.... for those interested in this saga. If not, ignore.

On Tuesday of this past week the service advisor told me they were
"finishing up" the installation of the new engine and would then road
test to make sure everything is ok. I said, "so it might be ready by
Friday?" (this is what Nissan Customer Service in TN had told me).
He said it would probably be done earlier than Friday, possibly
Wednesday after they tested everything.

Wednesday came and went. On Friday I received a call from Nissan again.
She told me basically what the service advisor at the dealership had
told me on Tuesday except now it would be next Monday, (June 26) before
I could get the car back.

I started getting a strong hunch that the new engine didn't solve the
"no heat" problem. The dots didn't connect.

So, this morning I took a ride down to the dealership. The service
manager/director was there. He was honest about it. The new engine was
in but the car still had no heat and they were back to square one.

I said, "I figured that" and reminded him of what I had told him back on
May 30th and what I thought was wrong. I said, "if you want to fix the
problem, you need to install a new heater control valve. It's mounted
on the firewall on the passenger side and has two heater hoses connected
to it, one in, one out to the heater core.

He said they checked for any faults with it in the ECU. I told him the
ECU wouldn't show a fault because the little motor that drives the valve
has an open winding. It burnt up, which connects the electrical burning
odor that I noticed the day I drove the car home (May 27th). I said the
12 volts would be applied, but nothing would happen to open the valve.
There is no positive feedback to the ECU that indicates the valve position.

It also explains why the electrical burning odor disappeared. Can't get
hot if no current is flowing in the windings.

I said if they warm up the car, set the temp to max and feel the hose
going to the valve, or measure it with an IR thermometer, it will be hot
on one side and significantly cooler on the other side of the valve.

The problem is that the dealership's hands are tied when it comes to
warranty work. They can't do anything unless Nissan authorizes it.
The service manager is more frustrated than I am. I think it's kinda
funny. They spring for a new engine (which it didn't need) and ignore
the customer input that was intended to help diagnose the problem.

Anyway, he asked me to call Nissan Customer Service and tell them
exactly what I had just told him. Turns out they are open today
(Saturday) but I had to leave a message. Awaiting a return call.

---
This email has been checked for viruses by AVG.
http://www.avg.com

On 6/24/17 9:54 AM, Mr. Luddite wrote:
... for those interested in this saga. If not, ignore.

On Tuesday of this past week the service advisor told me they were
"finishing up" the installation of the new engine and would then road
test to make sure everything is ok. I said, "so it might be ready by
Friday?" (this is what Nissan Customer Service in TN had told me).
He said it would probably be done earlier than Friday, possibly
Wednesday after they tested everything.

Wednesday came and went. On Friday I received a call from Nissan again.
She told me basically what the service advisor at the dealership had
told me on Tuesday except now it would be next Monday, (June 26) before
I could get the car back.

I started getting a strong hunch that the new engine didn't solve the
"no heat" problem. The dots didn't connect.

So, this morning I took a ride down to the dealership. The service
manager/director was there. He was honest about it. The new engine was
in but the car still had no heat and they were back to square one.

I said, "I figured that" and reminded him of what I had told him back on
May 30th and what I thought was wrong. I said, "if you want to fix the
problem, you need to install a new heater control valve. It's mounted
on the firewall on the passenger side and has two heater hoses connected
to it, one in, one out to the heater core.

He said they checked for any faults with it in the ECU. I told him the
ECU wouldn't show a fault because the little motor that drives the valve
has an open winding. It burnt up, which connects the electrical burning
odor that I noticed the day I drove the car home (May 27th). I said the
12 volts would be applied, but nothing would happen to open the valve.
There is no positive feedback to the ECU that indicates the valve position.

It also explains why the electrical burning odor disappeared. Can't get
hot if no current is flowing in the windings.

I said if they warm up the car, set the temp to max and feel the hose
going to the valve, or measure it with an IR thermometer, it will be hot
on one side and significantly cooler on the other side of the valve.

The problem is that the dealership's hands are tied when it comes to
warranty work. They can't do anything unless Nissan authorizes it.
The service manager is more frustrated than I am. I think it's kinda
funny. They spring for a new engine (which it didn't need) and ignore
the customer input that was intended to help diagnose the problem.

Anyway, he asked me to call Nissan Customer Service and tell them
exactly what I had just told him. Turns out they are open today
(Saturday) but I had to leave a message. Awaiting a return call.

---
This email has been checked for viruses by AVG.
http://www.avg.com


I think it is time to invoke the lemon law. Really.

On Saturday, June 24, 2017 at 9:54:33 AM UTC-4, Mr. Luddite wrote:
... for those interested in this saga. If not, ignore.

On Tuesday of this past week the service advisor told me they were
"finishing up" the installation of the new engine and would then road
test to make sure everything is ok. I said, "so it might be ready by
Friday?" (this is what Nissan Customer Service in TN had told me).
He said it would probably be done earlier than Friday, possibly
Wednesday after they tested everything.

Wednesday came and went. On Friday I received a call from Nissan again.
She told me basically what the service advisor at the dealership had
told me on Tuesday except now it would be next Monday, (June 26) before
I could get the car back.

I started getting a strong hunch that the new engine didn't solve the
"no heat" problem. The dots didn't connect.

So, this morning I took a ride down to the dealership. The service
manager/director was there. He was honest about it. The new engine was
in but the car still had no heat and they were back to square one.

I said, "I figured that" and reminded him of what I had told him back on
May 30th and what I thought was wrong. I said, "if you want to fix the
problem, you need to install a new heater control valve. It's mounted
on the firewall on the passenger side and has two heater hoses connected
to it, one in, one out to the heater core.

He said they checked for any faults with it in the ECU. I told him the
ECU wouldn't show a fault because the little motor that drives the valve
has an open winding. It burnt up, which connects the electrical burning
odor that I noticed the day I drove the car home (May 27th). I said the
12 volts would be applied, but nothing would happen to open the valve.
There is no positive feedback to the ECU that indicates the valve position.

It also explains why the electrical burning odor disappeared. Can't get
hot if no current is flowing in the windings.

I said if they warm up the car, set the temp to max and feel the hose
going to the valve, or measure it with an IR thermometer, it will be hot
on one side and significantly cooler on the other side of the valve.

The problem is that the dealership's hands are tied when it comes to
warranty work. They can't do anything unless Nissan authorizes it.
The service manager is more frustrated than I am. I think it's kinda
funny. They spring for a new engine (which it didn't need) and ignore
the customer input that was intended to help diagnose the problem.

Anyway, he asked me to call Nissan Customer Service and tell them
exactly what I had just told him. Turns out they are open today
(Saturday) but I had to leave a message. Awaiting a return call.

---
This email has been checked for viruses by AVG.
http://www.avg.com

That heater valve can't cost more than $75. I don't understand why the dealership doesn't just eat the cost of the valve and move on.

On Sat, 24 Jun 2017 09:54:03 -0400, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

... for those interested in this saga. If not, ignore.

On Tuesday of this past week the service advisor told me they were
"finishing up" the installation of the new engine and would then road
test to make sure everything is ok. I said, "so it might be ready by
Friday?" (this is what Nissan Customer Service in TN had told me).
He said it would probably be done earlier than Friday, possibly
Wednesday after they tested everything.

Wednesday came and went. On Friday I received a call from Nissan again.
She told me basically what the service advisor at the dealership had
told me on Tuesday except now it would be next Monday, (June 26) before
I could get the car back.

I started getting a strong hunch that the new engine didn't solve the
"no heat" problem. The dots didn't connect.

So, this morning I took a ride down to the dealership. The service
manager/director was there. He was honest about it. The new engine was
in but the car still had no heat and they were back to square one.

I said, "I figured that" and reminded him of what I had told him back on
May 30th and what I thought was wrong. I said, "if you want to fix the
problem, you need to install a new heater control valve. It's mounted
on the firewall on the passenger side and has two heater hoses connected
to it, one in, one out to the heater core.

He said they checked for any faults with it in the ECU. I told him the
ECU wouldn't show a fault because the little motor that drives the valve
has an open winding. It burnt up, which connects the electrical burning
odor that I noticed the day I drove the car home (May 27th). I said the
12 volts would be applied, but nothing would happen to open the valve.
There is no positive feedback to the ECU that indicates the valve position.

It also explains why the electrical burning odor disappeared. Can't get
hot if no current is flowing in the windings.

I said if they warm up the car, set the temp to max and feel the hose
going to the valve, or measure it with an IR thermometer, it will be hot
on one side and significantly cooler on the other side of the valve.

The problem is that the dealership's hands are tied when it comes to
warranty work. They can't do anything unless Nissan authorizes it.
The service manager is more frustrated than I am. I think it's kinda
funny. They spring for a new engine (which it didn't need) and ignore
the customer input that was intended to help diagnose the problem.

Anyway, he asked me to call Nissan Customer Service and tell them
exactly what I had just told him. Turns out they are open today
(Saturday) but I had to leave a message. Awaiting a return call.


The coyote that chewed off 3 legs and is still in the trap huh?
I guess you can't fix stupid.
The real problem is the dealer would rather get paid to do the
unnecessary warranty work than to fix the problem. That is coupled
with engineers at Nissan who are just unwilling to admit there is a
hole in their MAP.
It may just be a "face" thing. No wonder they lost the war ;-)

Harry is right, go for a new car. You said you like your loaner. Go
for that one.

On 6/24/2017 10:16 AM, Keyser Soze wrote:
On 6/24/17 9:54 AM, Mr. Luddite wrote:
... for those interested in this saga. If not, ignore.

On Tuesday of this past week the service advisor told me they were
"finishing up" the installation of the new engine and would then road
test to make sure everything is ok. I said, "so it might be ready by
Friday?" (this is what Nissan Customer Service in TN had told me).
He said it would probably be done earlier than Friday, possibly
Wednesday after they tested everything.

Wednesday came and went. On Friday I received a call from Nissan again.
She told me basically what the service advisor at the dealership had
told me on Tuesday except now it would be next Monday, (June 26)
before I could get the car back.

I started getting a strong hunch that the new engine didn't solve the
"no heat" problem. The dots didn't connect.

So, this morning I took a ride down to the dealership. The service
manager/director was there. He was honest about it. The new engine
was in but the car still had no heat and they were back to square one.

I said, "I figured that" and reminded him of what I had told him back
on May 30th and what I thought was wrong. I said, "if you want to fix
the problem, you need to install a new heater control valve. It's
mounted on the firewall on the passenger side and has two heater hoses
connected to it, one in, one out to the heater core.

He said they checked for any faults with it in the ECU. I told him
the ECU wouldn't show a fault because the little motor that drives the
valve has an open winding. It burnt up, which connects the electrical
burning odor that I noticed the day I drove the car home (May 27th).
I said the 12 volts would be applied, but nothing would happen to open
the valve. There is no positive feedback to the ECU that indicates the
valve position.

It also explains why the electrical burning odor disappeared. Can't
get hot if no current is flowing in the windings.

I said if they warm up the car, set the temp to max and feel the hose
going to the valve, or measure it with an IR thermometer, it will be
hot on one side and significantly cooler on the other side of the valve.

The problem is that the dealership's hands are tied when it comes to
warranty work. They can't do anything unless Nissan authorizes it.
The service manager is more frustrated than I am. I think it's kinda
funny. They spring for a new engine (which it didn't need) and ignore
the customer input that was intended to help diagnose the problem.

Anyway, he asked me to call Nissan Customer Service and tell them
exactly what I had just told him. Turns out they are open today
(Saturday) but I had to leave a message. Awaiting a return call.

---
This email has been checked for viruses by AVG.
http://www.avg.com




I think it is time to invoke the lemon law. Really.

I could but I learned more about that. Probably important to pass it on
because it probably affects everyone who buys a new car.

When you sign all the paperwork when you close, one of the documents is
basically a waiver of whatever your state's Lemon Law is. By signing
you agree to settle issues in the manner that the manufacturer dictates
which somewhat follows the Lemon Law but you also agree to arbitration
in the event of a dispute. When I asked about this to the Nissan
Corporate person last week, she said they follow "Better Business
Bureau" guidelines. I think you can still invoke the Lemon Law per your
state but it will likely turn into a ****ing contest.

In my case the Nissan person who called me last week represents the
Nissan Arbitration board. She told me that they are not going to "drag
this out" any further and if the car was not fixed by the beginning of
next week they will buy the car back and issue me a full refund.

Turns out she isn't in today (Saturday) so she probably doesn't know yet
that the new engine did not fix the problem.

I still think my theory of what is wrong is correct but at this point I
am just going to let Nissan do what they want to do. I've forgotten
what the car looks like anyway. :-)

On 6/24/2017 10:31 AM, Its Me wrote:
On Saturday, June 24, 2017 at 9:54:33 AM UTC-4, Mr. Luddite wrote:
... for those interested in this saga. If not, ignore.

On Tuesday of this past week the service advisor told me they were
"finishing up" the installation of the new engine and would then road
test to make sure everything is ok. I said, "so it might be ready by
Friday?" (this is what Nissan Customer Service in TN had told me).
He said it would probably be done earlier than Friday, possibly
Wednesday after they tested everything.

Wednesday came and went. On Friday I received a call from Nissan again.
She told me basically what the service advisor at the dealership had
told me on Tuesday except now it would be next Monday, (June 26) before
I could get the car back.

I started getting a strong hunch that the new engine didn't solve the
"no heat" problem. The dots didn't connect.

So, this morning I took a ride down to the dealership. The service
manager/director was there. He was honest about it. The new engine was
in but the car still had no heat and they were back to square one.

I said, "I figured that" and reminded him of what I had told him back on
May 30th and what I thought was wrong. I said, "if you want to fix the
problem, you need to install a new heater control valve. It's mounted
on the firewall on the passenger side and has two heater hoses connected
to it, one in, one out to the heater core.

He said they checked for any faults with it in the ECU. I told him the
ECU wouldn't show a fault because the little motor that drives the valve
has an open winding. It burnt up, which connects the electrical burning
odor that I noticed the day I drove the car home (May 27th). I said the
12 volts would be applied, but nothing would happen to open the valve.
There is no positive feedback to the ECU that indicates the valve position.

It also explains why the electrical burning odor disappeared. Can't get
hot if no current is flowing in the windings.

I said if they warm up the car, set the temp to max and feel the hose
going to the valve, or measure it with an IR thermometer, it will be hot
on one side and significantly cooler on the other side of the valve.

The problem is that the dealership's hands are tied when it comes to
warranty work. They can't do anything unless Nissan authorizes it.
The service manager is more frustrated than I am. I think it's kinda
funny. They spring for a new engine (which it didn't need) and ignore
the customer input that was intended to help diagnose the problem.

Anyway, he asked me to call Nissan Customer Service and tell them
exactly what I had just told him. Turns out they are open today
(Saturday) but I had to leave a message. Awaiting a return call.

---
This email has been checked for viruses by AVG.
http://www.avg.com

That heater valve can't cost more than $75. I don't understand why the dealership doesn't just eat the cost of the valve and move on.



Actually, a local AutoZone has them for $179. I jokingly mentioned that
to the Service Manager but he explained that they can't do *anything* to
a car that is in for warranty repair unless it is authorized by the
manufacturer. Even if I replaced it myself, the warranty on the car
could be compromised.

These heater control valves are used on cars that have "Automatic"
temperature control. It regulates how much hot coolant flows through
the heater core depending on what temp the control is set for. Not like
the old days when they simply relied on cable actuated trap doors on the
sides of the black container in which the heater core was located.
The heater control valve is actually in the engine compartment. Some
people confuse it with the air blending dampers that are located under
the dash. Different animal.

On 6/24/2017 10:51 AM, wrote:
On Sat, 24 Jun 2017 09:54:03 -0400, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

... for those interested in this saga. If not, ignore.

On Tuesday of this past week the service advisor told me they were
"finishing up" the installation of the new engine and would then road
test to make sure everything is ok. I said, "so it might be ready by
Friday?" (this is what Nissan Customer Service in TN had told me).
He said it would probably be done earlier than Friday, possibly
Wednesday after they tested everything.

Wednesday came and went. On Friday I received a call from Nissan again.
She told me basically what the service advisor at the dealership had
told me on Tuesday except now it would be next Monday, (June 26) before
I could get the car back.

I started getting a strong hunch that the new engine didn't solve the
"no heat" problem. The dots didn't connect.

So, this morning I took a ride down to the dealership. The service
manager/director was there. He was honest about it. The new engine was
in but the car still had no heat and they were back to square one.

I said, "I figured that" and reminded him of what I had told him back on
May 30th and what I thought was wrong. I said, "if you want to fix the
problem, you need to install a new heater control valve. It's mounted
on the firewall on the passenger side and has two heater hoses connected
to it, one in, one out to the heater core.

He said they checked for any faults with it in the ECU. I told him the
ECU wouldn't show a fault because the little motor that drives the valve
has an open winding. It burnt up, which connects the electrical burning
odor that I noticed the day I drove the car home (May 27th). I said the
12 volts would be applied, but nothing would happen to open the valve.
There is no positive feedback to the ECU that indicates the valve position.

It also explains why the electrical burning odor disappeared. Can't get
hot if no current is flowing in the windings.

I said if they warm up the car, set the temp to max and feel the hose
going to the valve, or measure it with an IR thermometer, it will be hot
on one side and significantly cooler on the other side of the valve.

The problem is that the dealership's hands are tied when it comes to
warranty work. They can't do anything unless Nissan authorizes it.
The service manager is more frustrated than I am. I think it's kinda
funny. They spring for a new engine (which it didn't need) and ignore
the customer input that was intended to help diagnose the problem.

Anyway, he asked me to call Nissan Customer Service and tell them
exactly what I had just told him. Turns out they are open today
(Saturday) but I had to leave a message. Awaiting a return call.


The coyote that chewed off 3 legs and is still in the trap huh?
I guess you can't fix stupid.
The real problem is the dealer would rather get paid to do the
unnecessary warranty work than to fix the problem. That is coupled
with engineers at Nissan who are just unwilling to admit there is a
hole in their MAP.
It may just be a "face" thing. No wonder they lost the war ;-)

Harry is right, go for a new car. You said you like your loaner. Go
for that one.



I had a long conversation with the service manager this morning and we
both decided to just let Nissan respond and do their thing. The Nissan
rep told me last week that if by the beginning of next week the problem
was not fixed they wouldn't "drag it out" any further and will buy the
car back.

He was very straight with me about how they work with the manufacturer.
They can't spend a nickle on parts or labor on a new car under warranty
unless it is authorized by Nissan even if they aren't looking for
reimbursement. It's the same thing if I had taken it to another
mechanic in a garage that does not do warranty work. Don't ever do
that. It will void your warranty. It's one of the first questions
Nissan asked me.

This particular dealership used to sell Lincoln/Mercury cars but ended
that relationship due to Ford not always honoring their warranty
obligations or being slow in delivering parts under warranty.

It just cracks me up because I am about 99 percent confident that I've
known what the problem has been since May 30th when I brought it back.
I must have mentioned the *electrical* burning odor at least four times
and assured them I knew the difference between it and a normal "hot"
odor of new pipes or parts getting hot for the first few times. As you
know an electrical burning odor is very distinctive. Anyway, we'll now
wait until Monday and see what Nissan says.

---
This email has been checked for viruses by AVG.
http://www.avg.com

On Sat, 24 Jun 2017 13:05:05 -0400, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

On 6/24/2017 10:51 AM, wrote:
On Sat, 24 Jun 2017 09:54:03 -0400, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

... for those interested in this saga. If not, ignore.

On Tuesday of this past week the service advisor told me they were
"finishing up" the installation of the new engine and would then road
test to make sure everything is ok. I said, "so it might be ready by
Friday?" (this is what Nissan Customer Service in TN had told me).
He said it would probably be done earlier than Friday, possibly
Wednesday after they tested everything.

Wednesday came and went. On Friday I received a call from Nissan again.
She told me basically what the service advisor at the dealership had
told me on Tuesday except now it would be next Monday, (June 26) before
I could get the car back.

I started getting a strong hunch that the new engine didn't solve the
"no heat" problem. The dots didn't connect.

So, this morning I took a ride down to the dealership. The service
manager/director was there. He was honest about it. The new engine was
in but the car still had no heat and they were back to square one.

I said, "I figured that" and reminded him of what I had told him back on
May 30th and what I thought was wrong. I said, "if you want to fix the
problem, you need to install a new heater control valve. It's mounted
on the firewall on the passenger side and has two heater hoses connected
to it, one in, one out to the heater core.

He said they checked for any faults with it in the ECU. I told him the
ECU wouldn't show a fault because the little motor that drives the valve
has an open winding. It burnt up, which connects the electrical burning
odor that I noticed the day I drove the car home (May 27th). I said the
12 volts would be applied, but nothing would happen to open the valve.
There is no positive feedback to the ECU that indicates the valve position.

It also explains why the electrical burning odor disappeared. Can't get
hot if no current is flowing in the windings.

I said if they warm up the car, set the temp to max and feel the hose
going to the valve, or measure it with an IR thermometer, it will be hot
on one side and significantly cooler on the other side of the valve.

The problem is that the dealership's hands are tied when it comes to
warranty work. They can't do anything unless Nissan authorizes it.
The service manager is more frustrated than I am. I think it's kinda
funny. They spring for a new engine (which it didn't need) and ignore
the customer input that was intended to help diagnose the problem.

Anyway, he asked me to call Nissan Customer Service and tell them
exactly what I had just told him. Turns out they are open today
(Saturday) but I had to leave a message. Awaiting a return call.


The coyote that chewed off 3 legs and is still in the trap huh?
I guess you can't fix stupid.
The real problem is the dealer would rather get paid to do the
unnecessary warranty work than to fix the problem. That is coupled
with engineers at Nissan who are just unwilling to admit there is a
hole in their MAP.
It may just be a "face" thing. No wonder they lost the war ;-)

Harry is right, go for a new car. You said you like your loaner. Go
for that one.



I had a long conversation with the service manager this morning and we
both decided to just let Nissan respond and do their thing. The Nissan
rep told me last week that if by the beginning of next week the problem
was not fixed they wouldn't "drag it out" any further and will buy the
car back.

It's the same thing if I had taken it to another
mechanic in a garage that does not do warranty work. Don't ever do
that. It will void your warranty. It's one of the first questions
Nissan asked me.

Perhaps they have never been sued. Federal law prohibits dealers and
manufacturers from requiring their products or services be used to
protect the warranty unless said product or service is provided for
free.
For example, you don't need to use Yamaha oil nor do you need to have
the dealer do the service to protect your warranty. I agree if a 3d
party installed an aftermarket valve, that valve would not be covered
under the warranty but they would need to demonstrate that the valve
caused other damage to deny a warranty claim.

On Saturday, 24 June 2017 14:05:35 UTC-3, Mr. Luddite wrote:
On 6/24/2017 10:51 AM, wrote:
On Sat, 24 Jun 2017 09:54:03 -0400, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

... for those interested in this saga. If not, ignore.

On Tuesday of this past week the service advisor told me they were
"finishing up" the installation of the new engine and would then road
test to make sure everything is ok. I said, "so it might be ready by
Friday?" (this is what Nissan Customer Service in TN had told me).
He said it would probably be done earlier than Friday, possibly
Wednesday after they tested everything.

Wednesday came and went. On Friday I received a call from Nissan again.
She told me basically what the service advisor at the dealership had
told me on Tuesday except now it would be next Monday, (June 26) before
I could get the car back.

I started getting a strong hunch that the new engine didn't solve the
"no heat" problem. The dots didn't connect.

So, this morning I took a ride down to the dealership. The service
manager/director was there. He was honest about it. The new engine was
in but the car still had no heat and they were back to square one.

I said, "I figured that" and reminded him of what I had told him back on
May 30th and what I thought was wrong. I said, "if you want to fix the
problem, you need to install a new heater control valve. It's mounted
on the firewall on the passenger side and has two heater hoses connected
to it, one in, one out to the heater core.

He said they checked for any faults with it in the ECU. I told him the
ECU wouldn't show a fault because the little motor that drives the valve
has an open winding. It burnt up, which connects the electrical burning
odor that I noticed the day I drove the car home (May 27th). I said the
12 volts would be applied, but nothing would happen to open the valve.
There is no positive feedback to the ECU that indicates the valve position.

It also explains why the electrical burning odor disappeared. Can't get
hot if no current is flowing in the windings.

I said if they warm up the car, set the temp to max and feel the hose
going to the valve, or measure it with an IR thermometer, it will be hot
on one side and significantly cooler on the other side of the valve.

The problem is that the dealership's hands are tied when it comes to
warranty work. They can't do anything unless Nissan authorizes it.
The service manager is more frustrated than I am. I think it's kinda
funny. They spring for a new engine (which it didn't need) and ignore
the customer input that was intended to help diagnose the problem.

Anyway, he asked me to call Nissan Customer Service and tell them
exactly what I had just told him. Turns out they are open today
(Saturday) but I had to leave a message. Awaiting a return call.


The coyote that chewed off 3 legs and is still in the trap huh?
I guess you can't fix stupid.
The real problem is the dealer would rather get paid to do the
unnecessary warranty work than to fix the problem. That is coupled
with engineers at Nissan who are just unwilling to admit there is a
hole in their MAP.
It may just be a "face" thing. No wonder they lost the war ;-)

Harry is right, go for a new car. You said you like your loaner. Go
for that one.



I had a long conversation with the service manager this morning and we
both decided to just let Nissan respond and do their thing. The Nissan
rep told me last week that if by the beginning of next week the problem
was not fixed they wouldn't "drag it out" any further and will buy the
car back.

He was very straight with me about how they work with the manufacturer.
They can't spend a nickle on parts or labor on a new car under warranty
unless it is authorized by Nissan even if they aren't looking for
reimbursement. It's the same thing if I had taken it to another
mechanic in a garage that does not do warranty work. Don't ever do
that. It will void your warranty. It's one of the first questions
Nissan asked me.

This particular dealership used to sell Lincoln/Mercury cars but ended
that relationship due to Ford not always honoring their warranty
obligations or being slow in delivering parts under warranty.

It just cracks me up because I am about 99 percent confident that I've
known what the problem has been since May 30th when I brought it back.
I must have mentioned the *electrical* burning odor at least four times
and assured them I knew the difference between it and a normal "hot"
odor of new pipes or parts getting hot for the first few times. As you
know an electrical burning odor is very distinctive. Anyway, we'll now
wait until Monday and see what Nissan says.

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Must be some kind of bad karma out on Nissan owners.
Just found out that some 81 year old guy raced out from a stop sign and smashed my sisters mint 2007 Infiniti F35 Crossover (50,000 kilometers)
The insurance companies wrote the car off even though it was in almost new shape except for the smashed in front end. The deciding factor seemed to be the deployment of the front airbag. I guess it's expensive to replace up here.
So, she'll get some chump change based on Blue Book/Black Book value. Shame..it was a nice vehicle and would have done her at least another 5 or more years.

On 6/24/2017 2:11 PM, wrote:
On Sat, 24 Jun 2017 13:05:05 -0400, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

On 6/24/2017 10:51 AM, wrote:
On Sat, 24 Jun 2017 09:54:03 -0400, "Mr. Luddite"
wrote:

... for those interested in this saga. If not, ignore.

On Tuesday of this past week the service advisor told me they were
"finishing up" the installation of the new engine and would then road
test to make sure everything is ok. I said, "so it might be ready by
Friday?" (this is what Nissan Customer Service in TN had told me).
He said it would probably be done earlier than Friday, possibly
Wednesday after they tested everything.

Wednesday came and went. On Friday I received a call from Nissan again.
She told me basically what the service advisor at the dealership had
told me on Tuesday except now it would be next Monday, (June 26) before
I could get the car back.

I started getting a strong hunch that the new engine didn't solve the
"no heat" problem. The dots didn't connect.

So, this morning I took a ride down to the dealership. The service
manager/director was there. He was honest about it. The new engine was
in but the car still had no heat and they were back to square one.

I said, "I figured that" and reminded him of what I had told him back on
May 30th and what I thought was wrong. I said, "if you want to fix the
problem, you need to install a new heater control valve. It's mounted
on the firewall on the passenger side and has two heater hoses connected
to it, one in, one out to the heater core.

He said they checked for any faults with it in the ECU. I told him the
ECU wouldn't show a fault because the little motor that drives the valve
has an open winding. It burnt up, which connects the electrical burning
odor that I noticed the day I drove the car home (May 27th). I said the
12 volts would be applied, but nothing would happen to open the valve.
There is no positive feedback to the ECU that indicates the valve position.

It also explains why the electrical burning odor disappeared. Can't get
hot if no current is flowing in the windings.

I said if they warm up the car, set the temp to max and feel the hose
going to the valve, or measure it with an IR thermometer, it will be hot
on one side and significantly cooler on the other side of the valve.

The problem is that the dealership's hands are tied when it comes to
warranty work. They can't do anything unless Nissan authorizes it.
The service manager is more frustrated than I am. I think it's kinda
funny. They spring for a new engine (which it didn't need) and ignore
the customer input that was intended to help diagnose the problem.

Anyway, he asked me to call Nissan Customer Service and tell them
exactly what I had just told him. Turns out they are open today
(Saturday) but I had to leave a message. Awaiting a return call.


The coyote that chewed off 3 legs and is still in the trap huh?
I guess you can't fix stupid.
The real problem is the dealer would rather get paid to do the
unnecessary warranty work than to fix the problem. That is coupled
with engineers at Nissan who are just unwilling to admit there is a
hole in their MAP.
It may just be a "face" thing. No wonder they lost the war ;-)

Harry is right, go for a new car. You said you like your loaner. Go
for that one.



I had a long conversation with the service manager this morning and we
both decided to just let Nissan respond and do their thing. The Nissan
rep told me last week that if by the beginning of next week the problem
was not fixed they wouldn't "drag it out" any further and will buy the
car back.

It's the same thing if I had taken it to another
mechanic in a garage that does not do warranty work. Don't ever do
that. It will void your warranty. It's one of the first questions
Nissan asked me.

Perhaps they have never been sued. Federal law prohibits dealers and
manufacturers from requiring their products or services be used to
protect the warranty unless said product or service is provided for
free.
For example, you don't need to use Yamaha oil nor do you need to have
the dealer do the service to protect your warranty. I agree if a 3d
party installed an aftermarket valve, that valve would not be covered
under the warranty but they would need to demonstrate that the valve
caused other damage to deny a warranty claim.


That's all probably true but who needs the hassle of going to court just
to get the damn car fixed. The girl at Nissan said if the new parts
(engine) didn't fix the problem they would buy the car back. Fine by
me. If they want to ship a new heater control valve and pay the
dealership to install it and it's fixed, that's also fine by me.

I found a court case involving Nissan. They were sued by two
dealerships because Nissan started tacking on a "Warranty fee" of
anything from $90 to $200 to the wholesale invoices to the dealers.
Basically Nissan was trying to get the dealers to participate in
warranty repair costs. Obviously the dealers would, in turn, pass that
cost on to the unsuspecting customer.

The dealers claimed that the warranty fee was not spelled out in their
original dealership agreement. The court decided in favor of the dealers.





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