrats talk about.
As I said in my "middle" thread, the people being hurt by the SALT
thing will be the top 3 or 4 % in blue states. They even pushed the
mortgage limit up to 3 quarter million.
If you have a $750k mortgage, you are not in the middle of anything.

Tell NBC that. A week or two ago, they ran a story about the tax plan and used a couple in NJ as their "average Americans", interviewing them on how the plan would hurt them. They were living in a $750k house.


===

For northern NJ that is probably average or below. You have a similar
situation in southern NY and south western CT. It's a very expensive
area to live, exacerbated by very high state and local taxes.

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On Wednesday, December 20, 2017 at 4:17:16 PM UTC-5, wrote:
On Wed, 20 Dec 2017 11:56:46 -0800 (PST), Its Me
wrote:

On Wednesday, December 20, 2017 at 2:50:38 PM UTC-5, wrote:
On Wed, 20 Dec 2017 13:38:07 -0500, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

On 12/20/2017 1:14 PM, wrote:

He does use some misleading DNC talking points like "13 million lose
health care" instead of the truth that 13 million can choose not to
buy it but he does make some valid points and he is a very good
spokesman for the DNC party line. It makes you wonder why they tried
so hard to stop him in 2016.


What amazes me is how the Republicans and their pundits are proclaiming
that 80 percent or more of the population will benefit from a tax cut
due to the Tax Cut and Jobs Act while at the same time the Democrats and
their pundits are proclaiming that 80 percent of the population will
receive a tax hike.



The reality is the number who will pay no income taxes at all will go
up, maybe to over 50%. It is hard to reconcile how this raises taxes
for the 80%the democrats talk about.
As I said in my "middle" thread, the people being hurt by the SALT
thing will be the top 3 or 4 % in blue states. They even pushed the
mortgage limit up to 3 quarter million.
If you have a $750k mortgage, you are not in the middle of anything.

Tell NBC that. A week or two ago, they ran a story about the tax plan and used a couple in NJ as their "average Americans", interviewing them on how the plan would hurt them. They were living in a $750k house.


===

For northern NJ that is probably average or below. You have a similar
situation in southern NY and south western CT. It's a very expensive
area to live, exacerbated by very high state and local taxes.

Oh I realize that, but that's not average. Probably for that immediate area, but not for America. This was on NBC national news.

My point was that NBC picked a couple living in a very expensive area then posed them and their situation as average. Seems like it was Greg that pointed out that these coastal "elites" live in a bubble and don't seem to have a clue what it's like across this country for normal people.

On Wed, 20 Dec 2017 11:56:46 -0800 (PST), Its Me
wrote:

On Wednesday, December 20, 2017 at 2:50:38 PM UTC-5, wrote:
On Wed, 20 Dec 2017 13:38:07 -0500, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

On 12/20/2017 1:14 PM, wrote:

He does use some misleading DNC talking points like "13 million lose
health care" instead of the truth that 13 million can choose not to
buy it but he does make some valid points and he is a very good
spokesman for the DNC party line. It makes you wonder why they tried
so hard to stop him in 2016.


What amazes me is how the Republicans and their pundits are proclaiming
that 80 percent or more of the population will benefit from a tax cut
due to the Tax Cut and Jobs Act while at the same time the Democrats and
their pundits are proclaiming that 80 percent of the population will
receive a tax hike.



The reality is the number who will pay no income taxes at all will go
up, maybe to over 50%. It is hard to reconcile how this raises taxes
for the 80%the democrats talk about.
As I said in my "middle" thread, the people being hurt by the SALT
thing will be the top 3 or 4 % in blue states. They even pushed the
mortgage limit up to 3 quarter million.
If you have a $750k mortgage, you are not in the middle of anything.

Tell NBC that. A week or two ago, they ran a story about the tax plan and used a couple in NJ as their "average Americans", interviewing them on how the plan would hurt them. They were living in a $750k house.

That is just the rarified air that coastal democrats live in. The
median price of a home in the US is $188,900.
You know, the people who elected Trump.
Millionaire talking heads on TV are not talking about the average
anything no matter what they say. They choose to forget the little
town they came from when they get to the network.

wrote:
On Wed, 20 Dec 2017 13:38:07 -0500, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

On 12/20/2017 1:14 PM, wrote:

He does use some misleading DNC talking points like "13 million lose
health care" instead of the truth that 13 million can choose not to
buy it but he does make some valid points and he is a very good
spokesman for the DNC party line. It makes you wonder why they tried
so hard to stop him in 2016.

What amazes me is how the Republicans and their pundits are proclaiming
that 80 percent or more of the population will benefit from a tax cut
due to the Tax Cut and Jobs Act while at the same time the Democrats and
their pundits are proclaiming that 80 percent of the population will
receive a tax hike.


The reality is the number who will pay no income taxes at all will go
up, maybe to over 50%. It is hard to reconcile how this raises taxes
for the 80%the democrats talk about.
As I said in my "middle" thread, the people being hurt by the SALT
thing will be the top 3 or 4 % in blue states. They even pushed the
mortgage limit up to 3 quarter million.
If you have a $750k mortgage, you are not in the middle of anything.


What's a mortgage?

Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 12/20/2017 1:14 PM, wrote:

He does use some misleading DNC talking points like "13 million lose
health care" instead of the truth that 13 million can choose not to
buy it but he does make some valid points and he is a very good
spokesman for the DNC party line. It makes you wonder why they tried
so hard to stop him in 2016.


What amazes me is how the Republicans and their pundits are
proclaiming that 80 percent or more of the population will benefit
from a tax cut
due to the Tax Cut and Jobs Act while at the same time the Democrats
and their pundits are proclaiming that 80 percent of the population
will receive a tax hike.




Even CNN has this tool to see what you will save. I tried a variety of
scenarios and *all* resolved in a cut. Mine is far less than the middle
class as it's defined...

http://www.cnn.com/2017/12/13/politi...ill/index.html

Alex wrote:
Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 12/20/2017 1:14 PM, wrote:

He does use some misleading DNC talking points like "13 million lose
health care" instead of the truth that 13 million can choose not to
buy it but he does make some valid points and he is a very good
spokesman for the DNC party line. It makes you wonder why they tried
so hard to stop him in 2016.


What amazes me is how the Republicans and their pundits are
proclaiming that 80 percent or more of the population will benefit
from a tax cut
due to the Tax Cut and Jobs Act while at the same time the Democrats
and their pundits are proclaiming that 80 percent of the population
will receive a tax hike.




Even CNN has this tool to see what you will save. I tried a variety of
scenarios and *all* resolved in a cut. Mine is far less than the middle
class as it's defined...

http://www.cnn.com/2017/12/13/politi...ill/index.html


Looks like I save 3.1%

On Thu, 21 Dec 2017 03:45:20 -0000 (UTC), Bill
wrote:

Alex wrote:
Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 12/20/2017 1:14 PM, wrote:

He does use some misleading DNC talking points like "13 million lose
health care" instead of the truth that 13 million can choose not to
buy it but he does make some valid points and he is a very good
spokesman for the DNC party line. It makes you wonder why they tried
so hard to stop him in 2016.


What amazes me is how the Republicans and their pundits are
proclaiming that 80 percent or more of the population will benefit
from a tax cut
due to the Tax Cut and Jobs Act while at the same time the Democrats
and their pundits are proclaiming that 80 percent of the population
will receive a tax hike.




Even CNN has this tool to see what you will save. I tried a variety of
scenarios and *all* resolved in a cut. Mine is far less than the middle
class as it's defined...

http://www.cnn.com/2017/12/13/politi...ill/index.html


Looks like I save 3.1%

After tax income goes up 2.4% here but ~$2500 is better than a poke in
the eye with a sharp stick. It is not as good as the $3k I guessed
tho.

wrote:
On Thu, 21 Dec 2017 03:45:20 -0000 (UTC), Bill
wrote:

Alex wrote:
Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 12/20/2017 1:14 PM, wrote:

He does use some misleading DNC talking points like "13 million lose
health care" instead of the truth that 13 million can choose not to
buy it but he does make some valid points and he is a very good
spokesman for the DNC party line. It makes you wonder why they tried
so hard to stop him in 2016.


What amazes me is how the Republicans and their pundits are
proclaiming that 80 percent or more of the population will benefit
from a tax cut
due to the Tax Cut and Jobs Act while at the same time the Democrats
and their pundits are proclaiming that 80 percent of the population
will receive a tax hike.




Even CNN has this tool to see what you will save. I tried a variety of
scenarios and *all* resolved in a cut. Mine is far less than the middle
class as it's defined...

http://www.cnn.com/2017/12/13/politi...ill/index.html


Looks like I save 3.1%

After tax income goes up 2.4% here but ~$2500 is better than a poke in
the eye with a sharp stick. It is not as good as the $3k I guessed
tho.


And I am in a high tax state. I take standardized deduction as I have no
mortgage, other than the Medicare and supplemental insurance, not a lot of
medical costs. Since most of my income is qualified dividends, I pay at
the 20% rate. Since those dividends come from 39% taxed already money, the
dividends should go up. And why are the Liberals worried about a $1.5
trillion deficit over 10 years? They seemed happy with a $10 trillion
over 8 years with only a 25% return on the overspending.

On Wed, 20 Dec 2017 19:36:58 -0500, Alex wrote:

Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 12/20/2017 1:14 PM, wrote:

He does use some misleading DNC talking points like "13 million lose
health care" instead of the truth that 13 million can choose not to
buy it but he does make some valid points and he is a very good
spokesman for the DNC party line. It makes you wonder why they tried
so hard to stop him in 2016.


What amazes me is how the Republicans and their pundits are
proclaiming that 80 percent or more of the population will benefit
from a tax cut
due to the Tax Cut and Jobs Act while at the same time the Democrats
and their pundits are proclaiming that 80 percent of the population
will receive a tax hike.




Even CNN has this tool to see what you will save. I tried a variety of
scenarios and *all* resolved in a cut. Mine is far less than the middle
class as it's defined...

http://www.cnn.com/2017/12/13/politi...ill/index.html

Mine go up. Might have to forgo that new Kimber for another year. Doggone it!

John H wrote:
On Wed, 20 Dec 2017 19:36:58 -0500, Alex wrote:

Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 12/20/2017 1:14 PM, wrote:

He does use some misleading DNC talking points like "13 million lose
health care" instead of the truth that 13 million can choose not to
buy it but he does make some valid points and he is a very good
spokesman for the DNC party line. It makes you wonder why they tried
so hard to stop him in 2016.

What amazes me is how the Republicans and their pundits are
proclaiming that 80 percent or more of the population will benefit
from a tax cut
due to the Tax Cut and Jobs Act while at the same time the Democrats
and their pundits are proclaiming that 80 percent of the population
will receive a tax hike.



Even CNN has this tool to see what you will save. I tried a variety of
scenarios and *all* resolved in a cut. Mine is far less than the middle
class as it's defined...

http://www.cnn.com/2017/12/13/politi...ill/index.html
Mine go up. Might have to forgo that new Kimber for another year. Doggone it!

I thought you had one. Looking at another?